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Malakree

AoS2 - Dankhold Troggoth Discussion

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Posted (edited)

So couple of things to start with.
My reason for this thread is simple, the Gloomspite Gitz thread is going to be ridiculously congested with at least 4 separate discussions going on. Anyone who has been following the Gloomspite thread knows that it's gained something like 10 pages in the past few days making it impossible to keep track of things. As a result I've decided to start this thread up in order to create a unique thread purely for the discussion of heavy Troggoth lists. Obviously they are still Gloomspite and can freely take from the allegiance so it's not quite it's own but I think it will help compartmentalise the discussions into much more managable areas.

The second and most important reason is that for the first time we can now field a 100% Troggoth army and this needs to be celebrated!

Ground Rules
As this is a bit of a unique case for the destruction forums I'm going to layout a few basic things as to what sort of lists go here and what goes in the main Gloomspite thread.

  • This thread is for Troggoth focused armies and the units/options available.
  • Broader Gloomspite units can be included but treat them more like easy to obtain allies.
  • Discussions of lists which don't have Dankhold Troggbosses as generals or all the Troggoth battleline are fine. As long as the list itself is trogg focused.
  • if it's not at least 50% Troggoths it should probably be in the main Gloomspite thread.

So what does all that mean, well here's a quick example to try and help you understand. 

Spoiler
Quote

Leaders
Skragrott, the Loonking (220)
- General
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
Dankhold Troggboss (300)


Battleline
20 x Stabbas (130)
20 x Stabbas (130)
20 x Stabbas (130)

Units
1 x Dankhold Troggoth (220)
1 x Dankhold Troggoth (220)
6 x Rockgut Troggoth (320)

Total: 1970/1220

Clearly this list is Troggoth focused, for all Skragrott is the general and we have stabba battleline it's pretty obvious why the choices have been made and how this might be an option instead of pure 100% Troggoths.

Quote

Leaders
Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (300)
- General
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
Loonboss on Giant Squig (110)


Battleline
20 x Stabbas (130)
20 x Stabbas (130)
6 x Squig Herd (70)

Units
10 x Boingrot Bounders
(200)
10 x Boingrot Bounders (200)
1 x Dankhold Troggoth (220)
3 x Rockgut Troggoth (160)
3 x Rockgut Troggoth (160)

Total: 1980/1220

Though this list has a lot of Troggoths in it it's clearly a more broad list and isn't focused around the Troggs. While it's fine to bring up this kind of list in order to compare/contrast to a more heavy Trogg list a discussion focused around it should be in the main Gloomspite thread as it IS a mixed list.

With all of that said, I'm not going to be "enforcing" any of this it's more to make sure this isn't detracting from the primary Gloomspite thread, instead being reserved for the much more focused Dankhold style lists. So without further ado. 

 

Below are the points costs for the various Troggoth units.

Spoiler
  • Troggoth Hag - 380
  • Dankhold Troggboss - 300
  • Dankhold Troggoth - 220 (1/3)
  • Rockgut Troggoths (Battleline iff) - 160 (3/12)
  • Fellwater Troggoths (Battleline iff) - 160 (3/12)

This means that the minimum size force for a pure Troggoth force is 780 leaving 1220 points spare

Quote

Leaders
Dankhold Troggboss (300)

Battleline
3 x Troggoths (160)
3 x Troggoths (160)
3 x Troggoths (160)

Total: 780/1220

Any questions etc. just ask.

Edited by Malakree
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Do we know what the Troggoth specific battalion grants yet?

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A 6+ to wound gives an extra point of damage for troggherd models

180pts

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2 minutes ago, Rid said:

A unmodified roll of a 6 to wound gives an extra point of damage for troggherd models

180pts

Quote

 

1-3 Dankhold Troggboss

3-9 Dankhold Troggoths, Fellwater Troggoths and Rotgut Troggoths in any combination

0-2 Aleguzzler Gargant

 

What makes me sad is that none of it is keyword bold so the Bonegrinder/Troggoth Hag doesn't go in it.

I'm hoping they change it to 

Quote

 

1-3 Gloomspite Troggoth Hero

3-9 Gloomspite Troggoths without the Hero keyword

0-2 Aleguzzler units

 

So that the Hag/Bonegrinder can be included in the battalion. I mean the battalion is awful so it probably won't come up but it's still irritating that one of the best Troggoth units, the Hag, can't be included. Hell even if they only changed it to Fellwater that would at least let her be included as a fellwater troggoth.

I can't help feeling that I'd rather just include another 3 troggs and take my 20 points towards triumph rather than including it.

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Posted (edited)

For a 1000 point force we can have 3 fellwater troggs, 3 rockgut troggs, a troggoth hag, and a dankhold troggboss....I'm sold so count me in.

Edited by BrocknerTheBear
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So I've been playing around with the numbers a bit and I feel like there are three questions which have to be asked when going into a list.

  1. To Hag or not to Hag, that is the 380 point question!
  2. Dankhold General or Skragrott, I really think those are the only 2 general choices for Dankhold armies.
  3. How many Grots for bodies.

First conclusion is that you can't have all 3. My reasoning is simple.

