AoS 2 - Sylvaneth Discussion

[Pennydude]

4 hours ago, MrCharisma said:

Just in case you missed it, last night I recorded Faction Focus: Sylvaneth 2.0 with long standing & successful Sylvaneth tournament players: Laurie Huggett-Wilde, Chris Welfare, Dan Street & Liam Burnett-Blue. The show runs for 3.5hrs and is a deep dive into building a list, the Groves, customsing that force, and tactical advice. I know the original video was useful to many so I hope this one adds equal value...

I'll be listening to that at least once today!  I think I listened to the first one like 4 times.

[Pennydude]

So after listening to the podcast/video, I'm considering removing the 3 Kurnoths with Swords from my list and replacing with a regular Treelord for the extra teleportation and Groundbreaking Stomp.  Hopefully 12 Kurnoths would still be worth running Heartwood.  Thoughts?

[Arnied3]

I love the new stomp ability. Its incredibly useful.  I have also always liked the basic Treelord and think he is well worth it now at 200pts. Even if 3 hunters can do more i think what he brings allows for some useful combos

[azmarus]

guys,  i try create competive list, What u think? maybe Alarielle the Everqueen very high ptice ? outcast batalion ?  i fear without tree-rev,  i can't play from misson

Spoiler

Allegiance: Sylvaneth
- Glade: Winterleaf

Leaders
Alarielle the Everqueen (660)
- Deepwood Spell: Throne of Vines
Spirit of Durthu (340)
- General
- Trait: My Heart Is Ice 
- Artefact: Frozen Kernel 
Branchwraith (80)
- Artefact: The Vesperal Gem 
- Deepwood Spell: Regrowth

Battleline
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)

Units
6 x Kurnoth Hunters (400)
- Scythes
3 x Kurnoth Hunters (200)
- Scythes

Battalions
Outcasts (100)

Endless Spells / Terrain
Vengeful Skullroot (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 93
 

 

[Frowny]

It really looks like your list lack bodies. To take or hold objectives. I've also been less of a fan of durthu this time round as he is harder to get those critical +2 attacks from being near a woods. 

I might go

-3 scythe hunters (drop the small unit)

+15 revenants

You could then drop the spell for either an arch revenant or 5 tree revenants depending on if you are more worried about objectives or punch. I might also substitute drycha for durthu but that's more personal taste

[Landohammer]

I really like the outcast battallion, but I don't think its worth it on just 3 units of 5 spites. I doubt 5 Spite Revenants will even survive to a morale phase once they reach combat. So at that point you are just paying 100pts for a second magic item and a CP. 

Probably best to drop the battalion for more bodies. Preferable more Spites or Tree Revenants.

[The World Tree]

34 minutes ago, Landohammer said:

I really like the outcast battallion, but I don't think its worth it on just 3 units of 5 spites. I doubt 5 Spite Revenants will even survive to a morale phase once they reach combat. So at that point you are just paying 100pts for a second magic item and a CP. 

Probably best to drop the battalion for more bodies. Preferable more Spites or Tree Revenants.

Honestly I think that CP and artefact are worth 100. The artefacts we have are incredible and really strengthen other aspects of the army.

[Trevelyan]

10 hours ago, azmarus said:

guys,  i try create competive list, What u think? 

Honestly, I think it has problems. 

Your spending 100 points to give the Branchwraith the Vesperal Gem. But the gem doesn’t help her native summoning. So either you plan to take her just as a healbot, in which case you’re missing out on standard Branchwraith summoning, or you hope to mix and match summoning and healing, which isn’t a great idea. 

You could easily drop the small unit of hunters (Alarielle can summon them in herself) and the battalion for an arch revenant, another caster and some more battleline units. 

Im also not convinced you’re really getting mileage from Alarielle’s casting. She casts Throne, her own spell and you’ve got one endless spell. If no one dispels the endless spell then by the next turn she doesn’t have anything significant to cast. Having Alarielle cast Throne to buff a shield seems redundant. 

[Aezeal]

49 minutes ago, Trevelyan said:

Honestly, I think it has problems. 

Your spending 100 points to give the Branchwraith the Vesperal Gem. But the gem doesn’t help her native summoning. So either you plan to take her just as a healbot, in which case you’re missing out on standard Branchwraith summoning, or you hope to mix and match summoning and healing, which isn’t a great idea. 

You could easily drop the small unit of hunters (Alarielle can summon them in herself) and the battalion for an arch revenant, another caster and some more battleline units. 

