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Chris Tomlin

AoS 2 - Free Peoples Discussion

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Would really suck if the General on horse left us... and kinda weird, don't really see why they'd do that. We can hope that it's just a reboxing tho. 

 

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Honestly I hope that models with horses are phased out with more fantastical replacements. I just don’t feel that horses fit well into the setting. 

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I went to games workshop website.

 

Refining for free people yields mages and artillery, guess everyone's back together.

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6 minutes ago, Warboss Gorbolg said:

Honestly I hope that models with horses are phased out with more fantastical replacements. I just don’t feel that horses fit well into the setting. 

Horses. Nay, cavalry, don't fit into a high fantasy setting?

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46 minutes ago, Warboss Gorbolg said:

Honestly I hope that models with horses are phased out with more fantastical replacements. I just don’t feel that horses fit well into the setting. 

Horses are almost universal, and if we're talking about them being mundane and boring, then I'm afraid Free Peoples being human just got cancelled.

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14 minutes ago, Knight Scáthach of Fimm said:

Horses are almost universal, and if we're talking about them being mundane and boring, then I'm afraid Free Peoples being human just got cancelled.

GW seems to have already moved on in the lore from horses to demigryphs for the Free Peoples. The demigryphs show up in a number of novels whereas I haven’t encountered a single horse so far. GW could continue to expand on that theme. Not nearly as dramatic as you make it seem.

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6 minutes ago, Warboss Gorbolg said:

GW seems to have already moved on in the lore from horses to demigryphs for the Free Peoples. The demigryphs show up in a number of novels whereas I haven’t encountered a single horse so far. GW could continue to expand on that theme. Not nearly as dramatic as you make it seem.

Universal as a trope in fantasy I mean. Nearly all fantasies have horses. They use Demigryphs often because they're trademarked.

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GW has gone with griffins because they are cool and people like them - likely helped by teh fact that many horses for Old World were very functional and had quite boring poses overall. The newer griffins are quite a different beast both in their style and in their often more animated designs. Yet lets not forget the horses in the Death factions that look really great! 

So there's still room for them, just not with the Free Cities en-mass; though I'd be surprised if we lost models like Dragon Knights and we are certainly not losing Dark Riders. 

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8 hours ago, Aelfric said:

He has to stick around cos he's in the mercenary detachment in the GHB, so I shouldn't worry too much.  Lots of units getting re-based, probably.  Wanderers have several metal heroes still and slightly nervous about them.  I'm hoping they'll stay on and be replaced with new models when the Wanderers battletome is released (he says confidently :)).

Oh, I do think he'll return, but when, and whether he'll be complete with tiny griffin and Karl Franz lettering is harder to say.

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16 hours ago, Knight Scáthach of Fimm said:

I don't think the Greatsword on the cover is 100% accurate to the models either. I don't recall a time when GW outright replaced an existing plastic battleline for AoS, in fact it's one of the recurring themes; that being a pre-existing plastic troops kit for a range of models to then be expanded, like Daughters of Khaine.

 

We won't get knights back; Demigryphs fulfill this role with a more fantastical approach, which AoS almost always has when making new models.

I don't know why Ironweld, Collegiate and Devoted would become Freepeoples when this isn't a Freepeoples book specifically. It's their book too.

GW are very much an: if it ain't broke, don't fix it, kind of company. Guard and Gunners are dated, but they're not exactly horrible models.

Greatswords are not 100% acurate right, but the guard is like 10% accurate - more like a greatsword with one handed sword and wep. The gunner & guard details are fine, but they just don't fit the new aesthetic, they look like a rabble from the old Empire (some even don't have boots, and check the faces :D) while stat wise they have 4+save with shields (same as golden boyz in full sigmarite armor haha) Though i agree with you the chance of getting new kit is low.

Demis are monster cavalry, and the old knight kit was dropped because it was so old that it looked realy bad. Since there are horses and knights why not combine them, lore wise it's also ok as you have... undead knights.

Why i'm thinking about the Ironweld, Collegiate and Devoted is that they are factions that alone are pretty useless and GW is getting rid of such leftovers or merging them.

Edited by Verengard

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7 hours ago, Warboss Gorbolg said:

GW seems to have already moved on in the lore from horses to demigryphs for the Free Peoples. The demigryphs show up in a number of novels whereas I haven’t encountered a single horse so far. GW could continue to expand on that theme. Not nearly as dramatic as you make it seem.

Read Eight Lamentations: Spear of Shadows - khornite Ahazian Kel rides a horse (a horse bred by vampires but a horse nonetheless). And we still have Pistoliers and Outriders (recently made available as mercenaries, so they're going to stay). The point of AoS is "everything fits". You want to ride demigryphs? Cool. You want to ride horses? Also cool.

