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Chris Tomlin

AoS 2 - Idoneth Deepkin Discussion

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1 minute ago, Nerdkingdan said:

As someone who bought it all, Don’t do what I did.   Buy a 1k in something that can ally with deepkin, or just something that does spells or ranged.   
 

Cities as a ranged or spell cast looks like a good idea, or stormcast which is what I’m leaning to.    Daughters looks to be in a similar boat as deepkin;

Sylvaneth to do wood and sea is tempting, but looks like an ineffective list as wood and sea.   I’d do something that has an underworlds warband, that game is fun.

oh I was planning on starting a cities list anyways, but just deciding which race to do before I pull the trigger. I like aelves, but I also like dwarfs. Still, I want to try and master my list before I jump to something else.

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Thinking of doing a Deep Kin army for the AoS WHW Heats, thoughts?

 

Enclaive: Dhom-Hain
Realm: Ulgu

Leaders
Isharann Tidecaster
- General
- Trait: Born from Agony
- Spell: Steed of Tides

Isharann Soulscryer
- Artefact: Talisman of the Watcher

Isharann Soulrender
- Artefact: Cloud of Midnight

Volturnos

Battleline
10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Reavers
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Reavers
- Icon Bearer

Other
9× Arkehlian Morrsarr Guard
- Command Group

Warscroll Battalion
Namarti Corps

Endless Spell
Malevolent Maelstrom

Points = 1,990
CP = 2
Drops = 5

General lets me dictate when I do high tide (turn 2 vs Slaanesh, aggro rush etc) and I do MSU but with small drops. Can nullify shooting for a turn and can teleport heroes. Volturnos helps with his bravery buff too. Endless Spell there just because.

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4 hours ago, Templar101 said:

Thinking of doing a Deep Kin army for the AoS WHW Heats, thoughts?

 

Enclaive: Dhom-Hain
Realm: Ulgu

Leaders
Isharann Tidecaster
- General
- Trait: Born from Agony
- Spell: Steed of Tides

Isharann Soulscryer
- Artefact: Talisman of the Watcher

Isharann Soulrender
- Artefact: Cloud of Midnight

Volturnos

Battleline
10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Thralls
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Reavers
- Icon Bearer

10× Namarti Reavers
- Icon Bearer

Other
9× Arkehlian Morrsarr Guard
- Command Group

Warscroll Battalion
Namarti Corps

Endless Spell
Malevolent Maelstrom

Points = 1,990
CP = 2
Drops = 5

General lets me dictate when I do high tide (turn 2 vs Slaanesh, aggro rush etc) and I do MSU but with small drops. Can nullify shooting for a turn and can teleport heroes. Volturnos helps with his bravery buff too. Endless Spell there just because.

Generally speaking are you building the list specifically as a counter to Slaanesh?  I would say its probably not perfectly "optimized" as an all comers list, but if you think you can grind it out against most opponents and are anticipating a massive amount of slaanesh I guess the lesser number of multi wound models might be better then the traditional 18 morrsarr.  Just due to not owning enough eels I played for a long time only using 1 block of morrsarr and while I definitely wouldn't say I felt completely overpowered, I definitely felt myself playing an uphill battle against most of the competitive builds I played against.  I won an okay amount of them, but I wouldn't have trusted my chances to go 4-1 at a tourney, felt more like a 3-2 list if I played very well.  With 18 morrsarr, I generally feel more evenly matched, though obviously against skaven  and slaanesh I think that uphill feeling is going to be there no matter what. 

I've been playing the namarti corp + 2 eel block build the most out of the "competitive" builds we have, and I am pretty comfortable with it, so I definitely support namarti corp as a drop reduction strategy, but I do think you will be missing that second block of morrsarr.  But again, I do think you may be right that this build has an edge over Slaanesh in comparison to our normal comp builds, so maybe its worth it.   I think what you just need to think about is if potential improvement (haven't playtested something like this vs slaanesh so wouldn't know for sure) vs the 1 seed army is worth being worse against most everything else.  With enough skill I am sure you can make it work, but I don't know if you are better off in general.  You are going to need to win on the objective game with a list like this, you try to steamroll you are going to get bogged down and killed by most of top tier.