Im also not convinced you’re really getting mileage from Alarielle’s casting. She casts Throne, her own spell and you’ve got one endless spell. If no one dispels the endless spell then by the next turn she doesn’t have anything significant to cast. Having Alarielle cast Throne to buff a shield seems redundant. 

Summon trees.

[Pennydude]

22 minutes ago, Aezeal said:

Summon trees.

If you are referring to the Branchwraith summoning trees, the Vesperal Gem will not help.  Verdant Blessing is not a part of the Lore of the Deepwood so you cannot use the Gem for the auto-cast.  For the most reliable way to get trees down, run Gnarlroot and give the Branchwraith the special artefact Chalice of Nectar.

[Trevelyan]

9 hours ago, Aezeal said:

Summon trees.

She could, but again that’s not something I see an opportunity for on a regular basis in competitive games and Azmarus said this is supposed to be a competitive list. Turn 1 or 2, perhaps but after that no one will be reliably summoning trees because they won’t be able to guarantee the space. A competent opponent will block off space.  Maybe she can still summon trees in less opportune places, but that’s not a great use of Alarielle plus Throne either. 

[Xil]

Is it legal to play 2 glades in one army? 

[Frowny]

1 hour ago, Xil said:

Is it legal to play 2 glades in one army? 

No.

[azmarus]

thx 4 advice  !  

imho  kurnoth hunter top sylvaneth unit and try maximaize in list, 

alariel + brachwraith dryad generator

i think throne need only for alariel. She have 3 casts and nice scroll spell.  in 1 turn she cast throne - wood - (scroll cast/world cast/ rr1 save), second  she take center or nice position and stack throne +2 +2 +2 destroy heroes or key target metamorfosice +  d3 arcane bolt or world spell or cast wood.

i will try  this list  )

Spoiler

Allegiance: Sylvaneth
- Glade: Winterleaf

Leaders
Spirit of Durthu (340)
- General
- Trait: My Heart Is Ice 
- Artefact: Frozen Kernel 
Alarielle the Everqueen (660)
- Deepwood Spell: Throne of Vines
Branchwraith (80)
- Deepwood Spell: Regrowth
Branchwraith (80)
- Deepwood Spell: Verdurous Harmony

Battleline
5 x Tree-Revenants (80)
5 x Tree-Revenants (80)
5 x Tree-Revenants (80)

Units
6 x Kurnoth Hunters (400)
- Scythes
3 x Kurnoth Hunters (200)
- Greatswords

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 98

or more spell

Spoiler

Allegiance: Sylvaneth
- Glade: Winterleaf

Leaders
Spirit of Durthu (340)
- General
- Trait: My Heart Is Ice 
- Artefact: Frozen Kernel 
Alarielle the Everqueen (660)
- Deepwood Spell: Throne of Vines
Branchwraith (80)
- Deepwood Spell: Regrowth
Branchwraith (80)
- Deepwood Spell: Verdurous Harmony

Battleline
5 x Tree-Revenants (80)
5 x Tree-Revenants (80)
20 x Dryads (200)

Units
6 x Kurnoth Hunters (400)
- Scythes

Endless Spells / Terrain
Spiteswarm Hive (50)
Gladewyrm (30)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 98
 

 

Edited August 15, 2019 by azmarus

[Pennydude]

Made some modifications to my list for this Saturday's 2000pt tournament.

Allegiance: Sylvaneth
- Glade: Gnarlroot

LEADERS
Treelord Ancient (300)
- General
- Command Trait : Nurtured by Magic
- Artefact : Spiritsong Stave
- Deepwood Spell : Verdurous Harmony
Branchwraith (80)
- Artefact : Chalice of Nectar
- Deepwood Spell : Regrowth
Drycha Hamadreth (320)
- Deepwood Spell : Regrowth

UNITS
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)
3 x Kurnoth Hunters (200)
- Greatbows
3 x Kurnoth Hunters (200)
- Greatbows
6 x Kurnoth Hunters (400)
- Scythes

BEHEMOTHS
Treelord (200)

BATTALIONS
Outcasts (100)

TOTAL: 1980/2000 EXTRA COMMAND POINTS: 1 WOUNDS: 114
LEADERS: 3/6 BATTLELINES: 3 (3+) BEHEMOTHS: 3/4 ARTILLERY: 0/4
ARTEFACTS: 2/2 ALLIES: 0/400

[Craze]

Good luck for the tournament!

I am kind of in a tough spot right now. I have the feeling that our new BT gives us so many options that all seem to be at least ok, if not super strong, which makes it really tough for me to decide what I want to play as a "main" loadout.