Edited by michu
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considering many night haunt models have horses, horses definitely exist in the mortal realms (thus one cannot argue that we still have horses due to the old world)

 

personally I hope that we eventually get a dynamic horse kit/s that also allow you to build a more fantastical beast (quarter-hippogryphs?)

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1 hour ago, Turin Turambar said:

considering many night haunt models have horses, horses definitely exist in the mortal realms (thus one cannot argue that we still have horses due to the old world)

 

personally I hope that we eventually get a dynamic horse kit/s that also allow you to build a more fantastical beast (quarter-hippogryphs?)

I am using wood elf horses with Gryph hound front quarters and Bretonnian horses with Tsaangor heads to achieve "Quartergryphs" for my Outriders and Pistoleers.

Their leaders are on old Empire horses with the same heads.

Old figures being smaller does help sometimes.

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2 hours ago, Verengard said:

Greatswords are not 100% acurate right, but the guard is like 10% accurate - more like a greatsword with one handed sword and wep. The gunner & guard details are fine, but they just don't fit the new aesthetic, they look like a rabble from the old Empire (some even don't have boots, and check the faces :D) while stat wise they have 4+save with shields (same as golden boyz in full sigmarite armor haha) Though i agree with you the chance of getting new kit is low.

Demis are monster cavalry, and the old knight kit was dropped because it was so old that it looked realy bad. Since there are horses and knights why not combine them, lore wise it's also ok as you have... undead knights.

Why i'm thinking about the Ironweld, Collegiate and Devoted is that they are factions that alone are pretty useless and GW is getting rid of such leftovers or merging them.

The guards have 5+, which fits most other units in breastplate or demicuirass. Swordsmen have 4+ in melee because of their parry ability, and Indomitable may have you remembering it wrong, but 5+ is the base stat.

I do agree they are not up to par with the rest of the models. Guards and crossbows are by far the ugliest Freeguild models. Make them as glorious as the greatswords, and you're golden.

The old knights are not the same scale as the new ones, they are almost 5mm smaller. That would be quite enough not to use them anymore.

Ironweld sits between Freeguild and Disposessed, and lessens both by existing as a separate entity.

College would be interesting to have as an inclusion for Freeguild if you don't use Devoted and vice versa. Devoted have extra against Wizards that the College may not like, and likewise Devoted could well be antagonistic against College.

They do not offer enough to be included in armies other than Freeguild (or disposessed in case of Ironweld).

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2 hours ago, zilberfrid said:

The guards have 5+, which fits most other units in breastplate or demicuirass. Swordsmen have 4+ in melee because of their parry ability, and Indomitable may have you remembering it wrong, but 5+ is the base stat.

Both 4+

262338138_both4.png.d849a32bede445ad4961947e4795ce27.png

Kinda different quality of armor xD

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2 hours ago, Verengard said:

Both 4+

262338138_both4.png.d849a32bede445ad4961947e4795ce27.png

Kinda different quality of armor xD

Like eletronics, they knew how to make it last 30-40 years ago, today they think its fine it works a few years :D

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2 hours ago, Verengard said:

Both 4+

262338138_both4.png.d849a32bede445ad4961947e4795ce27.png

Kinda different quality of armor xD

One only attacks once per turn, parrying the rest of the time. Thus gaining +1 save in melee.

The other attacks twice, thus not gaining a +1 save in melee.

The base guard is 5+, and with any weapon other than a sword, it stays the same.

The base of this Stormcast has a nonsensical but more covering armour, and is 4+, together with generals and demigryphs. The difference in depiction between 5+ and 4+ is breastplate/demicuirass vs full plate. 6+ is just a helmet or thick clothes.

If you want to see odd saves, look at the Warpriests, they seem rather lightly armoured for their save.

It is also stated that save could partly be skill, so Stormcast might just be clumsy?

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Hi guys! I usually play KO and Dispossessed but with the Cities of Sigmar tome I bought a good chunk of *I like this model* of free people. The idea is to have 2k humans in order to play them both alone and with my Dispo. So why not ask in the Cities of Sigmar topic, you may ask.

The idea is, as said, to have a viable Free people army and I need your wisdom! I have, so far:

General on Grif, Genral on horse, battlemage, Luminark or Hurricanum, 6 demigryph knight, 20 guards, 20 greatsword, 10 archers and 10 handgunnes, Steamtank. Good stuffs? I kinda like pistoleers on horse but they seems a little weak right now. What's a good Free People list ? (I like to play with models i really like, not the most competitive)

 

Thank you all for the attention and for playing such a wanderful army

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1 hour ago, zilberfrid said:

One only attacks once per turn, parrying the rest of the time. Thus gaining +1 save in melee.

The other attacks twice, thus not gaining a +1 save in melee.

The base guard is 5+, and with any weapon other than a sword, it stays the same.

The base of this Stormcast has a nonsensical but more covering armour, and is 4+, together with generals and demigryphs. The difference in depiction between 5+ and 4+ is breastplate/demicuirass vs full plate. 6+ is just a helmet or thick clothes.

