AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

[Stormrage89]

Ever price shown is doubble what it actually is right?

The websight is kinda wonky. 

[Nick907]

4 hours ago, stratigo said:

It isn’t that hard to get people into houses. We just aren’t willing to do it without giving the banks a huge cut. Bringing up the mortgage crisis is not a particularly great way to make any points, except maybe about corporate greed

So easy to do it led to a global recession.

I think it’s a great way to illustrate my point; which is that bad design can be exploited. Blaming corporate greed is out of order, sort of like when players stacked Thunderers with mortars after KO was first released. The rules allowed for the unit to equip the special weapons and buff with the khemist. The designers didn’t have the foresight to think that players would do this, but blaming the players is backwards since they were acting according to what the rules allowed. So a unit of 5 Thunderers could launch 10 mortar shots 36” across the board and cause up to 30 wounds.  Not the player’s fault, but rather the unintended consequences of poor design. 

[Aelfric]

1 hour ago, Nick907 said:

Not the player’s fault, but rather the unintended consequences of poor design. 

And human greed.

[Chunk]

1 hour ago, Nick907 said:

So easy to do it led to a global recession.

I think it’s a great way to illustrate my point; which is that bad design can be exploited. Blaming corporate greed is out of order, sort of like when players stacked Thunderers with mortars after KO was first released. The rules allowed for the unit to equip the special weapons and buff with the khemist. The designers didn’t have the foresight to think that players would do this, but blaming the players is backwards since they were acting according to what the rules allowed. So a unit of 5 Thunderers could launch 10 mortar shots 36” across the board and cause up to 30 wounds.  Not the player’s fault, but rather the unintended consequences of poor design. 

Oversight certainly,  I think they tend to have a blind spot when it comes to what people do without specific restrictions.

They've said many times that the models get produced first and then rules are written to best represent the models - including weapons. They probably saw the Thunderers kit had 1 each of every special weapon and assumed most players would use it like that, with only 1 of each special weapon per 5 Thunderers. 

[Gecktron]

5 all Mortar Thunderers werent a problem. 

20 all Mortar or all Aether-cannon with multiple Khemist were. 

[Baron Wastelands]

Have been having fun catching up with the numerous debates as we wait for any information, but feel the need to chip in as follows, sorry I’m late to some of the party!

1) I’m confident that GW does not hate any part of it’s money-spending customer base. (Not to mention that the beast “GW” is a category mistake, but let’s not get into that! 😁)

2) I’m also confident that (the people at) GW do not hate any of their own created factions. (They may possibly have hated Bretonnians, but I think a much more plausible explanation is that the aforementioned money-spending customer base didn’t like them very much, as a whole rather than individuals). Neither of these points take away your deity-given right to feel hard done by your own hobby, of course.

3) on the subject of perfectly balanced games, there are lots out there (look up “Chess” if you don’t believe me). We (and now I’m speaking for the whole player base, see what you’ve done?) don’t like those very much because they don’t allow us to do one or more of the following: I) play with a unique army that no-one else quite has and feel proud of our individual creativity; II) represent stories and/or cinematic battles with some degree of immersion, in which we like some randomness and against-the-oddsness, perhaps particularly when we win when we shouldn’t; and/or III) min/max the hell out of the system to create an army with a competitive edge because the rules aren’t perfectly balanced and allow us to do so and feel clever about it. No judgement people, I have done all of these things. I once designed a skirmish game where statistically everything was absolutely balanced. It was really, really dull.

4) On the subject of Mawtribes, I have to say I’ve been having a blast with the new book. I’m not sure it’s true that the majority of the player base want super competitive balanced tournament rules only, but it might be true of the majority of the most vocal set. All I really wanted to say here is that if the new KO book does as good a job as the new Mawtribes book, then I for one will be super happy.

Finally, I am overall already feeling quite positive and even excited about the changes I’ve heard, even if I have to rewrite my lists and change my playstyle (though I am not repainting my ships!) and I remain hopeful for a good week. There was a poster on this very forum, not so long ago, (apologies, I don’t remember who), who posted a topic called “l hate my Kharadron”. This still makes me laugh, it’s such a brilliant title for a post - not because of the poor hobbyist who wasn’t enjoying playing the army, but because it perfectly represents what is sometimes so odd about this hobby. I love my Kharadron, win or lose; and if he/she still has their figures, then I secretly hope this book is especially for him/her!

Eyes to the skies, folks!

 

Edited January 4, 2020 by Baron Wastelands

[TheadTheOgorSlayer]

@Baron Wastelands a voice of reason descends from the heavens 

[stratigo]

9 hours ago, Forrix said:

Honestly, if it's just two guys pumping out all these releases that might be a large part of the problem right there. They need more eyes reviewing these books and time to playtest and iterate.

