AoS 2 - Gloomspite Gitz Discussion

[a74xhx]

Interesting - the loonshrine rule replaces the existing grot ressurection one. But you only have to choose whether you're using it or not after placing the shrine.

That could make for interesting choices if you have a mixed list. I suspect it's most likely going to result in taking squig herd instead of stabbas.

Does this mean squig herd are better than stabbas now? - assuming neither are being buffed.

I will still be including shootas for the backline.

[Weazel]

Okay so I have a friendly tournament coming next week, so this WD update is worth considering (the magazine is available next weekend, right?) I confirmed with the TO that it's OK to use these rules.

This is the list I came up with:

Allegiance: Gloomspite Gitz
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Squig Lure

6 x Sneaky Snufflers (70)

Moon-Biter Squigalanche (90)

Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (280)
- General
- Artefact: The Clammy cowl

Loonboss on Giant Cave Squig (110)
- Moonclan Stabba
- Artefact: Syari Screamersquig

Mangler Squigs (240)
6 x Squig Herd (70)
6 x Squig Herd (70)

Moon-Jumper Stampede (140)
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)
10 x Squig Hoppers (180)

Loonshrine (0)

 

Total: 1740 / 1750
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 130
 

I have dreamed of a full squig list for quite some time but the random movement has been an issue. With rerolls it still might be but probably less so. What do you think? Unfortunately I don't have any more Herds and no interest in buying more models at this time...

[swarmofseals]

Jaws of Mork rules are pretty exciting! Bounders are crazy efficient in the new battalion. Their offense when charging is amazing, even unbuffed and their defense is reasonably good. Even hoppers are pretty solid in the battalion. That said, I think how to build the rest of the list out is an interesting question and I can think of a few possibilities:

• Take the new superbattalion with squig herd or hoppers as your battleline and consider adding a couple of support elements (wizards and/or snufflers).
• Take two of the new small battalions and use hoppers are your battleline. Again, maybe take some support elements.
• Take a more balanced approach with the smaller battalion either as the centerpiece or as a support piece. Either way you're taking a bit more non-squig stuff.

I'm honestly not sure at all what the best approach is. The metagame is pretty hostile to the grot part of the army now because it's so easy to pick off the key heroes, and unsupported units of grots seem pretty unattractive to me especially if you aren't going to be able to bring them back from the loonshrine. Beyond the obvious snufflers I'm not sure what the best support elements are. A couple of fungoids? A madcap with mommet?  An arachnarok with shrine (sneaky distraction? arachnacauldron?). 

[Dankboss]

2 minutes ago, swarmofseals said:

Jaws of Mork rules are pretty exciting! Bounders are crazy efficient in the new battalion. Their offense when charging is amazing, even unbuffed and their defense is reasonably good. Even hoppers are pretty solid in the battalion. That said, I think how to build the rest of the list out is an interesting question and I can think of a few possibilities:

• Take the new superbattalion with squig herd or hoppers as your battleline and consider adding a couple of support elements (wizards and/or snufflers).
• Take two of the new small battalions and use hoppers are your battleline. Again, maybe take some support elements.
• Take a more balanced approach with the smaller battalion either as the centerpiece or as a support piece. Either way you're taking a bit more non-squig stuff.

I'm honestly not sure at all what the best approach is. The metagame is pretty hostile to the grot part of the army now because it's so easy to pick off the key heroes, and unsupported units of grots seem pretty unattractive to me especially if you aren't going to be able to bring them back from the loonshrine. Beyond the obvious snufflers I'm not sure what the best support elements are. A couple of fungoids? A madcap with mommet?  An arachnarok with shrine (sneaky distraction? arachnacauldron?). 

The Troggboss is the hardest hero we have to kill, especially in this meta, so he'll have utility in being an anchor that can't be sniped off.

[swarmofseals]

1 minute ago, Dankboss said:

The Troggboss is the hardest hero we have to kill, especially in this meta, so he'll have utility in being an anchor that can't be sniped off.

I guess, but I'm not sure how much value he brings to a squig focused build. He can't be general if you want to get squigs back from the loonshrine and he's still very vulnerable to shooting.

[Dankboss]

3 minutes ago, swarmofseals said:

I guess, but I'm not sure how much value he brings to a squig focused build. He can't be general if you want to get squigs back from the loonshrine and he's still very vulnerable to shooting.