Ideally we want at 2 Troggbosses, enough to ensure the CA doesn't get sniped but iirc from when I looked through the book yesterday the only difference between the Troggboss and the normal Troggoths was +2 wounds and the CA. 80 points is to much to justify going beyond the point you've secured your CA. Anyway that's 600 points down the pan before we do anything else, leaving us with only 1400 points to actually play with. 

The first choice is to grab a Hag, if we do that shes basically points, combined with the 2 Troggbosses that's a whopping 1k points gone on just your 3 hero options.

If you're going for Skragrott it costs at least 430 points, his 220 and 3 squig herds for your battleline. Honestly though I feel like if you grab Skragrott you might as well get the grots needed for the bodies/wounds and to take advantage of the Moonshrine. Taking that into account the realistic cost of Skragrott and his 60 stabbas is 610 points, or  840 if you want one of them to be a unit of 60. This heavily hacks into the budget of 1400!

That is basically a list on it's own.

Spoiler

Leaders
Skragrott, the Loonking (220)
- General
Troggoth Hag (380)
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
Dankhold Troggboss (300)

Battleline
60 x Stabbas (360)
20 x Stabbas (130)
20 x Stabbas (130)

Total 1840/2000

Suddenly we have a very limited number of Troggoths and I'm questioning the double Troggboss. At which point we might as well transition into more of a mixed list.

Hence, either Skragrott or Hag. Obviously for those of us without a Hag the choice becomes very easy but it's useful to know for buying purposes. 

My initial thoughts on Dankhold Skragrott list are then looking something like this 

Quote

Leaders
Skragrott, the Loonking (220)
- General
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
Dankhold Troggboss (300)

Battleline
60 x Stabbas (360)
20 x Stabbas (130)
20 x Stabbas (130)

Units
3 x Rockgut Troggoths (160)
3 x Rockgut Troggoths (160)

Total 1760/2000 (240 points float)

Obviously there's a little bit of flex in how many grots you take and you can replace one of the 20s with a squig herd to shave some extra points. It's damn tricky to build though and I'm not sure we need the quantity of command points so you're really only getting him for his CA and spells, we could maybe take 2 fungoids at 180 instead and go for a Dankhold General.

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Posted (edited)

Well, I don’t think it’ll be good but I’m gonna go for this for starters:

Trogboss

2x Fungoid Shaman

Dankhold x1

Rockgut x6

Fellwater x6

Stabbas x60 in some variation of units

Cauldron endless spell to zing out some spells. Or maybe the Balewind and Geminids  

Batallion

2k

 

Would like the Hag too, could be done if I ditched the endless spell, a Fungoid and 3 Rockguts / Fellwaters. I do think having a blob of Grots will be a good shout as you get half your investment back through the shrine and we’ll need bodies. Any thoughts gratefully accepted. 

Edited by 5kaven5lave
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Firstly thanks for the thread, I spent ages searching for Troggoth information in the previous one.

A big block of stabbas or shootas may be needed but I'm all about the DANK, so I think a Hag is almost an auto include, especially as I highly rate spell-spite.

I don't have any models purchased, so I'll be starting completely fresh so the 780 point list you posted above is extremely helpful @Malakree

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I already have Hag, Gargant and 15 fellwater troggoths. I'm going for a swamp theme with lots of water effects on bases so I'm going to just add 3 more Fellwater troggoths and a Dankhold Throggboss. Going for a full Troggoth list. I would like another Dankhold troggoth but the points are really awkward and I dont know what I would cut out.

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1 hour ago, Malakree said:
  Reveal hidden contents

Leaders
Skragrott, the Loonking (220)
- General
Troggoth Hag (380)
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
Dankhold Troggboss (300)

Battleline
60 x Stabbas (360)
20 x Stabbas (130)
20 x Stabbas (130)

Total 1840/2000

Suddenly we have a very limited number of Troggoths and I'm questioning the double Troggboss. At which point we might as well transition into more of a mixed list.

 

I'm interested in whats the benefit of running bosses instead of Regular Dankhold troggoths? Isn't the main advantage of the boss to give troggoth battleline. I mean the regular Dankhold Troggoth is 80 points cheaper for a nerf of 2 wounds

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You know when I think about discussing Troggoth lists I don't think "let me put ONE HUNDRED tiny goblins in my list"

Let's get serious with the Troggoth lists here guys

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3 minutes ago, Walrustaco said:

You know when I think about discussing Troggoth lists I don't think "let me put ONE HUNDRED tiny goblins in my list"

Let's get serious with the Troggoth lists here guys

I do agree with this! Its not a Troggoth list if your battleline aint Troggoths

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9 minutes ago, Walrustaco said:

You know when I think about discussing Troggoth lists I don't think "let me put ONE HUNDRED tiny goblins in my list"

Let's get serious with the Troggoth lists here guys

I agree, maybe we should start discussing the other Troggoths available and their use in game to expand this thread.

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, j0lt said:

I agree, maybe we should start discussing the other Troggoths available and their use in game to expand this thread.

We have 6 units if you count Gargants. Thats plenty.