If you want to see odd saves, look at the Warpriests, they seem rather lightly armoured for their save.

It is also stated that save could partly be skill, so Stormcast might just be clumsy?

I understand your point ;) but the current models dont look like exceptionally skilled sword fencers more like a militia style rabble. The stormcast basicaly have low stats comparing to the description of Sigmar's finest warriors in best armor etc, but thats another story.

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5 hours ago, Verengard said:

I understand your point ;) but the current models dont look like exceptionally skilled sword fencers more like a militia style rabble. The stormcast basicaly have low stats comparing to the description of Sigmar's finest warriors in best armor etc, but thats another story.

If I was up against someone dressed as a Stormcast in a LARP, I would feel more confident than if I was up against someone in guard armour.

The guy in Stormcast armour is severely limited in movement and vision, while the guy in guard armour is dressed in something that is actually fit for purpose.

But then ahain, I really, really dislike the Stormcast/Space marine/Chaos warrior aesthetic.

Edited by zilberfrid

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5 hours ago, zilberfrid said:

If I was up against someone dressed as a Stormcast in a LARP, I would feel more confident than if I was up against someone in guard armour.

The guy in Stormcast armour is severely limited in movement and vision, while the guy in guard armour is dressed in something that is actually fit for purpose.

But then ahain, I really, really dislike the Stormcast/Space marine/Chaos warrior aesthetic.

 

No offense but any time someone complains about realism in warhammer, I always like to bring up the fact that it would be physically impossible for something like a Giant to exist as it would collapse under its own weight assuming earth gravity.

Also everyone's weapons are ridiculously large that everyone would tire themselves out after 5 minutes of fighting

I mean compare Warhammer's warhammer

Spoiler

99800202022_WarriorPriestGreatWeaponNEW0

 

To a real warhammer (looks like a medieval golf club)

Spoiler

6351_1.jpg

 

Heck even the old Empire Knights are in Full Plate Armor, yet use shields. Late Medieval Knights/Men at Arms abandoned shields once plate armor got good enough! Those guys are wasting time and effort carrying shields they don't need!

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1 hour ago, kenshin620 said:

 

No offense but any time someone complains about realism in warhammer, I always like to bring up the fact that it would be physically impossible for something like a Giant to exist as it would collapse under its own weight assuming earth gravity.

Also everyone's weapons are ridiculously large that everyone would tire themselves out after 5 minutes of fighting

I mean compare Warhammer's warhammer

  Reveal hidden contents

99800202022_WarriorPriestGreatWeaponNEW0

 

To a real warhammer (looks like a medieval golf club)

  Hide contents

6351_1.jpg

 

Heck even the old Empire Knights are in Full Plate Armor, yet use shields. Late Medieval Knights/Men at Arms abandoned shields once plate armor got good enough! Those guys are wasting time and effort carrying shields they don't need!

A medieval golf club that can still make horrendous injuries

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11 hours ago, Verengard said:

I understand your point ;) but the current models dont look like exceptionally skilled sword fencers more like a militia style rabble.

You're forgetting something. The Freeguild are all really scrappy little guys. Scrappiness equals +1 to their save.

Never forget, every Freeguild soldier is someone Sigmar DIDN'T have to save while every Stormcast Eternal is someone who'd be dead if Sigmar had not saved them. 😤

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5 hours ago, kenshin620 said:

 

No offense but any time someone complains about realism in warhammer, I always like to bring up the fact that it would be physically impossible for something like a Giant to exist as it would collapse under its own weight assuming earth gravity.

Also everyone's weapons are ridiculously large that everyone would tire themselves out after 5 minutes of fighting

I mean compare Warhammer's warhammer

  Reveal hidden contents

99800202022_WarriorPriestGreatWeaponNEW0

 

To a real warhammer (looks like a medieval golf club)

  Reveal hidden contents

6351_1.jpg

 

Heck even the old Empire Knights are in Full Plate Armor, yet use shields. Late Medieval Knights/Men at Arms abandoned shields once plate armor got good enough! Those guys are wasting time and effort carrying shields they don't need!

I know there isn't a whole lot of realism, but I simply don't like impracticality.

My girlfriend started with Tzeench, and that's its own brand of ridiculousness, but a brand that I can stomach a lot better than armour that blocks line of sight.

As for the knights, jousting was always with shield, and plate was good enough to withstand human weapons, not from ogres, giants etc.

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2 hours ago, Kamose said:

You're forgetting something. The Freeguild are all really scrappy little guys. Scrappiness equals +1 to their save.

Never forget, every Freeguild soldier is someone Sigmar DIDN'T have to save while every Stormcast Eternal is someone who'd be dead if Sigmar had not saved them. 😤

Yeah! Sigmar took only the guys that did not block or armour up good enough! What's left are the guys that do come back from a fight and their decendants.

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