AoS 2 - Skaventide Discussion

[Shirtripper]

1 hour ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Well since your partner seems to be focusing on combat I would trop the plague monks and the claword for either more clanrats, or for jezzails and Warlock bombardier/engineer.

Lague monks are fantastic but a terrorgheists will literally kill anything in combat, meaning your much slower plague monks will literally be thrown  away points.

I would just try and take what your partner lacks, like bodies and shooting.

My concern is that even with his Terrorgheists  I'll still need to be able to win combat one side of the board so he can focus on one specific army at a time. Our plan is for him to summon 20 ghouls with his Archregent so he can secure objectives without me needing to shift my Clanrats.

I suppose I can drop the Monks, and bump the 20 rat unit to 40, then add another block of 40. Thank The Great Horned Rat for movement trays lol.

Would 6 Jezzails be enough at 1000 points? Changing the Monks to 6 Jezzails and the Clawlord to a Warlock Engineer also sounds interesting. I was looking to trying out the Acolytes but have heard mixed things about them.

[Gwendar]

@Shirtripper Acolytes are great, but only in units of 20-30 if your goal is to delete units off the board. They will have a 20" threat range (6" move + 6" run + 8" throw) and if you get all 20-30 of them hitting something buffed with MMMWP + Sparks + Vigordust (if needed) then the damage is disgusting and they can easily split fire and wipe out whole units quite easily.

Of course Jezzails are the opposite end of that spectrum, wanting to focus more on heroes\elites and a unit of 6 will not typically need to be buffed with MMMWP as it will kill off 1 Jezzail on average per turn which isn't really worth it in my opinion. If he wants to focus those TG's into battleline\horde units then you should run Jezzails. If he plans to go after elites\heroes then I would choose the Acolytes.

Or go with the best of both worlds and run an AW + 60 Clanrats + 6 Stormfiends and go to town with your fully buffed Ratling Cannons + Windlaunchers.

[Aelford]

I've been thinking about this list also. It has three pretty survivable heroes, lots of bodies and everything can benefit from the Death Frenzy.  Only 6 drops too!

Leaders
Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- General
- Trait: Master of Magic 
- Artefact: Suspicious Stone 
- Lore of Ruin: Death Frenzy
Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet 
- Lore of Ruin: Warpgale
Plague Priest on Plague Furnace (200)
Battleline
40 x Clanrats (200)
40 x Clanrats (200)
40 x Clanrats (200)
Units
40 x Plague Monks (280)
40 x Plague Monks (280)
Battalions
Congregation of Filth (160)
Total: 1960 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Wounds: 239

[swarmofseals]

I hate to do this but I'm going to indulge myself in a bit of complaining. I'm dutifully working on my Skaven project and really enjoyed setting up my clanrat units. They have been super easy to clean up and despite the simple design it's not hard to make a unit where each model is unique.

My unit of Plague Monks, however, is taking forever to clean. Is it just me or is the sprue design of this kit just atrocious? The mould lines are awful and the sprue gates are in the worst places. Anyone else hate building this kit?

[TheWilddog]

21 minutes ago, swarmofseals said:

I hate to do this but I'm going to indulge myself in a bit of complaining. I'm dutifully working on my Skaven project and really enjoyed setting up my clanrat units. They have been super easy to clean up and despite the simple design it's not hard to make a unit where each model is unique.

My unit of Plague Monks, however, is taking forever to clean. Is it just me or is the sprue design of this kit just atrocious? The mould lines are awful and the sprue gates are in the worst places. Anyone else hate building this kit?

The Plague Monk kit  is just the worst.  They are a much older kit and unfortunately show their age quite a bit.

[MisterJoshua]

22 hours ago, Gwendar said:

Or go with the best of both worlds and run an AW + 60 Clanrats + 6 Stormfiends and go to town with your fully buffed Ratling Cannons + Windlaunchers.

I think that’s a really strong option for the points value. Lots of bodies, hard hitters and a good character.

I’ve been looking at this, which I think is very strong at 1k

Allegiance: Skaventide
Grey Seer (140)
- Artefact: Snoutgrovel Robes  
- Lore of Ruin: Warpgale
Warlock Bombardier (100)
- General
- Trait: Deranged Inventor  
- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Blade
20 x Clanrats (120)
- Rusty Blade
6 x Stormfiends (520)

Total: 1000 / 1000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 200
Wounds: 86

Its got less bodies, but 2 characters and a nice battleshock immunity bubble to keep the clanrats around longer.

