Juicy Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 57 minutes ago, OkayestDM said: Between the volume of attacks and the mortal wounds afterwards, 10 man unit of Evocators could probably do the job. that would mean that a unit of 10 with gavriel surecharges is a good combination to kill one of the gargants. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwabbele Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 17 minutes ago, Juicy said: that would mean that a unit of 10 with gavriel surecharges is a good combination to kill one of the gargants. Depends, it’s not an instant kill, and when you get double turned it’s going to look grim for the evos. Vanguard super battalion with double tapping longstrikes might do the job but at a high cost. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcvs Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 1 hour ago, SleeperAgent said: 8 man unit of Desolators and a Drakesworn Templar hitting with the skybolt bow. Storm Blast is 8 attacks 3 up to deal d3 MW's. Then 40 Thunderaxe attacks at 3/3/-1/2 damage. Add a Knight Azyros in 10" of the gargant to re-roll 1's. Bonus points if you are Anvils of the Heldenhammer to attack twice. The good thing about them is the big base lets a huge unit encircle it to get all of their attacks. Yeah so 1220 points kill 490. That's good to know Surely gargants are very bad news for mw based lists (like Starcast) because they just take too many to kill even one. I suppose shooting can do better but it's a bit sad to be pushed even more in that direction... That being said, anyone has had any interesting ideas about allying the krakeneater? I am trying to justify buying one but I can see any interest (o don't like buying models which I know I will not play): outside his allegiance abilities he doesn't seem to bring much. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwabbele Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 53 minutes ago, Marcvs said: doesn't seem to bring much. I gave up the Plan as soon as I realized they don’t get the objective cap bonus 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleeperAgent Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Marcvs said: Yeah so 1220 points kill 490. That's good to know Surely gargants are very bad news for mw based lists (like Starcast) because they just take too many to kill even one. I suppose shooting can do better but it's a bit sad to be pushed even more in that direction... That being said, anyone has had any interesting ideas about allying the krakeneater? I am trying to justify buying one but I can see any interest (o don't like buying models which I know I will not play): outside his allegiance abilities he doesn't seem to bring much. Well theres a chance that the 1220 points all survive and you can go after another one. In reality, 4 ballistas dropping nearby with an ordinator and azyros is your best bet to do mass damage for less cost. Truth is, this is just another sign that the SCE (and Nighthaunt) tomes are outdated and need to be redone. Alongside BoC, Nurgle, maybe Gitz. Edited October 11, 2020 by SleeperAgent 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattrulesok Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 I mean the question of how to beat a gargant surely depends on whether its an ally right? If its just an ally I imagine the best move is to ignore it, 500 points for one body on an objective can live while you take out the actual threats. In a Sob army? Lots of shooting and deepstriking for board presence and surely a kitty bomb has some legs? 6 evos on cats, LA on cat, tempest Lords and maybe even a seraphon wizard for extra cp generation. 6 cats with the LA buff 3 times for 3 extra draco attacks generate 38 wounds vs 4+ save on average and if you ally in a starseer at minimum on average you'll have command points to use the CA every round. Or just the 6 cats in celestial vindicator which should create a whopping 44 wounds on the charge on average although CP is harder to come by for the CA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostfire Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 Hey guys! Haven't been following the thread for quite a while. Recently the 1 drop Anvil list has become a podium list in many tournaments which really intrigues me. Is there any write-up or podcast from the player who play with this list? Just want to the know the pros and cons and how do people win with this list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killamike Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 Honest Wargamer does an Ep with Shawn Bates who was the first to put a score on the board with them. I won a smaller 16 man event with the list not to long ago. Your birds are the lynchpin of the list. It's not a face roll list that you can just put down and win, there is some finesse to the list and how you play it. I've found its real weakness is being doubled by a shooting list. Heavy combat armies are it's bread and butter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostfire Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 4 minutes ago, Killamike said: I've found its real weakness is being doubled by a shooting list. How come? Since you are 1 drop you can just deepstrike those longstrikes and give your opponent the first turn and the neutralize their ranged firepower a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Williams Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 42 minutes ago, frostfire said: How come? Since you are 1 drop you can just deepstrike those longstrikes and give your opponent the first turn and the neutralize their ranged firepower a bit. Low model count is the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baiardo Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Killamike said: Honest Wargamer does an Ep with Shawn Bates who was the first to put a score on the board with them. I won a smaller 16 man event with the list not to long ago. Can't find that ep but which list are you using? Edited October 15, 2020 by baiardo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwabbele Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 2 hours ago, baiardo said: Can't find that ep but which list are you using? Check the "Vanguard Auxiliary Chamber" battalion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killamike Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 14 hours ago, frostfire said: How come? Since you are 1 drop you can just deepstrike those longstrikes and give your opponent the first turn and the neutralize their ranged firepower a bit. U can't without some serious luck kill an ironclad rerolling saves on the drop. 12 hours ago, baiardo said: Can't find that ep but which list are you using? As schwabelle listed. The points are so tight with the three battalions that your only real customisation is 3 venators or 2 and an Azyros. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommissarRotke Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 pretty disappointing to come back after a bit and see that our only play against the Gargants will be ballistae yet again I wonder how well other armies are going about gargant-hunting. I at least finished painting my first Stormcast in between work and trying to read more Soul Wars 😅 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killamike Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 You'd be hard pressed killing a mega Gargant with Ballistas. Raptors or kittycators would do a better job, combined with something else. I don't think giants mw output is that big so storms with high armour can sit on them. Problem is they play the objective game better so you have to kill a unit a turn. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Williams Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 Anvils shootcast is pretty much the answer to everything, even giants. And yes Ballista are far too swingy. You might be able to take 1 giant out with a bit of luck with 4 plus an Ordinator dropping from the sky, but that's 580 points just for a small chance at killing one model, and hoping you don't miss and get immediately smacked down in the next round. Still might be our best play if combined with evocators as you say, but yes it's a pretty rough situation. Almost all stormcast tactics involve gambling that you'll kill whatever you expose yourself to in more or less a single turn. Otherwise once you start taking casualties it's pretty much all over. Yes the garghants are an interesting addition to the game. Hopefully I'll get to pay against them soon and get some experience in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattrulesok Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 I would think our ability to deep strike and simply zone out/screen the gargant from objectives is the strongest play, the gargant biggest weakness is their board presence, they are a low model count army. Yes each model counts as multiple but that's not useful if they can't get to the objective, longshanks is a fairly useless ability and if you zone the gargant out correctly I could see them easily being kept off important objectives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhamslam Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 For gargants, anything that slows their movement is great. SCE can also stack -ve hit modifiers, which make a lot of gargant attacks bad. Take thundershock, thunderclap, geminids, maybe a relictor. Take a soulsnare shackles, even if they FAQ longshanks to step over it, slowing a gargant to a 5 or 6 inch movement per turn is amazing. Honestly Kraken eaters would be the only trouble since they can kick objectives with em. Otherwise gargants have to come to use for shooting or we'll take em down. And that lets us teleport/deepstrike something behind them and get the objectives. Someone here mentioned Celestial Vindicators. Run Kroak for CP generation with a bound endless spell or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcvs Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 2 hours ago, jhamslam said: For gargants, anything that slows their movement is great. SCE can also stack -ve hit modifiers, which make a lot of gargant attacks bad. Take thundershock, thunderclap, geminids, maybe a relictor. Take a soulsnare shackles, even if they FAQ longshanks to step over it, slowing a gargant to a 5 or 6 inch movement per turn is amazing. Honestly Kraken eaters would be the only trouble since they can kick objectives with em. Otherwise gargants have to come to use for shooting or we'll take em down. And that lets us teleport/deepstrike something behind them and get the objectives. Someone here mentioned Celestial Vindicators. Run Kroak for CP generation with a bound endless spell or two. The problem is not as much tailoring one list to kill gargants. That is doable I'd say (with a 4+ save, even an evo bomb with grandstaves would hurt them a lot if not outright kill them). The problem is that when you are preparing a list to play a few games (as in a tournament) the possible presence of gargants essentially pushes you yet again towards a shooting build with raptors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarii Orientalis Posted October 20, 2020 Share Posted October 20, 2020 I agree longstrikes raptors are more reliable than ballistas when used against Sons of Behemat. The problem I see is that raptors nowadays are brutally wiped out by latest armies with any degree of shooting element. Ossiarchs, Seraphon, Lumineths, Kharadrons are but few examples. Unless you are tailoring the list everytime you are up against different factions, taking raptors just for the sake of countering gargants seems risky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhamslam Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 On 10/20/2020 at 2:11 AM, Marcvs said: The problem is not as much tailoring one list to kill gargants. That is doable I'd say (with a 4+ save, even an evo bomb with grandstaves would hurt them a lot if not outright kill them). The problem is that when you are preparing a list to play a few games (as in a tournament) the possible presence of gargants essentially pushes you yet again towards a shooting build with raptors Not necessarily. Its a rock paper scissors game now in AOS which is a good sign for balance. In general we didnt play a melee core because Slaanesh was so damn oppressive not to mention Fyreslayers would be an auto loss alongside Petrifex 3+ saves (which is gone) Shooting and nerfs has made slaanesh not a good choice anymore (although theyre great against gargants with triple keepers farming DP for days). So aside from Fyreslayers it gives our melee core a chance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeanfluflu Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 14 hours ago, jhamslam said: Not necessarily. Its a rock paper scissors game now in AOS which is a good sign for balance. In general we didnt play a melee core because Slaanesh was so damn oppressive not to mention Fyreslayers would be an auto loss alongside Petrifex 3+ saves (which is gone) Shooting and nerfs has made slaanesh not a good choice anymore (although theyre great against gargants with triple keepers farming DP for days). So aside from Fyreslayers it gives our melee core a chance What kind of melee core are you thinking? The classical castellant/sequitors/evocators build? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJetski Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 (edited) Evocators, Dracolines, and Dracoths (Desolators and Fulminators) are the only Stormcast melee units worth using. If we are in a shooting meta then Fulminators are a great choice. Edited October 22, 2020 by PJetski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattrulesok Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 In a shooting meta is there any play in protectors? - 1 to hit vs shooting, units behind count as in cover. Evocators or sequitors in cover vs ranged with a 3+ save rerolling 1s, 2+ with a Lord castellant 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schwabbele Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Mattrulesok said: In a shooting meta is there any play in protectors? - 1 to hit vs shooting, units behind count as in cover. Evocators or sequitors in cover vs ranged with a 3+ save rerolling 1s, 2+ with a Lord castellant That’s definitely something to try. Good catch totally forgot about that 🙃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.