AoS 2 - Cities of Sigmar Discussion

[michu]

I also want to say I don't understand why GW decided to make Greywater Fastness uniform colors that of Averland. Nuln would be much better.

[Thiagoma]

4 hours ago, Double Misfire said:

The second of my two articles on incorporating axed units  into a Cities of Sigmar force is up. This one focues on aelves (the previous one was humans and duardin), and features a detailed guide covering every discontinued aelf or elf unit going as far back as Wood Elf Beastmasters, giving suggestions on how to best incorporate them into a modern Cities of Sigmar force:

https://doublemisfire.blogspot.com/2019/09/no-substitute-discontinued-units-in_26.html

Feedback as always very welcome  

 

(Props to @dekayfor his amazing Grunstock Skycutter conversion idea )

 

Saw your article and got some feedback:

 

High Warden makes more sense for me as a General on Griffon (both are armored guys on griffons) than a Dragon or Phoenix, just adjust his base size.

Loremaster and the 2 different archmages are a perfect fit as Battlemages. Both archmages are on top of something elemental while the Loremaster has a sword just like one of the mages model. Dont think you need conversions since they are all male guys on foot casting spells. I Also think the same can go for Mistweaver, but she wouldnt be an "A" on your scale since she could be mistaken by a sorceress.

 

"For ease of browsing (I know a lot of you are aelf purists who would never deign to even consider fielding the likes  of humans or duardin, and won't wan't to sully yourselves looking at the previous post), I'll repeat Part 1's grading system, quickly identifying when some discontinued units are better represented by existing warscrolls than others. "

 

I am one of those guys 🤣

Now this part is just my point of view and my finally reached peace toward the High Elves purge: A LOT of CoS armies are gona be made by converions/Proxy. I think it is the very nature of the book itself and most likely the begining of the games will always  include "so this guy is this warscroll", since most people are gona try and insert their favorite models on it because in the end this book is the reward for those who stuck to their guns for years to be able to play with their vintage toys.

 

And it will be  so much fun to see those dusted off models like the Wood Elf Dragon back on the table!

I also belive that paint jobs are gona have an influence on how the units are identified on the field. Archmage with a Flaming Sword, well it is a Fire Battlemage, what else would that be?

Heck i have a Sorceress conversion (was gona use it as a Mistweaver) that i am turning into a healing mage (forgot the name)!

Edited September 26, 2019 by Thiagoma

[Double Misfire]

10 minutes ago, michu said:

I also want to say I don't understand why GW decided to make Greywater Fastness uniform colors that of Averland. Nuln would be much better.

Because Averland is love, Averland is life and I may have bribed/threatened several design studio members.  

In response to your previous post I didn't say Greywater Fastness couldn't have any Lord-Ordinators! 🤐 Just no other Stormcast.

Here's the Tempest Lords Lord-Ordinator I painted up for Malign Portents in his swank Averland GWF tabard:

 

34 minutes ago, Thiagoma said:

*Quite a lot of feeback!*

Thanks for the feedback.  As outlined in both parts of the article, I made the decision to omit substitutions that involved using a warscroll with the human, duardin or aelf keyword to represent units of different races, as I felt it was against the spirit of the background, and might confuse opponents. It was a personal choice, and I'd never want to enforce my beliefs on how toy soldiers *should* be played with on anyone.  

I am tempted to go back and suggest human head/rider swaps for aelf characters on griffons though... 🤔

Your Sorceress/Mistweaver/Jade Battlemage is stunning by the way!

