AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

[Nos]

2 hours ago, Lucur said:

It would be possible to bulge out the chestpiece of male Stormcast with some greenstuff (like Angarad Brightshield has). The accentuated boob armor doesn't make any sense anyways.

Agreed that Boob Plate isn’t necessary. But the entire silhouette is different. Shoulders much smaller, waist is tapered, greaves are more accentuated and the feet are semi stilettos. Helmet is also completely different. It’s very classic comic book Hero/Heroine contrast. Men are square and heavy, women lithe and taut. Compare the size of the chest musculature on the Liberators below on my Steelheart troupe. The pectorals on the Liberators are nearly as big as the entire torso of Angarhad. That’s not simply an issue of greenstuff, the anatomy is entirely different.

If you want to keep that monolithic warrior bloc aesthetic that is more or less what defines the SC then there isn’t a simple way to make an all female host of any size without significant cost or major conversion work unfortunately.

I wanted to make just one unit of all female Sequitors but stopped when I realised it cost literally 3x as much to buy. I paid £15 for Steelheart’s trio so I could have just one female Liberator in my unit of 10 and bought another box of Sequitors I didnt need to bump up the number of ladies but even then it’s only half of one unit. £45 quid basically for 6 female SC I didn’t need. It’s not a cheap way to go. With the Forgeworld heads included you’re looking at about £80 for a unit of £10 Sequitors. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Nos

[Draakur]

Hi guys,

 

I hate the idea idea of being “that guy”, but I’ve been digging through pages and pages of this thread and a few others, tried a few search attempts, and still don’t feel like I’m much closer to the answers I’m seeking. So thought I’d risk the flaggelation and just ask a newb question here:

 

I’ve  decided to pick up AoS with an eye to becoming competitive this time (played 40K eons ago as a very fluffy/narrative gamer), really testing myself and seeing how far I can take my skill, providing I enjoy it all etc. While the competitiveness of a faction is certainly going to be the main deciding factor for who I choose, if at all possible I’d actually like to LIKE the models I’m going to be using, and wanted to know: is it possible to play SCE competitively with a force revolving around the more heavily armoured model options? Looking at Decimators,  Protectors, Retributors, etc (and leader models like the Knight Vexillor, Lord Relictor)?? 

 

Thanks for any help or insight people can provide!

[The World Tree]

4 hours ago, Draakur said:

Hi guys,

 

I hate the idea idea of being “that guy”, but I’ve been digging through pages and pages of this thread and a few others, tried a few search attempts, and still don’t feel like I’m much closer to the answers I’m seeking. So thought I’d risk the flaggelation and just ask a newb question here:

 

I’ve  decided to pick up AoS with an eye to becoming competitive this time (played 40K eons ago as a very fluffy/narrative gamer), really testing myself and seeing how far I can take my skill, providing I enjoy it all etc. While the competitiveness of a faction is certainly going to be the main deciding factor for who I choose, if at all possible I’d actually like to LIKE the models I’m going to be using, and wanted to know: is it possible to play SCE competitively with a force revolving around the more heavily armoured model options? Looking at Decimators,  Protectors, Retributors, etc (and leader models like the Knight Vexillor, Lord Relictor)?? 

  

 Thanks for any help or insight people can provide!

Based on the current points values in the General's Handbook, no. 

 

Relictors and Vexillors (which I rate particularly highly) have a real value in certain list. The rest you mentioned just aren't great. 

Evocators, Ballistae and Sequitors are the bread and butter of a competitive list. I'd be wary of a points rise in teh near future for them, but right now they are the go-to list. Unfortunately the army wasn't well designed in terms of internal balance.

That is on the proviso that you are talking about competitive play!

[Draakur]

4 hours ago, The World Tree said:

Based on the current points values in the General's Handbook, no. 

 

Relictors and Vexillors (which I rate particularly highly) have a real value in certain list. The rest you mentioned just aren't great. 

Evocators, Ballistae and Sequitors are the bread and butter of a competitive list. I'd be wary of a points rise in teh near future for them, but right now they are the go-to list. Unfortunately the army wasn't well designed in terms of internal balance.

That is on the proviso that you are talking about competitive play!

Thanks, this is just the sort of infortmation I was looking for. Had certainly seen Evos, Balistae and Seqs a lot, but wasn’t sure if these were just popular right now and the other stuff I mentioned still had a place or not. Good to know!

