AoS 2 - Cities of Sigmar Discussion

[AlmGandix3]

1 hour ago, Televiper11 said:

Am thinking Handgunners for Tempest Eye

Yeah I thought about it too since they can be really fast buffed to hit and wound and shoot back when they get charged. The chip damage from the champion against heroes could also be nice.

[Televiper11]

10 minutes ago, AlmGandix3 said:

Yeah I thought about it too since they can be really fast buffed to hit and wound and shoot back when they get charged. The chip damage from the champion against heroes could also be nice.

Agreed. I could see making a nice, pacy gunline for board control and sniping. 

Also, am a reading this right? If I'm charged, I can shoot right away?

Stand and Shoot: As the enemy charge, these warriors make one last shot, praying it will be enough to blunt their advance. Once per turn, when an enemy unit ends a charge move within 3" of this unit and there are no other enemy units within 3" of this unit, this unit can shoot.

Edited October 1, 2019 by Televiper11

[Arkhanist]

57 minutes ago, Defonotaspambot said:

This may be covered in the book or an FAQ, but how do Stormcast special characters interface with CoS? Hammerhead gains a bonus through having Aventis Firestrike but Stormcast lose the Stormhost keyword when becoming part of an CoS army. Does that mean you can take whatever Stormcast special characters you want in a CoS army? Or is Aventis the one named exception?

Good question. GMG reads the relevent rule from page 63 (too small to read though for me). They do get the relevent city keyword, but don't get to pick a host keyword.

So there's nothing stopping you taking a named stormcast character, and they will have the stormhost keyword that's hardcoded in their datasheet (most being Hammers of Sigmar) - but other stormcast units won't. So in Aventis' case, you could use all his abilities, with the exception being his Command Ability, as that only works on friendly Hammers of Sigmar - which you won't have any of. Unless you use it on himself, of course, or if you took a 2nd named character from HoS.

Stormcast units can't take advantage of any stormhost allegience abilities though, which is presumably the primary reason for them not getting that keyword. They may also FAQ so it strips an existing fixed stormhost keyword, rather that just stops you adding one.

But stormcast, including named characters can take advantage of relevent CoS keyword stuff, so they're more integrated than usual allies, and the only restriction is the 1 in 4 units limit.

[SwampHeart]

28 minutes ago, Televiper11 said:

When does the app & Warscroll Builder get updated?

This upcoming Saturday (book release). 

[Televiper11]

Just now, SwampHeart said:

This upcoming Saturday (book release). 

Can't wait. So stoked. So many ideas knocking around my head for Tempest Eye.

[willange]

I'm looking forward to finding ways to play the Phoenicium efficiently.  It looks like it'll be a decent little challenge.  I'm especially looking for ways to either force my opponent to make difficult target priority decisions in the combat phase by engaging on multiple fronts, or just trying to guarantee that I have something die early (Knight Incantor suicide or something like that).  I'll of course also play it with the Phoenix battaltion just for fun!

[Defonotaspambot]

1 hour ago, Arkhanist said:

Good question. GMG reads the relevent rule from page 63 (too small to read though for me). They do get the relevent city keyword, but don't get to pick a host keyword.

So there's nothing stopping you taking a named stormcast character, and they will have the stormhost keyword that's hardcoded in their datasheet (most being Hammers of Sigmar) - but other stormcast units won't. So in Aventis' case, you could use all his abilities, with the exception being his Command Ability, as that only works on friendly Hammers of Sigmar - which you won't have any of. Unless you use it on himself, of course, or if you took a 2nd named character from HoS.

Stormcast units can't take advantage of any stormhost allegience abilities though, which is presumably the primary reason for them not getting that keyword. They may also FAQ so it strips an existing fixed stormhost keyword, rather that just stops you adding one.

But stormcast, including named characters can take advantage of relevent CoS keyword stuff, so they're more integrated than usual allies, and the only restriction is the 1 in 4 units limit.

I imagine they will strip the Stormhost. As it stands there is nothing stopping you from taking Avensis as a part or Hallowheart, maybe even as part of a Ministry of Magic battalion but that will probably also get FAQed.

[Rahatlin]

1 hour ago, Televiper11 said:

Also, am a reading this right? If I'm charged, I can shoot right away?

Stand and Shoot: As the enemy charge, these warriors make one last shot, praying it will be enough to blunt their advance. Once per turn, when an enemy unit ends a charge move within 3" of this unit and there are no other enemy units within 3" of this unit, this unit can shoot.

Yep. Same ability Sisters of the Watch got. You do your shots after charge and before pile in

[AthelLoren]

Dumb question - Can I use Stormcast Eternals Endless Spells for a CoS army, and Sylvaneth ones for a Living City force?

