AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

[AdamR]

I've tried it with 10 Evocators instead of the  Sequitors too. 
Bit hittier and another wizard for battleplans where that matters for scoring, but I think the bigger blob of sequitors is better most of the time.

I've also got a version with neither and just pump up one of the Liberator units to 30, which loses a drop, but it takes the list to 1970 so it loses out on an essential command point, so I've pretty much discarded it.

BTW, the Judicator squads are equipped that way purely because it's the models I currently have. When I'm able to get some more, I'd like both squads to be crossbows with a shockbolt prime.

[Roark]

On 4/4/2019 at 8:12 PM, AdamR said:

BTW, the Judicator squads are equipped that way purely because it's the models I currently have. When I'm able to get some more, I'd like both squads to be crossbows with a shockbolt prime.

Yeah,  I was to-ing and fro-ing about this but I'm doing the same. The guaranteed mortals on units of 10+ for the Thunderbolt is nothing to sniff at, but quite situational (in a battalion that already has quite situational Paladins) and is a mere ping on a true horde unit. The range and 2+ to Hit on the Prime (for 1d6 hits) from the Shockbolt is just too reliable and versatile to ignore...

[schwabbele]

I gotta say the comet is a real work horse and can severly cripple an army (mine included  ) 😍 

[Mark Williams]

1 minute ago, schwabbele said:

I gotta say the comet is a real work horse and can severly cripple an army (mine included  ) 😍 

Yes, I have played several games where the comet more or less single handedly won the game for me.

However I also found if I played someone who could shut it down, for some reason I would lose the game.

 

 I feel like the comet is one of those items that takes advantage of opponents that can’t defend against it well. So I have a bit of a love hate relationship with it. I like winning but not necessarily by “exploiting” a flaw in someone’s army composition.

I lack the words to explain what I mean, but I think in general I just feel a few of the endless spells are too strong and makes the game feel a bit weird.

[PrimeElectrid]

What’s the current optimal star drake list?

[stus67]

I'm still having trouble justifying a Knight-Azyros in my list. He's a throwaway 100 points for a single round of re-rolling 1s at best.

[Turragor]

Placed 4th in a 26 person tournament on Saturday passed.

Lost to an interesting Slaanesh list in Duality (which I would have hoped to win normally - but choosing 1st turn is key here). Many fiends and 2 princes. Summoning 3 enraputress's. Minus to hit all over.

Then won and achieved almost all secondarys against Gavespawn Thunderscorn list with 4 big gribblies and then a shooty SC anvils list with4 ballistae.

I took another version of my Prime/LCoSD list:

Quote

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
Mortal Realm: Ghur
Celestant-Prime (340)
Lord-Celestant on Stardrake (560)
- General
- Celestine Hammer
- Trait: Staunch Defender
- Artefact: Shardfist Pelt
- Mount Trait: Keen-clawed
Lord-Castellant (100)
Lord-Relictor (100)
- Prayer: Translocation
Knight-Incantor (140)
- Spell: Azyrite Halo
Knight-Heraldor (100)
5 x Judicators (160)
- Skybolt Bows
- 1x Shockbolt Bows
5 x Liberators (100)
- Warhammer & Shield
- 1x Grandhammers
5 x Liberators (100)
- Warhammer & Shield
- 3x Grandblades
2 x Fulminators (240)
10 x Skinks (60)
- Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
- Allies

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 60 / 400
Wounds: 95

Variations of this list have won me 11 of 16 games over the last 4 tournaments - which is pretty good. The losses I have had also haven't been down to the list itself.

I like my approach right now but I do not know how much of it is down to how well I know SC in general as opposed to anything in this list per se.

[ledha]

Lord-Celestant on Stardrake (560)
- General
- Command Trait : Staunch Defender
- Celestine Hammer
- Artefact : Smouldering Helm 
- Mount Trait : Star-branded
Knight-Heraldor (100)
Lord-Castellant (100)
 4 x Fulminators (480)
5 x Liberators (100) - Warblade & Shield - 1 x Grandblades
5 x Liberators (100) - Warhammer & Shield - 1 x Grandhammers
5 x Evocators (200) - 5 x Grandstaves - Lore of Invigoration : Speed of Lightning
5 x Evocators (200) - Lore of Invigoration : Celestial Blades
5 x Judicators (160) - Skybolt Bows

 

Thoughts on this list ? Except the "mortal wounds will stomp you"

Edited April 7, 2019 by ledha

[schwabbele]

5 hours ago, ledha said:

Thoughts on this list ? Except the "mortal wounds will stomp you"

 I wouldn’t run a drake without ignax scales, and make the evo‘s a unit of 10. 5 are usually too squishy. 

Tell us how the list played looks like real fun

[Turragor]

Drake is fine without ignax in most matches this weather. 

Id avoid evocators entirely (maybe a cheeky defensive 5) without more movement and charge or delivery shenanigans. 

They are rather slow. 

[XReN]

16 hours ago, stus67 said:

I'm still having trouble justifying a Knight-Azyros in my list. He's a throwaway 100 points for a single round of re-rolling 1s at best.

