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Chris Tomlin

AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

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KO got some errata:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/7292dea6.pdf

Quote

Page 90 – Arkanaut Ironclad, Flying Transport Add the following to the first paragraph: ‘If this model is in a warscroll battalion, units from the same battalion that can garrison this model can be set up as this model’s garrison when this model is set up.’

Page 91 – Arkanaut Frigate, Flying Transport Add the following to the first paragraph: ‘If this model is in a warscroll battalion, units from the same battalion that can garrison this model can be set up as this model’s garrison when this model is set up.’

 

And some more FAQ:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/b206c4ea.pdf

Quote

Q: When I set up a Skyvessel before the battle begins, can I set up units in its garrison?

A: If the unit is part of the same battalion as the Skyvessel, it can be set up as part of the Skyvessel’s garrison at the same time the Skyvessel is set up. If the unit is not part of the same battalion as the Skyvessel, the Skyvessel must be set up first, and the unit can be added to its garrison when you are allowed to set up that unit before the battle begins.

 

Edited by plavski
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Kudos to GW for quick errata and FAQ. Wasn't expecting this until June to be fair. 

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On 2/11/2020 at 2:51 PM, DavionStar said:

They do get extra command points as well. Roll a d6 for every hero you have and on each 4+ you get a free command point. And it looks like you have 4 heroes so that's statistically an average of 2 free points per game.

Hey, if you can't have fun with it, then what's the point? ;) I mean. Winning is good too of course but I feel like sometimes you just have to throw models onto the table and see what works. (Unless you're in like a formal tourney or something, then you should probably be more serious.)

The battleshock immunity isn’t to be sneezed at either.  Just this evening my Aether Khemist General held two units of Thunderers (10 & 15 Durin) and 30 Arkhanauts firm after a Beastclaw Raider charge and the following turn giving them enough time to gun down a four Ogor pack of Mournfangs on turn 1 and a Frost Lord by turn 3.  The big guy would have died sooner but on my turn 2 shooting he couldn’t roll under a five on his shrug saves.

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So, I have a tournament coming up and will be playing KOs. I have decided upon the follwing list. 

Mainly playing to hold 3 objectives at all times and fly shenanigans for extra.

Khemist with khemist supreme leads 20x arkanauts and 10x thunderers on home objectives.

20x arkanauts + navigator with pistol in Ironclad.

Gunhauler + balloonmaster + endrinriggers follow Ironclad in the beginning and then branch out on their own to melee-snipe turn 2-3.

No idea if this will work, but I like 20x arkanauts more than Thunderers in Ironclad. To deploy them on objective and move on if needed. 

What do you guys think?

image.png.ce0e77a5b8e0800bc7e00a4fd1959c55.png

Edited by Dejnar
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IMO, 19 Arkanauts+Navigator should be better than 20arkanauts + Navigator. You have Fly High from the begining, and you don't lose Aether-gold.

I don't know if 2 volleyguns+skyhooks are good enough for Fly High (pistols are 9", so you can just Fly High and shoot) even with aether-gold rerolls.

Now, just some crazy options here: If you want to use the Ironclad to disembark arkanauts, why not remove Iron Sky Command for an Iron Sky Squadron? Give the Aether-gold from Urbaz to your Ironclad to kill priority targets and use the Frigates to redeploy arkanauts.  Battleshockphase could be a problem for arkanauts, but you could split them in groups of 10  and use rerolls for being in objectives (or even aether-gold) to survive. Maybe remove the endrinmaster with dirigible suit for an endrinmaster (cheaper and can heal the ironclad) and an Admiral in the Ironclad (Reroll hit from the admiral and wounds with the Aether-gold), both heroes can pucnh some faces if the Ironclad is being charged.

