AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion

[Boar]

20 hours ago, Malakithe said:

 

Your both assuming the Krusha doesnt wipe the first screen, get the free move, charge into the next screen, wipe it, then get another free move and charge lol

 

20 hours ago, Malakithe said:

Its a combination of abilities. Smashing N Bashing, Mighty Destroyers, Mad as Hell. Castling against IJ is just a bad idea in general

It doesn`t look like that to me. First screen agreed, but after it`s charging into next screen it cannot deal required 10 MW on charge and so even if it wipes those arkos it`s staying there.

[Beliman]

Hi fellow admirals. Another question:

If I use the aetheric augmentation on a unit of thunderers, and that unit just embark in a frigatte, can they shoot with re-rolls of 1 to wound if they are garrisoning the frigatte?

[Rahxephon]

11 hours ago, Beliman said:

Hi fellow admirals. Another question:

If I use the aetheric augmentation on a unit of thunderers, and that unit just embark in a frigatte, can they shoot with re-rolls of 1 to wound if they are garrisoning the frigatte?

Yes, assuming both the khemist and Thunderers were on foot beforehand. Bit of a particular case to get it to happen.

Does bring up a point though, what do people use khemists on these days? I feel like rerolling 1s is only worthwhile on a 3+/2+. Which leaves just the balloons. If i ran thundrik I'd probably consider him with Thunderers as he buffs hits, but then I'd need to be Nar.

[Beliman]

46 minutes ago, Rahxephon said:

Yes, assuming both the khemist and Thunderers were on foot beforehand. Bit of a particular case to get it to happen.

Does bring up a point though, what do people use khemists on these days? I feel like rerolling 1s is only worthwhile on a 3+/2+. Which leaves just the balloons. If i ran thundrik I'd probably consider him with Thunderers as he buffs hits, but then I'd need to be Nar.

Didn't read the Bjorgen warscroll!! It seems that he can target units that are in ships? Maybe we can build some shenanigans around that?

[zilberfrid]

6 minutes ago, Beliman said:

Didn't read the Bjorgen warscroll!! It seems that he can target units that are in ships? Maybe we can build some shenanigans around that?

That seems plausible, but his Profiteers can't start in a ship. Thundrik can, I think, because he's a Khemist and these can be in a batallion

[Boar]

7 minutes ago, zilberfrid said:

his Profiteers can't start in a ship

Why would that be? You set up ship and later set up them in cargo (garrison), this has nothing to do with battalions.

[zilberfrid]

3 minutes ago, Boar said:

Why would that be? You set up ship and later set up them in cargo (garrison), this has nothing to do with battalions.

I may be wrong, thought that wasn't possible but don't have time to check on it now.

[Beliman]

I'm thinking about a mini-alpha strike with low resources on it. Grundstock wing in a Zilfin list:
-Set-up 10 thunderes with special weapons on a frigatte (really far away of everything). Maybe with 6 riggers around the frigatte.
-Hero Phase: Zilfin's footnote to put the frigatte 9" away from a target. If I have some riggers, I will put them just in front of the friggate (9" away from the enemy and move the frigatte a little bit).
-Movement Phase: Disembark Thunderers at 6" of the Frigatte and 3-5" away from the enemy.
-Shooting Phase: Grundstock wing to reroll 1 to hit. Aether-gold to re-roll wounds (if needed). All special weapons in range. Frigatte  (and endrinriggers if any) can shoot with the focus fire too.

If the oponent charge, he/she needs to go through 20 wounds 4+ save with -1hit (2 fumigators that should touch everything charging them) and maybe with the Aether-gold to reroll saves. If some of them survive, I have 3 options: Counter-Charge with riggers, Shoot again (with +1atk from special weapons) or just embark again and Fly high in the next movement/shooting rounds.

What do you think?

Edited May 26, 2020 by Beliman

[Rahxephon]

I feel there less worth to be had out of a zilfin escort wing as they already get the rerolls against flyers. Fly is pretty common, even squigs get it somehow.

Depends what you want to do with artifacts and drops, but I'd consider saving the battalion points. Its about another gunhauler.

For looking to survive following fights its doable, just need to pick them right.

