AoS 2 - Idoneth Deepkin Discussion

[Maddpainting]

How are you alpha against DoK? And when you say alpha you are talking about reverse tides correct?

[newsun]

3 hours ago, Maddpainting said:

How are you alpha against DoK? And when you say alpha you are talking about reverse tides correct?

Alpha refers to alpha striking, as in hitting first and hard. Typically this is with the goal of crippling the opponent and putting them on the back foot.

[Maddpainting]

I know what alpha is, i have tried it against DoK a few times and it never works for me, they have superior movements/DS skills and just out move/relocates on me. 

I meant to ask since it wasnt clear, How can you Alpha strike against DOK, if i give them trn 1 they just make sure to stay away and out positions me, if i go 1st i cant get them them and they will beta strike me.

It might be who i am playing, we all are compt players and he is just really good at movement/ds'ing and making sure to out position for a large hit/blowing a whole in my ranks. Its the worst match up for me.

Edited October 22, 2018 by Maddpainting

[Drofnum]

Superior movement?  6+d6" vs 14", where is their superior movement?  A lot of the scenarios also allow you to be 18" from the enemy so unless he is deploying far back you can pretty easily hit them first turn.  If he is deploying back then you just deploy a bit further back and you can use run+charge the second turn ensure you get in on turn 2.

Soulscryers can help with both deploying off the table or adding 3 to charge as well.  Really not sure where you are seeing DoK as having superior movement to Idoneth.

[Maddpainting]

Its the DS and teleporting movements then with the extra movemnts after for some units, along with the Doomfire horses, he plays a full on speedy army that can get to where it wants when it wants.

[mmimzie]

2 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:

Its the DS and teleporting movements then with the extra movemnts after for some units, along with the Doomfire horses, he plays a full on speedy army that can get to where it wants when it wants.

You cant start them off the table ID can. With 2 soul scryers that means you can hop on from a table edge with +6" to your charge range rerolling. 

 

Even failing that you can just start on the table and still utilize that +6" to your charge  along side a 14" move there are very very few situations where an ID army can't pull off a very effective charge if they'd like to. 

 

More over you could run royal court allowing you to get the effect of a sort of upgraded soul scryer. 

[Divinewish]

Hello All! I am new to AoS and have chosen the Idoneth Deepkin for my army.  I am still very new to the game and have a couple of question.
1. Does Volturnos 6+ on hist Astra Solus automatically wound with a rend of -5 or do you have to successfully make the wound roll for the 6+?

2. What Artefact do you all take on the Eidolon (either sea or storm)

3. How many eels are too many eels? Currently, my 2k list has 18 eels and I'm not sure if that is better or if a Leviadon would be worth getting.

Sorry for the questions,  still working at it

[Sergi]

8 hours ago, Divinewish said:

Hello All! I am new to AoS and have chosen the Idoneth Deepkin for my army.  I am still very new to the game and have a couple of question.
1. Does Volturnos 6+ on hist Astra Solus automatically wound with a rend of -5 or do you have to successfully make the wound roll for the 6+?

2. What Artefact do you all take on the Eidolon (either sea or storm)

3. How many eels are too many eels? Currently, my 2k list has 18 eels and I'm not sure if that is better or if a Leviadon would be worth getting.

Sorry for the questions,  still working at it

Hello!,

1. Yes, you have to roll a dice to Wound and if is successful, target have to save with -5 rend modifier ...the Wound always is done with this modifier

2.  Y like Terrornight Venom, Arcane Pearl or Sands Of Infinity

3. If you like an eels list, you can use all you want...Leviadon add cover, and melee attack and makes the opponent focus a lot on him..it is a good option.

 

 

[newsun]

10 hours ago, Divinewish said:

Hello All! I am new to AoS and have chosen the Idoneth Deepkin for my army.  I am still very new to the game and have a couple of question.
1. Does Volturnos 6+ on hist Astra Solus automatically wound with a rend of -5 or do you have to successfully make the wound roll for the 6+?

2. What Artefact do you all take on the Eidolon (either sea or storm)

3. How many eels are too many eels? Currently, my 2k list has 18 eels and I'm not sure if that is better or if a Leviadon would be worth getting.

Sorry for the questions,  still working at it

1. Yes still roll to wound

2. Ethereal amulet

3. There really isn't a too many. I run 18 as well. Need some heroes and mages for a few missions so I fill the rest with that

[Maddpainting]

Is Ethereal Amulet is part of a Realm, which Realm would it be?

I've looked over the realms many times, but there are so many its hard to remember them all and my book is at my club in my locker so i cant look  

[mmimzie]

33 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:

Is Ethereal Amulet is part of a Realm, which Realm would it be?

I've looked over the realms many times, but there are so many its hard to remember them all and my book is at my club in my locker so i cant look  

shyish the realm of death i believe

[PUFNSTUF]

On 10/8/2018 at 11:40 PM, Thankee said:

He is a friend of mine and he plays a lot! Very good player and An eel list which I think only lost 2 games ever. Against the winner tzeentch list and a mixed order list.

 

Do you happen to remember what was in the mixed order list?

[Maddpainting]

Yeah i was looking at other casters myself, after playing with 4 in Goblins and 3 in Deepkin i like casting/denying powers, but IMO Deepkin isnt very good at it, so i was going to get some spellweavers myself, as they are just to good not to take, once per game to unbind is really good.

But i was thinking of keeping 1 Tidecaster for Steed, the idea of Steed of Tides with Merc Raider (after listening to others about how to fight DoK) sounds like a very good idea.

 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Maddpainting

[valenswift]

I recently fought a 1800 point battle (Firestorm campaign) against BCR. He had to Stonehorn and 3x4 Mournfang.