Look out Sir and cover ought to be enough; if they're focusing him down then they're not targeting your squigs. I don't see why he's vulnerable to shooting when every other option gets sniped off faster by every means. If you're concerned with losing heroes to ranged and magic, then he's the only pick who can resist that. A Madcap casting nightshroud would also be a good addition.

I play against Tempest's Eye Irondrakes 50% of my games and they have never killed him.

[nuttyknatty]

Just checking the Loonshrine rules of a new unit returning with half the models (rounding fractions up). 
 

So if you return a unit of minimum number, then they all return? E.g a unit of 5 Squig Hopper is destroyed so I could return a unit of 5? 

[Nezzhil]

5 minutes ago, The Nameless One said:

Just checking the Loonshrine rules of a new unit returning with half the models (rounding fractions up). 
 

So if you return a unit of minimum number, then they all return? E.g a unit of 5 Squig Hopper is destroyed so I could return a unit of 5? 

No, you return 3 models.

[Drazarius]

On 8/17/2020 at 9:47 PM, Okonomiyakimarine said:

[...]
Leaders
Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (280)
- Artefact: Syari Screamersquig
Madcap Shaman (80)
- Artefact: Moonface Mommet  
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork
Madcap Shaman (80)
- Artefact: Staff of Sneaky Stealin'  
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork
[..]

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Scuttletide (30)
[..]

Why not take the Webspinner shaman instead of one Madcap Shaman ? He can cast scuttletide with a bonus of +1.

And he can take a very good spell : Sneaky distraction 

By the way, I think that we can take only one time the same spell. So you can't take 2 times The Hand of Gork. Am I right ?

 

[Dankboss]

4 minutes ago, Drazarius said:

Why not take the Webspinner shaman instead of one Madcap Shaman ? He can cast scuttletide with a bonus of +1.

And he can take a very good spell : Sneaky distraction 

By the way, I think that we can take only one time the same spell. So you can't take 2 times The Hand of Gork. Am I right ?

 

You can take it more than once, but only cast once.

[swarmofseals]

5 hours ago, Dankboss said:

Look out Sir and cover ought to be enough; if they're focusing him down then they're not targeting your squigs. I don't see why he's vulnerable to shooting when every other option gets sniped off faster by every means. If you're concerned with losing heroes to ranged and magic, then he's the only pick who can resist that. A Madcap casting nightshroud would also be a good addition.

I play against Tempest's Eye Irondrakes 50% of my games and they have never killed him.

I'm not just looking for any random hero though, I'm looking at heroes that make the rest of the army better. Even if it never dies having a Dankhold doesn't do anything to make grots better. They still need a Loonboss to do work.

[NinthMusketeer]

Just wanna say, I dig the new White Dwarf rules. Some cool support for Squig armies without pushing things into OP territory.

As for the issue of Grot heroes getting sniped; Grot heroes have always been easily sniped in AoS. The solution is to take more of them. Max out those hero slots for da little WAAAAGH!!

[NinthMusketeer]

18 hours ago, a74xhx said:

Interesting - the loonshrine rule replaces the existing grot ressurection one. But you only have to choose whether you're using it or not after placing the shrine.

That could make for interesting choices if you have a mixed list. I suspect it's most likely going to result in taking squig herd instead of stabbas.

Does this mean squig herd are better than stabbas now? - assuming neither are being buffed.

I will still be including shootas for the backline.

Stabbas are likely to always have a place for being extremely points-efficient when properly buffed. Not only are the stabbas themselves very cheap (and numerous--likely to be holding whatever objective they are on) but the stuff that buffs them is cheap and it buffs them significantly. Plus netters simply kick ass.

[Dankboss]

9 hours ago, swarmofseals said:

I'm not just looking for any random hero though, I'm looking at heroes that make the rest of the army better. Even if it never dies having a Dankhold doesn't do anything to make grots better. They still need a Loonboss to do work.

I'm not saying he's the hero you want, but he is the hero that can resist being sniped, and the hero keyword has value in itself.

The other thing you could do is body block your heroes; my Madcap can't be seen at all with 3 Fellwater Troggoths in the way, and Moonface Mommet does not require LoS.

[Okonomiyakimarine]

14 hours ago, Drazarius said:

Why not take the Webspinner shaman instead of one Madcap Shaman ? He can cast scuttletide with a bonus of +1.

And he can take a very good spell : Sneaky distraction 

By the way, I think that we can take only one time the same spell. So you can't take 2 times The Hand of Gork. Am I right ?

