AoS 2 - Dispossessed Discussion

[Bladedwind]

2 hours ago, michu said:

Some people take duardin stubborness too seriously..,. Those Warriors still can have a use as Freeguild Guards. Simple and flavourfully.

I agree. I get the resentment; I haven't been collecting as long as some of these guys, but I still have 30 Warriors, 20 Thunderers, 30 Quarrelers, 2 Unforged that I have to now proxy as other units.

That said, I'm glad we got a book that, according to the faction focus, looks like there's gonna be a TON of variety and overall awesome stuff in it, and it looks like a pure Duardin force is still VERY possible 

[Dr Ben]

3 hours ago, ColsBols said:

I am absolutely going to run my thunderers as freeguild handgunners and run the warriors as...something else and im going to stick a dwarf in my steam tank and I dare anyone try to stop me 

it really sucks they boned us like this but the resilience of the dawi will win out in the end

 

yeah that was extremely uncool but I'm turning my dragon princes into blood knights

Bloods knights is a classic option. You can still run them as drakespawn knights, just cross out the name on the warscroll and replace it with 'aelven heavy cavalry'. For those on this forum who clearly like exact 1:1 it won't do, but for those who don't mind a little more flexibility it would be fine.

3 hours ago, michu said:

Some people take duardin stubborness too seriously..,. Those Warriors still can have a use as Freeguild Guards. Simple and flavourfully.

I agree. As above, some folks clearly like 1:1 and are really bothered by this issue. That is their choice to make. But it isn't a choice they or anyone else has to make. I will be using my little bearded dudes as freeguild also.

3 hours ago, Televiper11 said:

Steam Tanks are duardin engineering and easy to build without the human character. All of mine have a Cogsmith.

And now we can also have a phoenix with a cogsmith. Nothing better to keep your Bugmans XXXXX cold than a frostheart phoenix. 

Also maybe a griffon ridden by a cogsmith, I'm going to need someone to order those warriors and thunderers around...….. all of a sudden the GW marketing seems to make more and more sense and I have an idea for what I might do with those spare cogsmiths from the start collecting.

[WatcherintheWater]

For people who are sad about the warriors going away, use them as Longbeards! That's a proxy that no one should have any problem with at all. They're still dwarfs, the weapons options are exactly the same, and their beards are pretty long anyway 🧔. It's barely even a proxy, just a different sculpt of basically the same thing.

I wonder if the option for great weapon & shield is going to go away. They did say they are updating warscrolls.

[Arkanaut Admiral]

I’m pretty sure that the great axe and shield combo will be removed.  Got to make the regular hand weapons viable.  

I have to admit, with the regular warriors gone, is there not a bit of a gap in their line up?  You’ve got ironbreakers and irondrakes who are like, elites.  You’ve got hammerers who are (even more?) elite bodyguards...and then you have longboards who whilst more elite than regular warriors were not quite as elite as the iron breakers and hammerers.  

So now the longbeards are possibly the bottom tier troops despite being ‘veterans’...unless they’ve really reworked the war scrolls it seems like they’ll be incomplete.

Of course this is just me.  I’m ocd like that. 

[Ironbreaker]

I see them changing the warscroll for two handed and shields. My dudes look like Ninja Turtles with the shields on their backs.

[Forrix]

9 minutes ago, Arkanaut Admiral said:

I’m pretty sure that the great axe and shield combo will be removed.  Got to make the regular hand weapons viable.  

I have to admit, with the regular warriors gone, is there not a bit of a gap in their line up?  You’ve got ironbreakers and irondrakes who are like, elites.  You’ve got hammerers who are (even more?) elite bodyguards...and then you have longboards who whilst more elite than regular warriors were not quite as elite as the iron breakers and hammerers.  

So now the longbeards are possibly the bottom tier troops despite being ‘veterans’...unless they’ve really reworked the war scrolls it seems like they’ll be incomplete.

Of course this is just me.  I’m ocd like that. 

