AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

[Lucur]

20 minutes ago, XReN said:

Oh...

Just realised  actual problem with gemenids - Arcanum's CA has only 12" range, whille gemenids can be set up in WW 18 of the caster.

Aaaand that's how I return to my opinion of Arcanum on foot - it's a cheapest sequior tax with defensive CA, so you can shoot opponent's endless spells back at him faster

Which leads me to the conclusion that a mount is basically mandatory, as i hardly see enemy endless spells and the Gryphcharger generates so much value for those 60 points... ymmv of course.

[chord]

Has anyone tried dropping in a unit of crossbow judicators behind an engaged enemy and just shooting the daylights out of them in the back?  If you don't move them you can get a lot of shots off. 

[PJetski]

11 minutes ago, chord said:

Has anyone tried dropping in a unit of crossbow judicators behind an engaged enemy and just shooting the daylights out of them in the back?  If you don't move them you can get a lot of shots off. 

Yes, it can be an effective use of a battleline unit

They tend to die or get stuck in combat immediately afterwards

[chord]

3 minutes ago, PJetski said:

Yes, it can be an effective use of a battleline unit

They tend to die or get stuck in combat immediately afterwards

Well if you stay out of pile in range, and the unit you are shooting is already engaged in combat that unit that is being shot can't get to the judicators unless they retreat.  Of course after that unit is wiped yeah they are pretty hosed

[Twh30]

50 minutes ago, chord said:

Has anyone tried dropping in a unit of crossbow judicators behind an engaged enemy and just shooting the daylights out of them in the back?  If you don't move them you can get a lot of shots off. 

Have been thinking about this list 

 

[HammerOfSigmar]

5 minutes ago, Twh30 said:

Have been thinking about this list 

 

How are you going to protect the judicator in your list? It seems to me that they can just shoot one turn and then get wiped out. Shooting in AOS is not very devastating such that one turn of shooting can paralyze enemy's whole army.

[PJetski]

2 minutes ago, HammerOfSigmar said:

How are you going to protect the judicator in your list? It seems to me that they can just shoot one turn and then get wiped out. Shooting in AOS is not very devastating such that one turn of shooting can paralyze enemy's whole army.

It can be in certain armies. Anvilstrike (Stormcast) and Thunderquake (Seraphon) are devastating shooting lists.

[Twh30]

17 minutes ago, PJetski said:

It can be in certain armies. Anvilstrike (Stormcast) and Thunderquake (Seraphon) are devastating shooting lists.

I agree . Also judicators shouldn’t be underestimated with crossbows as lot of horse armies about which means a unit of 10 auto 2d3 mortal wounds against them plus the quantity of shots can really cripple an army before it gets going . Also the heraldor dropping with them allowing to retreat and run or charge can help

[PJetski]

Retreating and charging isn't a very useful tactic for Judicators...

[HammerOfSigmar]

Judicator's primary damage output is shooting, why you want to retreat....you cannot shoot if you retreat...

The major problem with crossbow Judicators is that they have a shooting range of 12", enough for many units to get into combat in one turn so you need something to protect them. I don't see it in the list posted above unless you want to put the sequitor and judicator together near an objective and leave everything else to your enemy.

Edited February 1, 2019 by HammerOfSigmar

[Twh30]

5 minutes ago, HammerOfSigmar said:

Judicator's primary damage output is shooting, why you want to retreat....you cannot shoot if you retreat...

The major problem with crossbow Judicators is that they have a shooting range of 12", enough for many units to get into combat in one turn so you need something to protect them. I don't see it in the list posted above unless you want to put the sequitor and judicator together near an objective and leave everything else to your enemy.

I have toyed with taking out the 5 man unit of judicators and comet adding in 10 liberators and 10 skinks for screening purposes or just comet for 5 liberators 

[SirPug]

Queston about the hammer of sigmar command ability. 

May i use multiple command  poinst to try get dead unit back and would i get to roll that dice and then choose to use another command point to try to return them if i fail the roll?

[Lucur]

3 minutes ago, SirPug said:

Queston about the hammer of sigmar command ability. 

May i use multiple command  poinst to try get dead unit back and would i get to roll that dice and then choose to use another command point to try to return them if i fail the roll?

No, the recent FAQ clarified that the CA can only be used once on a "dead" unit.

[Nos]

34 minutes ago, SirPug said:

Queston about the hammer of sigmar command ability. 