Edited by tripchimeras

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Thanks, that makes sense. It is to counter Slaanesh but I'm timing to charge everything at high tide then hope for the best haha. Should have enough units to score objectives and I do like the threat multiple Namarti units present. Issue is if the eels fail or fluff then it kinda falls apart. 

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You know, I kinda want to wishlist for s second. Could you imagine if we had a fully close combat kitted put shark? Maybe one with a giant glaive carried by the guy on the platform like the Namarti use?  Kinda bringing it closer to the chariots of other elves is what I have in mind. Would be fun to have something like that, or maybe the alopex with a hero riding it to support our guys.

Edited by Acid_Nine

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Hi all, just got back from Blood and Glory where I achieved top Deepkin  (24/126 overall on battlepoints) and wanted to share my thoughts for us Fish Aelf players.  Sorry for the long post.

Firstly my list and rationale:

  • Dhom-Hain
  • Chamon
  • General: Volturnos
  • 2 x Soulscryers (one with Alchemical Chain for an unbind)
  • Ally: Hag Queen
  • Battleline:  6 units of 3 x Morrsarr Guard
  • Allies: One unit of 30 x Sisters of Slaughter with Knives
  • +1 command point
  • No boats

Until ~July this year I played the usual 2 blocks of 9 Morrsarr with some Thralls and Reavers.   I always felt uneasy when playing due to how much importance that placed on just the two eel units.   And two units of Bravery 6 at that.  I initially switched to  a mix of units of 6 and 3s but then decided to go all the way to units of 3s for a few reasons:

  1. Harder to screen:  with Changehost now running around with multiple layers of screens (and often screens they benefit from if you kill) it was getting more and more difficult to get 9 eels into contact with the stuff you need to kill.   3 eels often  fit  into places where 9 won't
  2. Less weight on any given unit:  you can sacrifice a unit of 3 without too much concern.  It is worth trading 3 even to kill a screen if it lets your next unit of 3 kill the hero
  3. Harder for your opponent to hit: 6 targets rather than 2, often placed so if they hit one unit of 3 you can counter-charge immediately with another and take their unit off
  4. Protects low bravery: the maximum number of eels you ever lose to bravery is 1 which beats the 4 I have experienced losing in blocks of 9
  5. Flexibility: 3 may not hit as hard as 9 but you can decide how many units of 3 you charge onto the same target based on how much you need to kill that target.  I have charged 12 into targets before (which beats 9!).  Also with Volturnos' Waaagh in turn 3 you can scale a unit of 3 eels back up to 9 with 4 command points (often available by turn 3)

For my other selections I had further rationale:

  • Dhom-Hain: I wanted Volturnos as general so I could scale units back up to 9 in terms of hitting power in turn 3.  This reduces the benefit of Fuethan so I switched to Dhom-Hain (which also helps against a lot of current armies anyway e.g. Slaanesh Keepers, Khorne Bloodthirsters, Rogue Idols etc.)
  • Daughters of Khaine allies: If you don't need Namarti for batteline, Sisters of Slaughter are just better.  They always have run and charge (rather than just in turn 2), 6" pile in means you can frequently make them strike first (rather than just in turn 3), 2" range on 25mm bases gives much greater consistent offensive output, especially alongside witchbrew from the Hag that gives them reroll wounds.  Immunity to Battleshock from the Hag makes up for their slightly worse save (seriously though, 5+ versus 6+ pretty much makes zero difference anyway)
    • I also do get worried with really low model count armies hence why I did not go fully MSU eel.  That's  just a personal hangup of mine though.
  • No wizard: Alchemical Chain gives an unbind but otherwise I do not see the point in spending 100 points on one wizard that just will not get any spells off against any current army
  • No boats: I like to reduce the decisions I need to make in a game so I can make sure to take the right ones when it counts.   Boats add an immediate decision to the start of the game and most of the time I actually think they hinder us Deepkin players more than help (especially the way most of us place them).   Ever use boats to block opponent's movement routes around the board?  I actually now think that's the exact opposite of what we need to do.   We need opponents to break apart their castles and send units further apart from each other so we can  more easily kill one at a time without getting bogged down in counter charges.   Blocking movement routes limits their options and often means their armies are more clustered together than otherwise

The tournament itself I lost to Slaanesh (4 keepers) first game, then beat Sylvaneth, Bloodthirster + Archaon Khorne (Turn 1 I shocked through the screen protecting Archaon with 6 eels and Volturnos' charge before just 3 eels + Volturnos killed Archaon himself), Changehost (very very glad I took MSU eels for that match-up: I could screen my hero on each objective from shooting via forgotten nightmares whilst still slipping other units of eels over screens and into heroes) and then a minor loss to Big Waaagh. 