[dekay]

@Double Misfire, you missed one potentially good counts-as for Warhawks, which I've just been randomly considering adding to my army (having stumbled upon some recently) - javelin Prosecutors. 40mm base, flying, shooting, 2W, so fitting the rest of light cavalry. (the other option I've considered is allied akhelians, if possible but those you mentioned ; ))

Apart from that, you're, still, doing a good work and the Cities community should be grateful ; )

[Thiagoma]

1 hour ago, Double Misfire said:

I am tempted to go back and suggest human head/rider swaps for aelf characters on griffons though... 🤔

I am doing the exactly oposite glueing elf heads on everyone 😂

[Double Misfire]

42 minutes ago, dekay said:

@Double Misfire, you missed one potentially good counts-as for Warhawks, which I've just been randomly considering adding to my army (having stumbled upon some recently) - javelin Prosecutors. 40mm base, flying, shooting, 2W, so fitting the rest of light cavalry. (the other option I've considered is allied akhelians, if possible but those you mentioned ; ))

Apart from that, you're, still, doing a good work and the Cities community should be grateful ; )

Thanks dude. I did consider them for Warhawk Riders, but they've got the human keyword and would be breaking my self imposed rule of not swapping races around.  Prosecutors did make it in as a suggestion for Pegasus Knights though  

💡

Hang about! How about Khinerai Heartrenders? No aelf keyword, but no human one either, and at least from an aelf army; cool flying high rules, and arguably better than Prosecutors, with a more Wood Elf appropriate save. Adding them to the article now...  

 

Have you decided what you're going to do with your griffons and Skycutters yet?

Edited September 26, 2019 by Double Misfire

[dekay]

1 hour ago, Double Misfire said:

I did consider them for Warhawk Riders, but they've got the human keyword and would be breaking my self imposed rule of not swapping races around.

I honestly forgot Stormcasts have a human keyword, weren't their souls supposed to come from all the other races too? But yeah, in that case, they're not an obvious solution.

Khinerai die if you look at them funny, though, so it would be a bit strange for large bird cavalry. Akhelians seem like a best options then. I wonder if we're allowed to ally deepkin.

1 hour ago, Double Misfire said:

Have you decided what you're going to do with your griffons and Skycutters yet?

Waiting for the battletome with the final verdict, there are still several options to be considered ; )

[Mandzak-Miniatures]

6 hours ago, Zanzou said:

Are people forgetting that Phoenicium already has options at their disposal if they want to increase their survivability even further?

But doesn’t this ability kinda counteract the effectiveness of the other benefit? Coupled with what others said about how conditional it is, where to get the perk you need something to die. I’d rather have constant bonus than to depend on loss for a trigger. 

Like the one city that gets extra movement is great but for first turn only, while good. I would rather then cut the bonus movement in half and just have it always work.

[Graftonianman]

The phonecium boons will be great with a MSU build. Especially with multi-wound units. 

[swarmofseals]

@Thiagoma yeah, I agree that the Phoenicum ability seems weaker but gotta remember that this is just a part of the overall picture. In most books there are subfactions with ****** abilities but good artefacts/command traits/command abilities, and some with great abilities but ****** artefacts etc. We really can't say anything yet about whether one faction or the other is too weak or too strong.

[Thiagoma]

7 minutes ago, swarmofseals said:

@Thiagoma yeah, I agree that the Phoenicum ability seems weaker but gotta remember that this is just a part of the overall picture. In most books there are subfactions with ****** abilities but good artefacts/command traits/command abilities, and some with great abilities but ****** artefacts etc. We really can't say anything yet about whether one faction or the other is too weak or too strong.

Indeed

[Thiagoma]

8 hours ago, Zanzou said:

Are people forgetting that Phoenicium already has options at their disposal if they want to increase their survivability even further?

But it isnt a trait. It is a battalion (aka cost points).

Phoenix Temple previous battalion had such stupid requirements that i wouldnt want it even if it gave me 50 pts instead of costing it.

I hope that the Phoenix Warscroll have been reworked. The former battalion required you to not have mounted birds, and without a rider they are just terrible, losing Witness to Destiny and 3 strong attacks.

[Eldarain]

With all the discussion of proxys/counts as thought I'd share my plan. My army is going to be spread across half a dozen companies/factions.

In kindness to those I'll be sharing the table with I'm going to be using these to mark what each unit is representing.

