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Starting Beasts of chaos, need advice...


Damian
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19 hours ago, Damian said:

Just started (bought the army book) an wondering how best to approach building an army?

Maybe 2x 'Start collecting' box + a few others? (Which others would you recommend)?

All advice appreciated...

Chimerae are amazing. 

It all depends on how strong you want to be. The start collecting is a good place to start as it doesn't waste time with Gors but gives you Ungors and Bestigors which are both great.

I'd rank a Beastlord pretty high too on the list for his command ability.

You need a herdstone

I feel like the Endless spells are a shoe in for that bull spell

The Tzaangor units are also quite good if you want a Tzeentch theme at all

 

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19 hours ago, Damian said:

Just started (bought the army book) an wondering how best to approach building an army?

Maybe 2x 'Start collecting' box + a few others? (Which others would you recommend)?

All advice appreciated...

Before I offer a ton of advice - a few questions:

-What's your goal - are you wanting to build a super competitive lists or something more narrative or something else all together?
-Do you have any must include models?
-Are there any particular battalions or great frays that have jumped out at you yet?

I don't want to go giving advice about ultra competitive lists if that doesn't fit your style, or tell you to take a certain model when you just can't stand it. 

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Thanks for replies, I will try to answer you as much as I can... We will be trying for 2000 points

1, I will be mainly playing with friends/local league, most  who main mostly Stormcast Eternal armies, the others Nagash and Nighthaunt respectively, so i'm guessing mortal wounds would be important?

2, Not wanting to be 'That guy' and play them with a tournament-style army, but also don't want to get my rear handed to me within a few turns, so would like it to me somewhat competent and the Stormcast players have some amazing units at their disposal (one of them showing me their amazing army got me into the game) 

3, I do like the look of the large characters and monsters, Doombull/Shaggoth/Chimerae but not sure what to build with them?  Prefer a smallish army instead of fielding 100000 gors/ungors - just to save my poor paint brush 🙂 but maybe having a large army is the only wat to counter Stormcast?

An army of Dragon ogors or Bull ogors? - but not i'f i'll get slaughtered easily 😞

4, Was thinking of also adding a Tzeengor Shaman+some Skyfires for some ranged damage? A 20 man unit of 2 blade wielding Tzeengors?

Well, hope that gives you a more clear picture of what i'm after

(would building one of the Battalion builds would suit my needs?

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14 hours ago, Damian said:

1, I will be mainly playing with friends/local league, most  who main mostly Stormcast Eternal armies, the others Nagash and Nighthaunt respectively, so i'm guessing mortal wounds would be important?

Mortal wounds are always helpful but we can't really build for MW cannon style builds. Our general answer to almost anything is just volume of attacks. 
 

14 hours ago, Damian said:

3, I do like the look of the large characters and monsters, Doombull/Shaggoth/Chimerae but not sure what to build with them?  Prefer a smallish army instead of fielding 100000 gors/ungors - just to save my poor paint brush 🙂 but maybe having a large army is the only wat to counter Stormcast?

All of those valid options - I'm not sold on the Doombull but some people swear by him. I personally like the Shaggoth and Chimerae - both have solid punch and the Shaggoth gives you a nice monster caster. You don't need to play a horde army but I'd get used to the idea of about 40-50 various type Ungors. Basic Ungors are good screens, bubble wrap, and objective grabbers and Ungor Raiders are one of our best options to help screen out Eels and Evocators. 

If you're playing against moderately competitive players I'd shy away from an army of Bullgors or Dragon Ogres. Dragon Ogres are serviceable as a defensive unit but at most I'd take one unit in an army with a Shaggoth general so you get a Battle Line out of them. Bullgors are basically second rate to either Enlightened on Discs or Bestigors. 

 

14 hours ago, Damian said:

4, Was thinking of also adding a Tzeengor Shaman+some Skyfires for some ranged damage? A 20 man unit of 2 blade wielding Tzeengors?

