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Chris Tomlin

AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

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14 hours ago, Grudgebearer said:

...

I'd go volley guns on the 10 man squad and take 3 drill cannons on the riggers, no grapnels.

Not being able to move over units with grapnels has limited their utility a fair bit. And you pay a fair price to reliably get one off. 

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22 hours ago, Grudgebearer said:

What are your thoughts on that list? Would you consider something different and if so, what would you reccomend?

Looks like a really fighty list! Any idea what scenarios? That can make a huge difference for KO lists.

if it’s going to be random my big concern would be the fact that there’s only one mobile unit that can score objectives. Also fast combat armies might be able to get into the big arkanaut turn 1 and smash them up pretty good.

I’m a fan of the grapnel launcher close combat Endrinriggers. At 1k it will be really tough for your opponent to screen everything and it gives a lot of mobility in a list that otherwise lacks it.

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I've recently got back into AoS and initially thought that Deepkin might be the faction for me, but in all honesty their eel only lists make it unbearable to even list for them, so it looks like I'm back on the Duardin train (does it count as never leaving if I played Dwarfs in WHFB? :D)

I'm gonna get my hands on an SC box because the discount is still present and Thunderers, Riggers seem cool, as does the small gunboat, obviously I'll need to purchase 2 boxes of arkanaut conpany and a khemist/use the SC guy to make a legal list, I really REALLY want an Ironclad - but I don't know if that's really bad mannered to use at 1000 points!

I feel like I've got my hobby mojo back, I guess it helps with all the metallic sprays, would anyone suggest using the fang spray for a Zilfin force or is a metallic all over and picking the blue spots manually better?

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3 hours ago, j0lt said:

I've recently got back into AoS and initially thought that Deepkin might be the faction for me, but in all honesty their eel only lists make it unbearable to even list for them, so it looks like I'm back on the Duardin train (does it count as never leaving if I played Dwarfs in WHFB? :D)

I'm gonna get my hands on an SC box because the discount is still present and Thunderers, Riggers seem cool, as does the small gunboat, obviously I'll need to purchase 2 boxes of arkanaut conpany and a khemist/use the SC guy to make a legal list, I really REALLY want an Ironclad - but I don't know if that's really bad mannered to use at 1000 points!

I feel like I've got my hobby mojo back, I guess it helps with all the metallic sprays, would anyone suggest using the fang spray for a Zilfin force or is a metallic all over and picking the blue spots manually better?

The SC is a good starting point. Thunderers and Endrinriggers are both really fun & good options. I think the Gunhauler and Endrinmaster are both really cool models. If you're trying to be competitive, they aren't the best choices, but we should get new some points updates in the 2019 Generals Handbook, so who knows what will be good a few months from now. If you are more skilled than me you could also try to convert the Endrinmaster to a Khemist.

I don't think anyone would object to you using the Ironclad in a 1K game. It looks awesome, and the firepower isn't so overwhelming to feel unfair. Especially since it takes up a ton of your points!

I think it's way easier to paint your boats in sub assemblies. When I did my frigates, I primed the hull of my ship blue, and primed the Endrins grey (if you have a metallic spray you could use that instead). Just prime each sub assembly based on whatever color it would use most.

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I'm building up my KO force and got a SC box and will probably get a second. I haven't played any AoS game and there is one thing that I wonder whilst I assemble my units. Should I split the 6 endrinriggers in 2 units of 3 and get the benefit of 2 leaders and do the same with the thunderers; split them in 2 units of 5 to have 2 leaders and thus more attacks? What are the benefits of larger units? That's something I really don't get yet. Probably I would find out by playing, but I have to assemble the guys first... 

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56 minutes ago, VascoPinto said:

I'm building up my KO force and got a SC box and will probably get a second. I haven't played any AoS game and there is one thing that I wonder whilst I assemble my units. Should I split the 6 endrinriggers in 2 units of 3 and get the benefit of 2 leaders and do the same with the thunderers; split them in 2 units of 5 to have 2 leaders and thus more attacks? What are the benefits of larger units? That's something I really don't get yet. Probably I would find out by playing, but I have to assemble the guys first... 

It's hard to say because your playstyle might change how you use the units. But in general I would say build the champions but mark them different. maybe something on the base or a different coloured pauldron. That way when you use them as two units it's clear and when you combine them as one you can easily recognize that the model with the red pauldron is the champion. 

From a gaming point of view. Will you be buffing them with a Khemist? If no, you might get more utility from 5 man Thunderer squads.