[Beliman]

5 minutes ago, Rahxephon said:

I feel there less worth to be had out of a zilfin escort wing as they already get the rerolls against flyers. Fly is pretty common, even squigs get it somehow.

Zilfin re-rolls only applies to Skyvessels!
Thunderers could still use that juicy rerolls (with +1hit form their special weapons) to rise up a bit their dmg output in this alpha strike. 
I think that maybe just removing the batallion and using Bjorgen will still help to do the same, but whatever, I like to play with batallions 😝

[Zplash]

4 hours ago, Rahxephon said:

I feel there less worth to be had out of a zilfin escort wing as they already get the rerolls against flyers. Fly is pretty common, even squigs get it somehow.

Depends what you want to do with artifacts and drops, but I'd consider saving the battalion points. Its about another gunhauler.

For looking to survive following fights its doable, just need to pick them right.

Artefacts are so strong in KO that most of the time that 2nd Artefacts alone is worth the battalion tax.

Adding the additional CP, some drop reduction and the batallion ability makes it kind of a shame to pass a battalion. Although I have to admit that another gunhauler (3) sounds tempting and fun

[zilberfrid]

What do people think of adding Miners to Thryng?

They are not very survivable (13 wounds at 5+ for 120 pts), but they do have decent rend and can pop up everywhere on the battlefield. They are also resistant to magic and really dwarf.

[Rahxephon]

The miners feel a bit lackluster as we've already got capacity to go nearly anywhere. Bit of a more expensive method though with boats. The miners warscroll looks outdated now, things tend to creep up over the years. An auric runesmiter and hearthguard berzerkers are more worthwhile. Can also pop up anywhere and the hearthguard have good staying power, so they're good to drop infront of relocating ships. The runesmiter is a bit useless offensively, but gives the berzerkers and after save and can get them to reroll wounds. Combined with Thyrng grudges reroll hits they can hit pretty hard.

Sometimes i wonder on the artifacts, depends on what i take. I don't see much appeal in the frigate endrinworks, but the others have good ones. And whilst the reroll ones is only on sky vessels, rerolling 1s on a unit of 10 Thunderers will only net you about 1 more wound for them to save.

I like the escort wing in Zon. Everything can make good use of it, chuck a ram and torpedo on an ironclad and gunhauler and get stuck in.

Edited May 26, 2020 by Rahxephon

[Rahxephon]

Barak Zon Escort Wing arrangements 1980

Endrinmaster w/ Suit 220 general - bearer of the ironstar, aethersped hammer
Aether Khemist - Emergency Ventplates 90
Arkanaut Company 90
Arkanaut Company 90
Grundstok Escort Wing 140
10 Thunderers - Rifles, 2 Fumigators 240
9 Skywardens - 1 Skyhook 300
Gunhauler - Drill 150
Gunhauler - Drill, Spar Torpedo 150
Ironclad - Great Skyhook, Dealbreaker Ram 510

Main changeout point is the khemist, either going with caustic anatomiser or taking a navigator with cyclonic aethometer. Not sure what I like most, but its nice having a combination of defense and offense so generally go with the khemist.

The khemist is also the only way I can see to make use of Zons footnote. Being able to disembark in the hero phase seems rather useless for nearly everyone, but can be used on the khemist so he can buff the skywardens. Does work decently as keeping the khemist onboard and popping smoke can cover the whole army from shooting (from my understanding its 6" from the ironclad if he's embarked which covers a lot). Then in my following turn disembark him with the footnote, boost the skywardens and charge in with them almost auto wounding.

[zilberfrid]

2 hours ago, Rahxephon said:

The miners feel a bit lackluster as we've already got capacity to go nearly anywhere. Bit of a more expensive method though with boats. The miners warscroll looks outdated now, things tend to creep up over the years. An auric runesmiter and hearthguard berzerkers are more worthwhile. Can also pop up anywhere and the hearthguard have good staying power, so they're good to drop infront of relocating ships. The runesmiter is a bit useless offensively, but gives the berzerkers and after save and can get them to reroll wounds. Combined with Thyrng grudges reroll hits they can hit pretty hard.

Sometimes i wonder on the artifacts, depends on what i take. I don't see much appeal in the frigate endrinworks, but the others have good ones. And whilst the reroll ones is only on sky vessels, rerolling 1s on a unit of 10 Thunderers will only net you about 1 more wound for them to save.