Slaanesh is a problem for everyone but all the Orruks now really are an issue for Deepkin.   Hordes of Ardboyz are just too difficult to properly chew through (multiple hordes with two wounds on a 4+,6++ that can punch back really hard) and killing the characters does not reduce their effectiveness enough.   Not yet sure what our answer to them is (it's definitely not Namarti).  I fought hard just to deny the Major but no way could I win on kill points.

Anyway, I hope that was good food for thought.  I can do more detailed battle write-ups if you want but this post is already pretty long!

Edited by Gilboy
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4 hours ago, Gilboy said:

 

  • No boats: I like to reduce the decisions I need to make in a game so I can make sure to take the right ones when it counts.   Boats add an immediate decision to the start of the game and most of the time I actually think they hinder us Deepkin players more than help (especially the way most of us place them).   Ever use boats to block opponent's movement routes around the board?  I actually now think that's the exact opposite of what we need to do.   We need opponents to break apart their castles and send units further apart from each other so we can  more easily kill one at a time without getting bogged down in counter charges.   Blocking movement routes limits their options and often means their armies are more clustered together than otherwise

 

 I think you put the boat on your side, to try a ritual, or have an extra save, or to hinder models coming in from the back, or a save for yourself.   I agree with not putting them to block opponents, but I disagree with your solution.   

The rest was an interesting read, thanks.

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15 minutes ago, Nerdkingdan said:

 I think you put the boat on your side, to try a ritual, or have an extra save, or to hinder models coming in from the back, or a save for yourself.   I agree with not putting them to block opponents, but I disagree with your solution.   

The rest was an interesting read, thanks.

I find the rituals still too unlikely to succeed and a lot of the time useless anyway (no flying units? No one in cover?).   I’ve never found the 6+ after save great, especially in such a confined space for an army that relies on mobility.  Using to block opponent off-board summon is good but there’s a lot of thinking and second guessing required for that and it’s exactly the kind of decision I want to remove so I can focus on where to move the eels

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24 minutes ago, Gilboy said:

I find the rituals still too unlikely to succeed and a lot of the time useless anyway (no flying units? No one in cover?).   I’ve never found the 6+ after save great, especially in such a confined space for an army that relies on mobility.  Using to block opponent off-board summon is good but there’s a lot of thinking and second guessing required for that and it’s exactly the kind of decision I want to remove so I can focus on where to move the eels

Think you make a lot of interesting points on the other stuff and I like the idea of using sisters of slaughter.   However, the boats are free.  6++ may not make a huge difference, but sometimes it is going to help, why deny yourself that when it's free?  Blocking movement lanes may be the wrong choice against some armies, but against others keeping your opponent bunched up on one part of the board may be exactly what you want.  Particularly in the matchups where winning through combat are not likely for us, obstructing opponent's movement may be just what you need to hold that objective 1 turn longer.  The do not fly ritual can be game changing depending on opponent, its situational and unlikely to succeed, but for free it could change a game or two. 

I also don't know if I agree that simplifying your decision making by not including them at all makes sense either.  Simplifying the terms of engagement, limiting mistakes, and removing chance are what you want when you have an advantage.  But when you aren't advantaged or evenly matched you want to complicate the scenario as much as humanly possible.  If you have a plus match-up and want to keep it strait forward, throw the ships in a corner and forget about them, but if you have an opponent you don't know how to deal with, and you don't think you can beat easily, place those baby's in the most inconvenient place possible and hope it causes them to make mistakes.  If you don't know how to win in a straight forward matchup, make the conditions of battle less straight forward imo. 

Again can't stress enough; they are free.  Even if only 1 of the 5 games sees you using them at all, that was 1 game where you got use out of a free thing, you wouldn't have gotten not including them.  Placement occures before you deploy your models, if a glance at their list doesn't leave you thinking Loss, toss em in corner and move on, but if you are concerned (like you are with Big Waa) seems like a good spot to use them.

