AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

[Richelieu]

1 minute ago, Rod said:

i don see it that way,

you allocate all wounds, models die

then you resolve cicle of the storm 

 

You allocate wounds one at a time.  Clearly explained in the core rules.

[Rod]

6 minutes ago, Richelieu said:

You allocate wounds one at a time.  Clearly explained in the core rules.

in that case, cicle of the storm is not broken at all, no reason to keep discussing it

 

thanks mate

[DanielFM]

32 minutes ago, Rod said:

in that case, cicle of the storm is not broken at all, no reason to keep discussing it

 

thanks mate

In fact it's extremely weak to the point of pointlessness. Either they kill your model with exact wounds, or it does nothing.

Disappointing, isn't it?

[Requizen]

1 minute ago, DanielFM said:

In fact it's extremely weak to the point of pointlessness. Either they kill your model with exact wounds, or it does nothing.

Disappointing, isn't it?

Nah, tough characters (Stardrake, Celestant on Dracoth, Fulminators) often die exactly due to their great saves. Stopping 1 wound is fantastic. On multi-wound units like Paladins/Evocators, stopping a wound can be the difference between losing 2 models and 3 models. It's quite noteworthy, imo, but doesn't break the game.

[PJetski]

It's so difficult to get more than 2 Lord Arcanum into a single list... even if cycle works in the most broken way possible (ie: negates "overkill" damage) I still don't see it being overpowered.

There's no sense arguing about Cycle any further. It definitely has to be covered in the FAQ, so let's just wait and see.

[Turragor]

1 hour ago, Richelieu said:

You allocate wounds one at a time.  Clearly explained in the core rules.

This is right but nowhere does it say what to do with overkill wounds when a unit is gone. Or rather, it says "keep allocating wounds until the target model is slain".

All arguments around this are about what exactly needs to happen to a unit to remove wounds. Apparently slain isn't enough for a majority decision.

This ability makes everyone look hard at what happens exactly with slain models. It's probably healthy to iron out all these loopholes and unclear mechanical interactions.

Is it setting up anew that clears wounds or is it when a unit is slain? Neither is specified.

Ppl have been playing resurrect items and abilities and replacement units wrong all along. The excess wounds follow the phoenix / the seraphon hero / Undead hero. Blue horrors have to take the excess damage the pink horrors took.

And yet it's just common sense too, I don't believe that if a model is slain wounds wait around.

The real reason I think it is moot is that I think Ben Johnson explained how they want it to work (RAI). The wounds wait for the cycle of the storm. I think that is okay, it means that multiple arcanums adont feel like an auto include in all lists.

/Edit - fixed wording.

Edited July 13, 2018 by Turragor

[Kadanga]

51 minutes ago, DanielFM said:

In fact it's extremely weak to the point of pointlessness. Either they kill your model with exact wounds, or it does nothing.

Disappointing, isn't it?

I thought it would be, but it turns out stuff die on their exact wound quite a lot. I had a game yesterday where I triggered the cycle in every turn (until my LA died ?). I also used it to negate 1 incoming damage in my opponents last activation in the combat phase if I hand't used it already. It might sound iffy but we had a situation where this saved one evocator, meaning 4 attacks and ~1 mortal wound more to dish back.

[Richelieu]

6 minutes ago, Kadanga said:

I thought it would be, but it turns out stuff die on their exact wound quite a lot. I had a game yesterday where I triggered the cycle in every turn (until my LA died ?). I also used it to negate 1 incoming damage in my opponents last activation in the combat phase if I hand't used it already. It might sound iffy but we had a situation where this saved one evocator, meaning 4 attacks and ~1 mortal wound more to dish back.

Yeah, 1 wound saved per turn is absolutely no joke.  I saved key models for one turn every turn against Nurgle's never ending steam of mortals last game.  Keeping Vandus alive for one additional turn is a massive point swing.  And then your opponent has to dedicate resources that otherwise would have been freed up to laying down another damage on that though character.  There's huge efficiency loss for them.  

[Mikosan]

I initially struggled with this rule as well close to the beginning of this very thread and changed my mind about it being useless when I started thinking about it negating one wound a turn per LA that triggers when a model is slain.  One less sequitor will die or one less wound on the sequitors that remain.  It's not game breaking but it is annoying for your opponent to have to dedicate more resources in another turn as Richelieu said, where you can just do it again.  2 LA's make it even better.  All that said, the characters to make it happen are not cheap so I doubt you will see many lists spamming the LA models, but who knows, negating 3 or 4 wounds would be fun!