I like the escort wing in Zon. Everything can make good use of it, chuck a ram and torpedo on an ironclad and gunhauler and get stuck in.

Yeah, I get what you mean. It's better just to use Arkanauts, or even thunderers at the same points.

I won't be adding naked dwarfs. Too many points and moneys.

I was thinking of a list that uses most of what I have, and the only required addition is something that I was going to get anyway, the Ironclad.

 

Thundrik (Khemist) 140

Endrinmaster (gen)foot 100

Navigator (or maybe extra  EM)100

 

Profiteers 0

Arkanauts 90

Gunhauler 150

Gunhauler 150

Endrinriggers 100

Thunderers 120

 

Ironclad 510

Frigate 250

 

Battalions:

Iron Sky command 130

Grundstok Escort wing 140

 

Three drop:

Deploy Grundstok

Deploy Iron Sky, with Thundrik in a Gunhauler

Deploy profiteers in Gunhauler.

Neat and tidy, with 0 boots on the ground turn one.

Was thinking of the ram, because the Arkanauts don't hate to be in melee, and neither do the Endrinmasters.

Needs to be Urbaz for BL.

 

[Rahxephon]

3 hours ago, zilberfrid said:

 

Ive never really thought about using 2 battalions at once. Looks too expensive to get a good return. Also Thundrik is Barak Bar, while you'll be needing to be Urbaz as you pointed out. With regards to drops its a bit more than 3, battalions deploy all at once, but others separate. Including embarked units unless in a battalion.

 Also in the iron sky I dont think you can take Thundrik. Its not the keyword in the battalion, its the unit name. Unlike the ENDRINMASTER keyword in it. 

Id suggest looking at just a single battalion.

[zilberfrid]

1 hour ago, Rahxephon said:

Ive never really thought about using 2 battalions at once. Looks too expensive to get a good return. Also Thundrik is Barak Bar, while you'll be needing to be Urbaz as you pointed out. With regards to drops its a bit more than 3, battalions deploy all at once, but others separate. Including embarked units unless in a battalion.

 Also in the iron sky I dont think you can take Thundrik. Its not the keyword in the battalion, its the unit name. Unlike the ENDRINMASTER keyword in it. 

Id suggest looking at just a single battalion.

Thanks!

I totally missed Barak Nar in Thundrik's list, because I've been looking at the AoS 1 warscroll. Which means they pinned him to Nar in AoS 2. That's quite puzzling to me, as Nar was the one port that already had a named character. I could still take them, but they won't get Urbaz specials.

As for the two battalions: I get what you mean by too expensive, but how else do you keep your drops low?

One battalion would leave you with quite a few points to spare, which would mean either taking something like Gotrek, or lots of extra drops.

I'll try a two battalion army again:

Iron Sky command 130 (1120):

Khemist 90 

Endrinmaster 100 

Navigator 100 (gen, Ride the wind)

Arkanauts 90

Endrinriggers 100

Ironclad 510

Grundstok Escort wing 140 (810)

Gunhauler 150

Gunhauler 150

Thunderers 120

Frigate 250

This leaves me with 70 points to spare, which is a bit low to be nice, but could be a unit of Aether wings, or a Gyrocopter. I'll choose that one and hope for a bit of a drop in points (of the Ironclad) to be able to fit in a unit of Skyriggers, which would have me fielding every unit (though not hero) on the roster.

Both gunhaulers and the Ironclad would have Endrinworks, torpedoes and go fast juice on the Gunhaulers, and the Ironclad would have the Last Word.

Artifacts would be:

Caustic Anatomizer for overzealous infantry

Cogmonculus to fish for 6es or save

Aethometer to annoy other flyers more

This is still a three drop.

Alternatively, I don't do the second battalion:

Iron sky command 1360:

Admiral

Endrinmaster

Khemist

Navigator

Arkanauts

Endrinriggers

Endrinriggers

Then add units to taste

Gunhauler

Thunderers (in gunhauler)

Frigate

Arkanauts (in frigate)

This leaves just twenty points, which will have to do.

This also opens ports: Zilfin, Urbaz and Nar. Nar seems good for dispelling, but the command trait would be entirely wasted, as well as Respect your Commanders.

