AoS 2 - Gloomspite Gitz Discussion

[Nox]

Wow, thanks for the input guys!

Yeah my first mistake was not realizing that Skragrott needs to be general to use his CA so in my list the Loonboss on Mangler squig was the general so no need for more battle line beyond the Boingrots. 

I really love the models for Rockguts It's a real shame it seems so hard to field them even in a 2k army. There seems to be very little synergies in general between Troggoths and Grots sadly.  Even If I'm usually gunning for a somewhat competitive list I always try to get a visually balanced army and the Rockguts achieve that beautifully 😃 

[novakai]

I feel like Rockgut are good standalone units to have in some army list, just having one 6-9 man unit can be really handy for backline support or taking out certain enemies.

though I feel the strength of Gloomspite are with the Grot-Squigs-Magic, having a troggoth unit in there isn't so bad

[Arkahn]

Hello guys, I need your opinion for a 1k list

Until now I'm playing 

Spoiler

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz
Mortal Realm: Ghur

Leaders
Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (300)
- General
- Trait: Fight Another Day 
- Artefact: Gryph-feather Charm 
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Squig Lure

Battleline
20 x Stabbas (130)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields
5 x Squig Hoppers (90)

Units
15 x Boingrot Bounderz (300)

Endless Spells
Mork's Mighty Mushroom (80)

Total: 990 / 1000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 200
Wounds: 76
 

And now, I'm considering to try this list, for few reasons... 15x Bounderz are good for the MWs but it's almost always impossible to attack with all of them and Hoppers are not so worth the points to me, only sometimes they can steal an objective or try to assassinate a small character...

Spoiler

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz
Mortal Realm: Ghur

Leaders
Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (300)
- General
- Trait: Fight Another Day 
- Artefact: Gryph-feather Charm 
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Squig Lure

Battleline
6 x Squig Herd (70)
6 x Squig Herd (70)

Units
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)

Behemoths
Mangler Squigs (240)

Endless Spells
Scuttletide (30)

Total: 1000 / 1000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 200
Wounds: 72
 

What's your opinions between those lists ?

Edited April 7, 2019 by Arkahn

[Malakree]

55 minutes ago, Arkahn said:

What's your opinions between those lists ? 

Imo drop the mangler from the second list for a second unit of 10 boingrots with 40 points float.

Can use it for a second endless spell or to up both squig herds to hoppers for bouncy madness.

[Malakree]

2 hours ago, novakai said:

I feel like Rockgut are good standalone units to have in some army list, just having one 6-9 man unit can be really handy for backline support or taking out certain enemies.

though I feel the strength of Gloomspite are with the Grot-Squigs-Magic, having a troggoth unit in there isn't so bad

I played a game vs a semi competitive skaven list at club tonight.

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz

Leaders
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
- General
- Trait: Mighty Blow 
- Artefact: Ghyrstrike 
Skragrott, The Loonking (220)
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Call da Moon
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Itchy Nuisance
Mollog (170)

Battleline
6 x Fellwater Troggoths (320)
3 x Rockgut Troggoths (160)
20 x Shootas (130)
20 x Shootas (130)

War Machines
Grot Spear Chukka (120)
Grot Spear Chukka (120)

Endless Spells
Scuttletide (30)
Quicksilver Swords (20)
Malevolent Maelstrom (20)
Mork's Mighty Mushroom (80)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 124

He also had a lot of endless spells, we had 9 on the board going into round 3.

I'm really not liking the mushroom, it's a lot of points for something which is erratic on the range. Feels like a tech addition that the list doesn't need. The spearchukkas felt like dead weight for their points while the maelstrom is just 20 points float.

The shootas did their job and were reasonable. I misused mollog and paid for it by having him sat around doing nothing. I still love him but not 100% attached.

Skragrott is a legend, he's so good. Combined with 2 fungoids I wasn't completely shafted in the spell game which was nice. I'd gladly put another 2 fungoids in the list instead of mollog.

Itchy nuisance really showed it's str when he pulled a deciver off the bell turn 2 with prio. It let really deal with him on my turn 2.

Ended with a loss but if I'd have won prio on 2 or 3 I'd have been well ahead. Prior turn 4 would have made it close.

I think the list needs another 3 rockguts to make a unit of 6. After that there is definitely options for either stabbas or more troggs. Will play about with it as I get more painted!