I've got a tournament too. I will try to play with a Zon list that could be fun. C&c welcome:


Allegiance: Kharadron Overlords
- Sky Port: Barak Zon

Leaders
Endrinmaster with Dirigible Suit (220)
- General
- Command Trait: Bearer of the Ironstar
- Artefact: Aethersped Hammer
Endrinmaster with Endrinharness (100)
Aetheric Navigator (100)
- Artefact: Svaregg-Stein Illuminator Flarepistol

Battleline
10 x Arkanaut Company (90)
- 1x Light Skyhooks
6 x Skywardens (200) (OR 12 x Skywardens (400) with 1 Skyhook)
- 1x Skyhooks
6 x Skywardens (200)
- 1x Skyhooks

Units
10 x Grundstok Thunderers (240)
1 x Grundstok Gunhauler (150)
- Main Gun: Drill Cannon
- Great Endrinworks: Coalbeard's Collapsible Compartments
1 x Grundstok Gunhauler (150)
- Main Gun: Drill Cannon
1 x Grundstok Gunhauler (150)
- Main Gun: Drill Cannon

Behemoths
Arkanaut Frigate (250)

Battalions
Grundstok Escort Wing (140)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 105

Main strategy: 10 Thunderers on the Frigate (pew-pew), the Endrinmaster and Navigator in the Gunhauler with the compartments.
10 Arkanauts running to my objectives (if there is one in my deplayment zone or near it). Behind the Arkanauts,  Gunhaulers+skywardens to counter-punch anyone. Basic explanation, nothign set on stone .

Tactics: Split the whole army in three small death-stars:
The frigate with 10 thunderers to remove slow units (4-6" movement).

Gunhaulers to remove key targets (mages, and support heroes,  looking for 5+ for mortals with rerolls from focus fire or even aehter-gold if needed).

12 skywardens for big punch (with aether-gold) or split them in two grups of 6 to abuse the Fly High (and beocme a bodyguards for my ships).

Navigator  to unbind and support the  Frigate and the Endrinmaster to repair  (and give more punch to the gunhauler, if needed).
General flying around repairing, shooting and trying to survive. Arkanauts are there to bait enemy charges and capture my objective.

 

Edited by Beliman
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@Beliman Loving that list. Let us know how those Skywardens do!

As for me, I threw together a 1k Zilfin list I want to try some time.

Allegiance: Kharadron Overlords
- Sky Port: Barak Zilfin
Aether-Khemist (90)
- General
- Command Trait: Collector
- Artefact: Spell in a Bottle
Aetheric Navigator (100)
- Artefact: Staff of Ocular Optimisation
10 x Arkanaut Company (90)
- 1x Skypikes
- 1x Light Skyhooks
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns
10 x Arkanaut Company (90)
- 1x Skypikes
- 1x Light Skyhooks
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns
Arkanaut Frigate (250)
- Main Gun: Heavy Sky Cannon
- Great Endrinworks: Malefic Skymines
3 x Endrinriggers (100)
5 x Grundstok Thunderers (120)
1 x Grundstok Gunhauler (150)
- Main Gun: Drill Cannon
- Great Endrinworks: Coalbeard's Collapsible Compartments
Malevolent Maelstrom (10)

Total: 1000 / 1000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 200
Wounds: 65
Thunderers in the Gunhauler, one of the Companies in the Frigate. Riggers hang out with the Frigate. Though I wish I had more room in the Frigate for at least one of the heroes. Maybe I could load it up anyway then disembark until it can Fly High afterwards?

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2 hours ago, Beliman said:

IMO, 19 Arkanauts+Navigator should be better than 20arkanauts + Navigator. You have Fly High from the begining, and you don't lose Aether-gold.

I don't know if 2 volleyguns+skyhooks are good enough for Fly High (pistols are 9", so you can just Fly High and shoot) even with aether-gold rerolls.

The limit for an Ironclad that wants to fly high is 15 not 20, so it doesn’t help. Would have to be 14+1, which doesn’t seem worth it over 10+1.

Also, I don’t think you can shoot pistols when landing from Fly high - you have to land more than 9” away, therefore outside of max range of 9”. I think if you’re going for range (and I can’t make my mind up, have 6x riggers with Saws, and 6x riggers with volleyguns and drill launchers) then drill launchers are probably worth it over the skyhooks because of the chance to do mortals, which is invaluable sometimes.

Edited by Baron Wastelands
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1 minute ago, Baron Wastelands said:

The limit for an Ironclad that wants to fly high is 15 not 20, so it doesn’t help. Would have to be 14+1, which doesn’t seem worth it over 10+1.

