Starting Death LoB or SoulBlight

[wakadaka]

Howdy there folks so recently I decided to pick up Death as I'm a big fan of blood knights and the old vampires in general. Now because of that I've been looking to either build up a Legion of Blood or Soulblight force, so my question is, in general how would one describe the gameplay of both? And along with that what are some other good death units? Thanks for the help!

[XReN]

One word: Glasshammer
Even though bloodknights can hit hard, they are fragile and you can't ressurect them in any way and so are vargheists
You will need to include some horde units to drag enemy heavy-hitters down whille your elites wreck targets that can't fight back and it'll still be sub optimal pick since LoN can have hordes that wreck faces

[Honk]

2 hours ago, XReN said:

Even though bloodknights can hit hard

And if they’re done charging, they don’t even hit that hard anymore...

Soulblight is high elite and needs to be played very tactically, not to get bogged down in some horde. And while the bloodlines give some variety, you play the fluffy evil knights of old... swift death will let them zoom over the table and punch people in the face, remember, that you can  „flee“ over a unit.

LoB on the other side is more rooted in the LoN book, has a big variety of units to choose from. Two general way for LoB to roll, one is favorite retainer spam (keyword vamp lords get +1 attack to all melee) or you go for the -1 bravery spam with overwhelming dread spell, death banner and morghast you can give a unit up to -5 bry then use a double mortis engine and some banshees.

A mix of both is also quite nice, the -1 might force a bravery roll and bye bye to some high cost elite model (brutes, bullgors) 

 

[wakadaka]

What are the best Lords currently for both armies? I heard VloZD were quite good

And In LoB what would be better 2x 5 man Blood Knight Squads or a single 10 man squad? Cheers!

[CaptainSoup]

14 minutes ago, wakadaka said:

What are the best Lords currently for both armies? I heard VloZD were quite good

And In LoB what would be better 2x 5 man Blood Knight Squads or a single 10 man squad? Cheers!

Admittedly I do not have much experience with LoB or Soulblight. That being said VLoZD is a good pick regardless of what army you are playing. The only others I could think of would be their respective mortarchs. They are not top tier by any stretch but they are very thematic and you magnetizing the model so you can switch between mortarch is very cost effective.

As for Blood Knights, that would depend on what you are using them for. A bigger blob means one less thing to deploy, though you may need to split them for better board coverage or a battalion. So it is a matter of preference. 

[Honk]

3 hours ago, wakadaka said:

And In LoB what would be better 2x 5 man Blood Knight Squads or a single 10 man squad?

Depends on the rest of your list... if you want a brutal assault unit a 10 men squad is nice. But you need other complementary units, maybe wolves to secure the flanks. 

Also with the big unit, you’ll need to make sure to hit where you want and need it. But it is easier to buff them into total madness 

[wakadaka]

How does this look for a starting 1000 LoB ilst

 

Lords

VloZD 440

Vampire Lord 140

 

Troops

3 x 5 Dire Wolves 180

1 x 5 Blood Knights  240

 

Cheers!

[CaptainSoup]

8 hours ago, wakadaka said:

How does this look for a starting 1000 LoB ilst

 

Lords

VloZD 440

Vampire Lord 140

 

Troops

3 x 5 Dire Wolves 180

1 x 5 Blood Knights  240

 

Cheers!

Very thematic, though it is lacking a good bit in damage. To balance out your source of damage output you could switch the Blood Knights for a horde unit. It will make it a little less thematic, but it will save you when your VLoZD dies and you run out of damage dealing units.

[Honk]

On 12/28/2018 at 9:23 PM, wakadaka said:

How does this look

@CaptainSoup is kinda right...

 

scoring might be tricky, positioning of your two hammer units (dragon+knights) is critical. If you can get both units to hit their targets with a buffed charge you‘re set. Countercharges can be blocked with wolves and if there are no enemies left, victory points will follow ;-D

 I really like the list

[wakadaka]

@CaptainSoup I can see where you're coming from however I would prefer not to drop them if at all possible I was possibly contemplating however removing the second lord and one wolf pack to add in either necro+skeles/ double skeletons/ or a blob of 30 zambies to try and help against the hordes.

