Joseph Mackay Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 1 hour ago, Sonnenspeer said: Rule Question: if I charge in the first round, does that unit loose the cover bonus from low tide? Yes as you don’t benefit from cover if you charge 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustAsPlanned Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 Page 100! Woooo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midjithero Posted March 2, 2021 Share Posted March 2, 2021 On 3/1/2021 at 5:31 AM, Joseph Mackay said: Yes as you don’t benefit from cover if you charge This is true, but remember Ishlann get +1 save when they charge! So if you’re charging with them, nothing really changed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Mackay Posted March 2, 2021 Share Posted March 2, 2021 4 hours ago, Midjithero said: This is true, but remember Ishlann get +1 save when they charge! So if you’re charging with them, nothing really changed ‘+1 save’ and ‘benefits of cover’ are different for rules purposes. The eels still get their +1 save from their own rule but wouldn’t get the Void Drum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimDork Posted March 2, 2021 Share Posted March 2, 2021 15 minutes ago, Joseph Mackay said: ‘+1 save’ and ‘benefits of cover’ are different for rules purposes. The eels still get their +1 save from their own rule but wouldn’t get the Void Drum Actually, they would get +1 from the void drum. The Leviadon warscroll was updated in BR:Morathi so the void drum now gives +1 to save (not cover) to friendly units with a wounds characteristic of 8 or less. So, a charging Ishlaen guard near a Leviadon will be at 2+ to save. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonnenspeer Posted March 2, 2021 Share Posted March 2, 2021 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Joseph Mackay said: ‘+1 save’ and ‘benefits of cover’ are different for rules purposes. The eels still get their +1 save from their own rule but wouldn’t get the Void Drum They still get the void drum bonus, the Warscroll of the turtle changed to +1 save - they just don't get the round 1 cover bonus. And Grim Dork is a ninja 😆 Edited March 2, 2021 by Sonnenspeer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Mackay Posted March 3, 2021 Share Posted March 3, 2021 Ah I see, got confused between the Void Drum and Low Tide rule due to an earlier question 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drazhoath Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 Yesterday I had a match against OB. I played a King, Eidolon, Leviodon, 3 Sharks, 3 units of 3 Ishlaen and 6 Morsarr. What a blast! Ok, his list was without Katakros or katapults but a lot of Morteks and Harvester. In round 3 he called the game. The shooting works very well against Harvester so that the Sharks or Morsarr kill the Morteks. But I think the combination of the Eidolon (+1 to wound), the King (rr 1 to hit) and shooting is too strong maybe? Or the mix of the Ishlean and the Turtle (2+ Save and ignore rend....heavy!) How do you deal with Katakros and Praetorians? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostfire Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 LRL can cast the Prismatic Palisade to block the line of sight of their own archers, and their leader can use the lantern to target our heros (in most cases would be Volturnos himself) and shoot him off, ignoring the Forgotten Nightmare rule. It might sound a bit weird but LRL gets this nasty trick. Dunno if anybody has talked about this one before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HollowHills Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 30 minutes ago, frostfire said: LRL can cast the Prismatic Palisade to block the line of sight of their own archers, and their leader can use the lantern to target our heros (in most cases would be Volturnos himself) and shoot him off, ignoring the Forgotten Nightmare rule. It might sound a bit weird but LRL gets this nasty trick. Dunno if anybody has talked about this one before Does anyone know if this is actually how it is meant to work? The wording on the Palisade is a bit confusing, it says "cannot see" rather than visible. Also all other rules relating to visibility mention they dont work on units which can fly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolf Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 could forgotten nightmares not be read so that our unit needs to be visible for enemy archers to target it? ie "IDK unit could only be targeted by missile weapon if it's the closest visible unit" so if a palisade blocks the sentinels completely there are no visible unit and hence no legal target for them? I would just play it so that the ignore LoS rule makes all units "visible" and hence sentinels should only be able to target the closest unit (regardless of a palisade), and I would think that also makes most sense from a rule as intended point of view Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimDork Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 1 hour ago, frostfire said: LRL can cast the Prismatic Palisade to block the line of sight of their own archers, and their leader can use the lantern to target our heros (in most cases would be Volturnos himself) and shoot him off, ignoring the Forgotten Nightmare rule. It might sound a bit weird but LRL gets this nasty trick. Dunno if anybody has talked about this one before. 52 minutes ago, HollowHills said: Does anyone know if this is actually how it is meant to work? The wording on the Palisade is a bit confusing, it says "cannot see" rather than visible. Also all other rules relating to visibility mention they dont work on units which can fly. Does seem a bit tricksy, but RAW, I think it works. Probably wouldn't even need to use PP. If you had a terrain feature you could place the sentinels completely behind so there are no units visible to them, then make 1 visible with the lantern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HollowHills Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 24 minutes ago, GrimDork said: terrain feature Thats what I mean. With terrain it doesn't work because fly units are visible regardless (assumption being idoneth have at least one flying unit closer). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimDork Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 14 minutes ago, HollowHills said: With terrain it doesn't work because fly units are visible regardless (assumption being idoneth have at least one flying unit closer). Where is that stated? I know that the Awakened Wyldwood & citadel wood have special exceptions to flying units being both visible and able to see over the woods. But does that apply to other terrain features? Like buildings? High walls etc? Rules for attacking talk about stooping to model level to check for visibility, true line of sight? Have I missed something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmill Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 Unfortunately for lumineth players this had already been faq'd a long time ago, so make sure to smile when you point out they can't do that 🤣 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocKeule Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 16 hours ago, HollowHills said: Thats what I mean. With terrain it doesn't work because fly units are visible regardless (assumption being idoneth have at least one flying unit closer). I think that is just the "overgrown" rule for terrain. Other than that visibility for flying units is not mentioned anywhere I think. We had a similar discussion in another message board few days ago and since it now it is just "line of sight" they came to the conclusion that flying units could hide behind terrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HollowHills Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 2 hours ago, Warmill said: Unfortunately for lumineth players this had already been faq'd a long time ago, so make sure to smile when you point out they can't do that 🤣 The warscroll for the wardens doesn't state it can target a non visible unit, it says it treats that unit as being visible. So I think it bypasses our faq. 1 hour ago, DocKeule said: I think that is just the "overgrown" rule for terrain. Other than that visibility for flying units is not mentioned anywhere I think. We had a similar discussion in another message board few days ago and since it now it is just "line of sight" they came to the conclusion that flying units could hide behind terrain. Yes I went and read a bit more after your post. You can the "true los" from the core rules, then the overgrown / warscroll visibility rules in the GHB and elsewhere. I'm still a bit confused by the Palisade because it doesn't say anything about visibility, it says "cannot see". Do we take that to mean the same thing? I'm kinda inclined to think lumineth can do this combo based on our discussion so far? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocKeule Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 (edited) Wow, that is a tough one. Typical case of GW ignoring their own rules while writing a new one. Edit: You could try to make sure there always is another visible unit closer to the sentinels or charge them as soon as possible to force them to should at the unit they are in melee with. Edited March 6, 2021 by DocKeule Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidsteel Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 It's interesting and from what I can see, the wording and interpretation is ambiguous and you can twist it either way. The High Warden's ability does indeed allow his unit to treat a target as being visible, however by doing so this ability is allowing them to target a unit that is not, in fact, visible. In other words, without the ability, is the target visible? The answer is no... One for the TO to rule on for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimDork Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 On 3/6/2021 at 10:13 AM, HollowHills said: I'm still a bit confused by the Palisade because it doesn't say anything about visibility, it says "cannot see". Do we take that to mean the same thing? I'm kinda inclined to think lumineth can do this combo based on our discussion so far? A good example of the lack of consistency in GW's wording. I'm leaning the way of it being possible. Not that it means anything when it comes to rules, but from a fluff perspective, if anyone can see through Idoneth's shenanigans it would be the Lumineth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolf Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 On 3/6/2021 at 11:13 AM, HollowHills said: The warscroll for the wardens doesn't state it can target a non visible unit, it says it treats that unit as being visible. So I think it bypasses our faq. Yes I went and read a bit more after your post. You can the "true los" from the core rules, then the overgrown / warscroll visibility rules in the GHB and elsewhere. I'm still a bit confused by the Palisade because it doesn't say anything about visibility, it says "cannot see". Do we take that to mean the same thing? I'm kinda inclined to think lumineth can do this combo based on our discussion so far? I too did some more reading and I would change my mind and agree this should be possible given how the sentinel rule is written. I would think of it like this. 1. a sentinel unit behind an obstacle have no legal target to shoot 2. activating the squad lead would "light up" one enemy unit, now making it a legal target, and in fact the only legal target for them to shoot at so only way for us to avoid this would be to make sure there are still other units in their LoS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStreicher Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 The whole LRL shooting is one big BS. So yeah, it works because it‘s an ability. 🤷🏼♂️ indirekt Fire should never be allowed and there is no reason to grant it to a super strong horde Archer unit with 30“ range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midjithero Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 On 3/7/2021 at 1:16 PM, JackStreicher said: The whole LRL shooting is one big BS. So yeah, it works because it‘s an ability. 🤷🏼♂️ indirekt Fire should never be allowed and there is no reason to grant it to a super strong horde Archer unit with 30“ range. Meh, the indirect fire part isn’t that bad. The MWs on 5+ to hit is the stupid part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStreicher Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Midjithero said: Meh, the indirect fire part isn’t that bad. The MWs on 5+ to hit is the stupid part. It‘s usually not a single rule that causes NPE but the stacking of several rules. MWs on 5s itself is fine. Being a Sorcerer Unit itself is fine. Indirect fire is fine. but all of it together and pretty low points for what they do, that‘s not fine. Edit: And don‘t forget, they also have Artherquarts and totally busted magic support in Teclis. Who the hell wrote the LRL books and thought they would actually improve the AoS experience. It‘s hilarious imo how busted and NPE heavy this army is. Edited March 10, 2021 by JackStreicher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidsteel Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 11 hours ago, JackStreicher said: It‘s usually not a single rule that causes NPE but the stacking of several rules. MWs on 5s itself is fine. Being a Sorcerer Unit itself is fine. Indirect fire is fine. but all of it together and pretty low points for what they do, that‘s not fine. Edit: And don‘t forget, they also have Artherquarts and totally busted magic support in Teclis. Who the hell wrote the LRL books and thought they would actually improve the AoS experience. It‘s hilarious imo how busted and NPE heavy this army is. Don't forget Lambent Light for reroll hits and Spellportal to extend the range. It's just awful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.