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Sleboda

Malignant Set - Will I Ever Use the Hexwraiths

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I have an opportunity to get the Start Collecting (and the skirmish set) for Malignants.

I'm not sure I'll end up using the Hexwraiths. I'd like thoughts on them.

How are people finding them?

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I built them as Hexwraiths but sorta regret it. I feel black knights are probably better these days. (though neither are great)

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6 minutes ago, CentralKarma said:

They can be built as hexwraiths or black knights correct?

Yes that is correct. I'm guessing since Reapers came out they pretty much replaced the role that Black Knights and Hexwraiths held, right?

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you can always magnetize them so that you can switch hexwraiths and black knights.

Sincerely I find them quite useful in both forms.

 

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11 hours ago, Sleboda said:

I have an opportunity to get the Start Collecting (and the skirmish set) for Malignants.

I'm not sure I'll end up using the Hexwraiths. I'd like thoughts on them.

How are people finding them?

 

4 hours ago, themortalgod said:

I built them as Hexwraiths but sorta regret it. I feel black knights are probably better these days. (though neither are great)

I would beg to differ, I think hexwraiths are better then black knight and worth to have atleast 1 unit of them of 10 in your army, especially if you're playing nighthaunts.

Hexwraiths, 5 for 160p = 2hp, 2 attacks, -1 rend, + 2 attack mount, Fly, ETHERAL flat +4 save 50/50 , frightfull touch, Spectral hunters, just run over a unit of 20+ models and rain down mortal wounds,  summonable.

Black knights, 5, 120p = Same hp, Same attacks, no rend, +5 save not etheral, dosen't fly, no mortal wounds, Deathly charge is good, but without rend, and a lower save they will not survive long enough for it to matter.

But at the same time, are you playing deathrattle black knights may be a better choice since they are Deathrattle and will benefit from Legion of Nagash.

 

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I love my unit of 10 hexwraiths. They threaten backlines and they are summonable, which means that your opponent isn’t too keen on wiping them, but he can’t ignore them either. And they have a huge footprint, so you can generally move them into a very annoying place turn 1. Just don’t expect them to be your main source of damage. 

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I also run a unit of 10 hexwraiths. They're great as they can soak a lot of damage and have some solid attacks as well. Buffing them with extra ttacks and/or rerolls to hit makes them chew through opponents. Altough they're slightly better against tougher, smaller units then against a horde.

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I think ultimately it comes down to how you want to run your army. Pogoing over units to potentially cause mortal wounds can be handy at times, but personally I find a lot of appeal in running Black Knights since they combo well when you pair the abilities of a Wight King and Neferata on them. Suddenly you have flying skeletal knights on horseback who are etheral and pile in and fight twice in a single combat round. Granted it's a lot of set up for a rather okay combo (and using Neferata's ability on a unit like Blood Knights is undoubtably better since they hit like a truck, and then hit like two trucks in the Legion of Blood and buffed by a Vampire Lord) but when we're looking at Deathrattle hitting like a small truck is better than hitting like a foam brick. :P

Seriously though, if you're running stuff that'll buff your Nighthaunt units take the Hexwraiths, if your army has a bone to pick with the opponent run Black Knights, otherwise save the models for the future or use the bits to make cool basing material or gravesite markers.

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I find hexwraiths to be a a significant threat against high rend units. They are quick and can bog down these high threat units. Not to mention they are summonable so you can bring em back.

If you are lucky you can also take out smaller with a decent charge or a weaken them by jumping over them with their fly.

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I think I'm seeing a general trend:

In a Nighthaunt army, Hexwraiths are a solid unit.

In a Legion, maybe go with Knights instead.

Either way, a useful purchase.

Sounds about right?

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1 minute ago, Sleboda said:

I think I'm seeing a general trend:

In a Nighthaunt army, Hexwraiths are a solid unit.

In a Legion, maybe go with Knights instead.

Either way, a useful purchase.

Sounds about right?

Yeah, but point for point i think Hexwraiths win.
And you can use them in LoN along with other nighthaunts like grimghast reapers.
Dance macabre still works on them and so on.

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Ok, so I suppose the bottom line question, then, is this -

In a Matched Play game, where points are at a premium, do most people include them or are there choices that makes more sense for the points in most circumstances?

I'll probably end up getting them just because I'm a completionist, but if I only used them in Open Play, it makes them less of a priority.

Edited by Sleboda

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1 minute ago, Sleboda said:

Ok, so I suppose the bottom line question, then, is this -

In a Matched Play game, where points are at a premium, do most people include them or are there choices that makes more sense for the points in most circumstances?

From what I've seen and heard with LoN people tend to opt for Grimghast Reapers since they can do what the hexwraiths and knights do with free ethereal buff and can be affected by all the of same allegiance abilities. They cost less than the hexwraiths with more bodies which means more attacks after the pile in and the possibility for mortal wounds after the leader swings. The range of the weapons are also longer for even more attacks depending on position. 