Of course Winterleaf seems to be the "punchiest" Glade with potentially insane output from Durthu/Hunters. But apart from the output superiority of Winterleaf I think there are at least 3 Glades that look - at least on paper - really good.

• Gnarlroot gives nice bonuses, especially the Chalice really helps with Dryad summoning and the rerolls are really strong on verious Units (e.g. Drycha)
• Harvestboon also has a nice punch and I guess "Seek new fruit" is the thing I like best in the whole book (not power wise, but for "style" reasons)
• Dreadwood as a mobility Glade + S-Rev heavy list, could also be really good.

I am really torn right now. What Glade do you guys like best and what do you see as strengths/weaknesses of the particular Glades?

[Arnied3]

Kinda feeling the same as you @Craze alot of good options in the book and its very hard to justify not taking a glade. The new traits and artifacts are awesome but you really need to squeeze in a battalion to use them now if you are taking a glade.

I've played winterleaf and gnarlroot and love them both for the different styles of play. 

I like Harvestboon for the same reason as you and will try to use it in my next game. Durthu with seek new fruit its just so appealing! add on something that gives a buff to charging or extra attacks and you have a thing of beauty. 

 

Best of luck @Pennydude!

[Landohammer]

7 hours ago, Craze said:

Good luck for the tournament!

I am kind of in a tough spot right now. I have the feeling that our new BT gives us so many options that all seem to be at least ok, if not super strong, which makes it really tough for me to decide what I want to play as a "main" loadout.

Of course Winterleaf seems to be the "punchiest" Glade with potentially insane output from Durthu/Hunters. But apart from the output superiority of Winterleaf I think there are at least 3 Glades that look - at least on paper - really good.

• Gnarlroot gives nice bonuses, especially the Chalice really helps with Dryad summoning and the rerolls are really strong on verious Units (e.g. Drycha)
• Harvestboon also has a nice punch and I guess "Seek new fruit" is the thing I like best in the whole book (not power wise, but for "style" reasons)
• Dreadwood as a mobility Glade + S-Rev heavy list, could also be really good.

I am really torn right now. What Glade do you guys like best and what do you see as strengths/weaknesses of the particular Glades?

As I mentioned before: When in doubt, take Winterleaf. It makes every single unit in the army better, and doesn't rely on CP.  

As a fan of Spites and teleporting, Dreadwood is also really solid. But its unfortunate that it doesn't buff Spites more. As it currently stands, Winterleaf Spites out-perform Dreadwood Spites, and the Frozen Kernel is probably one of the best (if not THE best) artefact in our book. 

 

[Pennydude]

58 minutes ago, Arnied3 said:

Best of luck @Pennydude!

Thank you!  I'm still torn between Treelord and 3 Sword-noths.  If my wyldwoods get shut down, my Treelord becomes much worse than Sword-noths since it can teleport on its own.   I'm wondering if I'm putting too much stock in that ability and the stomp over the resiliency of Swords.  Having more Kurnoths means I can run them next to Drycha to grant the TLA's  command ability to make Drycha not as squishy.   Any suggestions?

[Sethiris]

Hey guys! 

I have most of my list figured out for an upcoming tournament, and I'd love  some feedback on it.

 

So I have a few options for the remaining 350 points.

Option 1: Sprit of Durthu with an artefact of choice, such as Greenglade Gladius, Ghyrstrike, Thermalrider Cloak or Ethereal Amulet

Option 2:  More spite revenants (20 + 20 + 5 instead) and a Treelord. And give the Vesperal Gem to the Branchwych for auto-heals of d6+d3.

Option 3: 5 more spite revenants (20+10+5), a Treelord and another Branchwraith who will be general instead. Then I can give the Branchwych throne of vines and combo it with Balewind Vortex for an increasingly powerful Wychbomb (more of a gimmick I suppose?)

Option 4: Something else, like more endless spells?

 

A cool thing that I noticed about the Balewind Vortex is that you can summon it inside the Awakened Wyldwood and it won't be dispellable by your opponent (dispelling requires line of sight) So it will let me use the Chalice to cast two spells on the Branchwraith (Verdant Blessing and the summoning for instance)

 

Thoughts?