[smartazjb0y]

47 minutes ago, AthelLoren said:

Dumb question - Can I use Stormcast Eternals Endless Spells for a CoS army, and Sylvaneth ones for a Living City force?

I'm going to assume no because those don't have "Stormcast" or "Sylvaneth" as a keyword, but I haven't read the battletome yet so they may specify that you can. 

Edit: Well guess I might actually be wrong there! 

Edited October 1, 2019 by smartazjb0y

[Arkhanist]

43 minutes ago, AthelLoren said:

Dumb question - Can I use Stormcast Eternals Endless Spells for a CoS army, and Sylvaneth ones for a Living City force?

Likely yes, the same as you can if they're just normal allies. Endless spells themselves aren't part of the faction keyword system for picking 
allegiance, and don't take up an ally slot. When you buy them for matched play, all wizards in your army 'know' them. The faction-specific endless spells are restricted by caster keyword on the warscroll instead - e.g. for everblaze comet, "Only Stormcast Eternal Wizards can attempt to cast this spell." while generic ones can be attempted by any wizard. So as long as you've got a suitable Stormcast or Sylvaneth wizard as necessary to cast it, and there's not a specific rule in CoS saying otherwise (which I've not seen brought up anywhere in the pre-release reviews) you're fine.

Strictly speaking there's no reason you can't pay points for ANY faction-specific endless spell; but unless you have an appropriate faction wizard, you'll never be able to cast it!

Edited October 1, 2019 by Arkhanist

[Aelfric]

36 minutes ago, AthelLoren said:

Dumb question - Can I use Stormcast Eternals Endless Spells for a CoS army, and Sylvaneth ones for a Living City force?

As far as I'm aware, the Endless spell warscroll will say who is allowed to cast it.  So, if the warscroll says this can only be cast by a Stormcast Eternals Wizard, then so long as your wizard is Stormcast they can cast the Endless spell.  Endless spells themselves cost points, but do not have faction specific keywords nor do they count towards ally points.  You can take any Endless spell, but without the  right wizard it would be useless.

[Aelfric]

4 minutes ago, Arkhanist said:

Likely yes, the same as you can if they're just normal allies. Endless spells themselves aren't part of the faction keyword system for picking  allegiance, and don't take up an ally slot. When you buy them for matched play, all wizards in your army 'know' them. The faction-specific endless spells are restricted by caster keyword on the warscroll instead - e.g. for everblaze comet, "Only Stormcast Eternal Wizards can attempt to cast this spell." while generic ones can be attempted by any wizard. So as long as you've got a suitable Stormcast or Sylvaneth wizard as necessary to cast it, and there's not a specific rule in CoS saying otherwise (which I've not seen brought up anywhere in the pre-release reviews) you're fine.

Strictly speaking there's no reason you can't pay points for ANY faction-specific endless spell; but unless you have an appropriate faction wizard, you'll never be able to cast it!

Ah, you got there first!   

[Acid_Nine]

So what do you guys think of using a beat stick stormcast character as a relic bearer in this army? I had the inkling of an idea to use a stardrake as the big centerpiece model in a hammerhall list, or maybe a big host of dracoth guard as a powerful unit.

[WindstormSCR]

1 hour ago, Acid_Nine said:

So what do you guys think of using a beat stick stormcast character as a relic bearer in this army? I had the inkling of an idea to use a stardrake as the big centerpiece model in a hammerhall list, or maybe a big host of dracoth guard as a powerful unit.

Drakesworn Templar or LC on stardrake would be quite nasty as a living city general, with the +1sv and +1 to w trait, not to mention the healing potential.

[stratigo]

14 minutes ago, WindstormSCR said:

Drakesworn Templar or LC on stardrake would be quite nasty as a living city general, with the +1sv and +1 to w trait, not to mention the healing potential.

I kinda like durthu for it more, especially with the “lul I shoot then walk within 4 inches of you” command trait

[Frowny]

I did the math wrong on drakespawn knights. I had forgot they kept their rr'1s and 2's in combat, where every other unit just got the generic +1 save. Table should look like this. 

 

This makes drakespawn knights far and away the most resilient in the entire book, and very high overall as well. They are also very sturdy against higher rend attacks, but not by nearly so much, and also the sturdiest against higher rend attacks, although not by as much. Maybe useful as a mobile tarpit for lists that want that. 

