AoS 2 - Sylvaneth Discussion

[Mirage8112]

7 hours ago, Walkirriox said:

But that will only applies to shooting right? 
 

So in combat does it remains the same or you no longer receive cover from being wholly within that terrain?

It seems to apply for all terrain. So if you're at the edge of a single tree, and the enemy is on the other side, you should still receive the benefit of cover. 

This seems like it would work well with the new redeploy CA. Set up a group of dryads 3" behind a single tree to receive cover and block LoS. If the enemy ends their movement within 9" lining up for a charge, redeploy to move up 3" and get to the edge of the forest to maintain your cover save.

If you're in a complete wood, then the normal cover save rules still apply. 

 

7 minutes ago, Havelocke said:

I think it's a bummer, but not particularly surprising. The balewind vortex was used almost exclusively to create death star units, which is something that they are clearly trying to avoid in the new edition.

Probably a good thing. 

[Popisdead]

On 6/13/2021 at 9:24 PM, Pennydude said:

I think duplicate Warsong Revenants can be good.  Lots of magic prowess, durability, and bravery shenanigans.

Also unless I'm mistaken the bravery stacking for +10 guys is gone.  Not that you would see any unit larger than 30.  Bravery shenanigans could have some more legs now.

[Havelocke]

57 minutes ago, Mirage8112 said:

Probably a good thing. 

It's almost definitely a good thing, it's just also a good thing that makes me sad. It was a fun theory-crafting and list-building piece, but the balewind vortex was something that, almost as a rule, was not taken unless it did something broken.

 

57 minutes ago, Mirage8112 said:

It seems to apply for all terrain. So if you're at the edge of a single tree, and the enemy is on the other side, you should still receive the benefit of cover.

I think @Walkirriox was pointing out that one of the conditions for being behind terrain is being more than 3" from your attacker, so behind will never offer you a save bonus in the combat phase. Wholly within still can.

 

57 minutes ago, Mirage8112 said:

Set up a group of dryads 3" behind a single tree to receive cover and block LoS.

I read what you said on the previous page, which you referenced here, and I'm not sure I follow. Can you elaborate? My initial read on the rule is that since it says the imaginary line must pass across more than 3" of an Awakened Wyldwood, the Wyldwood needs to be at least 3" thick to block line of sight along a given path.

[Pennydude]

A single tree can’t block line of sight unless you line said tree up right down the shooting line.  It also won’t really give you cover unless it’s a single model right up against the tree trunk itself. 

Placement of a single tree just provides us the flexibility to maneuver around, spread buffs, and get more charge damage in. If we can get a 2 or 3 tree woods down, then we are looking at LoS blocking.

[Tizianolol]

Guys with new rules , one model of our wildwood with a unit of 3 KH with bows within 1" can block line of sight?

[Havelocke]

1 minute ago, Tizianolol said:

Guys with new rules , one model of our wildwood with a unit of 3 KH with bows within 1" can block line of sight?

I don't think so, and @Pennydude doesn't think so, but @Mirage8112 seems to think they can, so he might have seen something we didn't.

That being said, one model can definitely offer cover against shooting attacks.

[Tizianolol]

Mmm maybe they faq that? I honestly think new changes to our ww was amazing for us. Now with monsters that can destroy our forest and methamorphosis spell from today riveal from GW that make an hero a monster its very bad for our playstlyle. I hope they buff again wildwood or clarify  some rules! 

[a74xhx]

2 hours ago, Havelocke said:

I think it's a bummer, but not particularly surprising. The balewind vortex was used almost exclusively to create death star units, which is something that they are clearly trying to avoid in the new edition.

And also has been out of production for ages now, so yeah, not surprising really 😄

[Mirage8112]

36 minutes ago, Havelocke said:

I think @Walkirriox was pointing out that one of the conditions for being behind terrain is being more than 3" from your attacker, so behind will never offer you a save bonus in the combat phase. Wholly within still can.

Yes this is right. I realize now I was mixing a bunch of rules together because I'm trying to read and handle a baby at the same time. 

 

53 minutes ago, Havelocke said:

I don't think so, and @Pennydude doesn't think so, but @Mirage8112 seems to think they can, so he might have seen something we didn't.

That being said, one model can definitely offer cover against shooting attacks.

Re-reading the section again I'm in agreement. Cover vs shooting if the whole unit is within 1" with no attackers within 3" (although it will be tight with units larger than 5 but definitely doable). Single trees will still offer cover for units behind them, but it looks like we will need a full circle to block LoS. 