Zilfin is nice though, and the Admiral could make good use of CP's.

[NkfPanda]

If you are aiming for narrative and having fun play as many battalions as you would like :). If you are looking for competitive or semi-competitive a single battalion at most is best. You can use iron sky to keep drops low if you have the reqd models but if not don't worry about drops. My main army is Deepkin and when I am making a competitive list or even sem-comp I am always high drop. Of course that is different for KO but all you have to do is checkout a bunch of Tournament Lists for example the last Cancon. Multiple battalions are just not efficient. Especially for an army like KO which normally lacks bodies on the board. The good thing is our battalions are not hot garbage like Deepkin even if they aren't amazing.

I you aren't net listing and just looking for ideas and inspiration for list building it is often a good idea to look at others who have done well in tournaments. KO haven't had much play because of the recent Pandemic but there are still some tournament lists that have done fairly well. I would recommend checking out the Aethercast on youtube or going on the Kharadron Overlords facebook page as there is a pdf with a bunch of tournament lists from our recent battletome. 

[zilberfrid]

1 hour ago, NkfPanda said:

If you are aiming for narrative and having fun play as many battalions as you would like :). If you are looking for competitive or semi-competitive a single battalion at most is best. You can use iron sky to keep drops low if you have the reqd models but if not don't worry about drops. My main army is Deepkin and when I am making a competitive list or even sem-comp I am always high drop. Of course that is different for KO but all you have to do is checkout a bunch of Tournament Lists for example the last Cancon. Multiple battalions are just not efficient. Especially for an army like KO which normally lacks bodies on the board. The good thing is our battalions are not hot garbage like Deepkin even if they aren't amazing.

I you aren't net listing and just looking for ideas and inspiration for list building it is often a good idea to look at others who have done well in tournaments. KO haven't had much play because of the recent Pandemic but there are still some tournament lists that have done fairly well. I would recommend checking out the Aethercast on youtube or going on the Kharadron Overlords facebook page as there is a pdf with a bunch of tournament lists from our recent battletome. 

Thanks! I think I should just build all the models I have, and see what I can do with them. The points will have changed twice before they are finished, and maybe the heat death of the universe has occured.

 

[ACBelMutie]

On 5/26/2020 at 10:31 AM, Beliman said:

-Movement Phase: Disembark Thunderers at 6" of the Frigatte and 3-5" away from the enemy.

What do you think?

You can't disembark after moving if I'm correct...

Greetings

[Beliman]

11 hours ago, ACBelMutie said:

You can't disembark after moving if I'm correct...

Greetings

You are correct, you can't move and disembark in the same phase. 

That's why I use the footnote to move on the hero-phase. One issue with this strategy is that you must start with Thunderers embarked and can't be buffed by khemist that way.

I'm trying with Bjorgsen or Grundstock Wing to give them some rerolls, but I need more games to see if it's worth.

Edited May 28, 2020 by Beliman

[Rahxephon]

Do people use arkanaut squads bigger than 10 now? I can never really see a reason to.

Maybe if we could get 40 for 300 I might take a full squad.

[5kaven5lave]

I posted a list with 100 ArCo a couple of pages back, I think it’s got potential but I’m not sure I can face painting 100 of them. They are excellent value and Gold really helps them. Just a shame about that 9” reach. Maybe an idea to try out on TTS. 

[zilberfrid]

58 minutes ago, 5kaven5lave said:

I posted a list with 100 ArCo a couple of pages back, I think it’s got potential but I’m not sure I can face painting 100 of them. They are excellent value and Gold really helps them. Just a shame about that 9” reach. Maybe an idea to try out on TTS. 

They are quite diverse though, and you can sneak in Blood Bowl dwarves if you want more visual distinction.

It's not like easy to build, metal or other monopose troops.

[5kaven5lave]

54 minutes ago, zilberfrid said:

They are quite diverse though, and you can sneak in Blood Bowl dwarves if you want more visual distinction.

It's not like easy to build, metal or other monopose troops.

Oh, absolutely, they are fantastic models and I am a confirmed ArCo fanatic, it’s the level of detail in them that puts me off painting that many - it would take me aaaaaaages!!