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@Gilboy Nice write up! MSU eels have become a hot topic lately thanks to the face hammer thing, and you're helping to convince us to run more. I also like the giant blob of sisters you have there. Quite a good idea for just having bodies, and both you and a person from my local GW have got me thinking on using allies in my army someday.

 

How do you feel about having such a high drop army? 

 

Also, like others I will dissagree with boats, mostly because I find them more and more pivitol to some games I play.  I usually Park one 6" away from an objective with that protection bubble extending out to cover your guys when they take the objective or fight someone on the objective, and sometimes those 6+ saves really, really help with making my guys survive. just yesterday my king survived an ogor tyrant punching him in the face because of the shipwreck blunting damage, and I just really cannot imagine playing without one.

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18 minutes ago, Acid_Nine said:

How do you feel about having such a high drop army? 

Well the default optimal build (Namarti Corps, 2 x 9 Morrsarr) is 5 drop.  Sure that helps you outdrop some armies but most armies who are committing to choosing priority are going to be dropping lower than you anyway.    Once 5 drops is no longer good enough then you can either try for 4 or give up and just pick the army list you want without focusing on drops.   I did not find it to be a massive issue in my games (often they gave me first turn: I witchbrewed the sisters,  kept my units in the sea and made any easy, safe objective moves .  Then ended my turn, accepted a double turn in response and played for the double turn 2 into 3).  The only exception where it made a real noticeable impact was versus the Slaanesh list which was 2 drop anyway so no Deepkin list could beat it.

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1 hour ago, tripchimeras said:

 However, the boats are free.  6++ may not make a huge difference, but sometimes it is going to help, why deny yourself that when it's free? 

I take yours (and everyone else's points) on this and definitely you should use boats if they work for you.  The undercurrent of all this for me is you need to be fully confident and comfortable with your game plan for a given opponent and scenario.  I am confident with my eels and sisters and how i'm going to use them (and therefore, given a certain opponent and scenario, how to deploy them).  I just lack that confidence for the boats and mentally it knocks me back at the start (and I suspect all that second guessing and planning with the boats has a similar effect on others).  Starting a game with anything but a confident mindset can cost you that game.   

Also another point is that boats can feel a bit obnoxious for your opponents and we're all here to just have a good game and not needlessly annoy each other :)

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1 hour ago, Gilboy said:

Well the default optimal build (Namarti Corps, 2 x 9 Morrsarr) is 5 drop.  Sure that helps you outdrop some armies but most armies who are committing to choosing priority are going to be dropping lower than you anyway.    Once 5 drops is no longer good enough then you can either try for 4 or give up and just pick the army list you want without focusing on drops.   I did not find it to be a massive issue in my games (often they gave me first turn: I witchbrewed the sisters,  kept my units in the sea and made any easy, safe objective moves .  Then ended my turn, accepted a double turn in response and played for the double turn 2 into 3).  The only exception where it made a real noticeable impact was versus the Slaanesh list which was 2 drop anyway so no Deepkin list could beat it.

Fair enough. I am used to a four drop list myself when using my akhelian corps in dhom-hain, but I found there are games I won because my opponent gave me turn 1 to jump on objectives. It's a quite a balance, but your points do make it seem there is a slight advantage for going first in terms of objectives and buffing units enough to survive the double turn.

 

You know I had a thought today after reading these posts. We cannot do cities of sigmar allies, but we can do the keyworded factions. I'm thinking that maybe allying in some shadow warriors for surprise back-field objective grabs and assassinations, considering we have shadowblades as an ally keyword.

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Hello all!

Longtime lurker of the forum, finally signed myself up and seeking some advice!

 

I am going to be playing in my first 2k tournament at my local game store in a couple weeks.  I had been hoping to run my mawtribes but it is looking very unlikely that I will have everything painted in time, so I will be sallying forth we my trusty fish bois!

From what I know my shops meta is not super competitive, but I want to have a good showing and bring a strong list.  That being said I do not want, nor do I have the models to run eel spam.