Also, I don’t think you can shoot pistols when landing from Fly high - you have to land more than 9” away, therefore outside of max range of 9”.

Ouch, my bad.  Si 20 arkanautas to run inside an Ironclad... It could be interesting. 14 arkanautas seems not really good...

About the pistols, yep, I said the oposite /facepalm. My AutoC changed "can't" to "can" (not in english btw).

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1 minute ago, Beliman said:

Ouch, my bad.  Si 20 arkanautas to run inside an Ironclad... It could be interesting. 14 arkanautas seems not really good...

About the pistols, yep, I said the oposite /facepalm. My AutoC changed "can't" to "can" (not in english btw).

Ok, need to get your endrinmaster onto your autocorrect 😁 Glad we agree though.

Honestly, I love to run ironclads, but I’m struggling to see a home for arkanauts aboard. My arkanauts are footslogging more often than not, though I might use frigates if I had more. I think the only way to run arkanauts in an ironclad is 20+characters, but even then their role is a bit confused. Thunderers, on the other hand, even in units of 5 or 10, have done well in ironclads that don’t immediately want to close.

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@BelimanI ran a really similar list last night. First 2K game with the new book.

  • Endrinmaster with Dirigible Suit w/+2 Attack artifact
  • Navigator w/automatic dispel
  • 30 Arkanauts w/Skyhooks & Volley Guns
  • 6 Skywardens w/2 Grapnel Launchers & 2 Rotary Guns
  • 12 Skywardens w/1 Grapnel Launcher
  • 2 Gunhaulers w/Sky Cannons & Collapsible Compartments & Spar Torpedo
  • Frigate w/ Skycannon
  • 5 Thunderers w/Rifles
  • Escort Wing

My Opponent ran an Ogors list with a 2 Stonehorns, a big unit each of Gluttons & Ironguts, a wizard, and a couple small units of Leadbealchers as well as some battalion that let him out-drop me. We played Shifting Objectives.

It was a really close fun game with 3 double turns, and basically came down to the turn 5 priority roll, but I lost by one VP. I think the list was decent, but not the best. 

  • The Arkanaut screen feels pretty crucial against fast combat armies. They scored objectives on the first half round 1 & held up to 2 Stonehorn charges & combat for a turn and a half. I'd love to get them up to 40.
  • I'm not sure about the big Skywarden unit. They definitely underperformed in this game. They got one chance to fight, charging 2 remaining Ironguts, and only did 5 wounds. He was in cover and rolled great for his saves, so you can chalk some of that up to randomness.  I'd consider splitting them in two and either using them as more tactical strikers or loading them up for shooting.
  • The fly high rule is fantastic. I feel like it makes the army very strategic to play, and is great for grabbing uncontested objectives. When you have 6 guys to hitch along, it gets even better, since you can actually get a few bodies in. Had I kept my unit of wardens near a Gunhauler throughout the game, I could have taken the last objective I needed to win. That makes me lean more towards shooty units of Wardens, in which case I would probably swith to Urbaz.
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5 hours ago, Dejnar said:

What do you guys think?

I really like it personally (I don’t claim to be an expert or master tactician though just so you know), you’ve solved a list-building problem I was having trouble with. I’ll be giving that list a go too. My only thoughts re: the Khemist himself is that his buff isn’t really that amazing IMO, also with only 5 wounds can get focussed down quickly so maybe a Gryph-Feather Charm to make him effectively -2 to hit?

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7 minutes ago, 5kaven5lave said:

I really like it personally (I don’t claim to be an expert or master tactician though just so you know), you’ve solved a list-building problem I was having trouble with. I’ll be giving that list a go too. My only thoughts re: the Khemist himself is that his buff isn’t really that amazing IMO, also with only 5 wounds can get focussed down quickly so maybe a Gryph-Feather Charm to make him effectively -2 to hit?

Yeah, ive been thinking the same thing about the Khemist. We will be playing without realm artifacts though. 

I think to place him just after a screen of arkanauts and beside a thunderer fumigator. So that's -2. :)  

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6 hours ago, Dejnar said:

What do you guys think?