[Starfyre]

On 3/9/2019 at 10:15 AM, AdamR said:

Click the "reveal hidden content" tags!

Thanks, lol. Read the whole post, didn't even see those tags......

I'm playing a 1000pt game against DoK this week. I'm pretty sure I'll be up against Slaughter Queen on Cauldron of Blood, Hag Queen, Bloodwrack medusa, Witch aelves, Doomfire warlocks and Khinerai Heartrenders.

I was thinking of running:

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: None

Realm of Battle
- Shyish

Knight-Incantor (140)
- General
- Trait: Consummate Commander
- Spell: Chained Lightning
- Artefact: Goblet of Draining
Gavriel Sureheart (100)
5 x Judicators (160) with Skybolt Bows and Shockbolt Bow
5 x Liberators (100) with Hammers and Shield, Grandhammer
5 x Evocators (200)
- Spell: Celestial Blades
3 x Evocators on Celestial Dracolines (300)
- Spell: Terrifying Aspect
1000 points

With the DoK all bunched up around the Cauldron of Blood, strategy was to deepstrike Gav and the 2 units of Evocators and use the command ability to get the charge (with Consummate Commander hopefully giving a bonus CP to use for Forward to Victory for the re-roll if it's required), whilst the Incantor, and Judicators target the Cauldron as a priority.

Alternatively, swapping Consummate Commander for Staunch Defender to create a more secure centre and holding off on deepstriking until turn 2 to generate the 2nd command point.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

Edited March 10, 2019 by Starfyre

[Naprapaten]

3 hours ago, Starfyre said:

Thanks, lol. Read the whole post, didn't even see those tags......

I'm playing a 1000pt game against DoK this week. I'm pretty sure I'll be up against Slaughter Queen on Cauldron of Blood, Hag Queen, Bloodwrack medusa, Witch aelves, Doomfire warlocks and Khinerai Heartrenders.

I was thinking of running:

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: None

Realm of Battle
- Shyish

Knight-Incantor (140)
- General
- Trait: Consummate Commander
- Spell: Chained Lightning
- Artefact: Goblet of Draining
Gavriel Sureheart (100)
5 x Judicators (160) with Skybolt Bows and Shockbolt Bow
5 x Liberators (100) with Hammers and Shield, Grandhammer
5 x Evocators (200)
- Spell: Celestial Blades
3 x Evocators on Celestial Dracolines (300)
- Spell: Terrifying Aspect
1000 points

With the DoK all bunched up around the Cauldron of Blood, strategy was to deepstrike Gav and the 2 units of Evocators and use the command ability to get the charge (with Consummate Commander hopefully giving a bonus CP to use for Forward to Victory for the re-roll if it's required), whilst the Incantor, and Judicators target the Cauldron as a priority.

Alternatively, swapping Consummate Commander for Staunch Defender to create a more secure centre and holding off on deepstriking until turn 2 to generate the 2nd command point.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

If you want to use gavriels CA you have to take the hammers of sigmar stormhost. So you are stuck with we cannot fail command trait and god-forged blade as artefact

[HammerOfSigmar]

When I was reading the battletome today, there is a sentence  "The Anvils of the Heldenhammer are the dark and brooding heroes of an old era, reforged as the Broken World span sinister beneath a fell aspect."

I don't get the point here, especially the second part of the sentence. What does that mean?

and for the "dark and brooding heroes" I am not sure whether I am understanding correctly so does anyone mind sharing your understanding with me? 

Edited March 11, 2019 by HammerOfSigmar

[Mark Williams]

49 minutes ago, HammerOfSigmar said:

When I was reading the battletome today, there is a sentence  "The Anvils of the Heldenhammer are the dark and brooding heroes of an old era, reforged as the Broken World span sinister beneath a fell aspect."

I don't get the point here, especially the second part of the sentence. What does that mean?

and for the "dark and brooding heroes" I am not sure whether I am understanding correctly so does anyone mind sharing your understanding with me? 

The anvils look like goths - pale skin, black hair. They have sunken, deathlike features, and at times appear almost ghostly.

They were heroes before the age of Chaos, so they are very old and come from an era before the gods had a huge presence. The age of chaos happened while they were being reforged so they missed most of that era, only coming back to end it.

[Starfyre]

9 hours ago, Naprapaten said:

If you want to use gavriels CA you have to take the hammers of sigmar stormhost. So you are stuck with we cannot fail command trait and god-forged blade as artefact

Was using the old warscroll... 😖 Thanks for the assist.