 

@HonkGlad you like it I admit like captainsoup said though if the Lord flops the damage could be lacking. However I can see them sweet sweet blood knight charges if they are protected XD

[Honk]

The classic dilemma.

basically using blood knights is just not point efficient. For the equal amount you get 20 wolves(40hp), and they are summonable and will tear down those knights...

I (again personally) would rather switch out the lord on dragon for a second set of lord+knights (380pts) that leaves you with 240 points

You could get 20 skellis and 5 doggies or 10(2x5) doggies and 10 skellis.

Was thinking about a necromancer but not enough summonable, but the extra bravery debuff through overwhelming dread could come in handy. Necromancer with one pack, the other puppies positioned to harass flankers.

again, no hordes in your side, but that’s the price of noble knights

40skellis necro, 10 blackknights vampirelord and 5doggies and a coven throne (990pts) is possible 

[wakadaka]

@Honk Fair enough. If only they wer 40ish points less I think they would properly priced.

 

I mean If I remove the dragon I would Imagine something like

Lords

Vampire Lord 140

 

Battleline 

2 x 5 doggos 120

2 x 20 Skeles 320

5 Pointy Teeth Knights 240

 

Which would leave 180 points for something Maybe another lord or perhaps Vargeists or Black Knights? Would probably make it a bit smoother. That is keeping in spooky nights of course XD which I wanna try because I'm a sucker for their aesthetics >.> There is a time in every man's life where they must choose how much does the rule of cool mean to them and for me well I'll see XD

[Honk]

6 hours ago, wakadaka said:

There is a time in every man's life where they must choose how much does the rule of cool mean to them and for me well I'll see 

Other elite cavalry like Khorne juggernaut or the ironjawz boarboyz cost around 180... but I think we are not meant to have elite melee forces, morghast about the same and that there is an extra tax imposed on us. Wich is kinda ok, sometimes it hurts...

So the hunting party could be 

heroes

2lords and a necro (390)

elite

2x5 knights.                (480)

battle line

2x5 wolves                    (120)

                              Total   990

 

i think some overwhelming dread from the necromancer fits every face and what else to get if you throw him out for 120 points?! 20 zombies or another 10 dogs. 

Two forces 2x5 dogs, knights and lord... good speed, dogs prevent counter charges and if you don’t delete the unit you can retreat with the knights and keep the dogs stuck to prevent the chase... especially for Soulblight an option.

if you play LoB you could combine the knights into one big unit, throw out one lord for a necro and 10 puppies for 20 zombies. The gravesites will heal them...

 

[discoking]

On 12/28/2018 at 6:12 AM, wakadaka said:

Howdy there folks so recently I decided to pick up Death as I'm a big fan of blood knights and the old vampires in general. Now because of that I've been looking to either build up a Legion of Blood or Soulblight force, so my question is, in general how would one describe the gameplay of both? And along with that what are some other good death units? Thanks for the help!

Soulblight is all I've played since AoS landed and it's an amazing army to play.Fast,hard hitting and against a lot of armies extremely durable. Is it the best,most competitive death army? Nope and nor is it the best use of points but it's an army of Vampires (super cool in itself) which is tactically challenging and extremely rewarding to play.  Pure Soulblight gets no synergies or shenanigans and relies purely on good tactical play to do well. As there is no ultimate build,set play or cheat sheets to go thru every game is different. Master movement,positioning and timing and you'll do well Soulblight. 

My current list is: 

VLoZD

3x5 Blood Knights

2x6 Vargiests

4 command points(200pts) 

[Honk]

2 hours ago, discoking said:

Master movement,positioning and timing and you'll do well Soulblight. 

Yes Master Discoking... as you command!!!

(If I mastered all this, I can play whatever is worst at the moment and pull off a win  XD )

may I ask what you need 4 command points for?!

[wakadaka]

@Honk Dear lord honk your list that's a nice go big or go home list and hope the knights aren't tar pitted lol. Also I think Blood Knights if priced the same as the other elite cav would be a little underpriced 200 seems like the appropriate price to me at least, then again their biggest strength is that on the charge they can tear most things asunder where as the others are hellah durable and can deal good damage.

 

@discoking I as the same honk What's the 4 CPs for I imagine they are to help with charge rolls?  and also that list looks pretty sweet.

