Shroudguard Smash

[Mutter]

Hey there,

I'm an ex-WHFB veteran of 20+ years and a 40k player of 10+ years.

I stopped playing GW stuff when they nuked the Old World, but Shadespire has been slowly drawing me back in. After seeing the Nighthaunts for Shadespire, I looked at the other Nighthaunt stuff and immediately fell in love. Such awesome models!

Also, it seems that AoS has taken a turn for the better. The 1.0 was such a cruel joke, it broke my heart, but now it looks like a real game.

Anyway, after lurking on here and reading up on stuff, I'm trying to hammer out a first possible list. This is it ...

C&C welcome!

LEADERS
Guardian of Souls with Nightmare Lantern (140)
- General
- Command Trait : Terrifying Entity
- Infernal Lantern (Artefact) : Beacon of Nagashizzar
Reikenor the Grimhailer (180)
- Lore of the Underworlds : Lifestealer

Vampire Lord (140)
- Allies
Vampire Lord (140)
- Allies
Necromancer (110)
- Allies

UNITS
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (320)
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (320)
20 x Chainrasp Horde (160)
20 x Chainrasp Horde (160)
10 x Chainrasp Horde (80)
4 x Glaivewraith Stalkers (60)

BATTALIONS
Shroudguard (110)

ENDLESS SPELLS
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Soulsnare Shackles (20)

Artefacts are probably the Pendant of the Fell Wind, since the movement for the hordes is just glorious, and the second one might be the cape that gives +4 movement and flying to enable the Necro to keep up. Alternatively, if I find that the Necro does not need the cape, I could give somebody the CP brooch, that seems pretty nice.

Spells will be Soul Cage & Shademist for the two vampire lords, Lifestealer for Reikenor to help him with his Corpse Candles (which will be mainly used to ensure the going off of the Cogs for extra yummy Wave of Terror on 8+). Necro and Soukl Guardian get any old spell, since they will always be casting Vanhel's & Spectral Lure.

Obviously, everything is centered around the Bladegheists. The two big Chainrasp Hordes will block for them, to ensure them getting the charge, the vampires will give them extra attacks, the necro an extra attack phase and the Soul Guardian the buff to wounds. If even only some of the buffs are in play, they should really nuke anything.

The small Chainrasp Horde and the Stalkers will take care of objectives.

Any thoughts?

[kenshin620]

Unfortunately only nighthaunt wizards can generate nighthaunt spells in a nighthaunt army. The vampires and necromancer have to make do with their basic spells. Plus NH armies like to  bring a ton of NH heros for all the spooky synergy they have.

Unless I missed something about NH spells.

 

Now if you're playing with some friendly folk, they may allow more flexible spell choosing since you're new. Don't want to turn away new players after all!

[Kirjava13]

Unfortunately Chronomantic Cogs doesn't help with the Wave of Terror as the charge roll has to be an unmodified 10+ ? Still worth it for helping units coming up from the underworlds to charge, or for the extra spellcast it gives you, mind!

[Mutter]

15 minutes ago, kenshin620 said:

Unfortunately only nighthaunt wizards can generate nighthaunt spells in a nighthaunt army. The vampires and necromancer have to make do with their basic spells.

Oh, well, that's a bummer. But I still get Vanhel's from the Necro, right? Maybe I need to lose a vampire lord, then. Hmmmm ...

 

6 minutes ago, Kirjava13 said:

Unfortunately Chronomantic Cogs doesn't help with the Wave of Terror as the charge roll has to be an unmodified 10+

Another bummer. But I guess then I can save those points, because the guys should be mobile enough with a 11" move.

Thanks for your help, guys. Much appreciated ...

[Binkbinkplx]

Can Nighthaunt take a Necromancer as an ally?

[Mutter]

6 minutes ago, Binkbinkplx said:

Can Nighthaunt take a Necromancer as an ally?

Damn, you're right.

Man, this simple game system is a lot more complicated than it looks.

[Mutter]

So, lose the Necro (bleh, he was tasty) and the Shackles and put the Spirit Torment back in? Not too mad about it, but not sure what else to do. Or I could lose the Necro, the two spells and the Stalkers and get Lady Olynder.

[Binkbinkplx]

I've been looking at running something like this:

LEADERS
Lady Olynder, Mortarch of Grief (240)
- Lore of the Underworlds : Soul Cage
Reikenor the Grimhailer (180)
- Lore of the Underworlds : Spectral Tether
Knight of Shrouds on Ethereal Steed (140)
Guardian of Souls with Nightmare Lantern (140)
- Lore of the Underworlds : Shademist
- Infernal Lantern (Artefact) : Beacon of Nagashizzar
Spirit Torment (120)
- General
- Command Trait : Ruler of the Spirit Hosts
- Artefact : Gryph-feather Charm
UNITS
30 x Grimghast Reapers (360)
20 x Chainrasp Horde (160)
10 x Chainrasp Horde (80)
15 x Bladegheist Revenants (270)
5 x Bladegheist Revenants (90)
BATTALIONS
Shroudguard (110)
ENDLESS SPELLS
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Aethervoid Pendulum (40)

 

Definitely still up in the air on some things tho and looking for tips or opinions!

[kenshin620]

44 minutes ago, Mutter said:

Damn, you're right.

Man, this simple game system is a lot more complicated than it looks.

Oh believe me, chaos is even worse. Need a Venn Diagram to figure out who can be in what, especially with Nurgle.

Though Death is also a little funny since Legions of Nagash technically isn't an allegiance per say so its hard to remember what units in LoN have what keyword, doesn't' help most faction keywords have "Death" or "Dead" in front of them!

Still I'd say see what the other players in your area are like. If they're accommodating they may allow a more fluid ally system so you can learn the ropes.