If you don't want to go the Nighthaunt route though then it seems like a toss up between the Hexwraiths and the Black Knights which are from the same kit. 

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Thanks, all. I have both armies, with the current focus on Nighthaunt, so I'm sure I can find a use for the kit.

I appreciate the thoughts.

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18 hours ago, MrRoff said:

 

I would beg to differ, I think hexwraiths are better then black knight and worth to have atleast 1 unit of them of 10 in your army, especially if you're playing nighthaunts.

Hexwraiths, 5 for 160p = 2hp, 2 attacks, -1 rend, + 2 attack mount, Fly, ETHERAL flat +4 save 50/50 , frightfull touch, Spectral hunters, just run over a unit of 20+ models and rain down mortal wounds,  summonable.

Black knights, 5, 120p = Same hp, Same attacks, no rend, +5 save not etheral, dosen't fly, no mortal wounds, Deathly charge is good, but without rend, and a lower save they will not survive long enough for it to matter.

But at the same time, are you playing deathrattle black knights may be a better choice since they are Deathrattle and will benefit from Legion of Nagash.

 

You are forgetting about the AOE -1 bravery aura. The problem is neither are good hammers because neither do much damage. For example, compare to 160pts worth of Tzaangor Enlightened. The enlightened are faster, hit harder, and tougher than either Knights or Hexwraiths. But that -1 bravery when stacked with other bravery debuffs can be devastating and they are the only fast moving -1 bravery banner in the army. 

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I was torn between hexwraiths and black knights too,  but ultimately decided to go with black knights. 

Taking black knights, I had enough points left over to take a 3rd necromancer 

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15 hours ago, themortalgod said:

You are forgetting about the AOE -1 bravery aura. The problem is neither are good hammers because neither do much damage. For example, compare to 160pts worth of Tzaangor Enlightened. The enlightened are faster, hit harder, and tougher than either Knights or Hexwraiths. But that -1 bravery when stacked with other bravery debuffs can be devastating and they are the only fast moving -1 bravery banner in the army. 

Legion of Blood is great for stacking those debuffs. -2 base for being within 6" of a unit with a banner (-1 for Legion of Blood's rules and -1 for the banner), and you can easily escalate it pretty fast.

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1 hour ago, Fulkes said:

Legion of Blood is great for stacking those debuffs. -2 base for being within 6" of a unit with a banner (-1 for Legion of Blood's rules and -1 for the banner), and you can easily escalate it pretty fast.

Yup, agreed, you force the opponent to either invest resources in a crappy 120pt unit and ignore your real threats or potentially suffer heavily due to stacking LD debuffs. Add in Overwhelming Dread, Gnashing Jaws, and Gravetide to make even high bravery units scatter to the wind.

Unfortunately, though, mass AOE immune to battle shock such as what Khorne or SCE can bring does a nasty job of hard countering this.

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1 minute ago, themortalgod said:

Yup, agreed, you force the opponent to either invest resources in a crappy 120pt unit and ignore your real threats or potentially suffer heavily due to stacking LD debuffs. Add in Overwhelming Dread, Gnashing Jaws, and Gravetide to make even high bravery units scatter to the wind.

Unfortunately, though, mass AOE immune to battle shock such as what Khorne or SCE can bring does a nasty job of hard countering this.

On the flipside, it makes things like the Bloodseeker Palaquin or the Mortis Engine good as they go off like a bomb with their Wailing Dead shooting attack and hit all units in range. 2d6 vs leadership with the difference dished out as mortal wounds is a wonderful thing.

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I have a crazy idea for a conversion standpoint for leftover hexwriath parts.

 

Can you put Hexwrwaith riders on top of Glaivewraith stalkers? For double the spooks?

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9 minutes ago, Fulkes said:

On the flipside, it makes things like the Bloodseeker Palaquin or the Mortis Engine good as they go off like a bomb with their Wailing Dead shooting attack and hit all units in range. 2d6 vs leadership with the difference dished out as mortal wounds is a wonderful thing.

Yup, to a degree. Also more importantly Banshees and Terrogheists as they are already dece

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Terrorgheist are brutal in Legion of Blood! Their scream is a good sniping tool with bravery debuff and their maw in melee could be devastating! I once rolled 3x 6 to hit against the general of my opponent! xD I know it's unlikely but you should have seen his face when I said to him it's straight 18 dmg with no save! 

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I also have a bunch of Hexwraith/black knights just sitting there in a box. I don't like the way they look when compared to the rest of my NightHaunt army, they just clash visually... So I designed my list without them. If I ever feel like adding them or if I want to play DeathRattle or something I'll build them then.

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