AoS 2 - Sylvaneth Discussion

[Trevelyan]

4 minutes ago, Pennydude said:

Just needs some clarification. 

Which bit, precisely? Quote the section that is unclear, because I'm not seeing it. 

[Pennydude]

18 minutes ago, Trevelyan said:

Which bit, precisely? Quote the section that is unclear, because I'm not seeing it. 

It's more of an interpretation.  My feeling is that with an ongoing "aura" ability like Alarielle's and TLA's, the ability could only be measured from those models (like the abilities say) because they own the ability and not the Kurnoths. 

I honestly hope that I'm 100% wrong though.

[Emissary]

7 minutes ago, Pennydude said:

It's more of an interpretation.  My feeling is that with an ongoing "aura" ability like Alarielle's and TLA's, the ability could only be measured from those models (like the abilities say) because they own the ability and not the Kurnoths. 

I honestly hope that I'm 100% wrong though.

It doesn't matter who owns the ability.  The Kurnoths have nothing do with the ability.  The Kurnoths simply make it that you are within range of the ability  if you normally would be out of it.  That's all.  Just don't overthink it.  

Hero A uses a command ability.  Unit 1 is outside of the range of the command ability but wholly within 12" of a unit of Kurnoth Hunters.  The Kurnoth Hunters then make it so that Unit 1 is being counted as though they were within range of the command ability.   It's really as simple as that.   At no point do the Kurnoth Hunters channel the command ability or do the Kurnoth Hunters act as though they are the ones using the command ability.  

[Trevelyan]

15 minutes ago, Pennydude said:

It's more of an interpretation.  My feeling is that with an ongoing "aura" ability like Alarielle's and TLA's, the ability could only be measured from those models (like the abilities say) because they own the ability and not the Kurnoths. 

I honestly hope that I'm 100% wrong though.

You are wrong. You are adding entirely new concepts like “ownership” then declaring it confusing because the rules don’t address something that you’ve made up.

It’s really as easy as adding the phrase “... or wholly within 12” of a unit of Kurnoth Hunters” to the range of any command ability.

[Pennydude]

Well sorry about that then.  My intent wasn’t to make up stuff. Just an honest question because when I brought up my interpretation of it to some of the local players, it wasn’t shot down.

[Trevelyan]

51 minutes ago, Pennydude said:

Well sorry about that then.  My intent wasn’t to make up stuff. Just an honest question because when I brought up my interpretation of it to some of the local players, it wasn’t shot down.

You don’t need to apologise. I just don’t see how you came to your interpretation from the text of those abilities. I’d genuinely like to understand, because I right now I don’t. 

[Pennydude]

Just now, Trevelyan said:

You don’t need to apologise. I just don’t see how you came to your interpretation from the text of those abilities. I’d genuinely like to understand, because I right now I don’t. 

I think it's because I'm reading that it's a constant effect that only those around the users of the ability receives.  I understand that it's a command ability but including the Kurnoths in a constant affect  just seems like a stretch for me.  You have to remain wholly within 14" of Alarielle to gain re-roll 1s to wound when you make the wound roll.  You have to remain wholly within 12" of the chosen TLA to reroll 1s to save when you make the save roll.  If the units did not have to remain under that 12"/14" restriction, I think it would work just fine.  Like I said, I hope I'm wrong but I just see it a little differently right now.  I'm a relatively new Sylvaneth player (roughly 6 months in to my wargaming career) and I really enjoy everything they bring to the table.

[Trevelyan]

I think I see. If it helps, units need to remain wholly within 12” of the Hunters to benefit - they can’t leave Hunter range and still refill any more than They could leave range of Alarielle herself. You could think of the Hunters as being like a signal booster, or relay station with a 12” broadcast range. 

[Pennydude]

If you can still measure from the Kurnoths after the activation of the ability, then yes I would agree and I 100% hope that's the correct answer.  

I'm not saying you are wrong nor me correct.  I'm gonna email GW to see if they could just clarify.  

I'm gonna try out LHW's list from the Facehammer GT soon and that doesn't use TLA or Alarielle   I do have a list I wanna try that uses the Lords of the Clan battalion alongside Gotrek.  Yea, you can't heal Gotrek with Regrowth but you sure can with the Emerald Lifeswarm.  Throw him in some woods near an objective and watch your opponent cry.

[Trevelyan]

1 hour ago, Pennydude said:

If you can still measure from the Kurnoths after the activation of the ability, then yes I would agree and I 100% hope that's the correct answer.  

There is nothing in Envoys that suggests you cannot. 

[The World Tree]

I'm glad my question about Envoys wasn't as stupid as it seemed!

Does it mean that, for example, I am always in range of the Dreadwood command ability or the generic ones?

[Trevelyan]

1 hour ago, The World Tree said:

I'm glad my question about Envoys wasn't as stupid as it seemed!

Does it mean that, for example, I am always in range of the Dreadwood command ability or the generic ones?