They playtest, but I know way less about AoS playtesting than I do 40k playtesting, and there's no real front group involved in it the way FLG is for 40k. And I don't know any of the AoS playtesters. The 40k playtesters I know grouse about the process on occasion, but they seem fairly happy with how GW takes their feedback.

 

 

[Tittliewinks22]

Anyone know what time embargo lifts?

[Walrustaco]

I suppose this answers how I should equip my arkanaut company:

No more stacking skyhooks/volley guns. I wonder how this works with squads of more than 10? Need those damn warscrolls. When is Man Reads Book out?

[Double Misfire]

8 minutes ago, Walrustaco said:

I suppose this answers how I should equip my arkanaut company:

No more stacking skyhooks/volley guns. I wonder how this works with squads of more than 10? Need those damn warscrolls. When is Man Reads Book out?

Now  

 

 

[Dongilles]

https://youtu.be/K6uLWOITgdg

 

man who reads book is online

[Ellarr]

Want to know what's changed in the new battletome? I've written a review for Goonhammer for the new battletome which you can read here.

 

https://www.goonhammer.com/age-of-sigmar-review-kharadron-overlords/

[Clan's Cynic]

Thank you GMG. Very cool.

[Gecktron]

First review video is up. Im currently watching but its clarified, Aether-gold shares is 10 or more models. 

Edit: Video was already linked here

Edited January 4, 2020 by Gecktron

[plavski]

Ton of good stuff there and it's a fantastic set of changes overall, with the only niggling issue being the confirmation that Endrinriggers and Skywardens require the Balloonchief to be general to make them battleline. I hope everyone gets their Aether War before it sells out!

[Azamar]

Holy moly the ironclad sounds terrifying now- flat 6 damage on the sky cannon and up to 2 damage and 3+ to wound on the aethercarbines. Mix that with the new aethergold ability and it’s going to annihilate anything that gets close to it, plus better healing all round. 510 points now but worth every one by the sound of it. Mind you, I suspect there’s plenty of things out there that can still flatten it in a single turn even with a 3+ save. 
 

slightly disappointed that two battleline if choices are linked to the new hero, but sone options are better than none at all, and at least arkanauts are cheaper as well.  

[Phasteon]

Man, Arkanauts in boats will be hard to remove, 3+ Save thanks to cover, -1 to hit them and just 90 points. You can hold them back for later in the game when the objectives are cleared and then easily hold them. 

 

Also Thunderers same stats but with 2 wounds. 

And thats just the tip of the iceberg, this Tome will be legit S tier 👌🏻 finally. 

[plavski]

5 minutes ago, Azamar said:

Holy moly the ironclad sounds terrifying now- flat 6 damage on the sky cannon and up to 2 damage and 3+ to wound on the aethercarbines. Mix that with the new aethergold ability and it’s going to annihilate anything that gets close to it, plus better healing all round. 510 points now but worth every one by the sound of it. Mind you, I suspect there’s plenty of things out there that can still flatten it in a single turn even with a 3+ save. 
 

slightly disappointed that two battleline if choices are linked to the new hero, but sone options are better than none at all, and at least arkanauts are cheaper as well.  

Perch a group of endrinriggers around it with a nearby endrinmaster and you'll be repairing the hell out of it. It also carries aether-gold, so you can re-roll all saves one time. And with one of the articles, you can make it carry two loads for two goes at all save re-rolls!

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, Ellarr said:

Want to know what's changed in the new battletome? I've written a review for Goonhammer for the new battletome which you can read here.

 

https://www.goonhammer.com/age-of-sigmar-review-kharadron-overlords/

thanks! This works better for me than the video review 👍

[SireScott]

So is anyone certain of when you actually can disembark?

e.g. can you fly high then disembark in the same turn?

[Entombet]

Well our infantry lost ton of damage with the khemist change.

[Gecktron]

2 minutes ago, SireScott said:

So is anyone certain of when you actually can disembark?

e.g. can you fly high then disembark in the same turn?

In the movement phase, but they cant move that turn. 

[SireScott]

5 minutes ago, Gecktron said:

In the movement phase, but they cant move that turn. 

Thanks Gecktron, my main confusion is the Iron Sky Squadron mentioned that they could disembark before or after flying high, from the Garrison rules I cant quite see the significance of that.

[Aeryenn]

So how does it actually work? Can you fly high with an ironclad with 10 arkanauts in garrison 9" away from the enemy and shoot with them afterwards? Can the same Ironclad with Arkanauts fly high 9" away from the enemy, pull them from garrison in the enemy units direction and then charge them?