Well there is that rumor of Clanshields being a "new" generic warrior unit that uses the longbeard models but you could easily use other duardin models for. I'm expecting warscroll rewrites on the level of the Fyreslayer 2.0 battletome. So here's to hoping to 2 wounds while we're at it.

[Arkanaut Admiral]

7 minutes ago, Forrix said:

Well there is that rumor of Clanshields being a "new" generic warrior unit that uses the longbeard models but you could easily use other duardin models for. I'm expecting warscroll rewrites on the level of the Fyreslayer 2.0 battletome. So here's to hoping to 2 wounds while we're at it.

Oh really?  That’s interesting.  What does this mean?  That the longbeards are being repurposed as regular warriors?   

And 2 wound dorfs would be sweet! 

Edited September 23, 2019 by Arkanaut Admiral

[prochuvi]

8 hours ago, michu said:

Yeah, they're gone and there is nothing more to it. But @prochuvi is constantly negative about anything. Remember that even if that  SC! is not interesting for you it doesn't mean it's bad. I don't have any Duardin so it is perfect for me. GW is not going to check your collection and say "well, that guy already has those units, better put something else in the box." Ironbreakers will be probably Battleline units and that's why they're in the box.

Im sorry if i have been negative those two months after know that the 40% of my dwarfs have been deleted and the dragonlord and archmague that i used as allys have been deleted also.

But that post was only clarify as work that deep strike and tell that TO ME that starter is horrible,i didnt said that is bad for others.

A starter is allways great and a save of money and is rare get one so it is great,but even then a starter with two heroes is a bad design(that usually no other starter have out of weird kits as magmadroth that let you build multiple heroes) that dont incentive multiple buys of the starter.

But even then is good because it should cost around 65€ i guess so you pay the ironbreacker and copters and get free heroes

[Kramer]

5 hours ago, Ironbreaker said:

Their warscroll profile won't really fit the model.

Haha welcome to KO and their paper maché made frigates with 5+ saves 

[Kramer]

28 minutes ago, prochuvi said:

A starter is allways great and a save of money and is rare get one so it is great,but even then a starter with two heroes is a bad design(that usually no other starter have out of weird kits as magmadroth that let you build multiple heroes) that dont incentive multiple buys of the starter.

 

Honestly It's so perfect for me. I have too many old heroes already so I'm not buying the cogsmith and Belagor sculpts but secretly I really want them 😂. Add to that I have the metal Gyrocopters whose rotors fall off as soon as my cat in the garden of my neigbour sneezes. And I really want more Gromgril armoured dwarfs  

But buying two is indeed quite unlikely. 

[dirkdragonslayer]

3 hours ago, Kramer said:

Honestly It's so perfect for me. I have too many old heroes already so I'm not buying the cogsmith and Belagor sculpts but secretly I really want them 😂. Add to that I have the metal Gyrocopters whose rotors fall off as soon as my cat in the garden of my neigbour sneezes. And I really want more Gromgril armoured dwarfs  

But buying two is indeed quite unlikely. 

I had a crazy thought about if someone got two of those boxes, but it requires some other kits.

• Build the first Warden King and Cogsmith as normal.
• Build the Duardin and Gyrocopters as normal as well. With the Clanshield replacing Longbeards as basic infantry rumors, probably a block of 20 of those, or maybe 20 Hammerers. Gyros up to debate with how the new book handled them, because at the moment both are meh.
• Buy a Runelord, and use the alternative head and arms to make the second Warden King a Runelord too. Meta build used to be double Runelords, wasn't it?
• Buy a Steamtank, replace the empire shields/emblems with Longbeard/Ironbreaker shields. Put the second Cogsmith either in the turret or on the ground directing it. Preferably with pointing hand for style points.

Boom, Greywater Fastness army with a heavy Ironweld/Duardin theme.

[Forrix]

4 hours ago, Arkanaut Admiral said:

Oh really?  That’s interesting.  What does this mean?  That the longbeards are being repurposed as regular warriors?   

And 2 wound dorfs would be sweet! 

That's my understanding but it's just a rumor. I figure we'll find out for sure by Saturday though. 