May i use multiple command  poinst to try get dead unit back and would i get to roll that dice and then choose to use another command point to try to return them if i fail the roll?

Can only use it once per phase. So you only ever get one attempt, and you also can never restore more than one unit max per turn. So if a unit of 5 Libs and 20 Sequitors died that turn, don’t make the mistake of thinking you get a go with each.

[Roark]

15 hours ago, XReN said:

IMO there are better spells that can use a little push, such as purple sun or gemenids, but the idea is there and it sounds cool
Also I think his CA is most usefull with spells that can turn around and bite you, not a harmless Pendulum

Eh? Purple Sun is 8 to cast, procs on 6+ per model, and is 100pts. I think that's almost the worst possible spell for Stormcast wizards...

Also, how do you figure the Pendulum is "harmless"? If you can tag 4 units with it (eg: passing over 2 and landing near 2), that's 4d6 mortals straight up without rolls. 

I'm really confused by your thinking here. Sorry if I'm missing something.

Geminids is a great spell, but I think the combo is made more awkward and situational by the Nids' need to finish near each other, and the Lord Arcanum only being able to move one.

[Lucur]

I think by harmless he means that the Pendulum always moves in a straight line, hopefully away from your own dudes.

[DanteAlighieri]

Starting Stormcast and need some feedback on a prospective list.

 

Aventis Firestrike (General) (360 pts)

Lord Castellant (100 pts)

 

5 x Judicators (160 pts)

3x Castigators (80 pts)

Cleansing Phalanx  (120 pts)

10 x Evocators: Sword and Stave (400 pts)

3 x  Evocators on Dracolines (300 pts)

10 x Sequitors: Swords, 4 Greatmaces + Redemption Cache (240 pts)

10 x Sequitors: Swords, 4 Greatmaces + Redemption Cache (240 pts)

 

2000 Points

 

It definitely seems like a pretty meaty list although no Staunch defender since Aventis is named.

5 Judicators and 3 castigators surely isn't enough ranged. Aventis having 2 casts and 2 denies is pretty nice, but couldn't find the points for an Incantor.

I was considering downgrading the Kitty-Cators to 5 regular Evocators and with the spare 100 points, cut the castigators and add in 5 more judicators?

I'm afraid I will lose too much mobility since they are the only truly mobile unit besides Aventis.

What do you guys think? Maybe cut the batallion since sequitors are strong enough on their own?

I guess I should say I'm pretty set on running 20 Sequitors and Aventis. Everything else is flexible. 

[robinlvalentine]

9 hours ago, Roark said:

Eh? Purple Sun is 8 to cast, procs on 6+ per model, and is 100pts. I think that's almost the worst possible spell for Stormcast wizards...

Also, how do you figure the Pendulum is "harmless"? If you can tag 4 units with it (eg: passing over 2 and landing near 2), that's 4d6 mortals straight up without rolls. 

I'm really confused by your thinking here. Sorry if I'm missing something.

Geminids is a great spell, but I think the combo is made more awkward and situational by the Nids' need to finish near each other, and the Lord Arcanum only being able to move one.

He's talking about how it interacts with the LA's ability to 'push' Endless Spells.

So the Pendulum is 'harmless' in the sense that it can't swing back on your own dudes, so there's no value in being able to push it.

Whereas the Purple Sun is as dangerous to you as the opponent, so being able to push it can give you an edge. 

[Lucur]

8 hours ago, DanteAlighieri said:

Starting Stormcast and need some feedback on a prospective list.

 

Aventis Firestrike (General) (360 pts)

Lord Castellant (100 pts)

 

5 x Judicators (160 pts)

3x Castigators (80 pts)

Cleansing Phalanx  (120 pts)

10 x Evocators: Sword and Stave (400 pts)

3 x  Evocators on Dracolines (300 pts)

10 x Sequitors: Swords, 4 Greatmaces + Redemption Cache (240 pts)

10 x Sequitors: Swords, 4 Greatmaces + Redemption Cache (240 pts)

 

2000 Points

 

It definitely seems like a pretty meaty list although no Staunch defender since Aventis is named.

5 Judicators and 3 castigators surely isn't enough ranged. Aventis having 2 casts and 2 denies is pretty nice, but couldn't find the points for an Incantor.

I was considering downgrading the Kitty-Cators to 5 regular Evocators and with the spare 100 points, cut the castigators and add in 5 more judicators?

