Sentiment about the new releases

[Future]

I see a  lot of people in many threads and other forums being generally negative about the new releases. I am curious why? GW has been listening to feed back for awhile now and the sentiment scares me. They heard people want rules for their old models, people want rules for their 1.0 models. If the rumors are true they seem to be delivering on the promise of providing rules to the these factions, this year.

 

What worries me is the me too effect. Lots of people now feel left out that they 'only' got rules. If GW listens to this feedback we would see them planning bigger releases instead of incremental ones. This would lead back to the ways of new rules with new models every 3-5 years at most, or never for armies they don't plant o revamp. I don't want this, at all.

 

I'm just confused around the negativity when the alternative is no new rules, and your faction can use the old broken rules or you can buy a new model line. I thought we were all in consensus that this is generally terrible. If these launches go poorly and drive down public image I am worried GW will stop.

 

Is getting only a new battletome really worse than getting nothing at all?

[NinjaDetective]

It seems to be a few people who are upset complaining loudest, a lot more positive comments I've seen.

As a undead player getting a battletome was way better than nothing at all. I play all flavours of undead so  a new FEC book is awesome., endless spells and throne are just a bonus :)

 

[Future]

That is largely how I feel about seraphon. I love the models even the old ones. Some of the rules interactions are bad, no spell lore etc. 'Just a new battletome' is all I want to make them a great 2.0 army. I would rather see what comes from GW in terms of new factions than have them spend 3 years giving us a couple of models for the older factions. All the new model lines have been stunning so far and I feel very positive about the future of the game.

 

Those of us that play older factions made that choice intentionally.

[Blightzkrieg]

I think having seen the Gloomspite release people now know they can get more.

The issue is of course that not everyone can get that kind of release in a short period of time. But everyone wants that kind of release for their army.

[Future]

@Blightzkrieg That is what I am worried about. If GW releases 4-5 tomes like this and it creates a dumpster fire for pr, they will just stop. However, I'll take rules for every faction over waiting for a new model range. I'm sure dispossessed and free people players can agree on this one. No one was mad about Beasts of Chaos, or legions of Nagash, so why now?

[Shankelton]

I wouldn't read too much into it! Everyone wants the Gloomspite treatment for their faction, and for good reason! The gobbo's really set a standard for what a faction can look like in AoS that maintained much of its identity from fantasy.

If Gutbusters get a tome, where they put some spells/terrain, and a new list of rules I would be excited. But i'd also be a little sore that they didn't update any of the finecast (good as they are). We're not getting updates in a vacuum, so its only natural to compare the new releases to what has come before it.

End of the day, both these factions will be far better off with this much needed attention... and I'm sure there's a few people who'd eat their grandma to change places with them on the release schedule!

 

[Thiagoma]

I play Elves and cant wait for a BT release.

[Mandzak-Miniatures]

Personally I like the idea of combining up the broken armies back to how they were but with rules modified for AoS, plop in some endless spells and a new hero and move on. JUST to bring every army up to speed.

 

of course I expect dbl releases consistently like FEC and Skaven

 

[123lac]

Updated battle tomes is healthy for the game.

Everyone wants new models though. Gloomspite Gitz got a massive release with crazy new models, but now Skaven and FEC get 1 new hero each, some goofy looking endless spells/terrain and that's it? Bit of a letdown if you were basing your expectations on Gloomspite Gitz, whether realistic or not tbh.

[svnvaldez]

I think the new updates are great. I would love the same treatment for gutbusters.

[novakai]

let put it this way, all the blunt Stormcast release that happens every year have made us all salty in the end. Plus GW has never had a good history of sharing the love outside of there flagship races. sure you may get a Battletome now but then you may never get another update for another 5 years and if you do you end up still not getting anything new.

57 minutes ago, Future said:

@Blightzkrieg That is what I am worried about. If GW releases 4-5 tomes like this and it creates a dumpster fire for pr, they will just stop. However, I'll take rules for every faction over waiting for a new model range. I'm sure dispossessed and free people players can agree on this one. No one was mad about Beasts of Chaos, or legions of Nagash, so why now?

I pretty sure there people where mad that LON didn't have any new model because at the time Nighthaunt was not released yet

and BoC made Warherd and Gors worser so every release had it problem

hell someone complain they didn't redo the Grot  Infantry too.

[Inquisitorsz]

I've seen mostly positive responses to the FEC news.  (Who doesn't like Battleline Zombie Dragons). 
But the Skaven info has disappointed some people.  
They're probably the vocal minority. Personally i have 3k pts of Skaven from 7th and 8th Ed WFB and I'm looking forward to getting a proper battletome.  
I hate how they just rolled a whole separate faction into "chaos".  

Sure skaven need some updates.... mainly the gutter/nightrunner kit, plague monks, rat ogres. 
Some new weapon teams and replace the expensive hard to getting stuff like censer bearers and jezzails.  
Everything else is still fine. All the big kits are great, there's enough characters and the basic clanrats and stormvermin are still fine. 
But I also think that stuff can come at a later date. 