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9 minutes ago, Kramer said:

It's hard to say because your playstyle might change how you use the units. But in general I would say build the champions but mark them different. maybe something on the base or a different coloured pauldron. That way when you use them as two units it's clear and when you combine them as one you can easily recognize that the model with the red pauldron is the champion. 

From a gaming point of view. Will you be buffing them with a Khemist? If no, you might get more utility from 5 man Thunderer squads.

Good point on the khemist buff. From what I understood that makes the saws on the endrinriggers and rifles on the thunderers (I was thinking of going all rifles for it being much more straightforward for a newbie like me) much more effective, so yeah: large units it's gonna be. 🙂 Thanks!

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3 minutes ago, VascoPinto said:

Good point on the khemist buff. From what I understood that makes the saws on the endrinriggers and rifles on the thunderers (I was thinking of going all rifles for it being much more straightforward for a newbie like me) much more effective, so yeah: large units it's gonna be. 🙂 Thanks!

Fully with you on the endrinriggers. Good call, I do the same. 

But on the thunderers it's likely a bit more nuanced and depended on your playstyle. 

Currently the go to seems to have one big unit of arkanauts with max skyhooks with a Khemist nearby. You also have the bigger squad of endrinriggers with a khemist. Soooooo will you invest another 160pts for the third Khemist? 😁Or will two small diversion units be better on the whole?

My personal point of view:
I'm still trying everything out but the massive value from my thunderers is them using the fallback as extra movement and to force combat turn order. Not so much massive damage output. I now have enough painted to not proxy anymore so my 30 Arkanauts are out of the list, so my next games i'm testing my thunderers with a khemist again. It's annoying if you figure out things don't work as you thought but for me it's part of the fun. So on to further figuring the faction out ;) 

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5 minutes ago, Kramer said:

Fully with you on the endrinriggers. Good call, I do the same. 

But on the thunderers it's likely a bit more nuanced and depended on your playstyle. 

Currently the go to seems to have one big unit of arkanauts with max skyhooks with a Khemist nearby. You also have the bigger squad of endrinriggers with a khemist. Soooooo will you invest another 160pts for the third Khemist? 😁Or will two small diversion units be better on the whole?

My personal point of view:
I'm still trying everything out but the massive value from my thunderers is them using the fallback as extra movement and to force combat turn order. Not so much massive damage output. I now have enough painted to not proxy anymore so my 30 Arkanauts are out of the list, so my next games i'm testing my thunderers with a khemist again. It's annoying if you figure out things don't work as you thought but for me it's part of the fun. So on to further figuring the faction out ;) 

I actually didn't think about using a khemist for the arkanaut company. I have 3 units of them, but only 3 skyhooks. I wouldn't know where to get 6 more... Or do people just convert something into skyhooks?

Anyways, thanks for your help! I understand it's not the best time to start a KO force right now and anything can change when the new BT drops, but I love assembling and painting these guys so I want to get to it asap. 

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Posted (edited)

Recently as i recovered from selling my minis some time ago i started to think about starting new one. Would this list on 1000p be any good?.

Khemist

10 arkanauts

10 arkanauts

10 thunderers (9 in real)

6 riggers

Frigate

980p

Edited by Entombet
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Posted (edited)
47 minutes ago, Entombet said:

Recently as i recovered from selling my minis some time ago i started to think about starting new one. Would this list on 1000p be any good?.

Khemist

10 arkanauts

10 arkanauts

10 thunderers (9 in real)

6 riggers

Frigate

980p

Exactly my latest 1K list (including missing one thunderer, yeah Underworlds team to replace the missing one 😂) Well its actually 1080 but most of my opponnents are really happy with 100pts extr as well.
What I like about this list is you can go

Urbaz: Then you can screen with the arkanauts and buff the riggers for a counter charge and thunderers as gun base in one go. The frigate (maybe with 10 arkanauts) uses its mobility to force your opponent to deal with it or risk losing an objective. The extra hero phase shooting/pile in can be devastating in small games.

Mornar: for some very agressive early objectives claiming & screening. I love the targeting command ability, but with only 10 thunderers it loses a bit of it's bite in 1K games

Ziflin: to experiment with dropping in a ship with passengers. It's a bit weird because you get close to a clown car if you want but there are some real cool strategies to experiment with in combination with this list. Definitly check out Khron's Cancon games for some inspiration. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63XyZKXp-kU&t=4221s

Thryng: you could even go Thryng. Haven't tried it yet, but re-rolling all 1's vs D3 units could be really good in 1K games.

All in all, I like it because you get to get a real sense of what you want to build out into. It has to be said though, you'll close to auto-lose some scenario's if you randomly detirmine them. But that seems inherent to KO at the moment. Also inherent every game will be fun in my experience and a good challenge. 