[Gwendar]

@MisterJoshua I haven't been able to get in too many 1k games as of late... everyone's just been playing 2k, which I'm fine with. But yes, I would agree and... to be honest I think that is a bit more well-rounded (and I may steal it whenever I find myself playing 1k again...) compared to just having another 20 Clanrats.

At 1k, 6 Fiends can and likely will be atrocious to the point that needing 60+ Clanrats won't be needed much of the time. Of course, if we start talking about ME's and it's rules.. well, yeah. I think we all already had that convo a few pages back.

@Shirtripper I would definitely give MisterJoshua's list a shot and see how it goes for you. One thing I will always say is that it's nice to have a plan in mind for every game, but not every matchup can be handled the same way.. so both of you keep your minds open to changing tactics based on deployment and objectives firstly and how the game is looking after T1\2. Outright killing everything isn't always going to win you games and a couple of bad dice rolls from those TG's (it happens alot thanks to their important attack hitting on 4's...) can spell bad news for you both and support may be needed on that side.

[Obeisance]

I get the feeling people don't like weapon teams?

Also I keep hearing Doomwheels are underrated. Agree/disagree?

...

I'm currently painting 40 Plague Monks. I actually really like the kit. There's lots of small details and eyes I don't have to paint. 

Militarum Green, Darkoath Flesh and Wyldwood are like 90% of the model. Kind of annoys me that Warhammer TV came out with a Skaven painting scheme that uses Darkoath skin and Wyldwood for fur a month or so after I did, now my scheme is standard. Booooo.

[Skreech Verminking]

1 hour ago, Obeisance said:

I get the feeling people don't like weapon teams?

Also I keep hearing Doomwheels are underrated. Agree/disagree?

...

I'm currently painting 40 Plague Monks. I actually really like the kit. There's lots of small details and eyes I don't have to paint. 

Militarum Green, Darkoath Flesh and Wyldwood are like 90% of the model. Kind of annoys me that Warhammer TV came out with a Skaven painting scheme that uses Darkoath skin and Wyldwood for fur a month or so after I did, now my scheme is standard. Booooo.

I’vee used the doomwheel in a  normal 1k game and in meeting engagement.

it isn't bad at all especially in meeting engagement, where that thing can move from around 8inches to 48(when you have a specific artefact)

I actually like for a first turn deepstrike kamikaze style kill the enemy hero as fast as possible, or to just capture objective with it.

 

[Gwendar]

On 8/28/2019 at 11:35 PM, Obeisance said:

I get the feeling people don't like weapon teams?

Also I keep hearing Doomwheels are underrated. Agree/disagree?

Well, the Warpfire Thrower in particular can be problematic as it's easy to kill and it requires very specific positioning to get max benefit from. On the other hand, Ratling Gun teams are great against anything with\without buffs, though you typically see 2-3 brought at a time. They can be killed just as easily, but they can also be positioned easier for maximum effect. Still... I don't see the point in either when I can bring my triple-purpose Stormfiends but that's just my own preference really. I think a lot of the time I would rather just bring 6 Jezzails and have Monks or something else do the horde clearing work.

As for the Doomwheel, it's usually hit or miss which is why it isn't a popular option in the competitive scene. It can be great, especially at killing heroes. Assuming you get an average to good movement roll, it's usually pretty effective at killing heroes (always double the shots fired) and people don't tend to expect it. Those points can buy a lot of things that are more reliable though, and that's usually the issue.

Edited August 30, 2019 by Gwendar

[Cosmicsheep]

A question about battalions and number of drops. I played a game this week with my pure moulder list (that I asked for advice on a few weeks ago) and for the first time found myself with an equal number of drops vs a Khorne list. I won the roll off, started deploying first and subsequently found myself in the unusual position of being able to decide whether to go first or not. I chose to go first because I felt obliged that having won the roll off that would be the obvious thing to do.

so my question is this, how important is going first? I lost the game this week and felt that maybe if I’d gone second I might have performed better, and if I hadn’t wasted points making my army fit into as few drops as possible I’d have had a few more models on the field. I had Thanqoul as general so wasted my command trait and extra artefact too.

looking at some of the recent lists above, I don’t see many battalions outside of Pestilens being used (unless you go full Skryre)

[Aelford]

I think the option of going first will always be preferred. It will always be decided game by game. Do you need to get to an objective first or can you wait? Do you want to advance up the battlefield before they get a round of shooting off? Do you need a buff/spell to go off? A lot of players like playing a reaction game to what the opponent does. You'll also want to consider the possibility of the double turn. Will that benefit yourself more than your opponent?