** ALSO:  BIG MODIFIER, the TO's have decided to try running the tournament with true alternating turns, no roll off, no double turns **

Here are a few lists I am contemplating:

LIST 1

Enclave Fuethan/Dhom Hain(?)

Akhelian King (240)

 - General

 - Born From Agony

Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Sea (420)

 - Artefact: Black Pearl (or maybe Sands of Infinity)

- Lore of the Deeps: Abyssal Darkness

Isharann Soulscryer (130)

 

6 x Morssarr Guard (340)

3 x Ishlaen Guard (140)

3 x Ishlaen Guard (140)

2x Akhelian Allopex (240)

10 x Namarti Reavers (130)

10 x Namarti Thralls (130)

5x Tree Revenants (80)

  - Allies

1990/2000 Points

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LIST 2

Enclave: Fuethan

Isharann Tidecaster (100)

 - General

 - Born From Agony

- Lore of the Depths: ??

Isharann Soulcryer (130)

Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Storm (400)

- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet maybe?

 

10x Namarti Reaver (130)

10x Namarti Thralls (130)

10x Namarti Thralls (130)

6x Morrsarr Guard (340)

3x Ishlaen Guard (140)

3x Islaen Guard (140)

2x Akhelian Allopex (240)

5x Tree Revenants (80)

  - Allies

1960/2000

 

The second list has room to bump the Eidolon from Storm to Sea, but without the King i felt I might need another beat stick and RR1 bubble.  Or could drop the sharks to bring the King back in.

These lists use just about all the models I have...  I'd rather not buy any more eels, but would consider another box of reavers to make a namarti corps battalion if it really seemed worth it.

 

Anyways, greatly appreciate any advice -- on the lists, playing in a tournament in general, playing games WITHOUT double turns, etc!

 

Cheers!

 

 

Edited by chyortskazal

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21 minutes ago, chyortskazal said:

Hello all!

Longtime lurker of the forum, finally signed myself up and seeking some advice!

 

I am going to be playing in my first 2k tournament at my local game store in a couple weeks.  I had been hoping to run my mawtribes but it is looking very unlikely that I will have everything painted in time, so I will be sallying forth we my trusty fish bois!

From what I know my shops meta is not super competitive, but I want to have a good showing and bring a strong list.  That being said I do not want, nor do I have the models to run eel spam.

** ALSO:  BIG MODIFIER, the TO's have decided to try running the tournament with true alternating turns, no roll off, no double turns **

Here are a few lists I am contemplating:

LIST 1

Enclave Fuethan/Dhom Hain(?)

Akhelian King (240)

 - General

 - Born From Agony

Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Sea (420)

 - Artefact: Black Pearl (or maybe Sands of Infinity)

- Lore of the Deeps: Abyssal Darkness

Isharann Soulscryer (130)

 

6 x Morssarr Guard (340)

3 x Ishlaen Guard (140)

3 x Ishlaen Guard (140)

2x Akhelian Allopex (240)

10 x Namarti Reavers (130)

10 x Namarti Thralls (130)

5x Tree Revenants (80)

  - Allies

1990/2000 Points

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LIST 2

Enclave: Fuethan

Isharann Tidecaster (100)

 - General

 - Born From Agony

- Lore of the Depths: ??

Isharann Soulcryer (130)

Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Storm (400)

- Artefact: Ethereal Amulet maybe?

 

10x Namarti Reaver (130)

10x Namarti Thralls (130)

10x Namarti Thralls (130)

6x Morrsarr Guard (340)

3x Ishlaen Guard (140)

3x Islaen Guard (140)

2x Akhelian Allopex (240)

5x Tree Revenants (80)

  - Allies

1960/2000

 

The second list has room to bump the Eidolon from Storm to Sea, but without the King i felt I might need another beat stick and RR1 bubble.  Or could drop the sharks to bring the King back in.

These lists use just about all the models I have...  I'd rather not buy any more eels, but would consider another box of reavers to make a namarti corps battalion if it really seemed worth it.

 

Anyways, greatly appreciate any advice -- on the lists, playing in a tournament in general, playing games WITHOUT double turns, etc!

 

Cheers!

