AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

[Jacek]

1 hour ago, Chumphammer said:

Haggnar can still work well with Avatars

Take Iron circlet and Sacrament of blood

Cast it on any model in the army and they now count as having Zealots rage in turn 1, so all Avatars are now awake without a roll 

ALL avatars? how? Sacrament of Blood is only for one model and only that model gets additional round bonus. You can cast it on avatar / cauldron to "move" it to round 3 so it would be animated AND have hit of 1s re-roll but that is still only one model.

I don't see where it awakes all of your avatars (unless you have only one in the army, then 1 = all )?

@Edit - I wrote for model because I meant avatar or cauldron, normally it may also be unit

Edited March 23, 2021 by Jacek

[Chumphammer]

2 minutes ago, Jacek said:

ALL avatars? how? Sacrament of Blood is only for one model and only that model gets additional round bonus. You can cast it on avatar / cauldron to "move" it to round 3 so it would be animated AND have hit of 1s re-roll but that is still only one model.

I don't see where it awakes all of your avatars (unless you have only one in the army, then 1 = all )?

@Edit - I wrote for model because I meant avatar or cauldron, normally it may also be unit

If you read the pictures, its all there

Sacrament hits 1 of your units turn 1 in hagg nar and makes that unit have zealots rage.

Zealots rage states "In addition, friendly avatars of khaine are automatically activated"

Hense they all are go turn 1 cause 1 unit has zealots rage 

[Jacek]

2 minutes ago, Chumphammer said:

If you read the pictures, its all there

Sacrament hits 1 of your units turn 1 in hagg nar and makes that unit have zealots rage.

Zealots rage states "In addition, friendly avatars of khaine are automatically activated"

Hense they all are go turn 1 cause 1 unit has zealots rage 

But those friendly avatars of khaine are not on 3rd round, I understood this rule as:

if avatar of khaine has zealot's rage then it is animated?

Now that might be a nice surprise. Unexpected but a welcome one

[Milano]

Omg. Shadow Queen is back to -2 on heartrender. Emailing the sh*** out of GW really worked. Yesssss. Or it was just a typo in the first place. Guess we will never know 😉

[drkrash]

3 hours ago, jhamslam said:

Its how its worded in every other book, you get one warscroll ability prayer and one book prayer. They clarified that ivocations arent prayers

Except that the prayers in the list are not called Invocations.  It doesn't seem to be the same as Khorne.  It looks like you only get 1 prayer total now.

[DJMoose]

2 minutes ago, drkrash said:

Except that the prayers in the list are not called Invocations.  It doesn't seem to be the same as Khorne.  It looks like you only get 1 prayer total now.

Previously you could chant 1 prayer from the warscroll and 1 from the book. But it looks like it's only 1 prayer from any the priest knows. That sucks, but that makes the relic that lets you chant two prayers more valuable now.

[Lucentia]

Dropping to 1 prayer is a little annoying, but you're really only forgoing Rune of Khaine (situational) or awakening an Avatar (list dependent, and redundant after round 3), or Dance of Death I guess, but that's even less likely to show up in lists.  It's not like Khorne where you really want to be hitting those Blood Boils along with your allegiance prayers.  By that same notion it probably would have been fine to let them pray off the warscroll and the Khaine list, but whatever, I don't think it will be a huge deal most of the time.

Morathi back to rend 2, Witchbrew on a single roll and Khailebron teleport working as normal is good to see, being able to stick artifacts on the cauldron avatars was very funny, but not surprising or unexpected to see that nixed.

Hagg Nar clarification is interesting, as said up the page it probably does mean there's even greater parity between the temple options, which is neat!  And I like it thematically as the first temple's empowered faith allows them to more easily shrug off traditional wounds but not more esoteric attacks, but it is a little awkward and not something you see very often in AoS in general.

[Mutton]

Unless a rules writer interjects, rules as written, you still get your warscroll prayer AND a "known prayer."

Warscroll prayers are not "known prayers" and nothing suggests they are. The text in the warscroll simply states "you can chant one of these in the hero phase." It does not say "the priest knows the following prayers." This means the limit of 1 known prayer only applies to the ones on the prayer table, aka, the 1 prayer you choose to give them.

It's how every other priest in the game works, they just chose poor wording.

Edited March 23, 2021 by Mutton

[Lucentia]

I would agree with you in general, but the wording as it stands in the FAQ and battletome is '...friendly daughters of khaine priests that know any prayers can chant 1 prayer that they know.'  And '...this model can chant 1 of the following prayers.'

No distinction is made between warscroll and allegiance prayers, I don't see any wriggle room in the text as presented, regardless of precedent.

Edit:  Actually on consideration I can see you point, what qualifies as a 'known' prayer, any prayer the priest has access to, or just the ones they know from the lore?  I still think the wording as it stands reduces DoK priests to 1 prayer period, but it could be unintentional from the language they've chosen as you say.

Edited March 23, 2021 by Lucentia

[Lileath]

personally I just sent an email to the FAQ to clarify all that and I encourage you to do the same, since what I find strange and even too strong is the khainite pendant when we can pray 3 times, why 3 and not just 2 if we are limited to a single prayer ?

[Underworld40k]

6 minutes ago, Lileath said:

personally I just sent an email to the FAQ to clarify all that and I encourage you to do the same, since what I find strange and even too strong is the khainite pendant when we can pray 3 times, why 3 and not just 2 if we are limited to a single prayer ?

