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S133arcanite

AoS 2 - Gloomspite Gitz Discussion

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1 minute ago, Skumbaagh said:

Thx that was the answer I was looking for! 

You missed out on the D3 MW to units within 3 inch on a 2+. Also I fail to understand the wording, isnt it the MW that needs a 2+ roll and that the squigs doesnt require a roll?

Oh yeah i thought i forgot something haha!!! I believe you must roll a 2+ for the Squigs to come out afterwards, thats how ive been playing it. I see it like hes exploding into a bunch Squigs and not like he dies with a wet ****** noise on a roll of a 1 and some Squigs crawl out of his mouth confused as to how they ended up here.

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My mostly assembled Loonboss on Giant Cave Squig.

More chains to come. They have been a bit of a pain so far, and offer almost nothing in the way of stability - but they look cool!

 

Sorry for the poor photos. There is a ton going on in this model (It looks more like a diorama than a single model sometimes)and I'm not a photographer. Should have it painted with better pictures in a couple of days or so.

 

 

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Edited by KalmDown
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16 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

I'm thinking of running 60 blocks with Stabbas (not Spears)...you won't get as many in, but the better "To Hit" roll makes up for it a lot of the time, especially if you are trying to roll as many wound rolls as possible to trigger Mortal Wounds. 

The larger the unit is, the smaller the advantage of spears is. The only advantage spears offer is that if you can get only 1-2 Gitz in base to base with your foe, then spears will get you more attacks than Stabbas. But to be honest, in this case you will cause so few wounds it doesn´t really matter.

 

In all other cases you will get almost as many hits with both options: Stabbas in two ranks will give you the same number of hits as Spears in 3 ranks.

 

16 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

And even moreso in a world of -1 to Hit debuffs. 

Yes, that´s why Stabbas are better.

 

But if you do the math, the damage output of a 40 Gitz Stabba unit is nothing to write home about. You´ll most likely get something around 14-15 hits due to model positioning, equaling in 2,5 mortal wounds and 10 Rend "-" hits. Against 4+ save that´s roughly 7 wounds...

 

Interesting thing is that snufflers are almost as good as the Loonboss´ command ability when it comes down to inflicted wounds. And the lower the opponents save is, the more advantageous snufflers are.

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4 hours ago, Skumbaagh said:

Thx that was the answer I was looking for! 

You missed out on the D3 MW to units within 3 inch on a 2+. Also I fail to understand the wording, isnt it the MW that needs a 2+ roll and that the squigs doesnt require a roll?

This is correct, there's no need to roll for the squigs.

It states roll for each unit within 3". Gives the rules for mortals. After that it says "Then place..."

So either the rules aren't connected, and you always get the squigs, or they are and you get a unit of squigs for every 2+ rolled.

Clearly the second is absurd so it must be the first.

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3 minutes ago, Malakree said:

This is correct, there's no need to roll for the squigs.

It states roll for each unit within 3". Gives the rules for mortals. After that it says "Then place..."

So either the rules aren't connected, and you always get the squigs, or they are and you get a unit of squigs for every 2+ rolled.

Clearly the second is absurd so it must be the first.

Which means I can safely model a squig in the mouth of the colossal. 

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1 hour ago, Hannibal said:

I'm thinking of running 60 blocks with Stabbas (not Spears)...you won't get as many in, but the better "To Hit" roll makes up for it a lot of the time, especially if you are trying to roll as many wound rolls as possible to trigger Mortal Wounds. 

I'm considering using Stabbas instead of Spears as well, firstly cos I dont think it makes that much different, but secondly because of our beloved Loonshrine. A units of 60 Stabbas will return as a unit of 30 and "Stabbas" work much better compared to spears in smaller unit sizes. 

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I think spears make sense when you are adding more attacks to the unit. That third row of grots fighting means more when it’s adding 3+ attacks per grot.

In all other instances I would agree that normal stabbing stabbas are better.

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1 hour ago, Hannibal said:

The larger the unit is, the smaller the advantage of spears is. The only advantage spears offer is that if you can get only 1-2 Gitz in base to base with your foe, then spears will get you more attacks than Stabbas. But to be honest, in this case you will cause so few wounds it doesn´t really matter.

 

In all other cases you will get almost as many hits with both options: Stabbas in two ranks will give you the same number of hits as Spears in 3 ranks.

 

Yes, that´s why Stabbas are better.

 

But if you do the math, the damage output of a 40 Gitz Stabba unit is nothing to write home about. You´ll most likely get something around 14-15 hits due to model positioning, equaling in 2,5 mortal wounds and 10 Rend "-" hits. Against 4+ save that´s roughly 7 wounds...