 

 

Personally not a fan of removing double turn, but if they are going to do it, it definitely changes the game significantly.  Certainly makes it easier tactically (though that is going to go both ways).  I think one thing it probably does (though I have no personal experience playing without double turn) is expands the advantage of high move models.  In both these lists you are likely going to have a high degree of control over  who gets charges and when against most opponents.  Take advantage of that.  Also as important as screens are in double turn games, they become especially effective in I go you go.  You know a screen you set up properly will always work.  For an army who's main combat units can fly  this is extremely effective.  My guess is that this format is beneficial to our army moreso than most others, though I can't be sure.  

I think for your purposes both lists are fine, given that you don't want to go full optimal and think it will be semi-casual.  I think they are both in principal strong enough to have a good showing.  One thing I would personally change, regardless of which build you go with I would choose the eidolon of the storm over the eidolon of the sea.  It doesn't matter that you can afford the sea aspect in both, the storm is better in the way our lists are currently constructed and work.  I love the concept of the sea aspect, but in practice he just does not work with how we need to play the game.  If you are spending all those points you want something that can actually tilt a battle, the sea's spells are far too short range and do not have the casting buffs needed to be strong.  I think Storm is better in both of your lists.  I think either list can work, though they obviously each play a little differently.  I would go with whichever you feel personally more comfortable with.  The second may be the way to go with more objective holders, and because aspect of the storm fills a semi similar spot to the king, but I think for a semi-casual atmosphere both will be fine.  If you are bent on taking the eidolon of the sea I think the sands of infinity are the way to go.  For the storm ethereal amulet seems like a good choice, or maybe the 4+ ward vs mortals if your local meta has a lot of mortal wound dealing armies.

Def share your thoughts on a tourney without double turns though after its over.  Seems like it would take a little too much tactically away from the game for me, but would be interested to see how you feel afterwards.

Edited by tripchimeras
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Thanks for the advice!  I'm not a big fan of them doing away with the double turn rule either but I think you may be right with it being a benefit for us if we can use our speed/screens effectively.  Makes me lean towards list two so I have more chaff to put in front of my eels/sharks/eidolon.  

 

Will mess around with the storm eidolon for either list, have been wanting to give him a run out anyway.  Also thinking maybe one of the +1 to hit realm artifacts could be pretty wild especially if going dhom hain, as that would bring his spear to 4 attacks +2/+2/ -2 / 3dmg, rerolling 1s to hit and wound on just about every combat (thanks to his fall back and charge every time)

 

Will definitely provide an update on how it goes both for myself and in general with the rules modification

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On 11/5/2019 at 1:09 PM, chyortskazal said:

Thanks for the advice!  I'm not a big fan of them doing away with the double turn rule either but I think you may be right with it being a benefit for us if we can use our speed/screens effectively.  Makes me lean towards list two so I have more chaff to put in front of my eels/sharks/eidolon.  

 

Will mess around with the storm eidolon for either list, have been wanting to give him a run out anyway.  Also thinking maybe one of the +1 to hit realm artifacts could be pretty wild especially if going dhom hain, as that would bring his spear to 4 attacks +2/+2/ -2 / 3dmg, rerolling 1s to hit and wound on just about every combat (thanks to his fall back and charge every time)

 

Will definitely provide an update on how it goes both for myself and in general with the rules modification

i'm  interested to hear how it went!

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On 11/5/2019 at 7:09 PM, chyortskazal said:

Thanks for the advice!  I'm not a big fan of them doing away with the double turn rule either but I think you may be right with it being a benefit for us if we can use our speed/screens effectively.  Makes me lean towards list two so I have more chaff to put in front of my eels/sharks/eidolon.  

 

Will mess around with the storm eidolon for either list, have been wanting to give him a run out anyway.  Also thinking maybe one of the +1 to hit realm artifacts could be pretty wild especially if going dhom hain, as that would bring his spear to 4 attacks +2/+2/ -2 / 3dmg, rerolling 1s to hit and wound on just about every combat (thanks to his fall back and charge every time)

 

Will definitely provide an update on how it goes both for myself and in general with the rules modification

The Storm is a lot of fun.   I've even run two of them at once in my more "fun" lists.   Add the artefact from Hysh that adds one damage to the spear and then Isharann ritual him to reroll hit rolls.   4 attacks 3s rerolling/2s reroll 1s/ -2/ 4 damage on the charge.  It's not Eel-level damage but your opponent will fear it.

