AoS 2 - Seraphon Discussion

[daviseford]

Hey guys, just updated AoS Reminders with the latest GHB changes!

[Sugar Maple]

Has anyone tried Thunderquake in the new edition yet? Skink Alpha on a Stegadon seems like it may make up for losing the chance at a move

I'm currently thinking something like

Heroes

Slann (Great Rememberer, Retrices,  Stellar Tempest)

Astrolith Bearer

Engine of the Gods (Gryph-Feather Charm)

Skink Starpriest (stellar tempest? Unsure of running it twice but it seems so good)

Knight Incantor

3x10 Skinks

3x Salamanders

 Skink Handlers

Bastiladon

Stegadon

Balewind Vortex

Everblaze Comet

Malevolent Maelstrom (had 10 pts left)

2000/2000

Edited July 7, 2019 by Sugar Maple

[Calebexnihilo]

Every list i'm building right now... I end up with a Stegadon or two in it! Seems like the perfect teleport target. Teleport (unfailable) and then Alpha Skink move it D6". It should be in range for the Flamers and then charge (assuming you get a 3/4 average roll).

[Calebexnihilo]

Battle recaps of my 5 games at Warzon Houston last weekend. Last GT with GHB18!

https://youtu.be/TMK-hhrs07o

Game 1 vs Stormcast  (Chris Schelling)
Game 2 vs Khorne  (Spencer Burgett)
Game 3 vs DoK (Andrew Carlson)
Game 4 vs Nighthaunt  (Ryan Couch)
Game 5 vs Fyreslayers  (Zachary Kennedy)

My List:
Slann (Great Rememberer)
EotG
EoTG
Skink Priest (Betrayer's Crown)
Old Blood on Carnosaur (Doppleganger)
3x10 Skinks
8 Razordons
6 Ripperdactyls
Shadowstrike Starhost

[swarmofseals]

I don't own a copy of the new GHB yet, but my friend's copy lists Dracothion's Tail as requiring 4 other Seraphon battalions instead of 0-4. Fangs of Sotek is still 0-4. Was Tail changed, or is this generally considered to be a typo? Strange that it didn't make it into the errata. 

[Wilhelm Stürmer]

1 hour ago, swarmofseals said:

I don't own a copy of the new GHB yet, but my friend's copy lists Dracothion's Tail as requiring 4 other Seraphon battalions instead of 0-4. Fangs of Sotek is still 0-4. Was Tail changed, or is this generally considered to be a typo? Strange that it didn't make it into the errata. 

Is his the digital copy? I believe there was a misprint in it. It is still 0-4 of other battalions.

[themortalgod]

So I've been working on the following list concept lately and wanted to see what everyone thinks. The general idea is to use a deep striking start priest as a vessel to launch a bunch of endless spells deep into the enemy army on turn 1 then let the knights and old blood clean up. 

Slann Starmaster - 260 - General, Great Rememberer, Celestial Apothesis, Ignax Scales
Slann Starmaster - 260 - Stellar Tempest
Oldblood on Carnosaur - 240 - Essence of Vulcatrix
Skink Starpriest - 80 - Claws of Glory
Scar Veteran on Cold One - 100 - Light of Dracothian

10 Saurus Knights - 160
10 Saurus Knights - 160
10 Saurus Knights - 160
10 Skinks - 70

3 Skink Handlers - 40
3 Salamanders - 120

Dracothian Tail - 80
Firelance Starhost - 150

Gnashing Jaws - 30
Palisade - 30
Burning Head - 30
Gravetide - 20
Maelstrom - 10

Total: 2000pts

- Buff potential on the Oldblood is really nice. Starpriest's poison buff coupled with popping essence makes for a ton of potential damage
- Both Slann casting turn 1 endless spells through the priest will make for a lot of disruption in my opponent's lines.
- Deep striking Salamander is great fun. 
- Tons of bravery debuff tools makes battleshock a big problem for my opponent. 

I'm tempted to drop the skinks to make space for purple sun but unsure if it is worth it. 

 

thoughts?

Edited July 26, 2019 by themortalgod

[PJetski]

You can't cast endless spells through Arcane Vassal. The model must be set up within the range of the caster, no modifications are possible (check the Malign Sorcery FAQ). If you want to dump endless spells into the enemy on turn 1 you should use Great Remember to teleport your Slann into range, cast the spell, then teleport back. There's no risk and lots of reward.

Artefacts do not effect mounts unless stated otherwise, so Essence of Vulcatrix will have no effect on the Carnosaur claws and bite attack (and thus no synergy with the Starpriest ability).

Claws of Glory is a truly awful spell. Just bring an Astrolith Bearer to reroll all hits instead, or set up the proper constellation with one of your Slann.

[themortalgod]

33 minutes ago, PJetski said:

You can't cast endless spells through Arcane Vassal. The model must be set up within the range of the caster, no modifications are possible (check the Malign Sorcery FAQ). If you want to dump endless spells into the enemy on turn 1 you should use Great Remember to teleport your Slann into range, cast the spell, then teleport back. There's no risk and lots of reward.