Its pretty similar to my list a few pages back.  You can still fly high with the artifact and the boat fully loaded, so no reason to worry about that, but realistically you wont want to be flying high most of the time.  You want to get the Ironclad within 9" to get all the company guns shooting, if you can do that reliably it does quite a lot of damage.  I personally think you would want an Admiral to get +1 to hit for everything in the boat, not to mention his other command abilities helping out.  

Khemist + 20 company on the ground are great for holding objectives and you can actually use his buff that way. 

Edited by Drofnum

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2 hours ago, Drofnum said:

Its pretty similar to my list a few pages back.  You can still fly high with the artifact and the boat fully loaded, so no reason to worry about that, but realistically you wont want to be flying high most of the time.  You want to get the Ironclad within 9" to get all the company guns shooting, if you can do that reliably it does quite a lot of damage.  I personally think you would want an Admiral to get +1 to hit for everything in the boat, not to mention his other command abilities helping out.  

Khemist + 20 company on the ground are great for holding objectives and you can actually use his buff that way. 

Rember the +1 to hit from the Admiral is in the combat phase. I'm not very confortable with thd admiral since he costs 140 points and the buffs aren't as good as I thought. 

Greetings 

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4 minutes ago, ACBelMutie said:

Rember the +1 to hit from the Admiral is in the combat phase. I'm not very confortable with thd admiral since he costs 140 points and the buffs aren't as good as I thought. 

Greetings 

My thoughts exactly. My idea is to dump the embarked arkanauts turn 2 anyways and shoot another day elsewhere with the ironclad.

Besides the battalion gives battleshock immunity same as Admiral so thats a bit redundant aswell. 

Edited by Dejnar

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20 minutes ago, ACBelMutie said:

Rember the +1 to hit from the Admiral is in the combat phase. I'm not very confortable with thd admiral since he costs 140 points and the buffs aren't as good as I thought. 

Greetings 

Yeah good shout, I was in the app checking as soon as I read in case I missed something golden. Reroll 1s or Gold it is then. 

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Yeah its in the combat phase, but 14 company cutters and the Admirals melee himself do quite a bit.  If you're running Company in the Ironclad you're going to be within 9 of the enemy and if you're within 9 you may as well be charging to finish off whatever shooting didnt.  You're just going to get charged the next turn anyway and the combat from Ship+Company+Admiral will kill off a lot of things, I burned through an entire unit of Horrors for example which is 50 wounds, I think 6-8 battleshocked off but still.

If you're running an Ironclad filled with dudes the Admiral pulls his points pretty easily, he gives you run and charge on the Ironclad which you will want to ensure you get inside of 9 for the Company to shoot.  The +1 to hit does quite a bit in combat once you're rolling for everyone in the boat.  You can get reroll 1's in shooting which combos well with using Aether Gold to reroll wounds when you need to make sure the Ironclad kills something.  The reroll charges is a bit redundant, unless you take the mask artifact.  But honestly how many command abilities do you need from a 140 point hero to make him worth taking?  I think 3 is plenty, he's also no slouch in combat for his points.

If you're dumping the company thats another thing, but honestly I dont see the point in that.  Any reasonably decent combat unit is going to take 20 company off the board if they try to, they're quite a bit more useful in a ship where they can bring all their firepower to bear wherever you need it.

Edit: My original intention as the same as yours, drop the 20 company on an objective and move the Ironclad on to something else.  It just never worked well in my experience, the company was far better in the boat for me.

Edited by Drofnum
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25 minutes ago, Drofnum said:

Yeah its in the combat phase, but 14 company cutters and the Admirals melee himself do quite a bit.  If you're running Company in the Ironclad you're going to be within 9 of the enemy and if you're within 9 you may as well be charging to finish off whatever shooting didnt.  You're just going to get charged the next turn anyway and the combat from Ship+Company+Admiral will kill off a lot of things, I burned through an entire unit of Horrors for example which is 50 wounds, I think 6-8 battleshocked off but still.

