Warcry is Killteam/Mordheim... ?

[ChaosLord]

On 2/8/2019 at 8:08 AM, zedatkinszed said:

But what I think we all want is AOS kill team not a chaos only thing.

This.

[HorticulusTGA]

26 minutes ago, ChaosLord said:

This.

No. Also your name is ChaosLord. 

To be serious, Warhammer Battle Skirmish was less flavorful in terms of models, narrative and setting than Mordheim, even if they shared a similar rule concept. In the same way, Kill Team is also less interesting than Necromunda in terms of models, fluff and setting (even if I prefer Kill Team's rules than Necromunda ones !)

Of course, universal rules for a skirmish game that everybody can use are really cool, and more open to everybody. 

But the problem is that you have to balance openness and generality with, lets say, creativity and narrative focus : 

I do prefer to have boxes of new models in a interesting setting (be it Necromunda, Mordheim or Warcry), than general rules for all, but no new miniatures / no developing the existing lore / no exploring a certain theme and area of the setting.

--

I also want to repost this, it looks so promising : 

[ManlyMuppet88]

I hadn’t actually seen that image until now. Thanks!

[Acid_Nine]

hey, no grids! I guess it's not going to be like underworld.

[JPjr]

My god, actual stairs! I was genuinely worried that the knowledge and skill required to craft these technological wonders had been lost forever in the Age of Chaos.

Seriously though Warcry is going to be a beast of a set, lets say two warbands of up to 10 unique models each, what appears to be 6 different chaos chickens and 6 daemons, plus the board and all the scenery. Damn... Can't wait, even if they somehow totally fluff the rules it's just going to be a great set for modelling.

Edited May 14, 2019 by JPjr

[Acid_Nine]

2 minutes ago, JPjr said:

My god, actual stairs! I was genuinely worried that the knowledge and skill required to craft these technological wonders had been lost forever in the Age of Chaos.

do not be deceived by Chaos! It is obviously a ploy. This is just a ladder tilted slightly against the wall!

[ChaosLord]

25 minutes ago, HorticulusTGA said:

No. Also your name is ChaosLord. 

To be serious, Warhammer Battle Skirmish was less flavorful in terms of models, narrative and setting than Mordheim, even if they shared a similar rule concept. In the same way, Kill Team is also less interesting than Necromunda in terms of models, fluff and setting (even if I prefer Kill Team's rules than Necromunda ones !)

Of course, universal rules for a skirmish game that everybody can use are really cool, and more open to everybody. 

But the problem is that you have to balance openness and generality with, lets say, creativity and narrative focus : 

I do prefer to have boxes of new models in a interesting setting (be it Necromunda, Mordheim or Warcry), than general rules for all, but no new miniatures / no developing the existing lore / no exploring a certain theme and area of the setting.

--

I also want to repost this, it looks so promising : 

That image does make it look like AOS Kill Team. I think that's what people want. If someone wants to play with a small group of their existing Nighthaunt, Stormcast or whatever models, they should be able to do that. I'm not saying every model needs rules, but most factions (BCR might not work) should have some rules in this setting. The Chaos thing seems pretty arbitrary, but it doesn't worry me much, as over the lifetime of the game I would expect GW to expand on what is available for use in the game.

[ChaosLord]

PS. I hope all the terrain pictured in that image is in the initial box set. It could be used in AOS games so would be potentially be a really good value.

[HorticulusTGA]

23 hours ago, ChaosLord said:

PS. I hope all the terrain pictured in that image is in the initial box set. It could be used in AOS games so would be potentially be a really good value.

I think it's the Starter Set indeed, so all in the box (the scenery are fine for AOS proper or even AOS Skirmish!). 

Also, one of the designer said that after the initial Chaos release, and with a new IP to explore, the game would likely expand (like Necromunda and Mordheim were focused on one area/theme, and then got expanded). 

And yeah, I understand the idea of wanting rules for almost everybody, but as I say, the way GW think their games, you'll have to choose between a rich world to explore in particular, alas with less options compared to the main game (like Necromunda), or a general rule system but with few depth in terms of new models / narrative / world building (like Kill Team). I prefer the first option even if I like both.

Edited May 15, 2019 by HorticulusTGA

[Moldek]

Personnally as a life long fan of realms of chaos and mordheim, I’m really glad they went for a specific setting as a starting point. I think it’ll really help create a narrative between players, which is a lot harder to do with a bunch of random armies. And I hope they add campaign setting as they expand the game. You won’t just be playing such and such chaos army, you’ll be playing gortuk the bloody’s warband, who has a grudge against Valksss the snake priest and a bad limp... I hope!

[Stealth_Hobo]

That starter set looks promising indeed. 😍 

All the spiky barricades, stairs and bridges makes me wonder if the terrain has tactical uses, like you could kick or throw enemy fighters down the stairs or into the spikes Dark Messiah of Might & Magic style.  Didn't Gorechosen have similar mechanics? And that was a game about chaos champions duking it out.

I really, really hope that GW will release additional terrain sets for this game, like they have done with Killzone boxes for Kill Team. Anyway, I'm really excited for this game!