Tzeentch units are generally very strong in our book. I think a Shaman is always worth taking because its a fast moving caster which can be very important for certain scenarios. Skyfires you'll get very mixed opinions on - I like a unit of 6 but there are very valid arguments to suggest they're not worth running at their current cost. If you do run them understand they need to be charging to actually get their value - they need to shoot and then charge and clean up small units. As a final note if you run Tzaangors on foot - the current wording allows you to run say 2 models with shields and get the save after save effect without having to remove them first. I've run 20 before with maximum Great Blades (8), max mutants (4), two shields (2), and 6 dual blades - it takes a little doing to remember everything but I think its close to the optimum set up. You kill one shield early and then keep the other until you're down to it and Great Blades (who are the major damage dealers). 

So back to your original post - 2 Start Collectings wouldn't be a bad place to start at all. Gives you 20 Bestigors and 20 Ungors + 2 monsters. 

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Thanks, a few more questions...

1, Are Tzeengors worth it over Ungors or gors for shock troops/battle line? I guess what I/m really saying is  'are Tzeengors mandatory for a half-decent competitive army' ?

2, I have seen Tzeengor enlightened mentioned as been good fighters, would I use them as a small elite unit? maybe pair them with a Shaman?

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1 hour ago, Damian said:

Thanks, a few more questions...

1, Are Tzeengors worth it over Ungors or gors for shock troops/battle line? I guess what I/m really saying is  'are Tzeengors mandatory for a half-decent competitive army' ?

2, I have seen Tzeengor enlightened mentioned as been good fighters, would I use them as a small elite unit? maybe pair them with a Shaman?

Tzaangor are not mandatory.  They are good, but honestly I've been impressed at the balance in the book. Some stuff is a tad disappointing, but it's pretty reasonable. In a lot of cases niche would probably be a better description.  I'd actually say it's just gors who are a touch pointless, I've mainly used mine to convert centigors, and even they are an unconditional battleline that works in khorne.

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16 hours ago, Damian said:

1, Are Tzeengors worth it over Ungors or gors for shock troops/battle line? I guess what I/m really saying is  'are Tzeengors mandatory for a half-decent competitive army' ?

Tzaangors fulfill a very different role than Ungors - Tzaangors are actually punchy where Ungors are cheap and chaff-y. Against Gors its a bit different - Gors are unfortunately pretty lack luster in the book at current but they are MUCH cheaper than Tzaangors so they're hard to compare directly. As to the 'are they needed for competitive play' - I don't think so. They're a good choice but I don't think you'd be hamstringing yourself by not running them.
 

16 hours ago, Damian said:

2, I have seen Tzeengor enlightened mentioned as been good fighters, would I use them as a small elite unit? maybe pair them with a Shaman?

I generally use them in a unit of 6 with a Tzaangor Shaman for the +1 buff. Its moderately expensive (460 points total) but its a very solid hammer and if you get your Ungor Clip Charge off then its very reliable. 

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20 minutes ago, SwampHeart said:

Tzaangors fulfill a very different role than Ungors - Tzaangors are actually punchy where Ungors are cheap and chaff-y. Against Gors its a bit different - Gors are unfortunately pretty lack luster in the book at current but they are MUCH cheaper than Tzaangors so they're hard to compare directly. As to the 'are they needed for competitive play' - I don't think so. They're a good choice but I don't think you'd be hamstringing yourself by not running them.
 

I generally use them in a unit of 6 with a Tzaangor Shaman for the +1 buff. Its moderately expensive (460 points total) but its a very solid hammer and if you get your Ungor Clip Charge off then its very reliable. 

Ungor Clip Charge?

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1 hour ago, Damian said:

Ungor Clip Charge?

In the simplest form - you charge with a Tzaangor Enlightened Charge and contact one model in an enemy unit then charge with Ungors and use the Ungor pile in so that your opponent will only be able to swing one or maybe 2 models at the Enlightened. You get the Enlightened re-roll bonuses without actually putting your Enlightened in any real danger. 

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