Edited by Kramer

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5 hours ago, Entombet said:

Recently as i recovered from selling my minis some time ago i started to think about starting new one. Would this list on 1000p be any good?.

Khemist

10 arkanauts

10 arkanauts

10 thunderers (9 in real)

6 riggers

Frigate

980p

My only hesitation is the frigate.  While the mobility is nice, the frigate is as an expensive lead weight at 1000 pts.  My preferred 1k list is:

1 Admiral

1 Khemist

20 Arkanauts with 6 light sky hooks

10 Arkanauts with 3 light sky hooks

5 Thunderers - all rifles or 4 rifles with 1 fumigator (to help reduce incoming attacks)

6 Endrinriggers

I typically go Urbaz for the Khemist's ability to buff two units.  Usually both squads of Arkanauts until the Endrinriggers need a buff on their saws.  I will use the Endrinriggers to counter-charge or grab objectives while the main mass moves steadily towards the objectives.  You can also use command points to get the auto-6 for running when you need to grab objectives late game.

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6 minutes ago, FractalRain said:

My only hesitation is the frigate.  While the mobility is nice, the frigate is as an expensive lead weight at 1000 pts.  My preferred 1k list is:

1 Admiral

1 Khemist

20 Arkanauts with 6 light sky hooks

10 Arkanauts with 3 light sky hooks

5 Thunderers - all rifles or 4 rifles with 1 fumigator (to help reduce incoming attacks)

6 Endrinriggers

I typically go Urbaz for the Khemist's ability to buff two units.  Usually both squads of Arkanauts until the Endrinriggers need a buff on their saws.  I will use the Endrinriggers to counter-charge or grab objectives while the main mass moves steadily towards the objectives.  You can also use command points to get the auto-6 for running when you need to grab objectives late game.

Yeah i know frigate is not best choice but this faction is about ships :).

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2 hours ago, FractalRain said:

My only hesitation is the frigate.  While the mobility is nice, the frigate is as an expensive lead weight at 1000 pts.  My preferred 1k list is:

1 Admiral

1 Khemist

20 Arkanauts with 6 light sky hooks

10 Arkanauts with 3 light sky hooks

5 Thunderers - all rifles or 4 rifles with 1 fumigator (to help reduce incoming attacks)

6 Endrinriggers

I typically go Urbaz for the Khemist's ability to buff two units.  Usually both squads of Arkanauts until the Endrinriggers need a buff on their saws.  I will use the Endrinriggers to counter-charge or grab objectives while the main mass moves steadily towards the objectives.  You can also use command points to get the auto-6 for running when you need to grab objectives late game.

What does the admiral add in this list for you? I have a hard time justifying him currently

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1 minute ago, Kramer said:

What does the admiral add in this list for you? I have a hard time justifying him currently

Truthfully, he is cheaper than another Khemist!  You could substitute another hero of your choice, but having at least 2 heroes is good, in case the scenario requires them.  He also adds some small melee ability and  a group-wide ignore Battleshock, if you think you'll need it.  In our store campaign, he has a free artifact which bumps his save to 2+, so I also use him to tie up enemy units threatening objectives! 

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What do people think about the Light Skyhooks? Are Kharadrons getting the Storm Fiends treatment and only being allowed whats in the box?

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2 minutes ago, Pompe said:

What do people think about the Light Skyhooks? Are Kharadrons getting the Storm Fiends treatment and only being allowed whats in the box?

I think it's going to go. Seems bad business to sell incomplete kits. ( reckon it will also change the use of the Khemist, because it's ability to buff one weapon in an army which is forced to mix more is a bit... soft.)

12 minutes ago, FractalRain said:

Truthfully, he is cheaper than another Khemist!  You could substitute another hero of your choice, but having at least 2 heroes is good, in case the scenario requires them.  He also adds some small melee ability and  a group-wide ignore Battleshock, if you think you'll need it.  In our store campaign, he has a free artifact which bumps his save to 2+, so I also use him to tie up enemy units threatening objectives! 

That makes sense. I always just drop him for more thunderers and if I really wnat a second hero the navigator usually helps me more. (lower pts helps in that sense)

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8 minutes ago, Kramer said:

I think it's going to go. Seems bad business to sell incomplete kits. ( reckon it will also change the use of the Khemist, because it's ability to buff one weapon in an army which is forced to mix more is a bit... soft.)

As in you think it is going to be limited to be in what is in the box?