If you're running an Ironclad filled with dudes the Admiral pulls his points pretty easily, he gives you run and charge on the Ironclad which you will want to ensure you get inside of 9 for the Company to shoot.  The +1 to hit does quite a bit in combat once you're rolling for everyone in the boat.  You can get reroll 1's in shooting which combos well with using Aether Gold to reroll wounds when you need to make sure the Ironclad kills something.  The reroll charges is a bit redundant, unless you take the mask artifact.  But honestly how many command abilities do you need from a 140 point hero to make him worth taking?  I think 3 is plenty, he's also no slouch in combat for his points.

If you're dumping the company thats another thing, but honestly I dont see the point in that.  Any reasonably decent combat unit is going to take 20 company off the board if they try to, they're quite a bit more useful in a ship where they can bring all their firepower to bear wherever you need it.

Edit: My original intention as the same as yours, drop the 20 company on an objective and move the Ironclad on to something else.  It just never worked well in my experience, the company was far better in the boat for me.

Thanks for the reply. Very interesting.  Im just bot sure what to drop to fit tje Admiral in. Thunderers on foot may not be needed but I like the models. 😁

Ill tweak further and see where I end up. Thanks! 

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Any comments before I go in on this idea?:

Barak-Zilfin
General - Endrinmaster on Dirigible Suit,  Tough as old boots, Miniturised Aethermatic Repulsion Field (keep him alive)
Aetheric Navigator - Staff of Ocular Ocular Optimization (faction tax)
Arkanaut Frigate - Cannon
Arkanaut Frigate - Cannon
Arkanaut Frigate - Cannon

10 Arkanaut Company - Light skyhook, skypike, volleygun, Captain, Prudency Chutes
10 Arkanaut Company - Light skyhook, skypike, volleygun, Captain
10 Arkanaut Company - Light skyhook, skypike, volleygun, Captain

Grundstok Gunhauler - Drill Canon
Grundstok Gunhauler - Drill Canon, Zonbarcorp 'Deptsettler' spar torpedo

10 Gunstok Thunderers  - Rifles plus 1 double barrel rifle, Bearer and Sargent

Iron Sky attack Squadron 

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18 minutes ago, Dejnar said:

Thanks for the reply. Very interesting.  Im just bot sure what to drop to fit tje Admiral in. Thunderers on foot may not be needed but I like the models. 😁

Ill tweak further and see where I end up. Thanks! 

Yeah, my list definitely needs some tweaks as well but figuring out exactly what I want to change up still eludes me.  I think taking only 20 company and popping 10 thunderers in the ship is probably the next thing i'll try to see if just flying high everywhere with the ironclad is any good.

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1 hour ago, Dejnar said:

Thanks for the reply. Very interesting.  Im just bot sure what to drop to fit tje Admiral in. Thunderers on foot may not be needed but I like the models. 😁

Ill tweak further and see where I end up. Thanks! 

I'd say 10 Arkanauts with skypike, Thundrik's profiteers (Thundrik himself needs to wait outside), grapple cannon and the ramming edrinwork. Zilfin would give more range for a charge, right?

This may be an awful idea, but it would be funny.

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I think I finally did it. I've created fun to play and kinda working  Barak Mhornar list.  Please let me know what you think. 

Allegiance: Kharadron Overlords
- Sky Port: Barak Mhornar

Leaders
Aetheric Navigator (100)
- General
- Command Trait: Opportunistic Privateer
- Artefact: Galeforce Stave
Endrinmaster with Endrinharness (100)
Endrinmaster with Endrinharness (100)

Battleline
10 x Arkanaut Company (90)
- 1x Skypikes
- 1x Light Skyhooks
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns
10 x Arkanaut Company (90)
- 1x Skypikes
- 1x Light Skyhooks
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns
10 x Arkanaut Company (90)
- 1x Skypikes
- 1x Light Skyhooks
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns

Units
10 x Grundstok Thunderers (240)
1 x Grundstok Gunhauler (150)
- Main Gun: Sky Cannon
3 x Endrinriggers (100)
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns
- 1x Drill Launcher
5 x Grundstok Thunderers (120)
- 1x Aetheric Fumigators
- 1x Decksweepers
- 1x Aethercannons
- 1x Grundstok Mortars
3 x Endrinriggers (100)
- 1x Drill Launcher
3 x Endrinriggers (100)
- 1x Drill Launcher
3 x Endrinriggers (100)
- 1x Aethermatic Volley Guns
- 1x Drill Launcher