[Requizen]

I think you'll see lists with two, especially once the Tauralon is out. A Tauralon + smaller version (personally a fan of the Gryph-Charger for the heal, speed, and CA) feels quite strong with the right list.

[blueshirtman]

I have a question from a friend, that wants to start SCE, with the new models. He would like to get some tips for sequitors and evocators. Assuming he takes formations that buff them both, are swords or maces better for the sequitors. And the same with evocators should he kitbash great staffs, or go with the basic load out?
 

He wanted to ask about the bolt throwers too, he only has 2 and not hero to buff them, so he asks if he should keep them or sell them?

[PJetski]

Swords are almost always better than maces. They are better without buffs, any buffs to wound rolls (such as Empower or Celestial Blades) make the swords pull ahead even further.

Buffs to the number of attacks like Vandus Hammerhand or the Celestial Vindicators command traits might make the Maces better.

[Richelieu]

20 minutes ago, Requizen said:

I think you'll see lists with two, especially once the Tauralon is out. A Tauralon + smaller version (personally a fan of the Gryph-Charger for the heal, speed, and CA) feels quite strong with the right list.

I know it's expensive, but the dracoline version with pride leader trait accompanied by a unit of Dracovocators is a really mobile, reliably hard hitting strike force.  I am a big fan of the heal on the GC version though.  

[DanielFM]

1 minute ago, Richelieu said:

I know it's expensive, but the dracoline version with pride leader trait accompanied by a unit of Dracovocators is a really mobile, reliably hard hitting strike force.  I am a big fan of the heal on the GC version though.  

The CA really ruins the Tauralon version for me (and yet I'm fielding it ?). Was it that difficult for GW to give him a decent command ability? 

I would really like to have the LAoGC CA while using a Tauralon, but that's so many points... I can't justify both.

It doesn't help that I most of my lists include the Tauralon together with a Lord Aquilor or even a Drakesworn

[AwareTheLegend]

18 minutes ago, Richelieu said:

I know it's expensive, but the dracoline version with pride leader trait accompanied by a unit of Dracovocators is a really mobile, reliably hard hitting strike force.  I am a big fan of the heal on the GC version though.  

I feel the same way and I'm probably going to run a few lists with this combo once we get Dracovocators. The models being really nice helps immensely as well. 

[Richelieu]

23 minutes ago, DanielFM said:

The CA really ruins the Tauralon version for me (and yet I'm fielding it ?). Was it that difficult for GW to give him a decent command ability? 

I would really like to have the LAoGC CA while using a Tauralon, but that's so many points... I can't justify both.

It doesn't help that I most of my lists include the Tauralon together with a Lord Aquilor or even a Drakesworn

I agree it's a pretty disappointing CA.  I'll mostly be using Stormhost CAs anyway, but when I'm not, I'd still rather make a single unit guarantee a 6" run than a bunch of units getting +2" run.

[DanielFM]

19 minutes ago, Richelieu said:

I agree it's a pretty disappointing CA.  I'll mostly be using Stormhost CAs anyway, but when I'm not, I'd still rather make a single unit guarantee a 6" run than a bunch of units getting +2" run.

I guess with a good Stormhost CA (f.ex. Anvils) it's not as bad. 

It could be another useful tool from time to time. 1/3 of the time it's better than a 6" run, with the plus of affecting more models. If a pair of Sequitor units have to leg it to an objective after killing a target, +2 to run could be very welcome.

You know, I'm an incurable possitivist ? that's what we got for our mystic space goat. Let's deal with It!

[ledha]

2 hours ago, blueshirtman said:

I have a question from a friend, that wants to start SCE, with the new models. He would like to get some tips for sequitors and evocators. Assuming he takes formations that buff them both, are swords or maces better for the sequitors. And the same with evocators should he kitbash great staffs, or go with the basic load out?
 

He wanted to ask about the bolt throwers too, he only has 2 and not hero to buff them, so he asks if he should keep them or sell them?

swords are better than mace for sequitpr, and staff better than swords for evocators

HOWEVER, those differences are not incredible and are in a scale of doing like 8 wounds in average instead of 7, so it won't ruin his games if he take one choice instead the other (except if e take 20 evocators with swords ofc), si he should be free to take what please him the most

[mmmbbb3]

what do you guys think about this? a pretty basic list, but i think the anvils command thing will be great with the huge blob

sequitorblob.pdf

[neviskio]

Hey new to stormcast had a few questions. From mobile so sorry for mistakes!