Artefacts do not effect mounts unless stated otherwise, so Essence of Vulcatrix will have no effect on the Carnosaur claws and bite attack (and thus no synergy with the Starpriest ability).

Claws of Glory is a truly awful spell. Just bring an Astrolith Bearer to reroll all hits instead, or set up the proper constellation with one of your Slann.

I was under the impression that you couldn't "choose" a mount's melee weapon for magic weapons that require you to "pick a weapon", but an effect that buffs the whole model isn't that?

Bummer about the endless spell thing though, 1 slann can't cast enough to effectively flood the opponent with endless spells. (I assume most of the time that will translate to only one endless spell, maybe 2)  Probably have to rework the list and drop the whole endless spell concept. 

 

thanks

[PJetski]

8 minutes ago, themortalgod said:

I was under the impression that you couldn't "choose" a mount's melee weapon for magic weapons that require you to "pick a weapon", but an effect that buffs the whole model isn't that?

The core rules say "Artefacts of power have no effect on attacks made by a hero's mount unless noted otherwise" which is pretty cut and dry.

[themortalgod]

Just now, PJetski said:

The core rules say "Artefacts of power have no effect on attacks made by a hero's mount unless noted otherwise" which is pretty cut and dry.

Ah, alright back to the drawing board, the whole army idea is wash.

[themortalgod]

In response to the Feedback I've moved to the following concept, instead of mass endless spells, the goal is to rock magic support with a heavy emphasis on big lizards to maximize on using the oldblood command ability to maximize output. 

Slann - General,  Great Rememberer, Celestial Apotheosis, Incandescent Rectrices - 260

Oldblood on Carn - 240 - Ghyrstrike

Oldblood on Carn - 240 - Coronal Shield

Scar Vet on Carn - 240

10 Saurus Knights - 160

10 Saurus Knights - 160

10 Saurus Knights - 160

10 Skinks - 70

3 Skink Handlers -40

3 Salamanders - 120

Dracothian Tail - 80

Firelance Starhost - 150

Gnashing Jaws - 30

Pendulum - 50

Total: 2000pts

 

I know it won't outperform Thunderquake but be a fun one to run.  

 

[Calebexnihilo]

Tried a list with 3 Engines of the Gods, Shadowstrike, and a Purple Sun! Had a blast! When it all works, you can wipe hordes of the table while clogging up your own side with Skinks galore!

Tournament recap:

 

[Ironbreaker]

It looks like my Dispossessed army is getting squated and I am looking for a new army. Try to sell Seraphon to me. Why should I buy them? 

[etlm1987]

37 minutes ago, Ironbreaker said:

It looks like my Dispossessed army is getting squated and I am looking for a new army. Try to sell Seraphon to me. Why should I buy them? 

- Seraphon is very competitive in the meta right now

- The army has a great range of models, namely the big dinos

- You are able to play lots of different styles with them, from a heavy shooting list, or one that has high damage in melee from ripperdactyls deep striking 

- You are the most mobile army in the game 

- it’s one of the hardest but most rewarding armies to play

- oh dinosaurs riding dinosaurs 

 

 

 

[Calebexnihilo]

18 hours ago, Ironbreaker said:

It looks like my Dispossessed army is getting squated and I am looking for a new army. Try to sell Seraphon to me. Why should I buy them? 

Seraphon is a lot of fun played as a summoning army. They have some nice spell lore now (2 spells that are good) and can get to +2 to casting. Their shooting is good, albeit pretty streaky (best shooting is usually random D6 shots). Seraphon does not do well in melee. Shadowstrike has an awesome 3" deep strike that can usually cause 50+ save rolls... just don't deploy it against an army that has been invited to the Activation Wars.

If you like summoning and strategic movement while avoiding combat, this is the army for you!!!

Edited August 3, 2019 by Calebexnihilo

[Ivo]

On 8/3/2019 at 11:02 PM, Calebexnihilo said:

Seraphon is a lot of fun played as a summoning army. They have some nice spell lore now (2 spells that are good) and can get to +2 to casting. Their shooting is good, albeit pretty streaky (best shooting is usually random D6 shots). Seraphon does not do well in melee. Shadowstrike has an awesome 3" deep strike that can usually cause 50+ save rolls... just don't deploy it against an army that has been invited to the Activation Wars.

If you like summoning and strategic movement while avoiding combat, this is the army for you!!!

This +2 cast is it slann and astrolith?

[Calebexnihilo]

1 minute ago, Ivo said:

This +2 cast is it slann and astrolith?

Yep. On setup of the slann, roll a dice. 1/2 = +1 to run/charge. 3/4 = +1 cast. 5/6 = Reroll hit rolls of 1.

I used to always fish for the hit rerolls, but now with a decent spell from the spell lore... I tend to try for the +1 to cast.