The basic question remains pretty strange. The fact that a handful of people are confused doesn’t make it less so - Plenty of people apparently believe the earth if flat, but that doesn’t make it a topic for serious conversation. (Not suggesting that Envoys Doubt is on a par with Flat Earthers, just highlighting that you can’t always judge the validity of a view by the number of people who share it).

But the Dreadwood ability (and others from Glades) is a valid question as it isn’t clear whether that counts as a Sylvaneth Hero using the ability. Dreadwood, for example, says that you use the command ability then measure range from a Hero.

That’s said, the text is pretty close to Ghyran’s Wrath (use the ability, measure range from a Hero with that ability) which I think we can agree must count as Alarielle using the ability, so I’m inclined to assume that the Glade abilities should be read as being used by a Hero. But I could be convinced otherwise. 

Edited October 1, 2019 by Trevelyan

[Aezeal]

3 hours ago, Trevelyan said:

The basic question remains pretty strange. The fact that a handful of people are confused doesn’t make it less so - Plenty of people apparently believe the earth if flat, but that doesn’t make it a topic for serious conversation. (Not suggesting that Envoys Doubt is on a par with Flat Earthers, just highlighting that you can’t always judge the validity of a view by the number of people who share it).

But the Dreadwood ability (and others from Glades) is a valid question as it isn’t clear whether that counts as a Sylvaneth Hero using the ability. Dreadwood, for example, says that you use the command ability then measure range from a Hero.

That’s said, the text is pretty close to Ghyran’s Wrath (use the ability, measure range from a Hero with that ability) which I think we can agree must count as Alarielle using the ability, so I’m inclined to assume that the Glade abilities should be read as being used by a Hero. But I could be convinced otherwise. 

I would agree. You pick a hero and measure from him(her) normally, now you can pick a unit within range from Hunters too.

[Ian Wallsh]

Sooooo..... 

Due to an 'accident: on Ebay, I now have a 4th Start Collecting Sylvaneth box winging it's way to me.....😁 😬 😀 

This will mean (once painted) my army will have 4 Tree Lords,  4 Branchwych, 3 Branchwraiths and 5 Revenants.... I am considering selling my Soul to Nagash (via Ebay) for an Arch Revenant........  😬 So, do you think I should do 2 Vanilla Tree Lords, and 1 Durthu /Ancient.....?   *

[Ian Wallsh]

Sorry, forgot to mention the 64 Dryads!!! 😁 😬 😀 

[Trevelyan]

64 Dryads is a good number to work with. 

I’ve got four SC boxes and went with 1x Treelord, 1x Durthu and 2x TLA so I can run a Lords of the Clan Battalion. 

[Emissary]

Personally I have 80 Dryads (units of 30, 30, 10 and 10).  Also 1 Treelord, 2 TLA and 2 Durthus.  for the extra treelord, you can't really go wrong using it for the 2nd TLA for Lords of the Clan or just a second Durthu in general.  I wouldn't build a 2nd Treelord personally.  I'd rather just have a unit of 3 Sword Hunters.

[Pennydude]

I have 2 Treelord Ancients, 1 Durthu, and 1 Treelord.  I think Lords of the Clan is actually worth trying and having multiple vanilla Treelords is a bit of a waste.  You could make one of each and then magnetize the fourth one for options!

[Ian Wallsh]

Thanks all that's great advice. I think I'll go for the 2 TLA, 1 Durthu and 1TL option... 

[Frowny]

Treelords are very easy to magnetize. It's really only the right hand.

Some might be sticklers for the head I guess but if your opponent cant tell apart the giant staff/sword/vines im not sure anything will help them

[Landohammer]

Here is a secret: Non-sylvaneth players don't know the difference between the treelords lol.

Even in a strict WYSIWYG environment, you will only need to make sure you have the right equipment (ie  Claws, Sword, or Staff.) The head/stance/loincloth/etc are just personal preferences. 

 

 

 

[Trevelyan]

11 hours ago, Landohammer said:

Here is a secret: Non-sylvaneth players don't know the difference between the treelords lol.

That varies by local player base. If I turned up to an event with a Spirit of Durthu holding a magnetised TLA staff I would expect most people playing me to ask “why is your Durthu holding a staff?”

You might get a little more leeway with the standard Treelord head vs the Ancient head (assuming people don’t miss the huge beard on the Ancient, but Durthu has a very distinctive face. 

If you are going to magnetise the right hand on a fourth model then I’d recommend building the rest of it as the type it is likely to be most often to minimise confusion. 

[velocitydog]

I've been interested in a Sylvaneth army for awhile in large part because I love the models specifically the Treelords, Branchwraiths and wyches, Hunters and dryads.  Not a fan of the tree- or sprite-revenants.  Just don't like the models much.  My question is can you build a reasonably good list (not looking for something super competitive) without the revenants?

Thanks!

[Frowny]

Yes. Absolutely. You can easily build a solid list around hunters order dryads or some of the monsters. All are strong.

If you can stomach it 1 unit of 5 revenants is amazing for objectives. People are using a lot of spites for the battalion but it isn't strictly necessary either.

[velocitydog]

Awesome, thanks!!!  I don't hate the models but just like the pure walking tree look of the others.  From what I've read they are great for objectives.