Behemoths
Arkanaut Ironclad (510)
- Main Gun: Aethermatic Volley Cannon
- Great Endrinworks: The Last Word

Total: 1990 / 2000
Wounds: 114

The main idea is:  I put heros, 10 thunderers and 5 man special guns  squad (I plan to paint them as black marines)  into the ironclad and first round deep strike them with opportunistic privateer  in the enemy's face. He would be stupid to not take the first round.  But then (if he's not spell, shooting or both heavy [I'm looking at you Tzeentch]) we need to survive his charge phase. Thankfully navigator can halve 1 enemy's charge distance with artefact and if something will charge us, we have the last word. We might use gold to survive battle phase, and have two beefy Endrinmasters to retaliate in melee. In our round we heal boat with two Endrinmasters,  can run ours units and shoot, teleport Gunhauler with some melee riggers to support ironclad or just grab objectives, other two riggers squads are there to fire support and claiming objectives.  By the end of the round we should clear whatever was occupying ironclad and hope for the double turn. As soon as ironclad will be free, we drop special thunderers to distract and hold the enemy, and we can leave with boat wherever it is needed. 

It's not the best list, not most competitive, but hell it might be fun to play. This is what opportunistic privateer means. 

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I finally came up with a Barak-Nar list I‘d like to use: 

Brokk Grungsson

Endrinmaster w Dirigible

- General

- Aethercharged Rune

Khemist

- Ventplate (just for countering Tzeentch alphastrike/ general shooting) 

Navigator

 

20 Arkanauts

5 Thunderers

6 Endrinriggers

Gunhauler w Cannon

- Compartment

Ironclad

- Ebullient Aid

Iron Sky Command

Extra CP

 

+ 3 Drops

+ Lots of unbinds

+ Lots of CP

+ Solid defense against shooting alphastrike (-1 to hit for whole army, -2 for Brokk/ General, -3 for Heroes inside the Ironclad) 

+ Lots of Firepower from Brokk and Endrinmaster (their shooting is comparable to a Gunhauler but probably more reliable) 

+ You never have to worry about battleshock until its too late anyway

+ 5 Thunderers and a Gunhauler can probably be enough of a threat for a weak flank to capture and hold

 

- Not much Aethergold (you really can‘t withstand an enemy doubleturn like an Urbaz-List with 2 Aethergold Shares on the Ironclad) 

- Very depending on the 20 Arkanauts to hold the „critical“ objective, but thats always the case

 

Edit: + also top hat 🎩 

Edited by Phasteon

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27 minutes ago, Phasteon said:

I finally came up with a Barak-Nar list I‘d like to use: 

Brokk Grungsson

Endrinmaster w Dirigible

- General

- Aethercharged Rune

Khemist

- Ventplate (just for countering Tzeentch alphastrike/ general shooting) 

Navigator

 

20 Arkanauts

5 Thunderers

6 Endrinriggers

Gunhauler w Cannon

- Compartment

Ironclad

- Ebullient Aid

Iron Sky Command

Extra CP

 

+ 3 Drops

+ Lots of unbinds

+ Lots of CP

+ Solid defense against shooting alphastrike (-1 to hit for whole army, -2 for Brokk/ General, -3 for Heroes inside the Ironclad) 

+ Lots of Firepower from Brokk and Endrinmaster (their shooting is comparable to a Gunhauler but probably more reliable) 

+ You never have to worry about battleshock until its too late anyway

+ 5 Thunderers and a Gunhauler can probably be enough of a threat for a weak flank to capture and hold

 

- Not much Aethergold (you really can‘t withstand an enemy doubleturn like an Urbaz-List with 2 Aethergold Shares on the Ironclad) 

- Very depending on the 20 Arkanauts to hold the „critical“ objective, but thats always the case

 

Edit: + also top hat 🎩 

Don't forget you can hold an objective with thunderers. Not overly much, but could work.

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2 minutes ago, zilberfrid said:

Don't forget you can hold an objective with thunderers. Not overly much, but could work.

Thats why I brought them.

I even wrote it xD 

But thx for pointing it out again 😄👍🏻

 

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