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Hi guys. I am starting with Idoneth and I have two questions about Volturnos command ability. From what I can understand there is no limits about how many times I can use it in a turn right? And as there is no indication about the timing I can use it whenever I want, like before or after charging?

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56 minutes ago, Allornone said:

Hi guys. I am starting with Idoneth and I have two questions about Volturnos command ability. From what I can understand there is no limits about how many times I can use it in a turn right? And as there is no indication about the timing I can use it whenever I want, like before or after charging?

You can use it as often as you want in High Tide.  There is an FAQ that states if the command ability doesnt say which phase it is used in it is used in the hero phase.

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7 minutes ago, Drofnum said:

You can use it as often as you want in High Tide.  There is an FAQ that states if the command ability doesnt say which phase it is used in it is used in the hero phase.

Thanks

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Hi all considering jumping back into AOS after not having played since.. probably since 2.0 first came out.  I haven't done an Order army yet (I have FEC and Nurgle) and really like the look and fluff of Deepkin (right now it's a tossup between them and Bonereapers with Deepkin slightly in the lead).  One of the things I'm looking for in an army this time around besides no summoning (really don't want to have to buy a lot of extra stuff on top of the actual army) is an army that I can adjust the power level relatively easy i.e. turn it up for competitive games/tournaments and tone it down for more casual games.

Deepkin seem to fall right into this category as it seems like if I don't take 18+ Eels or maybe take some Allopex (love these models) and Namarti it tones it down, while more eels = more power?  Luckily for me I really like the entire range of models in the Deepkin line with the possible exception of the Octodude and I'm not a huge fan of the female spellcaster but she's not so bad.

Is this observation correct?  I know Deepkin are (were?) a higher end army competitively with eel spam, how do they fare when toned down?  Are they still pretty decent?

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1 hour ago, wayniac said:

Hi all considering jumping back into AOS after not having played since.. probably since 2.0 first came out.  I haven't done an Order army yet (I have FEC and Nurgle) and really like the look and fluff of Deepkin (right now it's a tossup between them and Bonereapers with Deepkin slightly in the lead).  One of the things I'm looking for in an army this time around besides no summoning (really don't want to have to buy a lot of extra stuff on top of the actual army) is an army that I can adjust the power level relatively easy i.e. turn it up for competitive games/tournaments and tone it down for more casual games.

Deepkin seem to fall right into this category as it seems like if I don't take 18+ Eels or maybe take some Allopex (love these models) and Namarti it tones it down, while more eels = more power?  Luckily for me I really like the entire range of models in the Deepkin line with the possible exception of the Octodude and I'm not a huge fan of the female spellcaster but she's not so bad.

Is this observation correct?  I know Deepkin are (were?) a higher end army competitively with eel spam, how do they fare when toned down?  Are they still pretty decent?

Pretty much spot on.  Power level basically correlates to the number of eels you have (up to 18) so you can scale it like that.   The other options aren't bad (the sharks and the Storm Eidolon are actually rather fun) but eel-Deepkin is basically playing the game on easy mode.    You can (and will) still win games running few eels, if any, plus sharks, Eidolons, Thralls, Reavers.   The Octodude is terrible so no need to buy it.   I've never tried a turtle but imagine they are slightly more on the hard mode than the easy mode side of the sharks and Eidolons.

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3 hours ago, Gilboy said:

Pretty much spot on.  Power level basically correlates to the number of eels you have (up to 18) so you can scale it like that.   The other options aren't bad (the sharks and the Storm Eidolon are actually rather fun) but eel-Deepkin is basically playing the game on easy mode.    You can (and will) still win games running few eels, if any, plus sharks, Eidolons, Thralls, Reavers.   The Octodude is terrible so no need to buy it.   I've never tried a turtle but imagine they are slightly more on the hard mode than the easy mode side of the sharks and Eidolons.

 

Honestly the turtle is not too bad. I played two games against Ogres yesterday and both times on the charge it surprised me how much damage he could put out, taking one squad of ironguts down by half in one game single-handedly,  and put a murderhorn in the second game down to half even with 8 wounds on him while tanking so much damage. He can be good, and really the akhelian corps battalion buffs him the most. 

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