I got the old starter set and the new one x 2 since I traded nighthaunts for more SC. I also got the lord exorcist and a box of judicators and 6x gryph-hounds. Was wondering what would be good future upgrades! I tend to play 1k points but like to vary and aiming for solid 2k once meta settles. Was wondering how to equip the judicators considering what I got. All is painted in hammers of sigmar floors but with my friends and FLGS I imagine I could get away with anvils.

I've read the 40 pages but still not sure what to do besides painting! 

[ToB]

8 hours ago, Erdemo86 said:

Something like this:

Stormhost: Hammers of Sigmar.

Allegiance: Order
Lord-Arcanum on Gryph-Charger (240)
- General
- Trait: We Cannot Fail  
- Celestial Staves (Artefact): Staff of Focus
- Spell: Celestial Blades
- Mount Trait: Keen-clawed
Gavriel Sureheart (100)
Knight-Heraldor (100)
5 x Evocators (200)
5 x Sequitors (120)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
5 x Sequitors (120)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
20 x Sequitors (400)
- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields
3 x Evocators on Dracolines (300)
Celestar Ballista (100)
Celestar Ballista (100)
Cleansing Phalanx (120)
Everblaze Comet (100)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 121

I have normal evocators + Castellant instead of Dracolines.
I played  3 games. Heraldor drop + Everblaze Comet + Staff of Focus, i think that combo is one the best stormcast has now. I did like average 5/6 MW to all enemy units. After that  gavriel + 2 evo boms +20 seqs. I mostly tabled 2 out of three first turn and Major Victory Last game.

The Buffed up Sequitors do some very Good work and Evocators hit hard. 20 Sequitors buffed with Castellant and Arkanum nearby are very resistant. If you buff them Evos too you have

3+ Reroll Save, 6+ Ward Save, 6+ Heals, Lord Arkanum Revive

3+ Reroll Hit, 3+ Reroll To wound, also you can get +1 to wound from Celestial Blades. That combined with 9 Grandweapons inside of the unit are 19 Attacks with Rend-1 Damage 2.

What do you deploy and what is in the realm?

[mystycalchemy]

5 hours ago, DanielFM said:

The CA really ruins the Tauralon version for me (and yet I'm fielding it ?). Was it that difficult for GW to give him a decent command ability? 

I would really like to have the LAoGC CA while using a Tauralon, but that's so many points... I can't justify both.

It doesn't help that I most of my lists include the Tauralon together with a Lord Aquilor or even a Drakesworn

Honestly I dont really get all the negativity towards the Tauralon's command ability. To me it looks like one that i'll pretty much use first turn every game that I run the Tauralon, with occasional use on later turns to grab objectives. Not to mention it can be used *with* the 6" auto run to have a unit run 8"! So sequitors moving 13" or evocators going that far and charging with a Heraldor.

[DanielFM]

3 hours ago, mystycalchemy said:

Honestly I dont really get all the negativity towards the Tauralon's command ability. To me it looks like one that i'll pretty much use first turn every game that I run the Tauralon, with occasional use on later turns to grab objectives. Not to mention it can be used *with* the 6" auto run to have a unit run 8"! So sequitors moving 13" or evocators going that far and charging with a Heraldor.

Good point. It's two CAs, but if you are playing Tempest Lords and swimming on CAs, you can make a unit run 8. Or make several units run more (50% if the time as much as the auto 6 run) with a single CA.

It's just that it's a mobility boost, and a subtle one. Damage and defense buffs tend to catch the eye more.

[Rhargar]

Hello, I have two boxes left with Dracoths, but I'm not sure how to assemble them. What is the new way to go? Still Fulminators or something different like Desolators perhaps? Who can help me?

[DanielFM]

1 hour ago, Rhargar said:

Hello, I have two boxes left with Dracoths, but I'm not sure how to assemble them. What is the new way to go? Still Fulminators or something different like Desolators perhaps? Who can help me?

It's either Tempestors (cheap, shooty) or Fulminators for me. Concussors and Desolators aren't good enough even after the points drops.