I'm afraid I will lose too much mobility since they are the only truly mobile unit besides Aventis.

What do you guys think? Maybe cut the batallion since sequitors are strong enough on their own?

I guess I should say I'm pretty set on running 20 Sequitors and Aventis. Everything else is flexible. 

I'd say a cleansing phalanx is at it's strongest with an Arcanum on Gryphcharger (or Astreia for that matter) so you can autocast empower on your Sequitors, moving them from "strong" to "ridiculous".

[Nos]

Used this list twice this week. It’s uh, good.

Castellant, SD, 100

LA on Dracoline, Pack Leader, Scroll of Condemnation, Thundershock

Incantor, Azyrite Halo

Heraldor

2 x 10 Sequitors

3 x 5 Liberators 

6 Evocators on Dracoline, Celestial Blades

Inspired by a Total Commitment experience and being sick of having to walk places, and my LA on Gryph Charger being a bit dull to use. Everything can set up on the table if required.

Sequitors and Castellant hold objectives. Liberators screen or can be used to grab/tidy up enemy objectives. Because:

With Heraldor you can run and charge  your Dracolines and almost certainly will not get charged if you placed them sensibly, while also very unlikely to fail charge yourself.

With Pack Leader your 6 Dracolines are hitting on 2+ and, if you need it, with Scroll of Condemnation they’re also wounding on 2’s, which, if they’ve empowered themselves, they can also re-roll. With LA Command trait Their mounts have 4xD3 Damage -1 rend attacks a piece on the charge if you use . You then get 12 Dice for MW’s. That’s not including any of your leaders attacks. Because your leader is in the thick of it they’re ideally placed to cast Thundershock, Storm Lance, Arcane Bolt to pile up the wounds and mess stuff up, or just mystic shield the cats. Cycle of the Storm keeps the unit topped up and is great value on a 5 wound model. On top of all the damage you’ve done you reduce bravery minus 1 for Battleshock.  If you still need to get rid of the enemy next turn, retreat and charge and do same again. Alternatively if you’ve messed them up/killed everything (likely) retreat/run and charge somewhere else, repeat. So long as you’re not charging into a tarpit-why would you-they can obliterate pretty much anything so long as you charge. They’re an absolute no nonsense charge of the Light Brigade Cavalry Unit.  It feels awesome.

Drop liberators in to claim objective/tidy up, or if safe from summoning risk, move up your Sequitors. In most scenarios 3 objectives will win you the game, and you have a rapid response Kitty unit to sway the fight elsewhere if your Sequitors are struggling. 

It’s hella fun. Only tricky bit is ensuring Heraldor is safe/close to sound the charge.  Giving him one of the Liberator units as a screen and running both has sufficed so far. General placing needs some thought if he can’t keep up with the run and charge as well but it’s nothing major unless you’re trying something insane.

Edited February 2, 2019 by Nos

[Marzillius]

41 minutes ago, Nos said:

Used this list twice this week. It’s uh, good.

Castellant, SD, 100

LA on Dracoline, Pack Leader, Scroll of Condemnation, Thundershock

Incantor, Azyrite Halo

Heraldor

2 x 10 Sequitors

3 x 5 Liberators 

6 Evocators on Dracoline, Celestial Blades

I really think this is cool, how many games have you played and how did the Dracoline Evocators do in most of them? Do they all die eventually, or do they just crush the enemy's most important unit and then you basically win? I play a lot of cavalry lists myself, but only with Dracoths and Palladors, and if I come up against Legions of Nagash I just die because their debuffs are so strong against Stormcast cavalry. I would think the issue would be even worse here.

And another completely unrelated question to anyone: When is a Lord-Ordinator useful for his +1 to-hit buff? When you have 2 Ballistas? 3? Is it ever worth taking him over another Ballista?

[Nos]

37 minutes ago, Marzillius said:

I really think this is cool, how many games have you played and how did the Dracoline Evocators do in most of them? Do they all die eventually, or do they just crush the enemy's most important unit and then you basically win? I play a lot of cavalry lists myself, but only with Dracoths and Palladors, and if I come up against Legions of Nagash I just die because their debuffs are so strong against Stormcast cavalry. I would think the issue would be even worse here.

And another completely unrelated question to anyone: When is a Lord-Ordinator useful for his +1 to-hit buff? When you have 2 Ballistas? 3? Is it ever worth taking him over another Ballista?

