AoS 2 - Skaventide Discussion

[Skreech Verminking]

1 hour ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

I challenge all of you (if you're a real skaven player you will) to build a list that "null deploys". Don't have a single model on the table to start. It doesn't matter who goes first. You just scare the ****** out of your opponent. I suggest Warpgnaw Verminlords summoned with the Gnawbomb, so many Drill Team Six's and a plethora of Gutter Runners. Use the GR's to tag your backfield objectives if you're really trying to score points. 

Challenge accepted 

[TerminusRex]

3 hours ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

I challenge all of you (if you're a real skaven player you will) to build a list that "null deploys". Don't have a single model on the table to start. It doesn't matter who goes first. You just scare the ****** out of your opponent. I suggest Warpgnaw Verminlords summoned with the Gnawbomb, so many Drill Team Six's and a plethora of Gutter Runners. Use the GR's to tag your backfield objectives if you're really trying to score points. 

I know verminlord spam is considered turds, but I am bringing back a 2.0 list where I had the Warpgnaw, Deceiver and Thanquol all dropping into enemy deployment with FU endless spells.

[Skreech Verminking]

47 minutes ago, TerminusRex said:

I know verminlord spam is considered turds, but I am bringing back a 2.0 list where I had the Warpgnaw, Deceiver and Thanquol all dropping into enemy deployment with FU endless spells.

Actually a Verminlord  spam list seems pretty decent.

you’ll be getting the extra victory points for achieving some of the secondary objectives with a monster or multiple

[TerminusRex]

23 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Actually a Verminlord  spam list seems pretty decent.

you’ll be getting the extra victory points for achieving some of the secondary objectives with a monster or multiple

Yes, getting multiple monsters in their deployment zone is EZ.

[Noserenda]

Hehe i did consider a null deploy eshin list for 600pt PtG but i think the points drop meant i couldnt spend all my points, damn cheap troops


Just to check btw, the claw weapon for deathmasters is just pure jank without a magic weapon or something right?

[Skreech Verminking]

17 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

Hehe i did consider a null deploy eshin list for 600pt PtG but i think the points drop meant i couldnt spend all my points, damn cheap troops


Just to check btw, the claw weapon for deathmasters is just pure jank without a magic weapon or something right?

In all actuality, you could easily do this with a mixed skaven force.

Thx, to the new hidden weapon team rule this already pretty easy, and deadly

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

@TerminusRex Absolutely go ham on big monsters. Huge stocks on verminlords right now and Thanquol can finally be a bruiser with flaming weapon. Mechanically speaking, its just a big advantage to have monsters for point scoring. Our monsters are still glass cannons despite buff stacking, but we also still have affordable chaff. 

@Noserenda Unless you "sacrificed" an enhancement on a Deathmaster, they're even worse now. The best I could see is re-rolling all hits and wounds against a target and turn him into a wizard for  flaming weapon. A better assassin is a clawlord with double death frenzy, give hime the Things-bane artifact and you teleport him to their back line. Way more fun.

[Megahurtz]

14 hours ago, Noserenda said:

Just to check btw, the claw weapon for deathmasters is just pure jank without a magic weapon or something right?

Yes. Did the math and not worth it unfortunately.

[Megahurtz]

3 hours ago, Megahurtz said:

Yes. Did the math and not worth it unfortunately.

Actually damage wise, even GR are better most of the time and cheaper.

[TerminusRex]

8 hours ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

@TerminusRex Absolutely go ham on big monsters. Huge stocks on verminlords right now and Thanquol can finally be a bruiser with flaming weapon. Mechanically speaking, its just a big advantage to have monsters for point scoring. Our monsters are still glass cannons despite buff stacking, but we also still have affordable chaff.

Unfortunately Thanquol cannot take flaming weapon.

[Skreech Verminking]

On 1/14/2022 at 2:09 PM, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

I challenge all of you (if you're a real skaven player you will) to build a list that "null deploys". Don't have a single model on the table to start. It doesn't matter who goes first. You just scare the ****** out of your opponent. I suggest Warpgnaw Verminlords summoned with the Gnawbomb, so many Drill Team Six's and a plethora of Gutter Runners. Use the GR's to tag your backfield objectives if you're really trying to score points. 