[discoking]

 

5 hours ago, Honk said:

Yes Master Discoking... as you command!!!

(If I mastered all this, I can play whatever is worst at the moment and pull off a win  XD )

may I ask what you need 4 command points for?!

hehe,oops shoulda read 'you'll do well with Soulblight'.   By all means call me Master tho 😁

Command points are there to ensure what ever charges gets maximum hits from the VLoZD command ability.  

 

[wakadaka]

little update on my part, got my first models in the form of 5 Blood Knights, Vampire Lord (The Vlad model), a squad of zambies, and an old blood dragon on a horse to act as a more thematic lord. 

 

My question what spells, traits and relics have been looking good for death?

[XReN]

24 minutes ago, wakadaka said:

little update on my part, got my first models in the form of 5 Blood Knights, Vampire Lord (The Vlad model), a squad of zambies, and an old blood dragon on a horse to act as a more thematic lord. 

 

My question what spells, traits and relics have been looking good for death?

Spells: Amethystine Pinions, Amaranthine Orb and Vile Transference for vampires, Overwhelming Dread and Fading vigour for non-vampires
Traits: -1 to hit or rerolling charges for SOULBLIGHT units within 9" of the general, both from Legion of Blood

Artefacts: Aetherial Amulet for VLoZD, Aetherquartz Brooch for more CPs because you'll love your CAs being stacked on your Blood Knights/VLoZD

[XReN]

And whille thinking this through I created quite an interesting (IMO) list


Allegiance: Legion of Blood
Mortal Realm: Shyish

Leaders
Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (440)
- General
- Deathlance & Shield & Chalice
- Trait: Aura of Dark Majesty 
- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet 
- Lore of the Vampires: Vile Transference
Vampire Lord (140)
- Mount: Flying Horror
- Lore of the Vampires: Amaranthine Orb
Necromancer (110)
- Lore of the Deathmages: Overwhelming Dread

Battleline
40 x Skeleton Warriors (280)
- Ancient Spears
5 x Dire Wolves (60)
5 x Dire Wolves (60)

Units
10 x Blood Knights (480)
6 x Vargheists (320)

Total: 1890 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 138


So here most of your army can hit like a truck, mess really hard with opponents bravery and also very fast 

[Honk]

4 hours ago, XReN said:

I created quite an interesting (IMO) list

Looks pretty punchy, esp. within LoB...

For an elite army, I also like Mannfred (wrong legion) or the Coven Throne, those CA crank the dial to 11

[Evil Bob]

17 hours ago, XReN said:

Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (440)
- General
- Deathlance & Shield & Chalice
- Trait: Aura of Dark Majesty 
- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet 
- Lore of the Vampires: Vile Transference

This is my dream build right here!  Still need to kit-bash enough knights to officially join the club.  I generally prefer a sword over the lance because “MOAR DICE!” and statistics.

If you have any experience with Varghiests and wouldn’t mind sharing then please do so XReN.  I own six but haven’t felt any urge to actually field them.  So everything is theory craft over here.

[Honk]

5 hours ago, Evil Bob said:

I generally prefer a sword over the lance because “MOAR DICE!” and statistics.

Don’t forget the deathlance charge, buffing the damage to a flat 3...

My experience with vargheists are pretty decent. They are squishy with their 5+ save, and pricey, but put out a bunch of damage. In a „swift death“ lineage, they move 14“, I had Mannfred in range and 6 of them ripped 5 blighkings to shreds... 

but as usual, the damage/survivability over the points costs favors a rabble horde... the coolness/awesome over the well positioned charge favors vargheists XD

[XReN]

On 1/26/2019 at 4:48 AM, Evil Bob said:

If you have any experience with Varghiests and wouldn’t mind sharing then please do so XReN.  I own six but haven’t felt any urge to actually field them.  So everything is theory craft over here.

I'm stormcast and FEC player so no expirience with them
The though process behind taking them was based on few advantages that they have over Blood Knights:
Price and accessibility of models
They cost less in points so they fit in nicely
They can fly, thats something that Blood Knights can't, unless you play Soulblight with specific bloodline

[Honk]

1 hour ago, XReN said:

Blood Knights:
Price and accessibility of models

It’s called Dragon Blades...