[AthelLoren]

2 hours ago, Arkhanist said:

Likely yes, the same as you can if they're just normal allies. Endless spells themselves aren't part of the faction keyword system for picking  allegiance, and don't take up an ally slot. When you buy them for matched play, all wizards in your army 'know' them. The faction-specific endless spells are restricted by caster keyword on the warscroll instead - e.g. for everblaze comet, "Only Stormcast Eternal Wizards can attempt to cast this spell." while generic ones can be attempted by any wizard. So as long as you've got a suitable Stormcast or Sylvaneth wizard as necessary to cast it, and there's not a specific rule in CoS saying otherwise (which I've not seen brought up anywhere in the pre-release reviews) you're fine.

Strictly speaking there's no reason you can't pay points for ANY faction-specific endless spell; but unless you have an appropriate faction wizard, you'll never be able to cast it!

Thanks!

[Malfunct Bot]

Question but how effective do you think a Flagellant suicide bomb would be in a Hallowheart list?

Get a big block of 40, cast Warding Brand on them (and potentially Ignite Weapons if you feel like it) and just throw them at the scariest thing your opponent has (potentially using the Soulseeker Endless spell to get them there). Everytime they kill one of the - Save Flagellants they take a Mortal Wound on a 4+, and everytime one runs its the exact same thing, so if you manage to touch something with the big block of 40 thats on average 20 Mortal Wounds if they all die/run, ON TOP of any damage the Flagellants do themselves.

Am I missing something or would this actually work?

 

[Cerlin]

1 hour ago, Malfunct Bot said:

Question but how effective do you think a Flagellant suicide bomb would be in a Hallowheart list?

Get a big block of 40, cast Warding Brand on them (and potentially Ignite Weapons if you feel like it) and just throw them at the scariest thing your opponent has (potentially using the Soulseeker Endless spell to get them there). Everytime they kill one of the - Save Flagellants they take a Mortal Wound on a 4+, and everytime one runs its the exact same thing, so if you manage to touch something with the big block of 40 thats on average 20 Mortal Wounds if they all die/run, ON TOP of any damage the Flagellants do themselves.

Am I missing something or would this actually work?

 

It would work for sure. They are cheap enough that the mortal wound bomb could really wreck many things. On the face of it I would say they are probably best verses elite units, since you can surround them, die to them, hit them, then mortal wound them to death.  I have 50 of these I built last year and I am excited to see it. 

[zilberfrid]

3 hours ago, Frowny said:

I did the math wrong on drakespawn knights. I had forgot they kept their rr'1s and 2's in combat, where every other unit just got the generic +1 save. Table should look like this. 

 

This makes drakespawn knights far and away the most resilient in the entire book, and very high overall as well. They are also very sturdy against higher rend attacks, but not by nearly so much, and also the sturdiest against higher rend attacks, although not by as much. Maybe useful as a mobile tarpit for lists that want that. 

That does make quite a difference!

One thing to note for Dark Riders, is that they drop in points at 20. They then only are 360 points, making them cheaper than pistoleers. Less useful as mobile bravery decreasers, but more useful as tarpit.

[XReN]

2 hours ago, Malfunct Bot said:

Question but how effective do you think a Flagellant suicide bomb would be in a Hallowheart list?

Get a big block of 40, cast Warding Brand on them (and potentially Ignite Weapons if you feel like it) and just throw them at the scariest thing your opponent has (potentially using the Soulseeker Endless spell to get them there). Everytime they kill one of the - Save Flagellants they take a Mortal Wound on a 4+, and everytime one runs its the exact same thing, so if you manage to touch something with the big block of 40 thats on average 20 Mortal Wounds if they all die/run, ON TOP of any damage the Flagellants do themselves.

Am I missing something or would this actually work?

 

Yep, everything except Soulseeker sounds good, Soulseeker was FAQed so he can't set up unit he carries closer than 9" from the enemy models

[soots]

5 hours ago, Frowny said:

I did the math wrong on drakespawn knights. I had forgot they kept their rr'1s and 2's in combat, where every other unit just got the generic +1 save. Table should look like this. 

 

Am I missing something?

https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls//aos_drakespawnknights_eng.pdf

1a, no reroll. 

[The Merchant Prince]

12 hours ago, Televiper11 said:

Agreed. I could see making a nice, pacy gunline for board control and sniping. 

Also, am a reading this right? If I'm charged, I can shoot right away?

Stand and Shoot: As the enemy charge, these warriors make one last shot, praying it will be enough to blunt their advance. Once per turn, when an enemy unit ends a charge move within 3" of this unit and there are no other enemy units within 3" of this unit, this unit can shoot.

Yes they get overwatch. The rules actually allow them to shoot any unit as normal, not just a unit they're charged by.

[XReN]

1 minute ago, The Merchant Prince said:

Yes they get overwatch. The rules actually allow them to shoot any unit as normal, not just a unit they're charged by.

Rules don't allow that.