 

The double madcap looks sure looks unusual. The answer to your question is connected to the issue of having no real counters or any defense really for the heroes. The Manglers are damage dealers, but also a carnifex distraction, the squigs are unbuffed and with the new rules make more sense in an offense is your best defense approach, as long as you go squigs-only.  In a grot list you would have spore-fanatics as defense+buff, buffing snufflers, stabbers as block, loon-fanatics as counter-chargers. You can put them all in a squig list to keep the squishy wizards alive ofc. With the double madcap I buy a hand of gork backup and through forward the herds for example, unbind, etc. it is just one extra wizard instead of investing in a (mostly) defensive unit.

But I am far from an expert. probably a mixed approach with the jumper battalion alone is the better approach.

6 hours ago, NinthMusketeer said:

Just wanna say, I dig the new White Dwarf rules. Some cool support for Squig armies without pushing things into OP territory.

As for the issue of Grot heroes getting sniped; Grot heroes have always been easily sniped in AoS. The solution is to take more of them. Max out those hero slots for da little WAAAAGH!!

 

[Nezzhil]

As always, @PlasticCraic wrote a fantastic article:

https://plasticcraic.blog/2020/08/20/getting-squiggy-with-it-jaws-of-mork-review/

 

After two games playing the new Squigalanche I think it's only a small improvement of the old Squigalanche. I think we need to continue testing and brewing lists, especially the mixed lists that I think it's the hidden gem of the new subfaction.

[C0deb1ue]

I know everyone seems really excited about these rules but they are really not that great and don’t really fix much that was needed except slightly less random movement.

Pros:
the smaller battalion is good

re-rolling movement is good

Cons

the artifact is really bad

the command trait is really bad and quite redundant.

(and you have to take both)

niche ability for mangler squigs 

the super-battalion is expensive for potentially 1 6inch move that you may not even want depending on the turn order . It’s also expensive in terms of basic points tax (mangler etc)

Not sure the loonshrine is that applicable unless you are going to camp Squig herds next to it...  
 

It’s lovely an fluffy but it’s barely a buff 🤷🏼‍♂️

Edited August 20, 2020 by C0deb1ue

[Arkahn]

12 minutes ago, C0deb1ue said:

Not sure the loonshrine is that applicable unless you are going to camp Squig herds next to it...  

 

It’s lovely an fluffy but it’s barely a buff 🤷🏼‍♂️

You dont have to be in any range to get a respawn 

[C0deb1ue]

28 minutes ago, Arkahn said:

You dont have to be in any range to get a respawn 

That is actually far better! Didn't catch that before

 

 

Edited August 20, 2020 by C0deb1ue

[Malakithe]

The advantage of the mega battalion is that it could a low drop list depending on what you toss in

[C0deb1ue]

I guess but it's got an awful lot of tax points  in it and i'm not convinced the benefit is that useful. 

With one stampede/squigalanche/additional mangler squig - thats 490 points.....

[Okonomiyakimarine]

still working on a pure squig-list with a little bit of help from the magic friends. won't have a game anytime soon though, will have to bring up some numbers. thoughts?

An Aggro-alternative could be minus 24x squig herd and geminids plus colossal squig and malevolent moon.

Leaders
Loonboss on Giant Cave Squig (110)
- General
- Moonclan Stabba
- Command Trait: Envoy of the Overbounder  
Madcap Shaman (80)
- Artefact: Moonface Mommet  
- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of Gork
Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (280)
- Artefact: Syari Screamersquig
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (90)
- Lore of the Moonclans: Squig Lure

Battleline
24 x Squig Herd (280)
24 x Squig Herd (280)

5 x Squig Hoppers (90)
5 x Squig Hoppers (90)

Units
6 x Sneaky Snufflers (70)

10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)
10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)

Battalions
Squig Rider Stampede (140)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Scuttletide (30)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (60)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 194

[swarmofseals]

@Okonomiyakimarine two words: tabletop simulator!

[Stryga]

Jaws of Mork sounds like so much fun!  What happens if you take the Jaws of Mork keyword but Skragrott is your general?

[Nezzhil]

13 minutes ago, Stryga said:

Jaws of Mork sounds like so much fun!  What happens if you take the Jaws of Mork keyword but Skragrott is your general?

Skragott is your general. 
- The Jaws of Work command trait is not asigned to anyone because the named characters can't have one.

- The artefact must be asigned to a none named character as always, so other one of your heroes must have it.

-The Loonshirne rules are the olds one because Skragrott don't have the Squig Keyword.