Is it better to swap to Hammers of Sigmar, which kinda makes my list a bit tougher, or swap Gavriel for a Lord Celestant on foot or Lord Castellant with Gryph-hound to deepstrike with the evocators, and rely on forward to victory as a failsafe for failed charges? Lacking the extra 20 points for a Vexillor.

Edited March 11, 2019 by Starfyre

[The World Tree]

The problem with deep striking a Lord Castellant is his ability is used in the Hero phase.

I would never use him, but Gavriel is the clear winner for reliable charging. To the point where his rules need changing.

Edited March 11, 2019 by The World Tree

[HammerOfSigmar]

3 hours ago, The World Tree said:

The problem with deep striking a Lord Castellant is his ability is used in the Hero phase.

I would never use him, but Gavriel is the clear winner for reliable charging. To the point where his rules need changing.

If you have 120 points left, take vexillor with pannant of stormbringer. Place your big blob of sequitors on the ground during delopyment. Give all kinds of buff to it in the hero face. Then at the end of the movement phase, drop Gavriel, evocators and vexillor near the enemy. Use vexillor's once per battle ability to relocate your fully buffed sequitor to be alongside Gavriel.

Actually Lord relictor with translocation prayer can do similar stuff but you need a 3+ to pass the prayer test, so it is less reliable but relictor is 20 points less than vexillor.

[The World Tree]

42 minutes ago, HammerOfSigmar said:

If you have 120 points left, take vexillor with pannant of stormbringer. Place your big blob of sequitors on the ground during delopyment. Give all kinds of buff to it in the hero face. Then at the end of the movement phase, drop Gavriel, evocators and vexillor near the enemy. Use vexillor's once per battle ability to relocate your fully buffed sequitor to be alongside Gavriel.

Actually Lord relictor with translocation prayer can do similar stuff but you need a 3+ to pass the prayer test, so it is less reliable but relictor is 20 points less than vexillor.

I used a Vexillor at the GT Heat 1 to great effect. It is much better than the Relictor for the simple reason that the teleport is not range-limited and is reliable as you say. You rarely NEED to teleport twice a game if you deploy well, so that limitation is minimised.

[robinlvalentine]

14 hours ago, HammerOfSigmar said:

When I was reading the battletome today, there is a sentence  "The Anvils of the Heldenhammer are the dark and brooding heroes of an old era, reforged as the Broken World span sinister beneath a fell aspect."

I don't get the point here, especially the second part of the sentence. What does that mean?

and for the "dark and brooding heroes" I am not sure whether I am understanding correctly so does anyone mind sharing your understanding with me? 

@Mark Williams is spot on, but just to expand a little on the second part of the sentence - "reforged as the Broken World span sinister beneath a fell aspect". The Broken World is a metal core which is all that remains of the Old World (the setting of Warhammer Fantasy) which floats in the space between Realms. It's basically saying 'when they were reforged, there were dark omens in the sky'. Bit like saying they were born under an evil star sign or something. Just adding to the idea that they're a bit creepy and sinister.

[PJetski]

9-0 with the Anvilstrike list so far in tournaments. Seems like there is virtually no way to lose unless you get greedy and make mistakes.

Even enemy double turns aren't much of an issue between Aetherwings and Geminids.

[Requizen]

Man, played against a Kunning Rukk this weekend. Won the game, but it's pretty disheartening to watch 10 Evocators just evaporate under a billion Arrerz. It was really close until I got the turn that let me drop the Rukk Boss and the Wizard with Brutal Beast Spirits via Longstrikes, but honestly if he had deployed/positioned differently I might not have been able to reach them even with 30", at least not without sacrificing my Longstrikes in the process. 

It seems like a pretty interesting matchup for Anvils. We don't have the oomph to drop 30 Boyz easily, and the Arrerboyz are basically like the unit of Longstrikes, especially if you get Hand off and they get a threat range of 33". 

[Nos]

21 hours ago, Starfyre said:

Thanks, lol. Read the whole post, didn't even see those tags......

I'm playing a 1000pt game against DoK this week. I'm pretty sure I'll be up against Slaughter Queen on Cauldron of Blood, Hag Queen, Bloodwrack medusa, Witch aelves, Doomfire warlocks and Khinerai Heartrenders.