[Goddin]

2 hours ago, Mutter said:

Artefacts are probably the Pendant of the Fell Wind, since the movement for the hordes is just glorious, and the second one might be the cape that gives +4 movement and flying to enable the Necro to keep up. Alternatively, if I find that the Necro does not need the cape, I could give somebody the CP brooch, that seems pretty nice.

 

Keep in mind that allies can't be granted artefacts, nor can named characters like Reiknor.  So in your initial list you have 2 artefacts (base, 1 from your battalion) but only 1 character who can be given an artefact.  No model can be given two artefacts.

 

I agree with other posters who suggested adding another nighthaunt hero.

[Mutter]

3 minutes ago, Goddin said:

Keep in mind that allies can't be granted artefacts,

Did I say 'bleh' already?

Hmmm, even in the revised list I'd only have the Soul Guardian to take one. Would it be worth trading in Reikonor for a KoS to take that second artefact? Possibly not, but then it's indeed wasted.

I think the vamps are too strong in this list to swap them out. I mean, they heal themselves, can bring back an average of six models each and their +1 attack buff is much, much stronger than the one from KoS.

[Binkbinkplx]

I do like Vamps! Its important to note that they don't give the 12" bubble of Deathless Save like a normal Nighthaunt Hero, nor do they do the other traits, such as -1 Bravery, healing 1 Wound on Failed Battleshocks, and perhaps worst, aren't Ethereal. I toyed around with trying to fit them in a lot too but besides the healing, I found them kinda lackluster trying to support our very needy troops.

Have you considering dropping some of the Bladegheists? Im a HUGE fan of them, but 20 often felt like overkill trying to get them all in.

[Mutter]

I think I want to stick to 20, 'cause I want them to be able to take a serious beating, too, and come back from that. That's why I want so much healing in the list as well - if somebody thinks smashing the 'geists down to half a dozen finishes them off will be in for a surprise.

[Binkbinkplx]

I would definitely say to drop the shackles with the necro to add a Spirit Torment with them then,

Spirit Torment will give the 'geists  Reroll all failed hits, and can get you d3 back as long as they kill atleast three models during the Battleshock phase! Not to mention give you another Nighthaunt to support them with the 6 Death Save in case Reik Dies.

[Mutter]

11 hours ago, Binkbinkplx said:

Spirit Torment will give the 'geists  Reroll all failed hits,

No, that's only from Reikonor or KoS from the battalion, unfortunately.

ST is only reroll 1s.

But still, I had similar thoughts. Lates incarnation would be:

LEADERS
Lady Olynder, Mortarch of Grief (240)
Guardian of Souls with Nightmare Lantern (140)
- Infernal Lantern (Artefact) : Beacon of Nagashizzar
Reikenor the Grimhailer (180)
- Lore of the Underworlds : Lifestealer
Spirit Torment (120)
Vampire Lord (140)
- Allies
UNITS
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (320)
20 x Bladegheist Revenants (320)
20 x Chainrasp Horde (160)
20 x Chainrasp Horde (160)
10 x Chainrasp Horde (80)
BATTALIONS
Shroudguard (110)
ENDLESS SPELLS
Soulsnare Shackles (20)

[spenson]

Their rule 'fearful frenzy' allows them to reroll all hits instead of 1's. From the warscroll: 

"You can re-roll failed hit rolls for attacks made by this unit if it is wholly within 12" of any friendly Spirit Torments or Chainghasts."

[Mutter]

D'oh, I'm such a honk.

Yes, of course, you're both right. That's why I had the ST originally in the list, of course, but then, across it's countless iterations, completely forgot it about, or rather mixed it up with the re-roll somebody else gets for charging.

I don't think I've ever come across a game where you needed so much cross-reference as AoS 2.0. Not sure how noob-friendly that whole system is. But thanks to you guys I'm slowly getting there, ironing out the kinks.

[Nevvermore]

You could use Azyr instead of Warscroll Builder because it will validate your list and catch any errors. Unfortunately it costs money

[XReN]

Keep in mind that you can't have more than 1 ally per 4 units, so that is another problem with the initial list where you had 3/11 allies/total ratio, lacking 1 unit to be valid
Also to add to previous commentator - Warscroll Builder does not have any REAL validation check mechanics (it will allow you to take necromancer as ally for example) . And Azyr app proved times and times again to be a sloppy made and poorly supported tool, so use it for roster building when you already know how it is actually done. To learn aspects of roster building you have to get to the reading, there is no real good way to cut edges.

[Mutter]

1 hour ago, XReN said:

Keep in mind that you can't have more than 1 ally per 4 units, so that is another problem with the initial list where you had 3/11 allies/total ratio, lacking 1 unit to be valid

Ah, gotcha. I thought that part got overwritten by the Matched Play rules, where it's 2000/400 for allies ...

[Sception]

yeah, figuring out what's legal exactly in matched play is in fact a lot more complicated than you might expect, or than it should be honestly.  But otherwise, yeah, 2nd edition is a big improvement on AoS 1e, and the nighthaunt range is gorgeous.

Vamps are good allies.  They miss out on a lot of stuff in a nighthaunt army (as already mentioned by others), but their CA and invocation abilities are really useful.

Necromancers would be as good or better, but aren't legal allies for nighthaunt.  But do remember that the /reverse/ works just fine.  You can run a 'Legions of Nagash' army with necromancers & vampires & all, and include a bunch of nighthaunt units as you like.  Some are straight forward parts of LoN armies themselves, and the rest are legal to take as allies.  That said, ghosts in a LoN army play dramatically differently from those same ghosts in a Nighthaunt army, what with the lack of formations, no deep striking / free attacks for big charges, etc.  Still, more different ways to run your army is nice for game play variety.