EDIT: Maybe switch to something like this

Spoiler

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz
Mortal Realm: Ghyran

Leaders
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
- General
- Trait: Mighty Blow 
- Artefact: Ghyrstrike 
Skragrott, The Loonking (220)
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Call da Moon
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Itchy Nuisance
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Great Green Spite

Battleline
60 x Stabbas (360)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields
6 x Rockgut Troggoths (320)
3 x Fellwater Troggoths (160)
3 x Fellwater Troggoths (160)
3 x Fellwater Troggoths (160)

Endless Spells
Scuttletide (30)
Quicksilver Swords (20)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 150

The quick silver swords are a tech due to skaven being in vogue atm, definitely a good call by @Skeekrit at heat 1.

Edited April 7, 2019 by Malakree

[Arkahn]

47 minutes ago, Malakree said:

Skragrott is a legend, he's so good. Combined with 2 fungoids I wasn't completely shafted in the spell game which was nice. I'd gladly put another 2 fungoids in the list instead of mollog.

Even if Skragrott is not the General he's really worth the point ? (i'm considering using Mangler boss as general plus Skragrott). 

4 Fungoid ? It's not too much ? 😅

[Malakree]

7 minutes ago, Arkahn said:

Even if Skragrott is not the General he's really worth the point ? (i'm considering using Mangler boss as general plus Skragrott). 

4 Fungoid ? It's not too much ? 😅

Skragrott is totally worth it. For 220 points you get an incredibly durable wizard who has 2 casts and unbinds at +1 native. This is especially important given the high magic meta we're in atm.

His personal spell is a super cheeky one which is basically always good. It's either an empowered arcane bolt on an 8+ (7 With his +1) or the only artefact stripping ability on a 10+.

Add onto the top of that his handcannon, which is a more consistent version of a hellblaster volleygun, and he easily pays for himself.

I'm running him with hand of Gork and scuttletide as his turn 1 casts. Both spells I really want to get off asap and which love the +1.

As to the fungoids, again they are incredibly durable wizards which give you a cast and unbind, all of the spells over my 4 wizards are completely usable which combined with the two endless spells gives me 5 casts a turn that I WANT to cast. That's before realm spells.

Equally the command points are just good, if I'm running at 9 in turn 2 I'll be throwing out charge rerolls etc non-stop, again that's ignoring realm command abilities like adapt or die from the realm of metal!

Imo skragrott and the fungoid are amazing no matter how many you include. Realistically you're capping at 4 maybe 5 and they haven't hit diminishing returns by that point.

If you consider turn 1 spell casts, scuttletide+hand of Gork, call da moon, mystic shield, quicksilver swords and great green spite. Again ignoring the realm spells like the +1 damage from the realm of fire.

So yes, I'm definitely on board the doom shroom wizard train!

[Aelfric]

5 hours ago, Nox said:

the Loonboss on Mangler squig was the general so no need for more battle line beyond the Boingrots. 

The problem is that Loonboss on Mangler does not make Boingrots battleline - only Squig Hoppers.

[Nox]

9 minutes ago, Aelfric said:

The problem is that Loonboss on Mangler does not make Boingrots battleline - only Squig Hoppers.

Haha, so double fail on my part 😃

[ShaneHobbes]

Thinking of trying this list.

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz
Mortal Realm: Ghyran

Leaders
Dankhold Troggboss (300)
- General
- Trait: Mighty Blow 
- Artefact: Ghyrstrike 
Skragrott, The Loonking (220)
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork
Gitmob Grot Shaman (80)
- Allies

Battleline
3 x Fellwater Troggoths (160)
3 x Fellwater Troggoths (160)
3 x Fellwater Troggoths (160)
3 x Fellwater Troggoths (160)
60 x Stabbas (360)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields
- 9x Barbed Nets
- 1x Moonclan Flag Bearers
- 1x Badmoon Icon Bearers
20 x Stabbas (130)
- Stabbas & Moon Shields
- 3x Barbed Nets
- 1x Moonclan Flag Bearers
- 1x Badmoon Icon Bearers

Units
60 x Gitmob Grots (270)
- Bows & Slashas
- Allies

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 350 / 400
Wounds: 210

So has anyone tried using the Gitmob with bows with the Gitmob shaman spell? It looks like it could be devastating and I kind'a wanna give it a shot. Unfortunately the only shaman I have (besides Skragrott) is one Fungoid Cave-Shaman who I'm gonna substitute as a Gitmob. Just a casual game, our place is good about letting us do stuff like that. But I did order another Fungoid and a regular shaman anyway. I def need to try 2-3 fungoids.