I was thinking of running:

Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: None

Realm of Battle
- Shyish

Knight-Incantor (140)
- General
- Trait: Consummate Commander
- Spell: Chained Lightning
- Artefact: Goblet of Draining
Gavriel Sureheart (100)
5 x Judicators (160) with Skybolt Bows and Shockbolt Bow
5 x Liberators (100) with Hammers and Shield, Grandhammer
5 x Evocators (200)
- Spell: Celestial Blades
3 x Evocators on Celestial Dracolines (300)
- Spell: Terrifying Aspect
1000 points

With the DoK all bunched up around the Cauldron of Blood, strategy was to deepstrike Gav and the 2 units of Evocators and use the command ability to get the charge (with Consummate Commander hopefully giving a bonus CP to use for Forward to Victory for the re-roll if it's required), whilst the Incantor, and Judicators target the Cauldron as a priority.

Alternatively, swapping Consummate Commander for Staunch Defender to create a more secure centre and holding off on deepstriking until turn 2 to generate the 2nd command point.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

I would be surprised if the Judicators do anything more than plink the cauldron. If you’re lucky with your Shockbolt and Arcane Bolts you theoretically could do kill it in two turns but it’s dependent on a lot of things repeatedly going well. 

If you’re identifying it as a priority to be removed I would spend the 300 points you've set aside for it on something that will be more reliable in that role. 

In general I think you need to think about how you’re going to divide their army as if you let them roll in in a big blob of buffs you’ll just get Annihilated.

I would suggest

Incantor with Scroll of Condemnation 140

Vexillor 120

2x5 Liberators  200

10  Sequitors 240

3  Dracoline 300

Liberators for Objectives/speed bumps, Sequitors for where the fight is thickest as they can both defend and attack well, aided by Vexillor to deploy them safely, Dracolines to Scion in with their automatic charge re-roll. Scroll of Condemnation gives you a good chance of maiming the Cauldron or important hero in one round. Or Staff of Focus wil mean that you’re casting Spirit Storm on a 6 and doing 2MW’s to every unit within 18” for a round. Staunch Defender will keep Evocators and Sequitors alive longer.

As it stands I don’t think your Gav charge is going to do enough damage and they’ll probably just get killed next turn. Leaving you with 1 Incantor, 5 Judicators and 5 Liberators to stand against a death blob of Witch Aelves as they run across the table at you.

Edited March 11, 2019 by Nos

[Heaven_lord]

Hi there, new Stormcast player here !

I just bought a lot of Stormcast on eBay and I wonder if I ca' build a decent list (on the 1k -2k points range) without buying too much models.

Also heard about anvilstrike but do not know so much about this archetype..

Here are models I own:

1x Lord Aquilor 

1x Knight Incantor
2x Lord Relictor 
1x Knight Venator 
1x Knight Azyros 
9x Raptors with Longstrikes 
3x Raptors with Longstrikes 
5x Judicators 
5x Judicators 
5x Liberators 
5x Hunters 
3x Aetherwings 

Thank you !

[Twh30]

Hi there would like some advice on this list . The plan in principle is for ballistas to drop down do there stuff then fulmilators charge in to mop up 

[Starfyre]

Neat feedback, thanks everyone.

' Leaving you with 1 Incantor, 5 Judicators and 5 Liberators to stand against a death blob of Witch Aelves as they run across the table at you. '

This is a concern if I'm honest. What I've seen is that he screens the cauldron on one side with warlocks, and the other side and front witch aelves, so you can't really charge the cauldron. The strategy was going to be to drop Gav and the 2 units of Evocators 9" from the witches, and batter them to reach the cauldron probably the following turn - or if the attacks do enough damage and I'm in range, given how clustered the units are together, direct the MWs straight at the cauldron. I figured there wasn't much that's more hardhitting at this points value than a concerted evocator attack like this in the SCE army.

The worry of course is that the evocators don't finish the unit off (about 20 models I think he fields in the unit), leaving the evocators open to counter-attack.

I know the Judicators and Incantor  can't reliably finish the cauldron off, but taking a few wounds off it (thought going to switch to Staff of Focus as you suggest to work in tandem with his spells, that's a great shout) to reduce it's movement and range of bloodshield seemed worthwhile, and the potential to reduce some of his supporting units helping the evocators.