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Just now, Pompe said:

As in you think it is going to be limited to be in what is in the box?

yes.

but worth noting it's all speculation of course. but I have a 2K list in mind and building the 30 more arkanauts I need is last on the list ;) 

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Posted (edited)

So, my nurgle army has been getting devastated by basically everything (unless I go mass blight kings).  I was tired of losing so I played a 2000 point last night.

40 x Arkanauts with 12 Skyhooks

40 x Arkanauts with 12 Skyhooks

30 x Arkanauts with 9 Skyhooks

1 x Khemist

1 x Khemist

1 x Incantor

1 x Incantor

1 x Lauchon the Soulseeker

Chose Mhornar hoping to roll a good new artycle with "These are just Guidelines".   Played against Khorne.  The battle was not fun but it's nice to win one after a slew of defeats 😂!  Being able to move a unit of 40 a million inches on turn 1 can really knock down a lot of back line heroes!

Edited by Vextol
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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Vextol said:

So, my nurgle army has been getting devastated by basically everything (unless I go mass blight kings).  I was tired of losing so I played a 2000 point last night.

40 x Arkanauts with 12 Skyhooks

40 x Arkanauts with 12 Skyhooks

30 x Arkanauts with 9 Skyhooks

1 x Khemist

1 x Khemist

1 x Incantor

1 x Incantor

1 x Lauchon the Soulseeker

Chose Mhornar hoping to roll a good new artycle with "These are just Guidelines".   Played against Khorne.  The battle was not fun but it's nice to win one after a slew of defeats 😂!  Being able to move a unit of 40 a million inches on turn 1 can really knock down a lot of back line heroes!

Dang! Those are some massive amounts of Skyhooks!

How did you find Lauchon? Seems hard to fit 30 let alone 40 within the 3" to pick it up. But a 12" move  (or 18 if your lucky) + your own run and shoot does seem massively beneficial. 

Congrats on the win!

Edited by Kramer

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4 hours ago, Kramer said:

Dang! Those are some massive amounts of Skyhooks!

How did you find Lauchon? Seems hard to fit 30 let alone 40 within the 3" to pick it up. But a 12" move  (or 18 if your lucky) + your own run and shoot does seem massively beneficial. 

Congrats on the win!

Haha thanks. 

I was working on the build so my opponent let me proxy Launchon.  I don't know his exact base size so I used a knight of shrouds on an ethereal steed.  I'm pretty sure that's the right base size (I don't think it can possibly be smaller but it could be bloodcrusher sized).  Either way, you can fit 49 arkanauts wholly within 3 at the smaller base size. 

Seems like the effective skyhook range on the first turn is about (if you cast) 45-47 inches. 

24 shoot +13  fly (you can actually leave a hole in front of ol' lunchbox and fill it post transport)+10 move with the run command point on the first turn.   The 45 is for models that aren't in the front lines. Still, pretty dern far for your block of 40! 

To maximize damage, you need to run a small number of models backward to get within 3 of your general for the reroll hits buff.  With lots of luck, you can guidelines into the artycle reroll hits and wounds of 1 on flying and you're basically a hero slaughtering machine.

Its a pretty one dimensional build (obviously 😂).  Still, you can pull this off every once in a while before people start building anti shooting lists again! 

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1 minute ago, Vextol said:

Haha thanks. 

I was working on the build so my opponent let me proxy Launchon.  I don't know his exact base size so I used a knight of shrouds on an ethereal steed.  I'm pretty sure that's the right base size (I don't think it can possibly be smaller but it could be bloodcrusher sized).  Either way, you can fit 49 arkanauts wholly within 3 at the smaller base size. 

Seems like the effective skyhook range on the first turn is about (if you cast) 45-47 inches. 

24 shoot +13  fly (you can actually leave a hole in front of ol' lunchbox and fill it post transport)+10 move with the run command point on the first turn.   The 45 is for models that aren't in the front lines. Still, pretty dern far for your block of 40! 

To maximize damage, you need to run a small number of models backward to get within 3 of your general for the reroll hits buff.  With lots of luck, you can guidelines into the artycle reroll hits and wounds of 1 on flying and you're basically a hero slaughtering machine.

Its a pretty one dimensional build (obviously 😂).  Still, you can pull this off every once in a while before people start building anti shooting lists again! 

Haha seems like it yeah! But great numbers on the ferry man, that’s very interesting. 

How did you do on objectives? Although I rather suspect it’s a clean up job after such assassination strike against Khorne. 

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Has anyone ever considered making Frigates Battleline in a KO allegiance army in addition to being behemoths?  Could be quite interesting...allows you to build a viable boat going army at 1k.

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