I really like the Clawhorde battalion. It gets your battleline units sorted in one drop and you bag an extra CP and artefact. 

[Obeisance]

I actually don't mind going second; better chance at the first double turn.

[robbobobo]

It depends on the game type and what kind of army YOU are fielding; if you have unbreakable hordes of Clanrats that you can rush up the board to clog the objectives with, go first. This puts pressure on your opponent to take you off the objective, they can't always chew through them all to steal them. If you don't feel need to do so and feel comfortable with your positioning and/or your opponents lack of mobility go second. Going second also lets you keep your heroes and critical units out of harms way if you deploy further back, they will be heading towards you in some capacity, if not directly.

Though a point I do want to emphasize with list building in general, regardless of game/opponent, is to build lists that don't mind going second. I tend to do this as they are more adaptable and/or resilient.

[Gwendar]

Keep in mind, pre-measuring is allowed in this game and no-one should give you grief for doing so quickly unless they're "that guy". If you're given T1 you have a lot of leeway to position yourself using those measurements to ensure that you nullify their next turn. Also be sure to position yourself according to your army\vs. theirs and what the battleplan is; sometimes it may be beneficial to to grab those objectives ASAP if you know you can survive 2 potentials turns of getting hit.

Just as an example, in my magic list I'm almost never going 2nd.. so I do what I can to cripple as much as possible T1 with magic to shutdown any T1\Double-turn shenanigans they can do (Slaanesh, FeC, Fyreslayers, etc usually) and keep myself deployed farther back unless I can comfortably occupy 1-2 objectives that are more center of the field. I think @robbobobo hit the nail on his points; there's a lot of factors so the best you can do is build a good all-rounder list and analyze deployment and think 1-2 turns ahead depending on whether or not you will\won't get a double and how to best maximize opportunity.

[Hagbean]

Pretty pleased with these boys, managed to smash through 40 of them with relative ease ready for battle along with their movement trays!

I've got 80 Stormvermin that are fully painted just need basing and then their movement trays need doing also, slowly starting to feel like i'm going to actually finish this list!

Still need to paint:
-Verminlord Warbringer (based/zenithal primed)
-Grey Seer on screaming bell (zenithal primed/coated with contrast grey ready for details)

I'm waiting for my delivery of masking putty from greenstuffworld (been waiting for about a month!! anyone else had stuff delivered from them? does it usually take this long?) before I do the screaming bell/warbringer due to some fiddly bits I don't want to overspray onto where masking tape/tissue just won't do the job.

Edited August 30, 2019 by Hagbean
spelling, added greenstuffworld delivery comment

[Num]

Hi,

On a youtube battle report that was posted there some time ago (KO vs Skaven), someone posted a comment that got me thinking.

The person said that Warlock Engineers cannot cast Mystic Shield and Arcane Bolt. Contrary to other casters, their warscrolls do not state that they know these spells...

I double checked the warscrolls and they indeed do not mention these spells...

Come on GW, why do you have to create confusion everywhere??

What do you think?

[Skreech Verminking]

53 minutes ago, Num said:

Hi,

On a youtube battle report that was posted there some time ago (KO vs Skaven), someone posted a comment that got me thinking.

The person said that Warlock Engineers cannot cast Mystic Shield and Arcane Bolt. Contrary to other casters, their warscrolls do not state that they know these spells...

I double checked the warscrolls and they indeed do not mention these spells...

Come on GW, why do you have to create confusion everywhere??

What do you think?

Well, having checked the warscroll, I actually cant say if its some sort of a mistake or was intended.

both seem logical, since for one, the warlock engineers spell Warplightning can be used multiple times in the same phase, something other wizard and spells can’t.

and since the Warp-lightning spell is well more useful then the actual arcane bolt, there isn't really much of a reason to use it.

but I guess having forgotten to add those spell onto the war-scroll, is something that is also possible.