Although using redeploy to bait an enemy deeper into a wood still looks like a solid plan. 

 

25 minutes ago, Tizianolol said:

Now with monsters that can destroy our forest and methamorphosis spell from today riveal from GW that make an hero a monster its very bad for our playstlyle. I hope they buff again wildwood or clarify  some rules! 

We're definitely going to lose some WW over the course of the game, since people will be brining monsters as a rule now. Although we can only use 1 per turn and only if they can roll a 3+ (so if they did it every turn, at least one roll will fail). And all we really lose out on is the MW in the charge phase (since the LoS blocking is harder to pull off and only works on rings of trees anyway.   





 

[Wachamba]

PepeHands

[Pennydude]

1 hour ago, Tizianolol said:

Guys with new rules , one model of our wildwood with a unit of 3 KH with bows within 1" can block line of sight?

As long as you have 3" of AWW between the shooter and you, the AWW blocks line of sight.  If the base of a single AWW is perpendicular to the shooting line (like a cross), it won't block line of sight because the AWW base isn't that deep.  You don't extend to under the branches; it's only the thin base of the AWW.  Now, if you have 2 or 3 models down in an AWW, the space inbetween also counts so THEN you would be able to block line of sight more often.
 

31 minutes ago, Tizianolol said:

Mmm maybe they faq that? I honestly think new changes to our ww was amazing for us. Now with monsters that can destroy our forest and methamorphosis spell from today riveal from GW that make an hero a monster its very bad for our playstlyle. I hope they buff again wildwood or clarify  some rules! 

What would they FAQ?  The only thing monsters can do to our AWW with the new rampages is remove the warscroll abilities of blocking line of sight and charge phase damage.  The rest of our abilities that rely on AWW are keyword based and thus still work.  The only things in the game that can fully shut down our AWW 100% is the Gatebreaker Mega-Gargant's Smash Down ability and the Breaker Tribe's Breaking Down The Houses subfaction ability.

[a74xhx]

34 minutes ago, Tizianolol said:

and methamorphosis spell from today riveal

Arghh! A second thing from the core books that reuses a name from the Sylvaneth book. I thought these things were meant to be unique.

Not too worried about wood destruction - we can still teleport through destroyed ones, which I feel is the number one function for them. The rest is a bonus.  (Ok, SOB can break that too, but they are low in models)

[Tizianolol]

49 minutes ago, Pennydude said:

As long as you have 3" of AWW between the shooter and you, the AWW blocks line of sight.  If the base of a single AWW is perpendicular to the shooting line (like a cross), it won't block line of sight because the AWW base isn't that deep.  You don't extend to under the branches; it's only the thin base of the AWW.  Now, if you have 2 or 3 models down in an AWW, the space inbetween also counts so THEN you would be able to block line of sight more often.
 

What would they FAQ?  The only thing monsters can do to our AWW with the new rampages is remove the warscroll abilities of blocking line of sight and charge phase damage.  The rest of our abilities that rely on AWW are keyword based and thus still work.  The only things in the game that can fully shut down our AWW 100% is the Gatebreaker Mega-Gargant's Smash Down ability and the Breaker Tribe's Breaking Down The Houses subfaction ability.

The faq i fought is about LoS . I think 1 model only of woods shoud be able to block LoS, at moment i agree with u, we got cover but not block of LoS with a single model

[Mirage8112]

A new wrinkle!

 

Although this hasn’t been officially confirmed, it seems quite possible and interesting if true.

 

Apparently the area of a single tree includes the area between the two prongs (as if you’ve drawn a straight line between the two arms). Like so:

 
 

If that’s true that means even the small tree included in the set will block line of sight to a character behind it. Since the distance between the edge of the woods at the tree, and the imaginary line is exactly 3 inches. The largest wood however will block line of sight to an area about 4” across. Enough that you could likely get LoS blocked to a compressed 5 man unit. 
 

While single woods don’t block a lot (ie a single wood won’t shield 30 dryads), multiple single woods on the board could definitely hamper enemy fire lines and at the very least prevent 1/2 a unit from firing.    