 

On 1/14/2022 at 3:30 PM, Skreech Verminking said:

Challenge accepted 

And the list is done.

now to try it out against a lumineth player, Yes-yes:

Allegiance: Skaventide
- Grand Strategy: 
- Triumphs: 
Warpgnaw Verminlord (275)*
- Artefact: Snoutgrovel Robes  
- Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon
Arch-Warlock (175)*
- General
- Command Trait: Overseer of Destruction  
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!
Deathmaster (100)*
- Artefact: Gnawbomb  
30 x Stormvermin (330)
- Halberd & Shield
- Reinforced x 2
30 x Stormvermin (330)
- Halberd & Shield
- Reinforced x 2
20 x Clanrats (130)
- Rusty Blade
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warpfire Thrower (70)
1 x Warpfire Thrower (70)
1 x Ratling Gun (65)
1 x Ratling Gun (65)
1 x Ratling Gun (65)*
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands

Total: 1975 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 128
Drops: 15

[Megahurtz]

4 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

 

And the list is done.

now to try it out against a lumineth player, Yes-yes:

Allegiance: Skaventide
- Grand Strategy: 
- Triumphs: 
Warpgnaw Verminlord (275)*
- Artefact: Snoutgrovel Robes  
- Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon
Arch-Warlock (175)*
- General
- Command Trait: Overseer of Destruction  
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!
Deathmaster (100)*
- Artefact: Gnawbomb  
30 x Stormvermin (330)
- Halberd & Shield
- Reinforced x 2
30 x Stormvermin (330)
- Halberd & Shield
- Reinforced x 2
20 x Clanrats (130)
- Rusty Blade
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warp-Grinder (75)
1 x Warpfire Thrower (70)
1 x Warpfire Thrower (70)
1 x Ratling Gun (65)
1 x Ratling Gun (65)
1 x Ratling Gun (65)*
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands

Total: 1975 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 128
Drops: 15

I like the list! Actually I hope the change the rules, so a hero and a unit could join the warp grinder. And reduce the points a bit, so you could add a few GR... Let us know how it goes!

[bonzai]

Hey guys. I have been sorting out my various armies for 3rd edition, and am now looking at my Skaven army. Skaven were my first AoS army from back in 1st edition. Typically my play style was big bricks of 40 clan rats that would bolstered by a Warbringer's death frenzy and the gnaw-gnash command ability. I loved how units would implode on them, and catch people by surprise. They would be backed up with wft's and WLC's.  Sadly, I kind drifted away from them in 2nd edition after they squated my clawlord on a Brood Horror (loved that little guy).

Now I am scratching my head trying to figure out what I want to do for 3rd edition. The price hikes and coherency changes hurt. This edition doesn’t seem to favor Hordes, but then again running one could catch people out. Hidden weapon teams seem like a fun new twist in a heavy shooting Meta.  

To me, the most interesting change in 3rd, is the access to generic prayers. Curse could make Clanrat bricks devastating, and fortunately Skaven have ready access to priests. Unfortunately it has a very short range and the 3 inch mortal wound bubble makes positioning tricky, though it could be fun to try.

My initial thoughts are:

Warbringer (General): Brutal Fury, Flaypelt Cloak, Flaming Weapon.

Clawlord

Clawlord

Plague priest

Plague priest

40 clan rats

40 clan rats

10 stormvermin

Warpfire Thrower

Warpfire Thrower 

Warpfire Thrower 

Warpfire Thrower 

Warp lightning cannon

Warp lightning cannon

Battalions: Battle Regiment, grand battery

Total: 1965

General idea is that each brick will be baby sat by a clawlord, a priest, Warp lightning cannon, and have 2 hidden weapon teams. The Warbringer will assist whichever brick needs reinforcement. 

Not a barn burner by any stretch, but it is the best adaptation I can see for my old style of list. Whether or not it is particularly viable or not anymore remains to be seen.

Edited January 15, 2022 by bonzai

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

@Skreech Verminking By golly you've done it. The 2x block of stormvermin make me extra proud. No need to alpha pin, going for the alpha strike from the look of things. Warpgnaw at flat 6 dmg sounds hilarious to me. Hunters of the Heartlands for the win, if you can take a triumph to get that free re-roll to charge. What I just realized for this many weapon teams, you can actually turn them into a screen for the heroes/stormvermin. The warpgrinder's alone account for at least 1 foot of speed bump if you line them all up. 

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

@bonzai Strong recommendation to bring at least one warlock. The possibility of overcharging a lightning cannon is too good to pass up. Even if you're the type of player who wants to blow up a key peice, its part of the mind games with your opponent. You need to keep the threat of 12 MW's with one shot on the table, even if you never use it. I would swap your artillery for Jezzails so they can run more independently. Otherwise a list after my own heart. 

Edited January 16, 2022 by Riff_Raff_Rascal

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

12 hours ago, TerminusRex said:

Unfortunately Thanquol cannot take flaming weapon.

I stand corrected. From FAQ:

"Q: Are Unique units allowed to take spells from the universal spell lore or prayers from the universal prayer scripture? A: No."

