AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion

[Congratz]

I can't find Beast of Chaos on the shop.... where is it?

[Kalus]

2 hours ago, Congratz said:

I can't find Beast of Chaos on the shop.... where is it?

 

Appears to be some rearranging going on. Beasts of Chaos have returned.

[Popisdead]

On 12/4/2018 at 3:58 AM, The_Yellow_Sign said:

Why would you run Dragon Ogres without a Shaggoth? It's like running Enlightened/Skyfires without a Tzaangor Shaman. 

Even if you're not using Dragon Ogres, Shaggoth is arguably the best hero in Beasts of Chaos, and has the best command trait: Ancient Without Knowing. He's worth taking just for that trait. 

Sure but that doesn't mean he will always be in command range for the re-rolls.  I believe it is close range.

On 12/4/2018 at 12:08 PM, Ben said:

Is anyone playing any lists with 200 Ungor?  

I've started writing some twists and it seems to be a solid option.  200 points for 40.  5 units.  Might seem spammy but it would be quick and easy to push them around the table.

The other 1000 points would need to do the heavy lifting but sheer weight of numbers should be hard to deal with.  

Has anyone played a full horde???

The AoS group creator on FB Larry Barbra is a champion of 200 Ungors and has been for a couple years.   I don't know if he has an account here; I suspect he does.

[SwampHeart]

19 minutes ago, Popisdead said:

Sure but that doesn't mean he will always be in command range for the re-rolls.  I believe it is close range.

Wholly within 12" - assuming you're running a single unit of Dragon Ogres its not too hard to keep them in range of the Shaggoth. If you were running multiple units it would be tough though. Even with a Shaggoth I only run one unit (of 6 personally). 

[Myrdin]

So me and my buddy are preparing for a 2v2 against dual SCE armies. 

Each players brings 1500 pts Vanguard army. Since its a friendly match up, we dont care about what Grand Alliances they are from.

He wants to bring his old (and very cool ! I hope they get an actual battle tome as I would love to start this army) Empire and I will bring my beasties. He does have Skaven (But he has no Hell Pit Abom omg squeek!) as his second army, but we wanted to try this "super Lore non friendly" setup first

The list I am considering:

Spoiler

 

Shaggoth - general,  3+ Save, and Azyrite Blade. Sundering blades / Hailstorm

2x Shaman - Wild Rampage each

1x6 Dragon Ogers - cleavers

1x10 Ungors

2x10 Bestigors

2x5 Centigors

1x Chimera 

1x3 Enlightened on Disc

 

 

This is quite the light body count list, but has some very fast units to run and get objectives while presenting multiple threats and one pretty darn solid wall of Dragon Ogors  to buy all the time in the world.

My buddy will be bringing a core of:

Spoiler

 

1x General standard Commander to keep the whole core of the army ignoring Battleshock, 

1x Hero with lance on horse Accompanying the Chocobos

2x20 gunners, 

1x 30 block of swordsmen with sword & shields

2x10 Greatswords

1x6 Chocobo riders

1x Hellblaster Wolley gun

....Or something like this.

 

 

The idea is that my fast agile, fluffy and absolutely peaceful Beastmen, will ..... rush forward and smash face ROAAAAAR !!!!

Ok srsly now   My army is made to surge forward, grab and contest objective and try Alpha striking as many targets of opportunity as possible. This should buy his army 1 turn to move forward and redeploy all his forces, so that from turn 2 onwards they can start peppering enemy units with lead.  And from what I remember playing against this army, their shooting - if allowed to deploy and stay put, is quite devastating. 

Ideally I want him to be within the range of the Herdstone so that if his units are charged by the high Armor SCE stuff, the herdstone start chipping at their saves, while his guns and Volley gun will add an additional -1 to that, pretty much tearing through the normally sturdy units with ease. 

I have not yet decided on the Shaggoths spell. I think Sundering Blades is a solid pick, but Hailstorm, if used correctly can be amazing. As for the build, Since this Shaggoth will run forward with his Dragon ogor retinue he is kitted out for war, rather than support. Maybe not the most optimal of traits and items but it does serve a specific purpose.