Edited June 15, 2021 by Mirage8112

[Tizianolol]

Thats exacly what I tested on tts! Thats why i asked that question. If I put 3 hunters 1"away from bug single wood , i m 4 " far from the wood i should block Los to a unit in front of the wood!!! 😀

[Pennydude]

We will definitely need clarification for that though. If it works as you demonstrate, HELL YEAH! Until then, I think it’s wise to be more conservative.

[Arzalyn]

A interesting combination I didn't saw mentioned around here: the universal artifact Arcane Tome turn a hero into a Wizard, which lets us make Durthu a wizard. In Gnarlroot, if he is the general, he could have a D3 healing from the command trait + D6 from regrowth + D3 from Heroic recovery (if needed) and always reroll 1 to hit as he is a wizard. It's not the most reliable thing as you need to cast regrowth and not be unbound do get the first two healings, but it can be a interesting option for some fun games.

Edited June 15, 2021 by Arzalyn

[Pennydude]

@Arzalyn if we are able to get multiple artefacts, putting The Vesperal Gem on Durthu with Regrowth is an option.

[Arzalyn]

21 minutes ago, Pennydude said:

@Arzalyn if we are able to get multiple artefacts, putting The Vesperal Gem on Durthu with Regrowth is an option.

Sadly we can't, Durthu needs to have the Tome artifact to become a wizard in the first place.

[Pennydude]

18 minutes ago, Arzalyn said:

Sadly we can't, Durthu needs to have the Tome artifact to become a wizard in the first place.

[Green Tea]

I've got a couple questions, if that's alright - Is Durthu a solid model at this point? He's how I've got my treelord built at the moment.

When I do get a second one, is ancient or generic a better choice?

And finally, with the changes in wood size, is being able to place them still an issue we have? I remember that being one of our big struggles.

[Havelocke]

30 minutes ago, Green Tea said:

I've got a couple questions, if that's alright - Is Durthu a solid model at this point? He's how I've got my treelord built at the moment.

When I do get a second one, is ancient or generic a better choice?

And finally, with the changes in wood size, is being able to place them still an issue we have? I remember that being one of our big struggles.

Of course it's alright! Your first two questions are hard to answer at the moment, though, as we still don't know what the point values will be in the new edition.

Durthu has been helped out by the new heroic action and monstrous rampage rules. Particularly the healing action which has the potential to unbracket him before a crucial charge. He's also helped indirectly by the new wyldwoods (more on that in a moment). That said, he's still not quite at the level he was when he had realm artefacts available to him. Points will matter here.

For your second treelord build, I would highly recommend that you wait a month or so before making a decision, if gameplay viability is a concern. Points will matter here, too. The ancient has historically been the more competitive choice, but the ancient has been challenged for the durable caster role by the new warsong revenant, and the Treelord might benefit more from the rampage rules than the Ancient will.

If you're feeling adventurous, Treelords are pretty easy to magnetize, so you can switch between the weapon options.

Finally, we haven't seen a ton of games with the new wyldwoods rules (I haven't managed to get any games in yet, myself), but early reports are promising. The onto reports I've seen suggest that the new rules are a huge improvement to their placeability.

[Kaylethia]

@Green Tea

I've magnetized two of my three treelords.

Both have swappable weapons and heads, although I only ever use the TLA head on my third one.

Your main issue is going to be finding a pose where one of the weapon options doesn't look silly

[Walkirriox]

BTW, what happened with the old Wyldwoods we have? Can we still play 1 of them as it is almost the same size as 3 of the awakened pieces, or are they gone?

[Hoseman]

Hi all. I have a some questions that I feel here is the good place to find answers...

I played Sylvaneth when AoS started, as my 90s child army was Silvan Elfs I thought sylvaneth were the new guys. At 2.0 I started to play other armys (idoneth, cities, kharadron and some stormcast). The thing is that I have not touched my Sylvaneth in a lot of time and for this edition I wanna focus in one or two factions. 

Yesterday I was searching the app and I saw the underworlds centaur warband and the cursed city elf as part of a sylvaneth army. For sure this has been said but will we have some new units? elf units? that cursed city is for sure a wanderer, but why is with sylvaneth? I miss old silvan elfs and cities doesnt give me that feeling (dragon is not "wanderer" and so other units). And other thing I dislike about sylvaneth was the forest, and I feel surely a lot of armys will go now with the monster to break it. So, are Sylvaneth in a good point now? what is like to come with 3.0?? how is playing sylvaneth now?? 

 I own Alarielle, treelord ancient, 20 dryads, 10 tree-rev and 3 kurnoth