EDIT: 7 units forgot about the FW Bonegrinder Gargant

Edited by Eevika

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The troll hag is cool as a model, but not exactly something I want to paint or field as it's a bit rank (which is impressive for a miniature), so what I'd likely do is get a Dankhold and get converting; I'm thinking of a hood over its face that covers its eyes and some shamanistic additions. Along with a 120mm base of course. Not a case of it might be cheaper, it's just the aesthetics.

I'm still torn on what exactly I'll be doing since I have a swamp themed Fimir army, but never had any Fellwaters as they were just bad by comparison. Now they're good, so at 2k points I can see myself running 1k points of trolls and 1k points of Fimir as GA Destruction; Arachnacauldron getting those juicy spells out of allegiance. At 1k I'd go Gloomspite. There's always the possibility that I'd go 2k with all trolls but that's too expensive for an immediate buy.

As for the battalion, even at 2k it's too expensive, even if you factor in that 50 points of Command Point. The extra item is cool, but again I'd rather have more trolls as they'll be doing more damage than natural 6s to wound ever will provide.

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15 minutes ago, Knight Scáthach of Fimm said:

The troll hag is cool as a model, but not exactly something I want to paint or field as it's a bit rank (which is impressive for a miniature), so what I'd likely do is get a Dankhold and get converting; I'm thinking of a hood over its face that covers its eyes and some shamanistic additions. Along with a 120mm base of course. Not a case of it might be cheaper, it's just the aesthetics.

 I'm still torn on what exactly I'll be doing since I have a swamp themed Fimir army, but never had any Fellwaters as they were just bad by comparison. Now they're good, so at 2k points I can see myself running 1k points of trolls and 1k points of Fimir as GA Destruction; Arachnacauldron getting those juicy spells out of allegiance. At 1k I'd go Gloomspite. There's always the possibility that I'd go 2k with all trolls but that's too expensive for an immediate buy.

 As for the battalion, even at 2k it's too expensive, even if you factor in that 50 points of Command Point. The extra item is cool, but again I'd rather have more trolls as they'll be doing more damage than natural 6s to wound ever will provide.

The biggest up side of a battalion is in my opinion the one drop army. Or 2 drop with the hag. Also that conversion idea I personally dont like as the Hag is so much bigger than a Dankhold troggoth will be. 

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17 minutes ago, Eevika said:

The biggest up side of a battalion is in my opinion the one drop army. Or 2 drop with the hag. Also that conversion idea I personally dont like as the Hag is so much bigger than a Dankhold troggoth will be. 

In terms of mass maybe, we haven't seen them side by side; I reckon they'll be roughly similar heights. Provided it's on the same base and clearly shows what it is it'll be fine, assuming the danktroll is big enough.

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small nitpick ( sorry)
is it possible to edit the name of the topic? it's a bit unfortunate, as you are intending to cover all Troggherd units, but Fellwater, Hag, Rockgut, and Gargants aren't Dankhold. 

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Posted (edited)

To add to the discussion there is one more troggoth unit available. Mollug from shadespire underworlds.

 

Hes got a club that auto inflicts mortal wounds, and some squig pals that may make things interesting. Also he’s a dankhold troll so tilts the battallion

Edited by Gothmaug
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20 minutes ago, Gothmaug said:

To add to the discussion there is one more troggoth unit available. Mollug from shadespire underworlds.

 

Hes got a club that auto inflicts mortal wounds, and some squig pals that may make things interesting. Also he’s a dankhold troll so tilts the battallion

Good spot!, totally didn't think about that.

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1 Dankhold Troggboss 300

1 Troggoth Hag 380

1 Mollog 170

6 Fellwater Trogs 320

6 Fellwater Trogs 320

3 Rockgut Trogs 160

3 Rockgut Trogs 160

1 Dankhold Trog 220

Troggoth Herd 180

1950/2000

 

Thats gonna be my force 🤘🏿

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3 minutes ago, Rid said:

1 Dankhold Troggboss 300

1 Troggoth Hag 380

1 Mollog 170

6 Fellwater Trogs 320

6 Fellwater Trogs 320

3 Rockgut Trogs 160

3 Rockgut Trogs 160

1 Dankhold Trog 220

Troggoth Herd 180

1950/2000

 

Thats gonna be my force 🤘🏿

That's more like it. 

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All the available types, now time to get gud with it 🤜🏻🤛🏻

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19 minutes ago, Rid said:

1 Dankhold Troggboss 300

1 Troggoth Hag 380

1 Mollog 170

6 Fellwater Trogs 320

6 Fellwater Trogs 320

3 Rockgut Trogs 160

3 Rockgut Trogs 160

1 Dankhold Trog 220

Troggoth Herd 180

1950/2000

 

Thats gonna be my force 🤘🏿

I calculated the total cost and you have 2210 points there mate.

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Maths is hard

1 Dankhold Trogboss 300

1 Trog Hag 380

1 Mollog

6 Fellwater Trogs 320

3 Fellwater Trogs 160

3 Rockgut Trogs 160

1 Dankhold Trog 220

Troggoth Herd 180

 

leaves 110 for two command pts and possibly a triumph 

 

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