Freejack02 Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 2 hours ago, Mark Williams said: Where do you guys see a ruling that would stop hurricane raptors getting bonus shots or Longstrike raptors getting bonus range in the hero phase? The warscroll doesn’t say anything about the shooting phase. Is the logic that you haven’t gotten a movement phase yet? Is there an FAQ that actually clarified that? I haven't seen a specific ruling on it, but I'm not sure I'd be so quick to say it definitively doesn't work... l could see either option making sense - love to see it clarified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synidus Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 (edited) 23 hours ago, ShepHammer said: I'm happy to provide some constructive criticism on this list, and I will make sure to maintain a narrative perspective. And I won't suggest that you dump almost everything for the sacrosanct army. I'll suggest some stuff for you to start thinking about spending your Christmas money on though. As I mentioned before, the lord-arcanum on dracoline is a good thing to think about in the future, but the lord-aquilor does hit just as hard, his mount is just a little less of a bruiser, and you trade the impressive flasks for an unimpressive gun. But I get it, you are running a vanguard force that is supported by a sacrosanct chamber, not the other way around. I like your choice of mount trait since you will be fighting when it is wise to do so. The knight-incantor and the comet are a big risk, even in narrative games. With no bonuses to cast, and only a single 5-wound model that is eligible to cast the comet, you might spend three turns trying to cast it, then lose your wizard before it ever goes off. I would highly suggest cutting the comet for a third ballista and changing the knight-incantor into a lord-ordinator. That cluster of units has been incredibly effective for me and many other players at all levels of competition. For the purposes of fluff, you can imagine that your lord-aquilor has arranged for the ordinator and his equipment to arrive on his signal, once the target has been located. The battleline looks fine to me, go get objectives and murder the enemy objective holders. Regarding the vanguard-palladors: In the context of this list, I'd love to see something that hits a lot harder. I like what they offer in a vacuum, but you've got so much shooting and hyper-maneuverability with scions of the storm and astral compasses, I think they just provide more of the high-cost, high-speed, low-output that you are full of already. This might be why you feel like you are missing some punch. Speaking of punch, I love this 10-strong unit of evocators. I'm sure it is your MVP in nearly every game you play. The heraldor helps to deliver them and also pluck them out of combats they don't want to be in. Love it! I think you'll see more success if you replaced the palladors with either a couple units of sequitors or more evocators. Imagine that your lord-aquilor has been encountering stiff resistance, and has requested more hard-hitting support for his hunting mission. Lastly, I really want to strongly recommend a lord-castellant in place of your knight-azyros. Your 400 point evocator unit is the most crucial unit in your whole force. It could do with some more support. The lord-castellant can deploy on the table with them, and with the lord and his hound, the evocators, and the heraldor, that will allow the ordinator and his toys to deploy in the sky. The lord aquilor and palladors (or whatever you replace them with) can start on the table when you want to compass your hunters. With the castellant/heraldor/evocator block, you have a good outlet for your CP (and bonus Tempest Lords CP). You'll really want to have 1 CP on-hand at all times for inspiring presence, you'll actually want 'at the double' since you can chain runs into charges, and rerolling charges with 'forward to victory' will come up a lot. If you don't manage to cast empower, you may even feel that 'rousing oratory' is worth using on the evocators. Once you invest in more melee punch from sequitors and evocators, you'll immediately feel an improvement. You don't have to run out and buy 50 sequitors and Gavriel, but a gradual inclusion of more of those units will ramp up your punch while preserving your theme. Hopefully that was helpful! That is immensely helpful. i can't bring myself to remove the palladors - they're the reason i bought into the vanguard chambers. I could possibly swap the azyros for a castellant, though i'm going to experiment first. also i just realised my list's reserves plan is whacked now. Because i usually drop the evos, heraldor and ballistas. maybe swap the azyros for gryphhounds. One can drop with the ballistas i do like the ballistas and ordinator, that seems wickedly effective. Here's the list: Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Tempest LordsLeadersLord-Aquilor (200)- General- Trait: Bonds of Noble Duty - Artefact: Patrician's Helm - Mount Trait: Aethereal StalkerKnight-Azyros (100)Knight-Heraldor (100)Lord-Ordinator (140)Battleline5 x Vanguard-Hunters (120)- Boltstorm Pistols and Storm Sabres5 x Vanguard-Hunters (120)- Boltstorm Pistols and Shock Handaxes5 x Vanguard-Hunters (120)- Boltstorm Pistols and Shock HandaxesUnits6 x Vanguard-Palladors (400)- Boltstorm Pistols and Starstrike Javelins10 x Evocators (400)- 5x Grandstaves- Lore of Invigoration: Celestial BladesWar MachinesCelestar Ballista (100)Celestar Ballista (100)Celestar Ballista (100)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 133 Edited January 3, 2019 by Synidus 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kozokus Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Is