 

Spoiler

Allegiance: Sylvaneth
- Glade: Gnarlroot
Alarielle the Everqueen (660)
- Deepwood Spell: Throne of Vines
Drycha Hamadreth (320)
- Deepwood Spell: Verdurous Harmony
Branchwych (80)
- General
- Trait: Nurtured by Magic 
- Deepwood Spell: Regrowth
Branchwraith (80)
- Artefact: Chalice of Nectar 
- Deepwood Spell: Throne of Vines
20 x Spite-Revenants (200)
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)
5 x Spite-Revenants (60)
Outcasts (100)
Spiteswarm Hive (50)
Balewind Vortex (40)

Total: 1650 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 66

 

[Heksagon]

On 8/16/2019 at 4:26 PM, Sethiris said:

A cool thing that I noticed about the Balewind Vortex is that you can summon it inside the Awakened Wyldwood and it won't be dispellable by your opponent (dispelling requires line of sight) So it will let me use the Chalice to cast two spells on the Branchwraith (Verdant Blessing and the summoning for instance) 

Unfortunately you also need a line of sight for the most of our spells, including Verdant Blessing.

[Pennydude]

@Heksagon Verdant Blessing does not require line of sight so you can have a caster in one Wyldwood and have them place another. Just has to be wholly within 24” and more than 1” from everything.

If you want to play hide-and-seek with that wizard, consider using Umbral Spellportals.

[Heksagon]

9 hours ago, Pennydude said:

@Heksagon Verdant Blessing does not require line of sight so you can have a caster in one Wyldwood and have them place another. Just has to be wholly within 24” and more than 1” from everything.

If you want to play hide-and-seek with that wizard, consider using Umbral Spellportals.

Oh. Woops. Sorry, I was mistaken.

I ws sure it does, so... This changes a lot.

[Trevelyan]

It doesn’t change that much. Most other spells do require LoS, and while adding 6” to the Wyldwood summon range is nice, wholly within 30” of a model bunkered back in a safe zone (assuming your opponent doesn’t have anything to render that zone less safe) is far less flexible than it sounds. You’re investing a lot of points into that trick for potentially very limited payoff given that any caster more than 6” away from the vortex (i.e. every other caster you’ve got) can cast the same summon in more places. 

It’s not nothing, but it is a classic case of a trick that is almost certainly far better in theory than in practice and you likely don’t gain enough benefit from the Vortex once the whole engine is running to justify the cost of taking it. 

If you set aside the whole “wouldn’t it be nice to be sitting in a wyldwood on a Balewind Vortex with Throne of Vines up and consistently summoning new Wyldwoods and Dryads” and think about the practical issues, the cracks start to show. You need a round or two to set it up - Vortex gives you an extra cast, but you still want to cast Throne of Vines and be summoning Dryads as often as possible, plus summon the Vortex itself. What’s the plan to get it all up and running in a timeframe where you really benefit? You might be able to invest in even more support to further increase your casting rate, but that ups the cost considerably. 

[Emissary]

1 hour ago, Trevelyan said:

It doesn’t change that much. Most other spells do require LoS, and while adding 6” to the Wyldwood summon range is nice, wholly within 30” of a model bunkered back in a safe zone (assuming your opponent doesn’t have anything to render that zone less safe) is far less flexible than it sounds. You’re investing a lot of points into that trick for potentially very limited payoff given that any caster more than 6” away from the vortex (i.e. every other caster you’ve got) can cast the same summon in more places. 

It’s not nothing, but it is a classic case of a trick that is almost certainly far better in theory than in practice and you likely don’t gain enough benefit from the Vortex once the whole engine is running to justify the cost of taking it. 

If you set aside the whole “wouldn’t it be nice to be sitting in a wyldwood on a Balewind Vortex with Throne of Vines up and consistently summoning new Wyldwoods and Dryads” and think about the practical issues, the cracks start to show. You need a round or two to set it up - Vortex gives you an extra cast, but you still want to cast Throne of Vines and be summoning Dryads as often as possible, plus summon the Vortex itself. What’s the plan to get it all up and running in a timeframe where you really benefit? You might be able to invest in even more support to further increase your casting rate, but that ups the cost considerably. 

If you take 2 branchwraiths, the first can cast the vortex and then throne, while the other summons the dryads.  Then the vortex one can summon the dryads and throne/woods after that while the other branchwraith wanders off to cast another spell.   A lot of my lists run 2 branchwraiths anyway, 1 to cast throne first turn and one to summon dryads, then switch and the throne one cast dryads after while the other is free for summoning trees or bringing back hunters.  Honestly though, I'd rather just take the relic that lets the branchwraith cast twice, so that you can thrones then summon every turn, or summon dryads then trees rather than fiddle with the vortex.  The vortex is more for a branchwych IMO.

Edited August 18, 2019 by Emissary