I also have 9 rockguts coming in and I eventually wanna do about 15 of them. I did a tournament with the 12 Fellwaters and the Trogboss along with some stabbas and the Trogboss was constantly my MVP. Anytime he attacked he did about 15-18 wounds. I brought the troggoth hag as well and she wasn't horrible but unfortunately between my bad  rolling for spell casts and my opponents red hot unbind rolls, she really didn't pull her 380 pt worth. The fellwaters are just a great workhorse unit. I love them.

I haven't tried giving the Trogboss Ghyrstrike though. Seems like it would be insane but even without it he seems to wipe anything he looks at anyway. I almost wanna give him the Gryph-Feather Charm for the -1 to hit and the extra 2" of movement for the extra survivability instead. Between all my Netters and Fellwaters in the tournament, it was driving some of the Khorne and Daughters players crazy.

I might drop the 20 stabbas for some endless spells. Emerald Lifestream to make sure my Trogboss is topped off or whatever.

Edited April 8, 2019 by ShaneHobbes

[Arkahn]

7 hours ago, Malakree said:

If you consider turn 1 spell casts, scuttletide+hand of Gork, call da moon, mystic shield, quicksilver swords and great green spite. 

There is a combo between scuttletide + HoG I didnt see?

[Malakree]

50 minutes ago, Arkahn said:

There is a combo between scuttletide + HoG I didnt see?

No but skragrott gets 2 spells 😁 basically showing how is use my spells for all 5 wizards turn 1 in a way that wasn't wasting them even without realm spells.

[GlitzFan]

Who here has played using a fully buffed stabbas army? I would love to know your thoughts!

 

[FPC]

9 hours ago, GlitzFan said:

Who here has played using a fully buffed stabbas army? I would love to know your thoughts!

 

Not sure exactly what you’d consider “fully buffed,” but I’ve run 2x60 a couple times and they’re great. Usually with Loonboss MWs on one, and trying for Sporesplatta extra attack on both.

Still working on what compliments them best. I’ve run 10-20 Boingrot and found them solid, but underwhelming when not properly buffed themselves. Thinking Fellwaters might be a nice flank guard/hammer unit.

[Malakree]

6 minutes ago, FPC said:

Not sure exactly what you’d consider “fully buffed,” but I’ve run 2x60 a couple times and they’re great. Usually with Loonboss MWs on one, and trying for Sporesplatta extra attack on both.

Still working on what compliments them best. I’ve run 10-20 Boingrot and found them solid, but underwhelming when not properly buffed themselves. Thinking Fellwaters might be a nice flank guard/hammer unit.

Is that with the sneaky snuffler and gobbapalooza buffs? I think that's what @GlitzFan is asking about.

[FPC]

4 minutes ago, Malakree said:

Is that with the sneaky snuffler and gobbapalooza buffs? I think that's what @GlitzFan is asking about.

Nah I don’t own either yet.  I’d honestly be inclined to think  you’re going to start seeing diminishing returns if you throw TOO many points at buffs. They’ve always been my MVP even with only basic buffs. One thing I did run once that I’d like to test more is a Webspinner on foot in the midst of two units, casting the 12” -1 to hit bubble (sneaky distraction? Can’t recall the name). With netters properly placed, -2 to hit gobbos will be hard to dislodge. Add a Colossal on one flank for even more negative hit debuff fun!

[GlitzFan]

Thanks guys for the responses. I agree with you both that having every possible buff on the grots will prove diminished returns.

I like the idea of having a loon boss for MWs on rolls of 6 for the unit. Add then having sporesplatters doubling the amount of attacks. 

The next thing I would consider is adding yet another attack to the entire unit with using sneaky snufflers. That might be the point of overbuffing / diminishing returns?

Not to mention spiker for rerolls wounds of 1.

[GlitzFan]

And I love the idea of the  webspinner shaman with sneaky distraction cast for -1 to hit as well. I haven't looked at any of the spiderfang units previously. Can I use the webspinner shaman in my normal moonclan army?

[Arkahn]

1 hour ago, FPC said:

 One thing I did run once that I’d like to test more is a Webspinner on foot in the midst of two units, casting the 12” -1 to hit bubble (sneaky distraction? Can’t recall the name). With netters properly placed, -2 to hit gobbos will be hard to dislodge. 