You want to present other, more important threats and screen him so he can live longer than one turn

[Future]

Sorry if it has been posted but does anyone have the Stormcast raptor list that went 5-0 at adepticon?

[Twh30]

29 minutes ago, XReN said:

You want to present other, more important threats and screen him so he can live longer than one turn

You could also screen him with scenery still being 10 inches away but making the enemy units have to go around scenery 

[ledha]

1 hour ago, Turragor said:

Drake is fine without ignax in most matches this weather. 

Id avoid evocators entirely (maybe a cheeky defensive 5) without more movement and charge or delivery shenanigans. 

They are rather slow. 

they are mostly there to support the fulminators (reroll charge +1 to wounds, etc), protect me a bit against magic, help me in some battleplans where a wizard count as 20 peoples, and serving as a second wave unit. Their lack of speed never wasn't that much of an issue for me when i used them

 

3 hours ago, schwabbele said:

 I wouldn’t run a drake without ignax scales, and make the evo‘s a unit of 10. 5 are usually too squishy. 

Tell us how the list played looks like real fun

Ignax Scale/smouldering helm is my biggest hesitation yes. The first protect him against his worst weakness, but the second will make him able to one-shot nearly all hordes in the game.

As for evocators, i'm afraid a unit of 10 will make me with "only" 3 good units, and i'm hesitating with having only one wizard. Plus it's easier to concentrate fire on a unit of 10, i think. I'll try both composition anyway.

[Turragor]

1 hour ago, ledha said:

they are mostly there to support the fulminators (reroll charge +1 to wounds, etc), protect me a bit against magic, help me in some battleplans where a wizard count as 20 peoples, and serving as a second wave unit. Their lack of speed never wasn't that much of an issue for me when i used them

 

Ignax Scale/smouldering helm is my biggest hesitation yes. The first protect him against his worst weakness, but the second will make him able to one-shot nearly all hordes in the game.

As for evocators, i'm afraid a unit of 10 will make me with "only" 3 good units, and i'm hesitating with having only one wizard. Plus it's easier to concentrate fire on a unit of 10, i think. I'll try both composition anyway.

I do like evocators, and have had success with 5 in my drake / prime lists. I wish i could fit 10 in together with Fulminators

[That Guy]

So what would you guys do with evocator loadout in a unit of 6 on dracolines? 2 in every 3 may pick a grandstave. So it could possibly be 4 grandstave, 2 blade. What is considered the best loadout for units like this and why? Also would you put a grandstave on the prime of the unit? I could ask the same question for the evocators on foot. Now i know that base sizes are different between on foot and mounted, so the situation might be different.

[PJetski]

Rule of thumb: always take as many Grandstaves as possible

With no buffs at all they are equal to Swords against 3+ saves and better against anything with a worse save. When they get buffs (Empower, bonus attacks, etc.) they pull ahead even against 3+ saves.

2" range is also really important

Edited April 8, 2019 by PJetski

[Requizen]

8 hours ago, Future said:

Sorry if it has been posted but does anyone have the Stormcast raptor list that went 5-0 at adepticon?

Just a couple pages back:

Incantor - General, Thundershock (was trying this, might go for Stormcaller in the future)
Relictor - Translocation
Heraldor
Azyros - Soulthief

Liberators
Liberators
Liberators

10 Evos - Granstaff
5 Evos - Sword + Staff
9 Longstrikes
3 Aetherwings
10 Skinks

1990/2000

Thinking of maybe swapping the Azyros for something else, but there are plenty of times where you really need those Longstrikes to connect and he's invaluable even for 1 turn.

[jake3991]

21 minutes ago, Requizen said:

Just a couple pages back:

Incantor - General, Thundershock (was trying this, might go for Stormcaller in the future)
Relictor - Translocation
Heraldor
Azyros - Soulthief

Liberators
Liberators
Liberators

10 Evos - Granstaff
5 Evos - Sword + Staff
9 Longstrikes
3 Aetherwings
10 Skinks

1990/2000

Thinking of maybe swapping the Azyros for something else, but there are plenty of times where you really need those Longstrikes to connect and he's invaluable even for 1 turn.

Any particular reason you did not go for the battalion with 3x raptors and atherwings?  Currently mulling over a similar list.  

[Requizen]

2 minutes ago, jake3991 said:

Any particular reason you did not go for the battalion with 3x raptors and atherwings?  Currently mulling over a similar list.  

A couple reasons. Mainly because it's expensive - if you want to run 1x9 Longstrikes and 2x3 Hurricanes + the Aetherwings, it's over 1000 points in that Battalion alone, and you really want the points around for the Evocators. It's somewhat cheaper if you go 3x3 Longstrikes, but then you lose out on the Anvils ability and that's really what makes the list work. 

I have been putting together a list using Vanguard Justicar, focusing on Hurricane Raptors as MSU damage dealers. I think it's just  too pricey if you go for Longstrikes, but Hurricanes are extremely points-efficient and 18" isn't even that short of a range in the long run, so there's definitely something there. 