I had:

King

Tidecaster

Soulrender

30 Thralls

6 Morsarr

10 Reavers

Allopex

Leviadon

 

I decided to stay out of his way as much as possible for the first two battle rounds and then smashed him in the third. Unfortunately as I'd held back he'd already secured enough VP from objectives that I couldn't catch up.

I'm looking for some strategy advice in this situation where the battleplan allows a lot of VP early on. We play casually so I don't really want to be told to get more eels.

 

[mmimzie]

8 minutes ago, valenswift said:

I recently fought a 1800 point battle (Firestorm campaign) against BCR. He had to Stonehorn and 3x4 Mournfang.

I had:

King

Tidecaster

Soulrender

30 Thralls

6 Morsarr

10 Reavers

Allopex

Leviadon

 

I decided to stay out of his way as much as possible for the first two battle rounds and then smashed him in the third. Unfortunately as I'd held back he'd already secured enough VP from objectives that I couldn't catch up.

I'm looking for some strategy advice in this situation where the battleplan allows a lot of VP early on. We play casually so I don't really want to be told to get more eels.

 

First and most importantly. Our turn 3 is amazing, but there is no reason for you to wait for turn 3 to start playing the game. A good alpha strike is very important, and as such ide advice taking a soulscryer to do. 

 

The thralls should only be in units of 10, as getting more than 10 in a fight is un realistic. 

[newsun]

I find I'm usually engaging something t1. Just need to remember AoS is all about objectives. It's more important than keeping your troops alive.

[CanHammer-darren]

Er. Why don’t people use more thralls. Just played them for first time and even a 10 man unit was putting out HURT!

[Rogue Sun]

1 hour ago, CanHammer-darren said:

Er. Why don’t people use more thralls. Just played them for first time and even a 10 man unit was putting out HURT!

5+ Save, 10 wounds, 6" move

Eels

4+ (3+ on charge), 12 wounds, 14" move

[mmimzie]

1 hour ago, CanHammer-darren said:

Er. Why don’t people use more thralls. Just played them for first time and even a 10 man unit was putting out HURT!

You are right they put out hurt. Its not that they are bad for thier points. they are quiet decent. it's just right now they dont fit in with the eels, and stand alone thralls aren't good enough to be there own army due to surface area issues. 

[CanHammer-darren]

Yea. They’re not eels. But it could be an alternative army build I reckon

 

but yea eels. Lucky I have lots of those. They do suck though when not charging haha

[mmimzie]

1 hour ago, CanHammer-darren said:

Yea. They’re not eels. But it could be an alternative army build I reckon

 

but yea eels. Lucky I have lots of those. They do suck though when not charging haha

Oh no no. So if you look like lower on page q or page 2 you can see some one made a page about this topic. 

 

Anyway its that the thrall list is kind of bad. Because on the charge you can barely only ever get 10 of those model into melee range meaning units of 20 just mean your paying double for 10 models just to get extra wounds, and having too many thralls on your side ends up ducking quick. 

 

Now you can reliably get a few more thralls into melee with the help of like 2 or 3 soul scryers. 

[Drofnum]

4 hours ago, CanHammer-darren said:

Yea. They’re not eels. But it could be an alternative army build I reckon

 

but yea eels. Lucky I have lots of those. They do suck though when not charging haha

I agree with you. Most people don't believe there is one despite no testing that I've seen really. 

[CanHammer-darren]

I didn’t really test. Was playing a casual game on stream (and batrep next week) against a new player so didn’t want to break out 20 eels. Had 3x10 thralls barebones. Against plaguebearers wiped them out easy with +1 attack. Then against drones one unit of 9 almost wiped a whole unit in one round with the 2 damage. They did so much damage to GUO. We’re pretty awesome

[Keggers]

On 10/5/2018 at 11:27 PM, Keggers said:

How are people finding Ishlaen for grabbing and holding objectives? Originally I intended to ally in 2x20 wanderers with a spellweaver to keep them alive for "my side of the board objectives." I'm willing to drop them but for their cost, it seems like they would do that job great.

If I do drop the allies, I'm looking at something like this:

IONRACH ENCLAVE
Akhelian King (240)
- General
- Command Trait : Emissary of the Deep Places
- Artefact : Cloud of Midnight
Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Sea (440)
Isharann Tidecaster (100)
Isharann Soulscryer (100)

3 x Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (140)
3 x Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (140)
3 x Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (140)
3 x Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (140)
9 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (480)

Balewind Vortex (40)

 

Leaves 40 points so I'll probably just throw a pendulum in as well.

I played 3 games with this list today. I haven't played in a few months, so I was a bit rusty on rules (game 1, forgetting that scryer could remove 3" from a charge really killed my Alpha strike -- failed a 9" charge with a 6 and rerolled to 5 ?  ).

Overall, I had a ton of fun with it. Using the Eidolon to teleport and debuff while Alpha striking the big block of eels and King worked really well. Ionrach was neat for the +1 cast/unbind but all in all, I definitely feel that rerolls from Domhain or Fuethan would've given much greater results. I'm also toying with the idea of combining two of the Ishlaen into a unit of 6 for staying power.  I got pendulum off once the entire day, only because my opponents waited to dispell it and let me cast everything else I wanted.  I'm also toying with the idea of removing 2x3 Ishlaen for 1 spellweaver, 20 eternal guard, and a burning head (more games are necessary).

I haven't played in a few months, so forgetting a few rules really hurt me, with some practice - I really see this list doing mid-tier in competitive tournies. I'm just looking to end in the upper 50% at Adepticon 2019.

Edited October 28, 2018 by Keggers

[Rogue Sun]

Hey guys, I'm building up the following list for competitive purposes and would love some feedback. Pretty straight forward, Eidolon and Ishlean start on the board and move defensively while the King and Morsarr come on in an ambush.