Ben Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 The GT Final has been won. Ben Savva @Age of The Erstwood defeated Gary P in the final round to take the title. Winning list was Daughters of Khaine. Quote Morathi Slaughter Queen Cauldron Meduas 30 Witches 30 Sisters of Slaughter 10 Witches 2x 5 Heart renders Full top 10 was: DoK w/Morathi Nighthaunt Nurgle Daemons Stormcast Sacrosanct Chamber Nagash DoK Snakes Order Soup Idoneth Nagash Daughters Horde Quite a mix. The final was streamed and the last game was quite a nail biter with some ballsy play and great sportsmanship. An amazing advertisement for the game We had Realm rules, spells, artefacts all in play. Soft scores too. No dramas. Fantastic split of lists and a worthy winner. @LLV is already working on getting the match ups from GW and i'm sure @Antipodean7 will be putting together one of his epic run down blog posts. If you were at the event let us know how it went, if you were watching from home what questions do you have for the players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overread Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Great news and nice to see a spread of factions in the top listing - although a touch worried that 3 daughters lists might suggest a potential nerf approaching them. However as all 3 were quite different (morathi- snakes and hoard) it might also just be representing the fact that they are updated in a sea of factions that are still to be updated. Nagash also features twice so 3 for Daughters isn't abnormal it would seem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted October 14, 2018 Author Share Posted October 14, 2018 Help me fill the usernames in? 1 - @Age of The Erstwood 2 - @Sedge 3- @Terry Pike 4- @Gary 5- Steve Curtis 6- Nick Thompson 7- @Bruce ??? Chris Myhill 8- Dan Bradshaw 9- @Countmoore 10- Colin Cochrane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkiham Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 good to hear we are actually getting the info. last i heard they werent to keen on doing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austin Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 I am excited to see what the Idoneth Deepkin player took! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoshiya Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 3 hours ago, Overread said: Great news and nice to see a spread of factions in the top listing - although a touch worried that 3 daughters lists might suggest a potential nerf approaching them. However as all 3 were quite different (morathi- snakes and hoard) it might also just be representing the fact that they are updated in a sea of factions that are still to be updated. Nagash also features twice so 3 for Daughters isn't abnormal it would seem. Eh, if anything I'd say three different Daughters list shows the opposite, ie.the whole faction is overperforming compared to even the best units from other factions. At this point I'd say it's more of a case of what they'll nerf rather than if they'll nerf. Admittedly the lack of Hag Queens in the top list is pretty interesting. Also, Nagash isn't exactly the best touchstone for "balanced" lists at the moment... Anyway, glad to see outside of that it was still overall pretty varied and congrats to all the people that made it to the top ten. I know this game is more than just strong lists and good play and hard work make up just as much of a placing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overread Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 6 minutes ago, Yoshiya said: Eh, if anything I'd say three different Daughters list shows the opposite, ie.the whole faction is overperforming compared to even the best units from other factions. At this point I'd say it's more of a case of what they'll nerf rather than if they'll nerf. Admittedly the lack of Hag Queens in the top list is pretty interesting. Also, Nagash isn't exactly the best touchstone for "balanced" lists at the moment... Anyway, glad to see outside of that it was still overall pretty varied and congrats to all the people that made it to the top ten. I know this game is more than just strong lists and good play and hard work make up just as much of a placing True, then again it might also just be faction popularity too. That said 3 different lists functioning shows that something is going well in Daughters that other armies can and should emulate - that of functional multiple viable army compositions. I guess it might be good to see how Beasts of Chaos are in a few months time and how well they are balancing out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoshiya Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Just now, Overread said: True, then again it might also just be faction popularity too. That said 3 different lists functioning shows that something is going well in Daughters that other armies can and should emulate - that of functional multiple viable army compositions. I guess it might be good to see how Beasts of Chaos are in a few months time and how well they are balancing out. Oh yea, I'd love for every army to have multiple viable lists like Daughters. It's honestly a pain because I believe Daughters are a bit too strong because they can do that at the moment but ultimately that's what I want every army to be able to do. Kind of leaves me torn because for the sake of balance it's easier to just knock Daughters down a bit but for the sake of the game I feel like the longer and more painful process of bringing everyone else up is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overread Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 I wouldn't mind Daughters coming in line with other factions, but yes I'd hate for it to happen in a way that cuts down on the versatility of their current lists. If GW did that I think it would be bad for the game in general - what we need are the choices that Daughters are offering. If anything they should be closer to a template for how other factions should start to be built toward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PUFNSTUF Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 O can't wait to see what the snake list was! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cblackaus Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Too much focus on the strength of the lists. Yes DoK are strong. Yes Death is strong - but so are a range of other armies. At the end of the day it comes down to the skill of the player, a very small amount of lick and the draw/scenario dynamic. It’s easy to blame the ‘list’ ... but I really think it doesn’t achieve anything. I can’t see the full results. But let’s say I saw 3 DoK lists in positions 20-50 and drew the conclusion ‘DoK are a mid tier list’ ?. It is ultimately about the player and the match up/opponent/scenario dynamic that is the key to improving your game. I think one the pivotal and interesting aspects of the last game was the decision to give priority away on T2. That was ballsy and a great play to force later term dynamics ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Skrolk Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 57 minutes ago, Cblackaus said: Too much focus on the strength of the lists. Yes DoK are strong. Yes Death is strong - but so are a range of other armies. At the end of the day it comes down to the skill of the player, a very small amount of lick and the draw/scenario dynamic. It’s easy to blame the ‘list’ ... but I really think it doesn’t achieve anything. I can’t see the full results. But let’s say I saw 3 DoK lists in positions 20-50 and drew the conclusion ‘DoK are a mid tier list’ ?. It is ultimately about the player and the match up/opponent/scenario dynamic that is the key to improving your game. I think one the pivotal and interesting aspects of the last game was the decision to give priority away on T2. That was ballsy and a great play to force later term dynamics ? Listen, I love Age of Sigmar but both AoS and 40K in general come down very little to tactics. They just aren't well-developed enough game systems to have chess-like moves deciding the outcome. A game system like Infinity is much better if you want tactics to make a big difference. I don't like it--but AoS is mostly comes down to lists and then variance. A top tier tournament list will stomp a random fluffy list if both players have remotely similar skill. Most skill comes down to keeping guys moving forward while staying within the most overlapping buffs, and abusing a few game mechanics like pile-in tips and tricks. It actually frustrates me about AoS, I turn to chess and poker if I want the feeling of "Oh that was clever!" during the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Watching the stream it seemed like there were virtually no endless spells taken by the players. Steve Wren had one (but couldn’t cast it), it will be interesting to see if GW update next year to make sure they see some play. This was the same at Throne of Skulls and Soul Wars, very light on endless spells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Wilson Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Really enjoyed watching bits of the stream this weekend, and especially the closing stages of Ben and Gary’s game. Great (and ballsy) tactical play by Ben giving away priority turn 2 - the commentary team couldn’t believe it haha. Actually the commentary team were pretty good, I have to say. Tactics are absolutely pivotal to AoS - what a lot of rot in the above post! What is deployment, for just one example, if not one long tactical exercise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlasticCraic Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Completely agree @Marc Wilson A real power move. Good on him. Why is that guy even posting in AOS forums if he has such disdain for the game. An attention-seeker and best ignored imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HollowHills Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 6 hours ago, Overread said: I wouldn't mind Daughters coming in line with other factions, but yes I'd hate for it to happen in a way that cuts down on the versatility of their current lists. If GW did that I think it would be bad for the game in general - what we need are the choices that Daughters are offering. If anything they should be closer to a template for how other factions should start to be built toward. Balance has never been great in AoS, I mean if you look at lists which were previously dominating tournaments they've generally gone from mass representation, regular top 10 etc to completely disappear. For example Tzeentch and BCR have dropped off fairly hard. That said some tournament lists that are no longer seen were clearly removed because they weren't in line with how the game was meant to be played. I'm looking at you vanguard wing and the soon to retire Gav charge. With the winning list on one hand it's nice to see an army that uses a real variety of units and isn't dependant upon a