 

Interesting thing is that snufflers are almost as good as the Loonboss´ command ability when it comes down to inflicted wounds. And the lower the opponents save is, the more advantageous snufflers are.

Few things. Against at least -2 to hit the stabbas become strictly worse than spears because an unmodified 6 always hits and both are now on 6s.

Point for point 20 stabbas with 17 stabbas, 2 netters and the boss with a better is the third best damage output of all our battleline units while they are all unbuffed. The only things which beat it are the troggoths.

They out perform spider riders against a 4+ save.

3 minutes ago, Matt Large said:

I'm considering using Stabbas instead of Spears as well, firstly cos I dont think it makes that much different, but secondly because of our beloved Loonshrine. A units of 60 Stabbas will return as a unit of 30 and "Stabbas" work much better compared to spears in smaller unit sizes. 

Honestly having done all things considered it's irrelevant. Both have advantages and disadvantages.

Play the option you prefer for aesthetic or avalibility reasons.

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I've got 2 ideas for forces, but can't decide which way to go.

Which of the below do you think would be more fun to play with (and against!)

Mixed2k.pdf

Squigs2k.pdf

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1 minute ago, Malakree said:

Honestly having done all things considered it's irrelevant. Both have advantages and disadvantages.

Play the option you prefer for aesthetic or avalibility reasons.

tbh its also to with aesthetic as well, the rag tag look of Stabbas appeals to me more. It also allows good use of all the spare Hopper weapons I have available!

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1 minute ago, Milandro said:

I think spears make sense when you are adding more attacks to the unit. That third row of grots fighting means more when it’s adding 3+ attacks per grot.

In all other instances I would agree that normal stabbing stabbas are better.

An extra rank is a 50% increase in attacks. Hitting on 4s instead of 5s is a 50% increase in hits.

Since the betters are 2" you could technically have all of them fighting from the 3rd row making stabbas marginally better.

Against -1 to hit stabbas are better against -2 to hit spears are better.

There are so many variables which swing it that the truth is it's difference is irrelevant. Dont agonise over the choice as it really is meaningless.

2 minutes ago, Matt Large said:

tbh its also to with aesthetic as well, the rag tag look of Stabbas appeals to me more. It also allows good use of all the spare Hopper weapons I have available!

In any situation one or the other will be MARGINALLY better. However any minor alteration can easily flip it. Don't stress and go for the visual preference!

Gw hit the nail on the head with balance between the two weapon options.

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Just a question.  When bringing back half a unit through the Loonshrine, can you bring back all of the netters?  So 9 netters in 60 Grots becomes 9 netters in 30 Grots.  Same for the banner bearers and musicians.

Apologies if this has already been asked.

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Why wouldn't the '3 in 20' stipulation still apply?

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4 minutes ago, Mutter said:

Why wouldn't the '3 in 20' stipulation still apply?

Sorry, you're right - it's a replacement unit, wasn't thinking.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you wanted to, you could lose a unit with no netters in it, and bring back a unit with netters.

Say, you lost a unit of 40 Stabbas with 1 leader, 2 banners, 2 musicians, and zero netters (maybe you only own a limited number of netter models, and they were all in a different unit, which has also been killed already so the netter models are now available).  You could pop back on a unit of 20 Stabbas with 1 leader, 1 banner, 1 musician, and 3 netters.

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21 minutes ago, amysrevenge said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you wanted to, you could lose a unit with no netters in it, and bring back a unit with netters.

Say, you lost a unit of 40 Stabbas with 1 leader, 2 banners, 2 musicians, and zero netters (maybe you only own a limited number of netter models, and they were all in a different unit, which has also been killed already so the netter models are now available).  You could pop back on a unit of 20 Stabbas with 1 leader, 1 banner, 1 musician, and 3 netters.

Yes. It doesn't even say they have to have the same weapons options.

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1 hour ago, Malakree said:

Yes. It doesn't even say they have to have the same weapons options.

Not sure about all this - it says “a new replacement unit with half of the models from the unit that was destroyed”. (My emphasis). So I think you could only take options in the original unit. I’m more unclear about whether, if you have 9 netters in the original unit, you can have 9 netters in the new unit of 30, or 4.5 ( so, 4), or even 3, if you cant have 6 until you have 40. There, that’s helped, hasn’t it?