People are behaving like all we're getting is a book, spells and dice. That may be true for now, but Skaven are a much bigger faction than Beasts of Chaos or FEC. I'm sure we'll see a few more model updates soon. 

Also, a new book is a great way for customers to show GW that we care about skaven and want new toys. The better this book sells, the more likely we are to get new kits quicker.  

[SwampHeart]

I'm hype. I'm a long time BoC player and I know I was ecstatic when the BoC news dropped and I'm excited for all the Skaven and FEC players out there to get some love. Do we all wish for lots of new models and huge new releases? Of course. Would I rather have armies languish without proper allegiance abilities, spells, and artifacts while we wait for that? Absolutely not. 

[novakai]

6 minutes ago, Inquisitorsz said:

 

Also, a new book is a great way for customers to show GW that we care about skaven and want new toys. The better this book sells, the more likely we are to get new kits quicker.  

Of course if you don't go reach close to the stormcast level of sales then it feel for not sometimes

[Ironbreaker]

As a Dispossessed player, all I would ever want at a minimum for my army is a battletome with updated rules and the ability to take Ironweld Duardin units without ally points.

[Vextol]

I would honestly buy a new book each year... It's like a Christmas present.  New models would be great, but new rules are the bees knees. 

I would be fine if they said "All done with new models for 2019.  Get ready for some amazing books." 

That said, I am going to go the other way.  If you are OK updating armies without new models, GET ME MY DAMN SERAPHON BOOK!! 

[Barbossal]

I understand it, and it's understandable from that perspective. I'd imagine that if I was a Skaven player eagerly awaiting my release for ~4 years and unlike the other factions who get new units, updated models, etc. - I'd be pretty disappointed too. There's no reason to blame someone if they wish their faction got more content, I think that's pretty reasonable.

As a Seraphon player - I desperately want Plastic Salamander/Razordon hunting packs, or Slann/Kroxigors/etc. For me - it means I don't have to pay $36 for a 40 point essential model that looks pretty atrocious.

[angrycontra]

Now I don't know if I'm considered to be one of these "negative" people, since I fully admit that I said that this was slightly disappointing release for me but here's what I think:

First of all, I still love the fact that this(these) new book(s) is(are) coming and I enjoy the fact that both my skaven pestilens and skaven skyre armies are gonna get possibly more options and better synergies. However, when it comes to Skaven and FEC, I was expecting at least some new model updates. Maybe they're coming later, I don't know, but both factions really needed some updates, even if it were just a couple of boxes. In fact, these releases have now made me nervous about future fyreslayer releases. Skaven I can live with despite no new models but fyreslayers? They're the most monotone army in the game. Gw can't expect them to sell any better if some lousy scenery/endless spells is all they get. I think it's perfectly fair for me to voice my concerns and disappointments. In fact, I think any fan who just blindly accepts any not so great product / lack of desired product is just feeding Gw to not care about their releases even more.

And now WARNING Incoming stormcast rant WARNING...

Now I don't mind the fact that SCE got new models in 2.0. I know they are AoS main faction and I've already accepted that. Further more they are kinda cool and they really needed some new units (such as wizards and war machines)...

BUT...

Every lord-exorcist, every castigator, every unnecessary extra version of lord-arcanum and every extra variation of evocators/knight-incantor/lord-ordinator (2+ versions of each of these models was unnecessary) was a complete and utter waste of that model designer's time and effort. Thanks to these, plus some poor rule designs, stormcast have become bloated mess, with huge number of useless/redundant units and meanwhile armies that needed new models get nothing. Now I know it's never as simple as this sure (and designing multiple forms of lord-arcanum was probably very quick process for them) but I still consider every useless release for stormcast be one less actually useful release for one of the other factions. I would've gladly seen all the useless stuff mentioned above be gone, if it meant that both Skaven and Fec got at least 1 new kit each. And let me be clear on one thing, I don't hate stormcast for the sake of it, I just want gw to really consider what units they add to army that already has everything. I wouldn't be happy if the new skaven release had some new stormfiends that are better than the current ones and same goes for every army in the game. Rant over.

 

[novakai]

27 minutes ago, angrycontra said:

 

And now WARNING Incoming stormcast rant WARNING...

Now I don't mind the fact that SCE got new models in 2.0. I know they are AoS main faction and I've already accepted that. Further more they are kinda cool and they really needed some new units (such as wizards and war machines)...

BUT...

Every lord-exorcist, every castigator, every unnecessary extra version of lord-arcanum and every extra variation of evocators/knight-incantor/lord-ordinator (2+ versions of each of these models was unnecessary) was a complete and utter waste of that model designer's time and effort. Thanks to these, plus some poor rule designs, stormcast have become bloated mess, with huge number of useless/redundant units and meanwhile armies that needed new models get nothing. Now I know it's never as simple as this sure (and designing multiple forms of lord-arcanum was probably very quick process for them) but I still consider every useless release for stormcast be one less actually useful release for one of the other factions. I would've gladly seen all the useless stuff mentioned above be gone, if it meant that both Skaven and Fec got at least 1 new kit each. And let me be clear on one thing, I don't hate stormcast for the sake of it, I just want gw to really consider what units they add to army that already has everything. I wouldn't be happy if the new skaven release had some new stormfiends that are better than the current ones and same goes for every army in the game. Rant over.