While at the same time, your army is still allowed to take a spell enhancements. It is stated that no individual unit is given said enhancement. Then, each unit may take a spell from lore they have access to. Except unique units. 

Before we go down that rabbit hole, check out the discussion here also on this site if you're interested. I was just typing this all out to cement it in my head. Warscroll builder still let me do it so I was confused.

[Cosmicsheep]

9 hours ago, bonzai said:

The price hikes and coherency changes hurt.

Yes, the lack of a horde bonus still hurts, but we aren’t really affected by the new coherency rules. Because of GW’s rules being in inches but bases having to be sold in mm, our 25mm bases mean that even stringing Clanrats out in single file means that there are 2 models within 1”. The one and only time I’ve had to think about coherency is with a unit of 6 rat ogres when I played pure moulder.

But I love that list though. I might even steal that 🤣

Edited January 16, 2022 by Cosmicsheep

[Skreech Verminking]

5 hours ago, Riff_Raff_Rascal said:

@Skreech Verminking By golly you've done it. The 2x block of stormvermin make me extra proud. No need to alpha pin, going for the alpha strike from the look of things. Warpgnaw at flat 6 dmg sounds hilarious to me. Hunters of the Heartlands for the win, if you can take a triumph to get that free re-roll to charge. What I just realized for this many weapon teams, you can actually turn them into a screen for the heroes/stormvermin. The warpgrinder's alone account for at least 1 foot of speed bump if you line them all up. 

Yes-yes.

it might even be the greatest list to deal with any lumineth player, that isn’t using 4 foxes.

Against the less experienced players, there is a good chance that they would give you first, after all how wpuld they do damage to something that just doesn’t quite yet exist.

although it can get problematic, when you’re fighting against somebody fast.

if he outdrops you and takes first, turn, he could make certain that y

our army won’t ever get the chance to deepstrike.

but with ironjawz some lumineth, beast of chaos  and against any skaven list with a few doomwheels being the more problematic speed bumps, that should still leave most of the currently existing armies, left unable to take-steal the whole board from us-us

[Megahurtz]

17 minutes ago, Cosmicsheep said:

Yes, the lack of a horde bonus still hurts, but we aren’t really affected by the new coherency rules. Because of GW’s rules being in inches but bases having to be sold in mm, our 25mm bases mean that even stringing Clanrats out in single file means that there are 2 models within 1”. The one and only time I’ve had to think about coherency is with a unit of 6 rat ogres when I played pure moulder.

But I love that list though. I might even steal that 🤣

Just make sure nobody picks and removes one model in the middle (Warpgnaw) if only a little poorly placed, you have to remove half of the unit due to ceherency and the other half due to battleshock...

[Cosmicsheep]

23 minutes ago, Megahurtz said:

Just make sure nobody picks and removes one model in the middle (Warpgnaw) if only a little poorly placed, you have to remove half of the unit due to ceherency and the other half due to battleshock...

True true, so it pays to make sure your frenemy explains all his abilities before the game.

And I thought coherency triggered after a turn(15.2) , so it would be after the battle shock phase.

[Riff_Raff_Rascal]

2 hours ago, Cosmicsheep said:

And I thought coherency triggered after a turn(15.2) , so it would be after the battle shock phase.

I've thought about the Splinter spell a lot, especially with list ideas that have the warpgnaw, and generally yes, it would only really check at the end of your turn's battleshock phase. If you use this strategy you have to make sure its a unit you don't plan on engaging in melee, otherwise their pile-in could fix the gap. More interestingly, if you plan to shoot that same unit (which we would more reliably do off of a deep-strike), you want to make sure they are battleshock immune or won't lose so many models to the shoosting or the following battleshock phase such that coherency doesn't matter. Very good strategy against death armies though. 

These are some subtle pointers but important if you want the model removal spells to get maximum effect. 

[Skreech Verminking]

Welp, I got some more rattling guns and jezzails converted.

Although the greenstuff part of the models, is currently missing.

Still have to do a few pipes, and some chain armor on the shields

[bonzai]

12 hours ago, Cosmicsheep said:

Yes, the lack of a horde bonus still hurts, but we aren’t really affected by the new coherency rules. Because of GW’s rules being in inches but bases having to be sold in mm, our 25mm bases mean that even stringing Clanrats out in single file means that there are 2 models within 1”. The one and only time I’ve had to think about coherency is with a unit of 6 rat ogres when I played pure moulder.

But I love that list though. I might even steal that 🤣

Awesome point. And mine are still on squares, so they pack in extra close, lol.

[Skreech Verminking]

Just got some greenstuff on them.

and I’m now the proud owner of 6 rattling guns, 7 more to go

[Megahurtz]

Nice! How did you do the big rattling guns with 4 barrels? What parts did you use?