Just two so far, Sylvaneth and Nighthaunt. I wouldn’t want to charge it into a LON skeleton blob but there’s not many things you can charge into one of those with any army right now. Probably why they keep coming top. Suspect Gloomspite might have the same going for them once the meta settles as well. 

What I think the Dracoline are great as are anti-elites. Usually you dont want to line up your best unit against their best unit, it’s a waste of their potential. You want to target heroes or objective holders while trapping their best units with chaff. Thing is though that for the reasons I stated above Dracolines cause so much damage on the charge, and with a Heraldor and re-rolled charge they have so much range, that they’re ideally placed to kill well armoured but small units, screened heroes, or glass cannon types. In my two games they annihalated Kurnoth Hunters, Durthu, Ghrimghast and Spirit Host before they could hit back then cleaned up the backline. 

Rest of both armies had nothing that could shift a Lanterned or Azyrite Halo’ed unit  of Sequitors flanked by the Liberator screen with SD in sufficient time to claim enough points. 

The best thing about is that you get more than one charge with your death unit. You can quite feasibly destroy two expensive units on either side of the board from each other in as many turns if you’re lucky. No one-drop- Gav-Bomb we’re-here-guys- oh-the-rest-of -the-battles-over-there-now-oh-well. And unlike Gav Bomb it’s hard to screen against.

Again I’m not claiming it’s foolproof but at this stage I think with practice I’d fancy my chances with it competitively against most match ups at present.

No idea on the Ordinator sorry! I like to play as many different models as possible so would always veer towards LO and one Ballista due to rule of cool.

Edited February 2, 2019 by Nos

[schwabbele]

@Marzillius here is a real good calculation on the ballista ordinator stormcast shooting in general: 

@Nos Great to hear that the KittyCators are doing well - started today with Astreia test painting to settle on a scheme - quite motivating

[Marzillius]

13 minutes ago, Nos said:

Just two so far, Sylvaneth and Nighthaunt. I wouldn’t want to charge it into a LON skeleton blob but there’s not many things you can charge into one of those with any army right now. Probably why they keep coming top. Suspect Gloomspite might have the same going for them once the meta settles as well. 

What I think the Dracoline are great as are anti-elites. Usually you dont want to line up your best unit against their best unit, it’s a waste of their potential. You want to target heroes or objective holders while trapping their best units with chaff. Thing is though that for the reasons I stated above Dracolines cause so much damage on the charge, and with a Heraldor and re-rolled charge they have so much range, that they’re ideally placed to kill well armoured but small units, screened heroes, or glass cannon types. In my two games they annihalated Kurnoth Hunters, Durthu, Ghrimghast and Spirit Host before they could hit back then cleaned up the backline. 

Rest of both armies had nothing that could shift a Lanterned or Azyrite Halo’ed unit  of Sequitors flanked by the Liberator screen with SD in sufficient time to claim enough points. 

The best thing about is that you get more than one charge with your death unit. You can quite feasibly destroy two expensive units on either side of the board from each other in as many turns if you’re lucky. No one-drop- Gav-Bomb we’re-here-guys- oh-the-rest-of -the-battles-over-there-now-oh-well. And unlike Gav Bomb it’s hard to screen against.

Again I’m not claiming it’s foolproof but at this stage I think with practice I’d fancy my chances with it competitively against most match ups at present.

No idea on the Ordinator sorry! I like to play as many different models as possible so would always veer towards LO and one Ballista due to rule of cool.

I see, how do you deal with really annoying screens like Skinks? And if you are Haloing a unit of Sequitors, isn't it better to run a 20-man unit, so the enemy has no choice in attacking the un-haloed unit. This also saves 80 points. Also, do you hit the Dracolines with the Lantern, or a unit of Sequitors?

And I forgot to ask, how do you equip your Dracoline Evocators? I'm going to build my two boxes tomorrow and I'm still unsure how to go about it. 3 with Grandstave and 3 with Tempest Blades maybe? Which weapon does the Prime have?

[Furuzzolo]

Hi guys, not an usual Stormcast player but i got my hands on some soul wars half and i started to write lists on Azyr.

I have sequitors and lord arcanum, 2 ballistae and 10 evocators but i'd love to field fulminators and some classic paladin. Any suggestion, good command ability/artifact interaction to suggest? (Again, arcanun+sequitors battleline but i'd love a cavalry/paladins very elite army. 2000 points. I'm not found in the ballistae spam but kinda ok with one in the list to range-support)