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22 minutes ago, Baron Wastelands said:

So I think you could only take options in the original unit. I’m more unclear about whether, if you have 9 netters in the original unit, you can have 9 netters in the new unit of 30, or 4.5 ( so, 4), or even 3, if you cant have 6 until you have 40. There, that’s helped, hasn’t it?

The Loonshrine Warscroll actually says you round fractions up when replacing the unit, so 4.5 would become 5 (not 4).

It doesn't explicitly say this applies to Netters...but it also doesn't tell you to round Netters down anywhere, either.  So I think you'd be rounding up for Netters as with the replacement unit as a whole?

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6 hours ago, Injuryprone said:

How big is the loonboss on cave squig compared to the squig hopper kit?

He is a fair bit bigger. Squig Hoppers are on 32mm bases while according to the FAQ the Giant Cave Squig Loonboss is on a 50mm.
Hoppers ride normal Squigs, loonbosses ride Giant Squigs.

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3 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

The Loonshrine Warscroll actually says you round fractions up when replacing the unit, so 4.5 would become 5 (not 4).

It doesn't explicitly say this applies to Netters...but it also doesn't tell you to round Netters down anywhere, either.  So I think you'd be rounding up for Netters as with the replacement unit as a whole?

That’s an interesting point, I had assumed the rounding up applied to halving the original unit strength, but then again if you are only taking multiples of 20 you will never need to round up the total number. So I think your interpretation is right, but think you can only take up to five netters if the original (60 strong) unit contained 9. Similarly, if the original unit contained 3 standards, the new unit could contain 2 (in 30).

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Okay its list time! I like this but there is always room for changes. Possible changes could be dropping DoomShroom and Troggs. I like the idea of Troggs but is 3 effective? And the DoomShroom is great for area denial tactics.

Mortal Realm: Ghur
Loonboss on Giant Cave Squig (110)
- General
- Trait: Dead Shouty 
- Artefact: Gryph-feather Charm 
Webspinner Shaman on Arachnarok Spider (300)
- Artefact: Headdress of Many Eyes 
- Lore of the Spiderfangs: Sneaky Distraction
Madcap Shaman (80)
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork
Webspinner Shaman (80)
- Lore of the Spiderfangs: Gift of da Spider God
10 x Squig Hoppers (180)
18 x Squig Herd (210)
18 x Squig Herd (210)
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)
3 x Rockgut Troggoths (160)
Squig Rider Stampede (140)
Mork's Mighty Mushroom (80)
Scrapskuttle's Arachnacauldron (50)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Wounds: 172

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I just won a game against nighthaunts with this list: 

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz

Leaders
Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (300)
- Artefact: The Clammy cowl 
Madcap Shaman (80)
- Artefact: Moonface Mommet 
- Lore of the Moonclans: Squig Lure
Skragrott, The Loonking (220)
- General
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork

Battleline
18 x Squig Herd (210)
6 x Squig Herd (70)
60 x Stabbas (360)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields
- 9x Barbed Nets
- 1x Moonclan Flag Bearers
- 1x Badmoon Icon Bearers

Units
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)
5 x Loonsmasha Fanatics (140)

Battalions
Squig Rider Stampede (140)

Endless Spells
Mork's Mighty Mushroom (80)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 175

 

Auto running the mangler and bounders 6 then charging under the light of the moon was very strong. Thanks to Skragott's command point farming ability I could do it on all 3 on the same turn (While keeping the moon in the middle with his Command ability). Meanwhile my unit of 60 goblins controlled the middle objective all game while just winthin 12 of the shrine so they never had to take a battleshock test.

Clutch roll of the game was rolling a 26 on the mushroom distance to allow me to place it in the best possible spot. when that spell goes off it really screws over hordes

 

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(Without wanting to offend all the Squig lovers) Is anyone here considering Squig free lists? I'd like to do just Grots, Magic, Trolls and Spiders. Am I kicking just myself in the face for thinking this? Or are there some Squig units that are essential?

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8 minutes ago, a74xhx said:

(Without wanting to offend all the Squig lovers) Is anyone here considering Squig free lists? I'd like to do just Grots, Magic, Trolls and Spiders. Am I kicking just myself in the face for thinking this? Or are there some Squig units that are essential?

Bounderz + Loonboss on cave squig is the closest thing to essential you come with squigs :) I run three units of 10 bounderz myself, alongside a grot/troggoth army lead by a cunning  (loonskin) Troggboss. I could definitely see it working out when scaling down the squigs for more grots/troggoths/magic, so go for it :) hard to go wrong with more bodies anyway, if you're up for that.

Edited by Mayple

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