I'm staying optimistic about pure duardin forces considering what they've done with incredibly small miniature lines in the Fyreslayer and FEC battletomes. Plus with Tempest Eye we can bring in KO and dont have to spend ally points on gyrocopters and bombers.

[Kramer]

4 hours ago, dirkdragonslayer said:

I had a crazy thought about if someone got two of those boxes, but it requires some other kits.

• Build the first Warden King and Cogsmith as normal.
• Build the Duardin and Gyrocopters as normal as well. With the Clanshield replacing Longbeards as basic infantry rumors, probably a block of 20 of those, or maybe 20 Hammerers. Gyros up to debate with how the new book handled them, because at the moment both are meh.
• Buy a Runelord, and use the alternative head and arms to make the second Warden King a Runelord too. Meta build used to be double Runelords, wasn't it?
• Buy a Steamtank, replace the empire shields/emblems with Longbeard/Ironbreaker shields. Put the second Cogsmith either in the turret or on the ground directing it. Preferably with pointing hand for style points.

Boom, Greywater Fastness army with a heavy Ironweld/Duardin theme.

Oh absolutely conversion opportunities a plenty. Not sure on the longbeards being the main/only battleline though. I’m expecting that they make ironbreakers BATTLELINE and probably even irondrakes  BATTLELINE IF. 

Or the longbeards will need to shift from being the veterans with a lot of influence to regular warriors, but that requires such a change in fluff. 

Warden king to runelord is a good one though! had’nt thought of that. Already have three though 😂

[Dr Ben]

3 hours ago, Kramer said:

Oh absolutely conversion opportunities a plenty. Not sure on the longbeards being the main/only battleline though. I’m expecting that they make ironbreakers BATTLELINE and probably even irondrakes  BATTLELINE IF. 

Or the longbeards will need to shift from being the veterans with a lot of influence to regular warriors, but that requires such a change in fluff. 

Warden king to runelord is a good one though! had’nt thought of that. Already have three though 😂

In the community post it definitely shows that all the dwarf infantry including irondrakes can be battleline (its in that picture bit). They didn't specify which will be universal battleline and which will be battleline if. We'll find out soon, but I expect longbeards and ironbreakers universal, hammerers with warden king general and irondrakes with cogsmith general.

In the worst case scenario you can probably use the bodies from the warden king and cogsmith to make alternative unit leaders for the ironbreakers/drakes with a bit of repositioning.

Ironjawz and bonesplitterz exist as special types of bigger/crazier orks without any normal orks having battletome representations. In comparison the lack of non veteran dwarves doesn't seem to be a major issue!

[Kramer]

9 minutes ago, Dr Ben said:

Ironjawz and bonesplitterz exist as special types of bigger/crazier orks without any normal orks having battletome representations. In comparison the lack of non veteran dwarves doesn't seem to be a major issue!

No definitely not a big issue. I like how they seem to have chosen for the gromgril armour aesthetic and would expect that an eventual update would add some warriors that are either more elite (bigger armour 😍) or something in between the old warriors and the ironbreakers. 

[ColsBols]

my fellow dawi 

we're back baby

[Syrex]

Really? There's the odd buff in there, but from what I've seen it's more nerfs/sidegrades that anything.

Ironbreakers - Save went to 3+ sure, but they lost their shields, -1 rend immunity, Spell immunity. Hoping that the missing shields is somehow a mistake but not holding my breath
Irondrakes - No longer need 10+ in the unit to shoot twice, but can't have moved (I'd rather have a larger unit and be able to move). Lost their rend immunity, gained +1 save against missile attacks
Longbeards - Can't take 2H and shield anymore (This was expected). Their 2h profile did change to 3+/3+ though.
Hammerers - Now deal a mortal wound on a 6 to hit. This is a good buff.

Obviously impossible to really say much without seeing points and additional city rules/etc, but a bit underwhelmed at the moment. Especially as I'm in the middle of building 120 of them... Much happier with Wanderer changes

[Arkanaut Admiral]

There’s information about them?  Can I ask where it is?