 

EDIT: Damn and of course I forgot to pose the question itself - What do you guys think about this ? 

With all the information about both of our armies, do you think there should be some other aspect that should be looked at ? I do have low body count, and that is something that worries me. And I dont trust the Chimera to live past 2 turns, heck maybe it will die from SCE shooting even in the first one, so those 240 pts do feel a bit .... "ouch" and possibly better spent  elsewhere.

Edited December 11, 2018 by Myrdin

[Popisdead]

On 12/10/2018 at 8:01 AM, SwampHeart said:

Wholly within 12" - assuming you're running a single unit of Dragon Ogres its not too hard to keep them in range of the Shaggoth. If you were running multiple units it would be tough though. Even with a Shaggoth I only run one unit (of 6 personally). 

Um... Okay.  

 

[The_Yellow_Sign]

5 hours ago, Myrdin said:

So me and my buddy are preparing for a 2v2 against dual SCE armies. 

Each players brings 1500 pts Vanguard army. Since its a friendly match up, we dont care about what Grand Alliances they are from.

He wants to bring his old (and very cool ! I hope they get an actual battle tome as I would love to start this army) Empire and I will bring my beasties. He does have Skaven (But he has no Hell Pit Abom omg squeek!) as his second army, but we wanted to try this "super Lore non friendly" setup first

The list I am considering:

  Hide contents

 

Shaggoth - general,  3+ Save, and Azyrite Blade. Sundering blades / Hailstorm

2x Shaman - Wild Rampage each

1x6 Dragon Ogers - cleavers

1x10 Ungors

2x10 Bestigors

2x5 Centigors

1x Chimera 

1x3 Enlightened on Disc

 

 

This is quite the light body count list, but has some very fast units to run and get objectives while presenting multiple threats and one pretty darn solid wall of Dragon Ogors  to buy all the time in the world.

My buddy will be bringing a core of:

  Hide contents

 

1x General standard Commander to keep the whole core of the army ignoring Battleshock, 

1x Hero with lance on horse Accompanying the Chocobos

2x20 gunners, 

1x 30 block of swordsmen with sword & shields

2x10 Greatswords

1x6 Chocobo riders

1x Hellblaster Wolley gun

....Or something like this.

 

 

The idea is that my fast agile, fluffy and absolutely peaceful Beastmen, will ..... rush forward and smash face ROAAAAAR !!!!

Ok srsly now   My army is made to surge forward, grab and contest objective and try Alpha striking as many targets of opportunity as possible. This should buy his army 1 turn to move forward and redeploy all his forces, so that from turn 2 onwards they can start peppering enemy units with lead.  And from what I remember playing against this army, their shooting - if allowed to deploy and stay put, is quite devastating. 

Ideally I want him to be within the range of the Herdstone so that if his units are charged by the high Armor SCE stuff, the herdstone start chipping at their saves, while his guns and Volley gun will add an additional -1 to that, pretty much tearing through the normally sturdy units with ease. 

I have not yet decided on the Shaggoths spell. I think Sundering Blades is a solid pick, but Hailstorm, if used correctly can be amazing. As for the build, Since this Shaggoth will run forward with his Dragon ogor retinue he is kitted out for war, rather than support. Maybe not the most optimal of traits and items but it does serve a specific purpose.

 

EDIT: Damn and of course I forgot to pose the question itself - What do you guys think about this ? 

With all the information about both of our armies, do you think there should be some other aspect that should be looked at ? I do have low body count, and that is something that worries me. And I dont trust the Chimera to live past 2 turns, heck maybe it will die from SCE shooting even in the first one, so those 240 pts do feel a bit .... "ouch" and possibly better spent  elsewhere.