[robbobobo]

Curious. The app has the rules for both Arcane Bolt and Mystic Shield but it doesn't say that they know it. Same goes for the Bombardier. Might be an idea to shoot a message to the rules team, otherwise I've learned something new today and have a need to apologize to several opponents...

[Gwendar]

If you look at the core rules for Lores of Magic, Arcane bolt and Mystic Shield are listed that most Wizards know them, not all. Since the Warscroll for the Engineer\Bombardier specifically only says that they know Warp-Lightning, then that really is all they know (aside from realm spells and Skryre lore spells). I think because almost every other Wizard in the game generally has them listed as the wizard knowing them, then most just sort of generalize them to all wizards.

But yes, it is confusing at first glance since they're explicitly listed on Azyr under the warscrolls for everything, including the Engineer\Bombardier.

 

[robbobobo]

I mean, I don't dispute that they don't know it. It's just a surprise given the Engineer could before.

Edited September 1, 2019 by robbobobo

[undeadheadz]

Theres a kickstarter for acolyte and jezzail conversion kits going on at the moment if anyones inerested they look pretty good 

 

[swarmofseals]

I've got a lore question! Does anyone know of any good "official" resources for skaven runes/writing? I don't really care if it's an AOS or WHFB publication. I found this resource: https://pariedolia.weebly.com/nimh/the-skaven-alphabet which is quite excellent, but I don't see any citations so I have no idea if it's a fan creation or from an official publication.

[Aelford]

So all weekend I've been pondering over a few lists. I've been trying to reduce the redundancy of certain aspects of the list while keeping a core of fairly survivable heroes and lots of rats with Death Frenzy.  Here is what I've come up with. I'd love to hear what your favourite list is and if I should make any changes to it.

Spoiler

 

List One -

Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- General
- Trait: Master of Magic 
- Artefact: Aetherquartz Brooch 
- Lore of Ruin: Death Frenzy
Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- Lore of Ruin: Warpgale
Skaven Clawlord on Brood Horror (180)
- Mighty Warlord Command Trait: Verminous Valour

40 x Stormvermin (450)
40 x Clanrats (200)
20 x Clanrats (120)
40 x Plague Monks (280)
40 x Plague Monks (280)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Wounds: 214

List Two -
Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- General
- Trait: Master of Magic 
- Artefact: Suspicious Stone 
- Lore of Ruin: Death Frenzy
Verminlord Warbringer (280)
- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet 
Plague Priest on Plague Furnace (200)
40 x Clanrats (200)
40 x Clanrats (200)
20 x Clanrats (120)
40 x Plague Monks (280)
40 x Plague Monks (280)
Congregation of Filth (160)
Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Wounds: 218

List Three -

Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- General
- Trait: Master of Magic 
- Artefact: Aetherquartz Brooch 
- Lore of Ruin: Death Frenzy
Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220)
- Lore of Ruin: Warpgale
Skaven Clawlord on Brood Horror (180)
- Mighty Warlord Command Trait: Verminous Valour
Grey Seer (140)
- Lore of Ruin: Skitterleap

40 x Stormvermin (450)
40 x Clanrats (200)
40 x Clanrats (200)
40 x Plague Monks (280)
Aethervoid Pendulum (50)
Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Wounds: 199

 

 

Edited September 2, 2019 by Aelford

[Darkhan]

Thoughts anyone?  Been tinkering with a Alpha Omega Stormfiend list😂

Works as skitterleaping the Arch-warlock a head, casting WLV, then pop up the 9 stormfiends infront of him, to get the deranged inventor buff, spark etc.

One trick pony! But looks like a super fun list. Was not sure what to get instead of anoter screaming bell. This way, all the clan rats should be battleshock immune T1.

LEADERS Arch-Warlock (160) - General - Command Trait : Deranged Inventor - Artefact : Vigordust Injector

Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220) - Lore of Ruin : Skitterleap

Grey Seer on Screaming Bell (220) - Lore of Ruin : Plague

UNITS

40 x Clanrats (200) - Rusty Spear

20 x Clanrats (120) - Rusty Blade

20 x Clanrats (120) - Rusty Blade

9 x Stormfiends (780) - 3x ratling cannons, 3x windlaunchers, 2xshock gauntlets, 1x doomflayer gauntlets.

1 x Warp-Grinder (80)

ENDLESS SPELLS / TERRAIN

Warp Lightning Vortex (100)

TOTAL: 2000/2000