[Syrex]

It's all on GW's page - Might need to change Locale to Au/NZ due to timezones.
All units have the new warscrolls under "rules"

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-AU/Warhammer?N=1764547698+78046592&Nr=AND(sku.siteId%3AAU_gw%2Cproduct.locale%3Aen_AU_gw)&Nrs=collection()%2Frecord[product.startDate+<%3D+1569664680000+and+product.endDate+>%3D+1569664680000]

Edited September 28, 2019 by Syrex

[Forrix]

Dwarf rumors were false . Not terrible but not impressed by the new warscrolls. I'll have to watch some battletome reviews tomorrow for the full picture though.

[dirkdragonslayer]

Quote

‘Too much damned magic flying about these days!’: A unit with this complaint can attempt to dispel 1 endless spell in your hero phase.

Longbeards got a dispell for endless spells which is cool.

[Ironbreaker]

4 hours ago, ColsBols said:

my fellow dawi 

we're back baby

*Checks warriors, organ gun, and unforged*
Nope, I don't think so.

[Arkhanist]

Just put together a post for CoS dispossessed changes, comparing new and grand alliance:order warscrolls, thought I'd repost here:

- For all: Various re-rolling saves with shields (shieldwall etc) removed. Musicians changed to +1 to run and charge rolls. Banners changed to +1 bravery. Both changed to max 1-in-10 models. All units changed to 'any number of models'.

- Warden King: Save improved to 3+, command ability changed to +1A for dispossessed melee weapons against single enemy unit within 18" of King. Doesn't stack.

- Runelord: can also attempt to dispel 1 endless spell with a +2, rune lore prayer (both effects) range reduced to a dispossessed unit wholly within 12".

- Irondrakes: Ironwarden drakefire pistol improved to 3+ to hit, +1A if paired, only as missile wpn; but mailed fist improved to 4+ to wound for all. Unit loses ignore rend of -1, gains +1 save against missile attacks. Loses 5+ spell save on banner. Lots of other rewording with no net changes I think. Blaze Away FAQ change reversed, back to gets +1A for missile wpns if didn't move that turn.

- Longbeards: Great axe or axe/hammer and shield, Great axe and shield option removed. Great Axe improved to 3+ to hit. Shields now give +1 save against melee attacks. Old Grumblers changed to 1 of a) +1 bravery to friendly dispossessed units wholly within 12, b) You can re-roll wound rolls of 1 for attacks made by friendly Dispossessed units while wholly within 12", c) attempt to dispel 1 endless spell

- Ironbreakers: Save improved to 3+. Ironbeard pistol missile wpn stays 4+ to hit but 2A, +1A if paired, melee profile replaced with mailed fist (same statline). Unit loses ignore rend of -1. Loses 5+ spell save on banner.

- Hammerers: Ignores battleshock reduced to wholly within within 12" of friendly dispossessed hero. Gains inflicting an additional MW for unmodified wound rolls of 6.

Technically ironweld, but I'mma doing them anyway:

- Gyrocopter: Move increased to 16". Steam gun improved to attack all models in unit within 8". Bomb changed to 2+ chance (per gyro) to inflict D3 mortal wounds once per battle.

- Gyrobomber: Bomb changed to 2+ chance (per gyro) to inflict D3 mortal wounds

- Cogsmith: Automatically repairs D3 W on a ironweld war machine within 3". Cog axe improved to 3+ to hit. Can give up cog axe for +1 to hit with missile wpns; or give up grudge-raker for +1 to hit with melee wpns.

Edited September 28, 2019 by Arkhanist

[Syrex]

Nice summary Arkhanist!
It's really going to come down to point costs.
If there aren't any/many changes, it's all a bit disappointing. Odd that the Ironbreaker warscroll just doesn't mention shields whatsoever.

Edited September 28, 2019 by Syrex

[Grumblebeard]

I waited for the Battletome before start building my 2k Dispossessed army. Now I'm thinking of selling them instead.