 

https://www.versatileterrain.co.uk/name-plates

[XReN]

For everyone who talks smack about phoenicium - get a knight incantor, get a single gryphhound (either through SCE hero or Warpriest) and then nuke the doggo with Spirit Flasks on the turn you want the bonus (that is clearly intended as defensive boost)
Profit! Army-wide CC bonus at the cost of bringing 2 support heroes and causing yourself problems with animal protectionists.

[JackStreicher]

On 9/25/2019 at 4:29 PM, Thiagoma said:

Yeah i was taking a look into it and i am not sure.

If it doesnt require  alot of green stuff mess (i am terrible at it) i can still keep the Hydra standart assembly sisnce i always wanted an excuse to buy one.

The hydra heads are rather small. I‘ll make you a comparison image =}

[Raffonerd]

1 hour ago, XReN said:

For everyone who talks smack about phoenicium - get a knight incantor, get a single gryphhound (either through SCE hero or Warpriest) and then nuke the doggo with Spirit Flasks on the turn you want the bonus (that is clearly intended as defensive boost)
Profit! Army-wide CC bonus at the cost of bringing 2 support heroes and causing yourself problems with animal protectionists.

Also eatherwing. The thing is: is it stormcast getting the city keyword? Or are they allies?

[XReN]

5 minutes ago, Raffonerd said:

Also eatherwing. The thing is: is it stormcast getting the city keyword? Or are they allies?

Too much wounds to go through. Yes, you can take SCE into main force and give them city keyword.

[kuroyume]

 

Seems like there won't be much limitation to what you can take from SCE. They suggest Aventis as a General for Hammerhal. He's a Hero, Monster, Sacrosanct named character, so we know all those are in.

[Mcprowlington]

3 minutes ago, kuroyume said:

 

Seems like there won't be much limitation to what you can take from SCE. They suggest Aventis as a General for Hammerhal. He's a Hero, Monster, Sacrosanct named character, so we know all those are in.

His full name is literally "Aventis firestrike, Magister of Hammerhal" 

 

that'd pretty silly if you couldn't use him in your Hammerhal army. 

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

Just now, Mcprowlington said:

His full name is literally "Aventis firestrike, Magister of Hammerhal" 

 

that'd pretty silly if you couldn't use him in your Hammerhal army. 

True, and it would be weird if he wasn't an option for general. Just makes me wonder what other Stormcast generals will be an option in the book.

[The Merchant Prince]

8 minutes ago, kuroyume said:

 

Seems like there won't be much limitation to what you can take from SCE. They suggest Aventis as a General for Hammerhal. He's a Hero, Monster, Sacrosanct named character, so we know all those are in.

There may simply be a points cap for the amount of SC that can be taken. One of the FB posts stated clearly that the majority of the army (presumably pts-wise since it was min freeguild battleline and mostly SC) couldn't be SC.

[kuroyume]

2 minutes ago, The Merchant Prince said:

There may simply be a points cap for the amount of SC that can be taken. One of the FB posts stated clearly that the majority of the army (presumably pts-wise since it was min freeguild battleline and mostly SC) couldn't be SC.

I haven't been able to find that comment, can you link it? (not doubting you, just want to see the wording)

[Thalassic Monstrosity]

1 minute ago, The Merchant Prince said:

There may simply be a points cap for the amount of SC that can be taken. One of the FB posts stated clearly that the majority of the army (presumably pts-wise since it was min freeguild battleline and mostly SC) couldn't be SC.

I'm intensely curious to find out the specifics, even though I don't plan to use Stormcast at all in my main City!

[The Merchant Prince]

5 minutes ago, kuroyume said:

I haven't been able to find that comment, can you link it? (not doubting you, just want to see the wording)

 

5 minutes ago, Thalassic Monstrosity said:

I'm intensely curious to find out the specifics, even though I don't plan to use Stormcast at all in my main City!

 

[kuroyume]

Interesting. That's a pretty extreme case, dude was running almost 1500 points of SCE. This confirms they won't go the Slave to Darkness route then, as there is no limitations to StD in monogod armies.