I'm wondering if a Webspinner Shaman w/ Sneaky Distraction is worth 80 points ? 

He can be quickly done if focused by range weapons or MWs, but -1 to hit + netters seems strong to hold the line ! 

[svnvaldez]

20 minutes ago, Arkahn said:

I'm wondering if a Webspinner Shaman w/ Sneaky Distraction is worth 80 points ? 

He can be quickly done if focused by range weapons or MWs, but -1 to hit + netters seems strong to hold the line ! 

I have been thinking a Webspinner Shaman on Arachnarok Spider for 300 points sitting in the middle of the board casting Sneaky Distraction might be really good. He also gets a second spell (lots of good realm spells out there) and gets the self buff of +1 to cast and +1 to his 2 unbinds with the Catchweb Spidershrine ability.

[Malakree]

1 hour ago, Arkahn said:

I'm wondering if a Webspinner Shaman w/ Sneaky Distraction is worth 80 points ? 

He can be quickly done if focused by range weapons or MWs, but -1 to hit + netters seems strong to hold the line ! 

Like Skragrott and the fungoid he functionally doesn't have a normal save instead replacing it with his 5++ so he comes out at 6 effective wounds combined with the Lookout Sir! buff shouldn't be super squishy.

Biggest issue with the -1 hit aura is that it's very easily gamed. as long as your opponents unit has one model which is slightly out of 12" the whole unit ignores the debuff. It means that against good players you will find they can play around it fairly comfortably.

[novakai]

Skragrott is basically an arttillery cannon too. 28 range 6 attack +3,+3 -1 with the mortal wound afterward. It pretty insane

[Malakree]

31 minutes ago, novakai said:

Skragrott is basically an arttillery cannon too. 28 range 6 attack +3,+3 -1 with the mortal wound afterward. It pretty insane

I always call it his Hand Cannon  he's just so good. At 220 points I think he's amazing for any Gloomspite army that can fit him whether he's your general or not.

Remember that he rerolls 1s to hit while under The Bad Moon, he's also the reason you run the Gobbapalooza. He makes Brewgits reroll hits completely worth it and even spikers reroll 1s to wound is fantastic on him. With those two buffs I suspect I'd try to split his fire a little bit, see if I could get the MW debuff running on multiple enemy units asap. When you think that dealing a damage to a model on the first round makes it functionally 6 damage over the course of the game. It's horrific.

EDIT: So a full Moonclan Grot list would look something like this I think.

Quote

Allegiance: Destruction

Leaders
Skragrott, The Loonking (220)
- General
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
Madcap Shaman (80)
- Artefact: Moonface Mommet 
Loonboss (70)
- Artefact: Lunestone Talisman (Defensive)
- Artefact: Spiteful Prodder (Offensive)

Battleline
60 x Stabbas (360)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields
60 x Stabbas (360)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields
20 x Shootas (130)

Units
1 x Boggleye (48)
1 x Brewgit (48)
1 x Scaremonger (48)
1 x Shroomancer (48)
1 x Spiker (48)
6 x Sneaky Snufflers (70)
6 x Sneaky Snufflers (70)
5 x Sporesplatta Fanatics (120)

Battalions
Gobbapalooza (110)

Endless Spells
Scuttletide (30)

Total: 1950 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 206

You have 50 points spare to take another endless spell if you want or just sit on it for the CP/Triumph. The artefact on the Loonboss depends on how you want to use him, the spiteful prodder is pretty horrific with this list as the Sneaky Snufflers both contribute a dice and the 20 shootas are easy to keep near him which puts it at 3 dice without the stabbas. Don't forget that you can put the Snuffler buff on the Sporesplattas aswell.

Edited April 9, 2019 by Malakree

[Arkahn]

6 hours ago, Malakree said:

Biggest issue with the -1 hit aura is that it's very easily gamed. as long as your opponents unit has one model which is slightly out of 12" the whole unit ignores the debuff. It means that against good players you will find they can play around it fairly comfortably.

That's true, the " wholly within" change everything, sadly... 

[GlitzFan]

@Malakree I like your full moonclan grot list. However I would like to see what you would do if you removed the gobapalooza units! What would you replace them with?

I find that most the gobapalooza are weak units. Thoughts?

Edited April 9, 2019 by GlitzFan