Your's is an interesting list, with the sequitor blob it feels more tanky, but feels like the damage output is less. That said, I've fielded evocators on foot for 2 games in a row now and both times they died quickly, so maybe it's worth trying out.

Much to think about.

Edited March 11, 2019 by Starfyre

[Nos]

2 hours ago, Starfyre said:

Neat feedback, thanks everyone.

' Leaving you with 1 Incantor, 5 Judicators and 5 Liberators to stand against a death blob of Witch Aelves as they run across the table at you. '

This is a concern if I'm honest. What I've seen is that he screens the cauldron on one side with warlocks, and the other side and front witch aelves, so you can't really charge the cauldron. The strategy was going to be to drop Gav and the 2 units of Evocators 9" from the witches, and batter them to reach the cauldron probably the following turn - or if the attacks do enough damage and I'm in range, given how clustered the units are together, direct the MWs straight at the cauldron. I figured there wasn't much that's more hardhitting at this points value than a concerted evocator attack like this in the SCE army.

The worry of course is that the evocators don't finish the unit off (about 20 models I think he fields in the unit), leaving the evocators open to counter-attack.

I know the Judicators and Incantor  can't reliably finish the cauldron off, but taking a few wounds off it (thought going to switch to Staff of Focus as you suggest to work in tandem with his spells, that's a great shout) to reduce it's movement and range of bloodshield seemed worthwhile, and the potential to reduce some of his supporting units helping the evocators.

Your's is an interesting list, with the sequitor blob it feels more tanky, but feels like the damage output is less. That said, I've fielded evocators on foot for 2 games in a row now and both times they died quickly, so maybe it's worth trying out.

Much to think about.

Other thought is why the 3 Dracolines? 6 with a LA on a Dracoline with the CA is a real blender, but 3 is frequently underwhelming. You also have to consider that a big part of Evocators is the MW output and they only produce 6. Also with two separate units of Evocators you’re going to have to survive a WE round of combat against one of them meaning you’re likely to lose some before they attack and electrocute.

With all that in mind: I’d go 10 Evocators for the 500 points you currently have allotted. With Sureheart to get the charge in you’ve got however many attacks you can get from pile-ins plus a guaranteed 20 MW rolls before any of them get attacked. That’s probably going to finish most of the Aelves off if not all of them.  They’re going to be -1 to hit in the turn they drop so even if you don’t finish them all off you shouldn’t lose many,

With the 100 points saved you could take an Azyros to drop alongside for re-rolling ones, and then get some free MW’s in the next hero phase with his light.

Or if you *really* want to roll the dice on the cauldron, take a Venator, and use the Star Fated Arrow on it. No room for a luck stone if you’re taking Hanmers so it’s a total gamble but it could really cripple the cauldron and if not you can plink away at stuff otherwise.

Edited March 11, 2019 by Nos

[stus67]

How do you guys feel about using the Anvils ability on units in combat? Rather than spending it on Longstrikes? I find that dropping it on 20 sequitors or evocators  is pretty devastating.

[Nos]

7 minutes ago, stus67 said:

How do you guys feel about using the Anvils ability on units in combat? Rather than spending it on Longstrikes? I find that dropping it on 20 sequitors or evocators  is pretty devastating.

It’s outright silly on Evocators seeing as their Celestial attack isn’t limited to being only in combat phase 

Edited March 12, 2019 by Nos

[Lucur]

Of course the CA is useful on units in combat, if you have the CP you can also use it on several units simultaneously. The issue i find is that what gets touched by Evocators is usually not in combat anymore due to being dead or at least crippled to a point where spending a CP seems unnecessary (unless you really need to get those Evocators moving without falling back).

The unit/s that come in to countercharge and in turn dead-en the Evocators is what bothers me, and shooting them with Longstrikes helps.

[PJetski]

It's really powerful with Evocators. Since the ability says "pile in and attack" you don't even need to be within 3" of an enemy to activate it. With 2" reach Grandstaves and the 3" range on Celestial Lightning Arc you can do some significant damage even if only one model is within 6" of your frontline when you get charged.

Getting multiple attack phases with Evocators will almost definitely win you the game every time.

[That Guy]

This is maybe a silly question, but for the competitive scene and even just store gaming and the everchanging meta, how do you guys do it with painting, once it comes to specific stormhosts....? I for example am a Hammers of Sigmar collector and paint my miniatures accordingly. Now say i would want to try Anvils, how would you go about it? Start an entire new force?