there any go-to stormcast tournament list like the old les Martin list? If you would go to a tournament what would you bring? At least in the concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Williams Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 (edited) 37 minutes ago, kozokus said: Is there any go-to stormcast tournament list like the old les Martin list? If you would go to a tournament what would you bring? At least in the concept. I’ll “bite.” Basically you want a Gavriel Bomb Hammers of Sigmar list with a Lord Arcanum as your general, and a large number of Sequitors and Evocators. Use a Knight Heraldor so that you can freely retreat and charge, so that you can maximize your movement and assault strength. I’ve built and brought several lists to tournaments this past year, and I’ve tried a lot of different things. Sequitors and Evocators with Gavriel are more or less the most effective and efficient units in the tome at the moment. If you can build a list around buffing and assisting them... well you can never guarantee wins, but that will definitely provide you the most “bad luck protection” that you can get with Stormcast at the moment. They are still difficult to master, however. Without understanding why it works and knowing your opponents, you’re still going to have a bad time against some of the better armies. Another option is Anvils of the Heldenhammer with a large unit of Longstrike Raptors. This seems to be a pretty crazy tough list in the right hands. I have a few theories for some alternative lists. For example I think an army built around the Astral Warbringers probably has some good merit. And I think there might be something there for a mortal wound bomb list with a dragon and some wizards and endless spells... maybe. But in any case the best list I’ve been able to play this year is objectively my Gav Bomb list. I have a few ideas that I wouldn’t mind trying out if I ever get around to buying and painting new models, but all that stuff is on the back burner this year, unless ghb 2019 breathes some new life into the army for me. I’m not in the mood to paint 40 more Sequitors and Evocators right now, so I’m sticking with my current list for the foreseeable future. Edited January 3, 2019 by Mark Williams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turragor Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsMortal Realm: AqshyLord-Celestant On Stardrake (560)- General- Celestine Hammer- Trait: Shielded by Faith - Artefact: Ignax's Scales - Mount Trait: Keen-clawedLord-Castellant (100)Knight-Incantor (140)- Spell: Azyrite HaloCelestant-Prime (340)5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandblades5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers2 x Fulminators (240)3 x Aetherwings (50)3 x Vanguard-Raptors with Hurricane Crossbows (140)Everblaze Comet (100)Total: 1970 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 87 Roast me - I'm mad to take this to a mini-tourney right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karragon Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 29 minutes ago, Turragor said: Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsMortal Realm: AqshyLord-Celestant On Stardrake (560)- General- Celestine Hammer- Trait: Shielded by Faith - Artefact: Ignax's Scales - Mount Trait: Keen-clawedLord-Castellant (100)Knight-Incantor (140)- Spell: Azyrite HaloCelestant-Prime (340)5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandblades5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers2 x Fulminators (240)3 x Aetherwings (50)3 x Vanguard-Raptors with Hurricane Crossbows (140)Everblaze Comet (100)Total: 1970 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 87 Roast me - I'm mad to take this to a mini-tourney right? I've found the comet to be very hit and miss depending on the opposing army/deployment. Against something that clusters all up together it is amazing and, if you're going 2nd, can potentially kill their buff heroes off without them being able to move out of range. Against Death, for example, and now that the Staff of Focus pairing isn't allowed it's just not going to do enough damage to be worth while. Plus you've only got 1 wizard capable of casting it. You'd probably get more mileage out of a Knight-Heraldor or a Lord-Relictor instead 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 48 minutes ago, Turragor said: Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsMortal Realm: AqshyLord-Celestant On Stardrake (560)- General- Celestine Hammer- Trait: Shielded by Faith - Artefact: Ignax's Scales - Mount Trait: Keen-clawedLord-Castellant (100)Knight-Incantor (140)- Spell: Azyrite HaloCelestant-Prime (340)5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandblades5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield- 1x Grandhammers2 x Fulminators (240)3 x Aetherwings (50)3 x Vanguard-Raptors with Hurricane Crossbows (140)Everblaze Comet (100)Total: 1970 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 87 Roast me - I'm mad to take this to a mini-tourney right? That's not a lot of wounds! Is there a reason I'm not seeing that you've gone for Shielded by Faith instead of Staunch? Seeing as he already has a 4+ vs Mortals from Ignax's scales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turragor Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 (edited) 14 minutes ago, AdamR said: That's not a lot of wounds! Is there a reason I'm not seeing that you've gone for Shielded by Faith instead of Staunch? Seeing as he already has a 4+ vs Mortals from Ignax's scales. Wounds there are not many of no Reason for shielded by faith is just an attempt to make the SD very scary even to mortal wound armies but I dunno. Staunch Defender is possibly still worth it. I haven't played SC since new tome (been playing with Nurgle) and haven't got any new models. Trying to see what I can do with old stuff. 