Chosen prayer, warscroll prayer, avatar prayer (list dependant) 

[Jaskier]

I did think it was very strange that Morathi's Heartrender changed between Broken Realms and the battletome considering they would have been written and printed around the same time as each other. Nice to see it was indeed a typo as many thought. 

[Lucentia]

I was looking through the book to see if I could find anything further on the subject of prayers and found a couple of interesting points: 

In a Harr Kuron army you can pick one DoK Priest per hero phase to chant a special prayer as part of the city allegiance abilities.  But the text of this ability is '...in addition to the 1 other prayer that priest can attempt on that phase.'  Which kind of matches the FAQ response of priests only getting the 1 prayer, even though you could take an Avatar and priest in a Harry Kuron army, which would theoretically get her another prayer, the wording here is clearly assuming she only gets the 1 per turn.

Also less relevant but still kind of interesting is the lack of consistency in explaining how to roll for prayers, both DoK priest warscrolls and the DoK allegiance prayers mention a 3+ roll is required, but there's no mention of a dice roll at all for the Har Kuron prayer or awakening an avatar.  My take away is they really should standardise priests and prayers as they have with wizards and spells.

Edited March 24, 2021 by Lucentia

[UnholyRevenant]

Funny that the FAQ that was supposed to clarify issues, needs an FAQ to clarify issues. 

[zombiepiratexxx]

1 hour ago, UnholyRevenant said:

Funny that the FAQ that was supposed to clarify issues, needs an FAQ to clarify issues. 

This happens far more often than anyone would like though, it's just GW's Modus Operandi. 

[Underworld40k]

6 hours ago, Lucentia said:

Also less relevant but still kind of interesting is the lack of consistency in explaining how to roll for prayers, both DoK priest warscrolls and the DoK allegiance prayers mention a 3+ roll is required, but there's no mention of a dice roll at all for the Har Kuron prayer or awakening an avatar.  My take away is they really should standardise priests and prayers as they have with wizards and spells.

a 1000 times this. Why they ever decided  to word it differently to spellcasters is a mystery to me.

Something like, "This unit may attempt to pray x times in your hero phase. It knows the following prayers" then the faction section on prayers can outline which if any additional prayers a unit may know, just like they do with spells. 

[Ggom]

On 3/23/2021 at 2:15 PM, Chumphammer said:

If you read the pictures, its all there

Sacrament hits 1 of your units turn 1 in hagg nar and makes that unit have zealots rage.

Zealots rage states "In addition, friendly avatars of khaine are automatically activated"

Hense they all are go turn 1 cause 1 unit has zealots rage 

This is hilarious, probably unintentional,  but totally valid per my understanding of the english language. I don’t think the rules writers saw this coming hahaha.

[mojojojo101]

Is it me who finds it odd that the Bloodwrack Shrine didn't get the 'CREW' treatment?

I know it doesn't really matter but it feels a little odd not to correct it.

[Lucentia]

Hah, good point, I know I for sure queried both in my FAQ email.  They also didn't touch on Shadow Patrol, which I thought was weird.

[Angela]

On 3/24/2021 at 3:04 AM, Lucentia said:

...Also less relevant but still kind of interesting is the lack of consistency in explaining how to roll for prayers, both DoK priest warscrolls and the DoK allegiance prayers mention a 3+ roll is required, but there's no mention of a dice roll at all for the Har Kuron prayer or awakening an avatar.  My take away is they really should standardise priests and prayers as they have with wizards and spells.

When I first started playing DoK, I thought awakening an Avatar was automatic if you had a priest, because the Avatars warscroll says nothing about rolling a dice.  To my mind, it is very similar to the Star Stone Staff ability of a Skink Starpriest, in which you just pick a unit to buff.  And then I realized that I seemed to be the only one playing that way.

[Lucentia]

Yes, it's very strange,  I hadn't really thought about it in the old book but it's the same there too.  The Khainite prayers section has instructions on how to roll for prayers, as do the hag/slaughter queen warscrolls, but nothing for the avatar.  You have the theoretical situation where you could take a hag queen and avatar as allies in a non-DoK list and following the rules as written would have you activate the avatar without a roll cos there's nothing to suggest otherwise.

 

[Gokken]

9 hours ago, mojojojo101 said:

Is it me who finds it odd that the Bloodwrack Shrine didn't get the 'CREW' treatment?

I know it doesn't really matter but it feels a little odd not to correct it.

Now that you say it, its weird! 

The mount thing I don't play many armies other Dok. The item from Hagnar Ulfuri can that be put on the witches goadstaves/spears on the shrine?

 

[5kaven5lave]

So I guess with Prayergate I’m ditching Blood Sigil as it’s now pointless and taking the Iron Circlet to have a better chance of getting that one prayer off?

[JackStreicher]

1 hour ago, 5kaven5lave said:

So I guess with Prayergate I’m ditching Blood Sigil as it’s now pointless and taking the Iron Circlet to have a better chance of getting that one prayer off?

Yea.

[Jacek]

2 hours ago, 5kaven5lave said:

So I guess with Prayergate I’m ditching Blood Sigil as it’s now pointless and taking the Iron Circlet to have a better chance of getting that one prayer off?

Depends on your build.

If you take avatar on foot - no need for circlet (as it rerolls 1s, not unmodified 1s - that is my understanding so far) so if you are near avatar on foot (+1 to prayer rolls) you just succeed on 2+ and on 1 you take no dmg. Then you can replace circlet with something else.