[ElectricPaladin]

I think Mordheim is actually a pretty good model for Warcry. They both have robust storylines that you can't necessarily shoehorn every faction into. I think Warcry is going to be even more focused, for good or for ill.

[Acid_Nine]

34 minutes ago, ElectricPaladin said:

I think Mordheim is actually a pretty good model for Warcry. They both have robust storylines that you can't necessarily shoehorn every faction into. I think Warcry is going to be even more focused, for good or for ill.

Honestly if it's a city like mordheim (or the varanspire / allpoints) then I could see the cities spilling over into other realms, A La' hammer hall. make these areas special like necromunda, and give fluff reasons why every faction is trying to duke it out. (ie, idoneth trying to find souls / scout locations for raids, Orruks looking for a fight, storm casts trying to find a way into allpoints / kill champions, that sort of thing) it would explain why all these other factions have such easy access into the city from all the different realms.

[ChaosLord]

Release this already... I want to buy it today.

[Clan's Cynic]

I feel like Warcry's problem is that it doesn't sell itself as Not!Kill-Team visually, if that is their intention.

Kill-Team is very easy to visualise what it actually is; squad-based, small, short games using existing 40k miniatures. People easily associate it's meant to be for small '40k' games because it literally uses the same models.

Warcry meanwhile looks more like Necromunda: Mortal Realms Edition, owing to it being advertised with a suite of Chaos-only models, specific to that game. GW can go "b-but we're allowing AoS models too!" but most people aren't going to read that deep into it. You can use Chaos Cultist and Genestealer Cult models in Necromunda too, but all people think of is the game-specific Gangs.

This is presumably why Underworld's new beginner-friendly box actually uses existing AoS models instead of new, uniquely Underworlds ones.

Edited May 19, 2019 by Clan's Cynic

[HorticulusTGA]

3 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

I feel like Warcry's problem is that it doesn't sell itself as Not!Kill-Team visually, if that is their intention.

(...)

It clearly isn't (apart from the Skirmish size), so I do not see why it would be a problem. 

Warcry looks great, precisely, because it's not Kill Team (rules for everyone BUT no new models) nor Necromunda/Mordheim (i.e. expanding the "Good" Guys' settings and focusing on them).

It's a Skirmish sized game (so without a hexed board, in 3D with multi levels scenery, 10-ish models, etc.), focusing on an interesting area of the Mortal Realms (the Eightpoints), and, at last, on Chaos. That's what GW is trying to market, nothing else. 

[Carnelian]

6 hours ago, Clan's Cynic said:

This is presumably why Underworld's new beginner-friendly box actually uses existing AoS models instead of new, uniquely Underworlds ones.

Personally I suspect those models were originally built for Underworlds and then re-purposed (I think their bases look like Underworlds bases and when we saw them at first we all assumed they were new warbands before they got AoS rules). 

Anyway I don't personally see any problem in Underworlds having its own look like Necromunda (p.s. plenty of munda players play Genestealer Cult) 

[Percivael]

 What’s interesting about this image is that it includes the two starter war bands AND the furies and Vulture thing. This supports the idea that these are neutral NPCs - bestial denizens of the Allpoints that will attack anyone who gets close. I could imagine these guys getting their own random  phase, and could work to flush out warriors hiding in the safety of cover.

[ElectricPaladin]

20 minutes ago, Percivael said:

 What’s interesting about this image is that it includes the two starter war bands AND the furies and Vulture thing. This supports the idea that these are neutral NPCs - bestial denizens of the Allpoints that will attack anyone who gets close. I could imagine these guys getting their own random  phase, and could work to flush out warriors hiding in the safety of cover.

I may need to get some of those myself for scenarios with random monsters attacking both sides...

[FlatTooth]

I really wish they’d post some concrete warcry information. I’m loving the minis and the general tone of it but I’m also feeling like it could be out next week and it could be out the last week of August! I’m planning on going pretty heavily into it (barring something insane) but don’t know if I should set aside money or what haha

[novakai]

3 minutes ago, FlatTooth said:

I really wish they’d post some concrete warcry information. I’m loving the minis and the general tone of it but I’m also feeling like it could be out next week and it could be out the last week of August! I’m planning on going pretty heavily into it (barring something insane) but don’t know if I should set aside money or what haha

but the most concrete info we got about warcry was that it going to be released in July though

[FlatTooth]

13 minutes ago, novakai said:

but the most concrete info we got about warcry was that it going to be released in July though

Well ****** I missed that

 

 

Feelin a little sheepish now. 

 

Still wouldn’t hate a bit of info on the gameplay itself. 

Edited May 20, 2019 by FlatTooth

[Still-young]

37 minutes ago, FlatTooth said:

Well ****** I missed that

 

 

Feelin a little sheepish now. 

 

Still wouldn’t hate a bit of info on the gameplay itself. 

They said we’d get all that before it came out.

[FlatTooth]

Cool. I guess that’s what I’m saying is I’d like to have seen some of it? 

[Sabotage!]

I have a feeling we might see a demo of Warcry at the upcoming UK Games Expo. I'm not sure if GW has an events to show things off at in June, but I imagine they will want to show off a demo of the game at an event. Then in sometime starting in June we will get more Warhammer Community articles with more detail on how the game plays, background, warbands, etc. until the game is release in July.