 

as a Vanguard fan I kind was sad that Vanguard stormcast is still meh after the last battletome

my opinion though is that FEC probably deserved a little bit more then just the Archreagent since this was a 2nd release for them, while they did need rule updates, their old  battletome probably could have carry them a little bit longer until they got one or two kits.

of course if  rumor are true that they do get deathwalker units in the army, it gives them something to work with (along with the infamous zombie models)

Skaven has plenty of models in it range like 6 verminlords and a lot newer units from Endtime, since this is the first time they are unified as a force in AoS, is a new frontier for them.

[Lucky Snake Eyes]

I don't understand the negativity either. I played Vampire counts briefly in 8th edition WFB using a friends army and was glad to see I could get back to my vamps with LoN. Albeit seeing the past few releases I feel a trend is being set that they want every army to have some sort of terrain and endless spells so I wouldn't be surprised if the upcoming soul wars set will play out similarly to carrion empire and be accompanied by new battletomes, terrain and endless spells as an update for LoN or soulblight as well as some order army if not more stormcast stuff. Discussions go on endlessly about what changes or new stuff LoN could get but if any new models for the death range where to be released it would have to be for soulblight or a new death faction, comparatively death is kinda falling behind in the number of army options with only 3 real choices if you don't count soulblight compared to chaos' 7, destruction's 4-5 and order's bucketfull of armies. I'd love to see more small armies like fyreslayers or soulblight get the FEC treatment even if it is just endless spells, terrain and a tome overhaul but I also understand that they need to keep supporting the armies that sell the most. I'm sure we can all agree armies like KO need some love at least.

[Lucky Snake Eyes]

Just throwing in an aside after having spoken to a friend of mine who plays skaven, he loves the news. He was always happy with the skaven range, just wanted sculpt updates, and likes the idea of new rules so that he can start using some of his models that have been shelved for a little too long. I get where he's coming from as a death player there are a few units that I've just shelved and haven't used because of bad rules and lack of battalion support. I can see this issue already happening with stormcast too.

[novakai]

3 minutes ago, Lucky Snake Eyes said:

Just throwing in an aside after having spoken to a friend of mine who plays skaven, he loves the news. He was always happy with the skaven range, just wanted sculpt updates, and likes the idea of new rules so that he can start using some of his models that have been shelved for a little too long. I get where he's coming from as a death player there are a few units that I've just shelved and haven't used because of bad rules and lack of battalion support. I can see this issue already happening with stormcast too.

I don't thing the Skaven side are unhappy with the release, maybe minor disappointment that their iconic status didn't equal love from GW but they seem more happy about it

I think the FEC side is where it mostly coming from (come on at least give them new dice what is up with that)

[Skreech Verminking]

Well as a skavenplayer, I am very hyped and happy that we finally get that so long awaited battletome after 7-9 or so years.

(not counting pestilence or the end times)

although I am still a bit disappointed, nonetheless Gw did a great job.

 

[Future]

I guess I look at it the other way. Instead of being like well GW isn't supporting new models, I see it as well GW could have said these factions are out of the game. New game, new models, (not) sorry about your fantasy stuff. 

2 hours ago, Barbossal said:

I desperately want Plastic Salamander/Razordon hunting packs, or Slann/Kroxigors/etc. For me - it means I don't have to pay $36 for a 40 point essential model that looks pretty atrocious.

Same. Honestly for Razordon I would be happy with them just changing the rules. Make a Razordon unit size be the model + handlers like the new ballista from SC. If they keep the same 4x4 unit size for them they really need to do a plastic kit like flesh hounds. Given the way releases are going I'm hopeful for new rules... although I'd have to sell off some razordons at that point.

[Throt the Unclean]

@FutureI've been very negative about the new release because of how extremely lazy it looks. Obviously, doing a dual release with Flesh Eaters Courts was too much for the GW creative team, having just come off of the incredible Gloomspite release. I would honestly have preferred only the book be released. I wish they would have put all their time and energy into that instead of half-assing the spells, terrain, and dice. Maybe they did put all of their time and energy into the book, which is why the other things are so lack luster. Who knows? If that's the case I will be more than happy. If all of it sucks, then I would have rather had nothing at all, obviously. lol 

I think criticism in general is very healthy and good thing. All criticism is constructive, in my mind, even if it isn't accompanied by solutions or positivity. Without criticism the world would still be an archaic and awful place.

You said you were wondering why people are being critical and negative about this release. Go and read my comments in the thread about this release in the Chaos forums.