32 minutes ago, Karragon said: Plus you've only got 1 wizard capable of casting it. You'd probably get more mileage out of a Knight-Heraldor or a Lord-Relictor instead Perhaps, but in combination with the Prime and LcoSD? What old school lists have ppl been running otherwise? Edited January 3, 2019 by Turragor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Turragor said: Wounds there are not many of no Reason for shielded by faith is just an attempt to make the SD very scary even to mortal wound armies but I dunno. Staunch Defender is possibly still worth it. I haven't played SC since new tome (been playing with Nurgle) and haven't got any new models. Trying to see what I can do with old stuff. I think Staunch will save you a lot more wounds over the course of the tournament than the extra mortals save. But now I've written that you'll probably just face mortalspam lists all the way! EDIT - I'd also agree with dropping the comet for a Heraldor. He still has the mortal wound output, plus you can keep your Fulminators charging. Edited January 3, 2019 by AdamR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turragor Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 1 minute ago, AdamR said: I think Staunch will save you a lot more wounds over the course of the tournament than the extra mortals save. But now I've written that you'll probably just face mortalspam lists all the way! EDIT - I'd also agree with dropping the comet for a Heraldor. He still has the mortal wound output, plus you can keep your Fulminators charging. would you guys go so far as to suggest dropping the incantor too? Or is the auto unbind worth it alone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 I'd keep him just for Azyrite Halo on the space dragon! But also an auto unbind at a key moment can swing a game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 the auto unbind definitely worths its point, especially facing an army with wonderful spells... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainBrink Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Does anyone have experience running an old-style Stardrake list like this in the current meta? Is it still viable without swapping in sequitors/evocators? ++ **Pitched Battle** 2,000 (Order - Stormcast Eternals) [2000pts] ++ + Leader + Knight-Heraldor [100pts] Knight-Incantor [140pts] Lord-Castellant [100pts] Lord-Celestant on Stardrake [560pts]: 2. Keen-clawed, 4. Ignax's Scales, 5. Staunch Defender, Celestine Hammer, General Lord-Relictor [100pts] + Battleline + Judicators [160pts]: 5 Judicators, Skybolt Bow Judicators [160pts]: 5 Judicators, Skybolt Bow Liberators [100pts]: 5 Liberators, Grandhammer, Warhammer and Shield + Other + Fulminators [240pts]: 2 Fulminators Fulminators [240pts]: 2 Fulminators Prosecutors [100pts]: 3 Prosecutors, Stormcall Javelin and Sigmarite Shield, Stormsurge Trident + Allegiance + Allegiance: Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals + Game Options + Game Type: 2000 Points - Battlehost + Realm of Origin + Realm of Origin: Origin: Aqshy ++ Total: [2000pts] ++ Created with BattleScribe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 (edited) LCOD's command ability is not very good. I think the best way to run Dracoths is a block of 4-6 Concussors/Fulminators with: Drakesworn Templar giving them +1 hit with his bow Azyros to reroll hit1 A wizard buffing them with Celestial Blades for +1 wound A Castellant for +1 save Unlike the LCOD variant this list is not required to take Staunch Defender so you could take Celestial Vindicators for the ridiculous command ability and reroll hit1 on charge, or Astral Templars for a free 6" move and +1 hit vs Monsters. The problem with Dracoth deathstars is that Dracolines do the same thing but way more efficiently Edited January 3, 2019 by PJetski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Well, if you are stacking a big unit of dracoths more than 4 models, why not use desolator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Just now, HammerOfSigmar said: Well, if you are stacking a big unit of dracoths more than 4 models, why not use desolator? That's interesting, I had not considered Desolators. I like the mortal wound output on the Concussors and their ability to deny pile-in. Thunderaxes are a 2" reach and hit on 4+ instead of 3+, but at 220 points it might be worth running them in an Astral Templars list since they can get to +2 hit between the Templar and the Stormhost trait. 460 Drakesworn Templar 660 6 Desolator 100 Castellant 100 Azyros 300 Battleline Liberators 1620/2000 From here we want some ranged support... we could fit some combination of Ballistas and Incantors in here. I think I like 2x Ballista + Incantor + Geminids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbin484 Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Hi guys, After a little advice please. Looking for some thoughts on a current list. Want it to be an all round friendly kind of list, not looking for ultimate competitive. Been playing nagash for a while so looking to run something different. Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Hammers of SigmarMortal Realm: GhyranLord-Arcanum on Celestial Dracoline (240)- General- Trait: Staunch Defender - Mount Trait: Pride LeaderLord-Castellant (100)Anointed Of Asuryan On Frostheart Phoenix(280)- Allies10 x Sequitors (240)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields- 2x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield9 x Castigators (240)5 x Evocators (200)3 x Evocators on Dracolines (300)Celestar Ballista (100)Celestar Ballista (100)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 280 / 400Wounds: 127 Idea is to hold the liberators in reserve and charge everything else forward but use the castigators to hold an objective in my own deployment. I realise the Phoenix is a little random but I have one painted up from 8th edition that I'm really proud of and still haven't used him in AOS yet so keen to give it a whirl. Ideally I would like 1 more spell caster in the list but can't quite squeeze it in. Thanks in advance PS - I haven't decided on artifacts and traits as yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 5 minutes ago, Bobbin484 said: Hi guys, After a little advice please. Looking for some thoughts on a current list. Want it to be an all round friendly kind of list, not looking for ultimate competitive. Been playing nagash for a while so looking to run something different. Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals- Stormhost: Hammers of SigmarMortal Realm: GhyranLord-Arcanum on Celestial Dracoline (240)- General- Trait: Staunch Defender - Mount Trait: Pride LeaderLord-Castellant (100)Anointed Of Asuryan On Frostheart Phoenix(280)- Allies10 x Sequitors (240)- Stormsmite Mauls and Soulshields- 2x Stormsmite Greatmaces5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield5 x Liberators (100)- Warhammer & Shield9 x Castigators (240)5 x Evocators (200)3 x Evocators on Dracolines (300)Celestar Ballista (100)Celestar Ballista (100)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 280 / 400Wounds: 127 Idea is to hold the liberators in reserve and charge everything else forward but use the castigators to hold an objective in my own deployment. I realise the Phoenix is a little random but I have one painted up from 8th edition that I'm really proud of and still haven't used him in AOS yet so keen to give it a whirl. Ideally I would like 1 more spell caster in the list but can't quite squeeze it in. Thanks in advance PS - I haven't decided on artifacts and traits as yet. If you are using hammer of sigmar stormhost, your command trait, aretifect is fixed. You cannot use the staunch defender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbin484 Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Got you, thanks. I'm still undecided on the artifacts etc and if it's even worth taking the stormhost, I'm pretty flexible on that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 10 minutes ago, Bobbin484 said: Got you, thanks. I'm still undecided on the artifacts etc and if it's even worth taking the stormhost, I'm pretty flexible on that Some advice, if you are not using any name character, you don't need to take the hammer of sigmar stormhost. Name Characters, such as graviel, their CA usual only works for hammer of sigmar units. This is the main reason why I would choose Hammer of sigmar in some lists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamezorz Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Hello Stormcast Players, I am interested in transitioning to your army. I currently play Nurgle and as I do enjoy them I sorta feel they are currently lacking in some areas and have some really bad match ups. I am having difficulties finding the best way to get a 1250 list that is semi competitive. Which boxes do you recommend? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 4 hours ago, Jamezorz said: Hello Stormcast Players, I am interested in transitioning to your army. I currently play Nurgle and as I do enjoy them I sorta feel they are currently lacking in some areas and have some really bad match ups. I am having difficulties finding the best way to get a 1250 list that is semi competitive. Which boxes do you recommend? Get the stormcast half of the soul war kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karragon Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 9 hours ago, HammerOfSigmar said: Some advice, if you are not using any name character, you don't need to take the hammer of sigmar stormhost. Name Characters, such as graviel, their CA usual only works for hammer of sigmar units. This is the main reason why I would choose Hammer of sigmar in some lists. Personally I always run Hammers (nothing to do with that as a new player I painted everything in those colours, honest), even without named characters. The +1 Bravery across the board is just too good to pass up and though it doesn't happen often, the expression on your opponents face when you return the 20 sequitors they just spent 3 turns killing is priceless. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbin484 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 3 hours ago, Karragon said: Personally I always run Hammers (nothing to do with that as a new player I painted everything in those colours, honest), even without named characters. The +1 Bravery across the board is just too good to pass up and though it doesn't happen often, the expression on your opponents face when you return the 20 sequitors they just spent 3 turns killing is priceless. Having played LoN quite alot recently and doing the exact same thing with 30 grimghast or 40 skellies I can confirm it is very satisfying! I was hoping to do a similar thing with SCE just not quite on the same scale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOfSigmar Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 1cp and 5+ to return a unit of sequitor is not very easy thing....LON guarantees that 1cp=a unit back, but you can't do so when using hammer of sigmar CA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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