[PJetski]

7 minutes ago, jake3991 said:

Any particular reason you did not go for the battalion with 3x raptors and atherwings?  Currently mulling over a similar list.  

You want 1x9 Longstrike for the Anvils command ability

 

In other news, we have only seen the rules for 2 Fyreslayer Lodges and I am approximately 5000% more excited about them than I am about Stormhosts. 

Edited April 8, 2019 by PJetski

[Sagittarii Orientalis]

46 minutes ago, Requizen said:

Just a couple pages back:

Incantor - General, Thundershock (was trying this, might go for Stormcaller in the future)
Relictor - Translocation
Heraldor
Azyros - Soulthief

Liberators
Liberators
Liberators

10 Evos - Granstaff
5 Evos - Sword + Staff
9 Longstrikes
3 Aetherwings
10 Skinks

1990/2000

Thinking of maybe swapping the Azyros for something else, but there are plenty of times where you really need those Longstrikes to connect and he's invaluable even for 1 turn.

Seeing Anvils Longstrike list doing well at Adepticon is thought provoking. 

What was the list's final placing?

It is a pity that most of the Adepticon 2019 results only show lists' grand alliance and not the specific faction.

Thus it is very difficult to figure out how factions under each grand alliance performed.

 

I have used Anvils Longstrike list for a few times, but with Vanguard Justicar Conclave. Below is the list I just wrote this weekend.

 

- Heroes

Lord-Aquilor(General, Command Trait: Deathly Aura, Artefact: Ignax's Scales, Mount Trait: Wind Runner)

Knight-Heraldor(Artefact: Soulthief)

Knight-Incantor(Spell: Lightning Blast)

 

- Battleline

5 Liberators

5 Liberators

5 Vanguard-Hunters

 

- Others

6 Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows

3 Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows

3 Vanguard-Raptors with Hurricane Crossbows

3 Aetherwings

3 Aetherwings

3 Aetherwings

5 Evocators(Spell: Speed of Lightning, Grandstaves)

 

- Warscroll Battalion

Vanguard Justicar Conclave

 

- Endless Spell

Celestian Vortex

 

Total: 1,950pts

 

The battalion rule is decent, and I found out reducing the number of deployment drops(and thus increasing the likelihood of choosing who goes first or second) is more important for Anvils Longstrike.

This is because longstrike raptors only get to shoot at 24" when using Anvils command ability, since it happens before the movement phase. In this case, going second is even more valuable as raptors are more likely to use command ability more efficiently against approaching enemy units.

As for the odd unit of vanguard-hunters, I wanted to give it a try since it can be set up closer to the enemy than other stormcast units. They can charge the enemies near the objective more easily, although I have to be careful when selecting targets. Boltstorm Pistols, while not the best ranged weapons in Stormcast arsenals, can put some dents on isolated low-tier units guarding the objective at the rear. Even in Total Commitment mission, they can still perform as bodyguard unit for stalling the enemy advance at just 20 more points than 5 liberators. But perhaps I might be too optimistic.

I included the Celestian Vortex because I had spare points, but also because I wanted to inflict damages to enemy units should I get double-turned. Since I have trouble against Chaos lists mostly, the increased damage output of Celestian Vortex against Chaos units is a welcome addition. I know quicksilver swords have exactly the same function at half the price, but I had little choice as I do not have malign sorcery set at the moment.

However, I do find lack of bodies worrisome while reviewing my list. Especially more so since I often play against Skullcrushers heavy Khorne list that includes 27 skullcrushers and two bloodthirsters of insensate rage. I expect the liberators and aetherwings to block delay skullcrushers' advance, but you never know until you play multiple times. 

Edited April 8, 2019 by Sagittarii Orientalis

[jhamslam]

21 minutes ago, PJetski said:

You want 1x9 Longstrike for the Anvils command ability

 

In other news, we have only seen the rules for 2 Fyreslayer Lodges and I am approximately 5000% more excited about them than I am about Stormhosts. 

Same. 

I wonder if they'' ever overhaul some of the older SCE stuff including Battalions and Stormhosts. Right now we simply don't have the stacking thing other factions have going on, outside the Sacrosanct chamber. 

Even points reductions would be nice, now that mortal wounds get handed out like candy and we really need bodies

[Requizen]

I could see point drops for certain things, but honestly we're in a solid place right now. We'll have to shift builds to compensate for the changing meta, of course, but that's expected.

[jhamslam]

2 minutes ago, Requizen said:

I could see point drops for certain things, but honestly we're in a solid place right now. We'll have to shift builds to compensate for the changing meta, of course, but that's expected.

Honestly the 300 point liberator tax is brutal. A points drops or alternate battle line choice there would be ideal. 

The reason for battalions is that none of our battalions synergize with our heroes. Like you would expect Castellant and 2 Libs to be a battalion but instead they're all rather clunky and extremely situational hence the Gav + Cleansing Phalanx spam.

I saw something about a Penumbral Engine terrain in Forbidden power don't know if thats SCE specific terrain or just regular terrain but if its the former that could help