BUT.... it can backfire. If you try to change it and roll a 1, your slann can't cast/summon that turn.

The Astrolith is vital now (even more so than it used to be). That one 6 pt model gives us +1 to cast, +8 to spell range, reroll hits, and D3 summoning points.

You will have to balance protecting him and the Slann.

My lists seem to be hard countered by SCE Shootcast lists. They will always take turn one and snip the slann/banner/EoTG,

[PJetski]

5 hours ago, Calebexnihilo said:

Yep. On setup of the slann, roll a dice. 1/2 = +1 to run/charge. 3/4 = +1 cast. 5/6 = Reroll hit rolls of 1.

I used to always fish for the hit rerolls, but now with a decent spell from the spell lore... I tend to try for the +1 to cast.

BUT.... it can backfire. If you try to change it and roll a 1, your slann can't cast/summon that turn.

The Astrolith is vital now (even more so than it used to be). That one 6 pt model gives us +1 to cast, +8 to spell range, reroll hits, and D3 summoning points.

You will have to balance protecting him and the Slann.

My lists seem to be hard countered by SCE Shootcast lists. They will always take turn one and snip the slann/banner/EoTG,

You should always have less drops than a Stormcast list - none of their battalions are worth using.

[Calebexnihilo]

8 minutes ago, PJetski said:

You should always have less drops than a Stormcast list - none of their battalions are worth using.

Yeah, Draco's Tail helps. Nice to have a 1 drop soup list.

The SCE guy I play against most... his tourney list is a 5 drop 12 sniper list with Venator. Eeek. Even if I go first he can usually snipe the slann his first turn. If I go Etheral Amulet or Miasmic Blade on the slann, the mortals get him. If I go Ignax… he will have a 6+ save. If I go Ragged Cloak, he snipes him in the hero phase. If I try and hide the Slann, he can drop down his sniper unit or Venator (with Luckstone) almost anywhere he wants.

Haha... 😓

[PJetski]

33 minutes ago, Calebexnihilo said:

Yeah, Draco's Tail helps. Nice to have a 1 drop soup list.

The SCE guy I play against most... his tourney list is a 5 drop 12 sniper list with Venator. Eeek. Even if I go first he can usually snipe the slann his first turn. If I go Etheral Amulet or Miasmic Blade on the slann, the mortals get him. If I go Ignax… he will have a 6+ save. If I go Ragged Cloak, he snipes him in the hero phase. If I try and hide the Slann, he can drop down his sniper unit or Venator (with Luckstone) almost anywhere he wants.

Haha... 😓

Put your Slann in the corner or somewhere out of sight that he can't see even after he drops in. Alternatively, take the first turn and spread out your army to deny him space to drop in range to shoot.

30" is a long range, but it's possible to deny that space if you deploy properly and use your teleports to spread units and deny space.

[Calebexnihilo]

10 minutes ago, PJetski said:

Put your Slann in the corner or somewhere out of sight that he can't see even after he drops in. Alternatively, take the first turn and spread out your army to deny him space to drop in range to shoot.

30" is a long range, but it's possible to deny that space if you deploy properly and use your teleports to spread units and deny space.

My fav is putting him in the corner and casting palisades! lol

[Calebexnihilo]

Recaps of my 5 games at GW's Grand Tournament USA in Grapevine Texas this past weekend!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w37n9fuYFqA&

Game 1 - 05:56 - vs Gitz in Battle for the Pass

Game 2 - 16:37 - vs Tomb Kings in Focal Points
Game 3 - 29:07 - vs Skaven in Places of Arcane Power
Game 4 - 38:08 - vs Iron Jaws in Total Conquest
Game 5 - 53:47 - vs Khorne in Duality of Death

I ran Shadowstrike with 2 EoTG, a Bastiladon, Astrolith, Slann of course, and a Purple Sun!

Went 3-2 on the weekend. Lost horribly to Skaven (lots of shooting and on a bad battleplan) and lost a slightly closer game to Tomb Kings! Tomb Kings was a fun game though!

Games 4 and 5 were both decided by ONE SKINK surviving!!!!

Edited August 16, 2019 by Calebexnihilo

[Ajmaus]

On 8/2/2019 at 9:02 PM, Ironbreaker said:

It looks like my Dispossessed army is getting squated and I am looking for a new army. Try to sell Seraphon to me. Why should I buy them? 

I am going to warn you that there us a chance that a lot of seraphon get squated so if you jump ship to lizardmen remember they have a lot of old units from fantasy that may not make it to a new book

[Ironbreaker]

46 minutes ago, Ajmaus said:

I am going to warn you that there us a chance that a lot of seraphon get squated so if you jump ship to lizardmen remember they have a lot of old units from fantasy that may not make it to a new book

I actually went ahead and started a Kharadron Overlords army. They are different yet still familiar in a way. Probably jumping from one dumpster fire to another competitivewise, but I’m playing a big gamble on their 2.0 battletome being decent.