specific battalion or combo. On the other these results just go further to show that Nagash and DoK are stronger than they should be. As an aside do any of those who attended have thoughts about realm rules? In my local community people feel fairly strongly that they ruin the balance and fun of the game. I personally want to give them a try, but even getting some people to use scenery rules from the core rules is tough enough. Congratulations to the winner and all those in the top ten as well. Especially the chap playing the best army of all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 54 minutes ago, HollowHills said: Balance has never been great in AoS, I mean if you look at lists which were previously dominating tournaments they've generally gone from mass representation, regular top 10 etc to completely disappear. For example Tzeentch and BCR have dropped off fairly hard. That said some tournament lists that are no longer seen were clearly removed because they weren't in line with how the game was meant to be played. I'm looking at you vanguard wing and the soon to retire Gav charge. With the winning list on one hand it's nice to see an army that uses a real variety of units and isn't dependant upon a specific battalion or combo. On the other these results just go further to show that Nagash and DoK are stronger than they should be. As an aside do any of those who attended have thoughts about realm rules? In my local community people feel fairly strongly that they ruin the balance and fun of the game. I personally want to give them a try, but even getting some people to use scenery rules from the core rules is tough enough. Congratulations to the winner and all those in the top ten as well. Especially the chap playing the best army of all. Well I didn’t attend the tournament but have played a fair bit of the realmrules. i don’t really think that it ruins the balance. the extra spell everyone can use are great but army’s which already have their own magic lore will mostly use them. Also realm rules can be something much more interesting and can sometimes shut the much hated spamming shooting down, which would mean that a more strategic approach is needed. in other words Realmrules can help the balance a lot. armys or faction which don’t have a battletome or just we’re forgotten to get any updates since now will much likely benefit of it. (Also army’s which already have a sort of update/battletome etc. Will and can benefit of the realm rules, as long as nobody goes out on a full shooting army) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronWilson Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Congratulations Ben! Well deserved and well earned win, even if DoK are too strong etc this isn't a thread to talk about / take away from Bens win. If I had been given the list I wouldn't of won the event, so well done to Ben for piloting the list to 6 wins in a tough event with stiff competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azmarus Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 somebody see SCE list ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planar Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Nice to see the results. Congrats to everybody making it to the top 10. Looking forward to see the lists! Does the lack of Seraphon from the top 10 surprise you as much it surprises me? What do you think is the reason of their absence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Congrats too everybody in the top ten.? (still wondering: have there been any mixed skaven players??) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tropical Ghost General Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Is there anyway of seeing the lists used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted October 15, 2018 Author Share Posted October 15, 2018 The Nighthaunt list from Sedge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tropical Ghost General Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 14 minutes ago, Ben said: Nighthaunt list from Sedge How did know I was interested in seeing the ghost list? ? (guessing the username gave it away ?) Do you have the other lists from the top ten? Am keen to see what other armies are using as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overread Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 4 hours ago, PlasticCraic said: Why is that guy even posting in AOS forums if he has such disdain for the game. An attention-seeker and best ignored imo. In any game there are always positives and negatives. Some are absolute whilst some are based on experience, understanding and interpretation of situations. Most of the time online (esp in forums) people only give a summary of their viewpoint, if that is met with hostility then its unlikely that they will expand on their point in greater depth. This stifles conversation and defeats the ability of all those interacting from adding detail to their thoughts and on taking conversation beyond casual comments. Plus negative viewpoints are important to air and go into detail on as much as the positive. By looking in detail at the negative one might notice ways to improve or adjust things. Furthermore sometimes encouraging someone to write out their negative viewpoint can sometimes show where its not actually an absolute negative, but perhaps where they've focused their perception on something incorrectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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