I'd suggest you drop the Chimera and bring that unit of Enlightened up to 6. Also drop one shaman for a Tzaangor Shaman, since +1 hit is huge and he's the best caster in the army. Lastly, put a defensive artefact like Gryph-Feather charm or Doppelganger cloak on the Shaggoth so he doesn't die in one turn. He doesn't have a great profile for offensive artefacts anyway.

[Amradiel]

So, been wondering if Beasts of Chaos has started to show up at bigger events yet? And how they are doing? I want to build a rather competitive army but have no idea what works and not yet. 

[The_Yellow_Sign]

2 minutes ago, Amradiel said:

So, been wondering if Beasts of Chaos has started to show up at bigger events yet? And how they are doing? I want to build a rather competitive army but have no idea what works and not yet. 

I believe the guy from Doom and Darkness is taking them to Cancon in January, which will be the biggest AoS tournament ever played.

[SwampHeart]

34 minutes ago, Amradiel said:

So, been wondering if Beasts of Chaos has started to show up at bigger events yet? And how they are doing? I want to build a rather competitive army but have no idea what works and not yet. 

We haven't really seen them yet - but that tends to be the case with AoS. The meta is slow to develop as people work through painting (and sometimes the pain of just acquiring the models), and testing the list. They have been to a few events but with poor showings - that said I think most of that comes down to poor lists. 

[Amradiel]

32 minutes ago, The_Yellow_Sign said:

I believe the guy from Doom and Darkness is taking them to Cancon in January, which will be the biggest AoS tournament ever played.

Yeah I have been checking out the battle reports posted by him on youtube but have a hard time telling if the lists are competitive or not. 

[The_Yellow_Sign]

4 minutes ago, Amradiel said:

Yeah I have been checking out the battle reports posted by him on youtube but have a hard time telling if the lists are competitive or not. 

He placed 5th in the Sydney GT with a mixed chaos list, so he definitely knows what he's doing. He also qualified for the Australian Masters tournament this year, but couldn't go because it was his son's birthday.

[Myrdin]

11 hours ago, The_Yellow_Sign said:

I'd suggest you drop the Chimera and bring that unit of Enlightened up to 6. Also drop one shaman for a Tzaangor Shaman, since +1 hit is huge and he's the best caster in the army. Lastly, put a defensive artefact like Gryph-Feather charm or Doppelganger cloak on the Shaggoth so he doesn't die in one turn. He doesn't have a great profile for offensive artefacts anyway.

I want to avoid going with 6 enlightened, as they are sort of an auto include in my lists anyway, and I wanted to lay them off for a moment. Thats small unit of 3 is more of an opportunistic hero chaser, archers eater than an actual serious threat.

As for The Tzaan shaman, I dont have him built up yet so and I want to start moving away from proxying units with empty. But yeah, it seems that chimera is not a good choice, as much as I want to see a monster of that caliber of murderification on the table

[peasant]

hi! one doubt about our slaaneh battallion, do we have rerrolls Against special characters like nagash?

 

thx in.advance!

[SwampHeart]

3 hours ago, peasant said:

hi! one doubt about our slaaneh battallion, do we have rerrolls Against special characters like nagash?

 

thx in.advance!

We do not - per the FAQ those characters don't have artifacts. 

[Satyrical Sophist]

I'm a lunatic and have been converting my own centigors, pretty pleased with them. Figured I'd try chariots next. One problem I've been having is getting the bases for chariots (somewhat for centigors as well, but I'll have a fair few from the boars for the chariots), the only source seems to be £3 from GW direct, which seems pretty pricey. 

On a gaming front, anyone tried chariots much? I want to try them in both nurgle and khorne lists for different reasons. For nurgle they are a cheap fast unit that takes advantage of the battalion bonus and for khorne I think they are one of the cheapest sources of blood tithe points (other than spawn, which are considerably reliable). 

For nurgle the centigors also work well with blades of putrefaction (since they have a native hit bonus and 4 attacks each) and are very very fast. (14 + 3 + d6+1 + 2d6 for an expected 28.5 charge).

[Myrdin]

3 hours ago, Satyrical Sophist said:

I'm a lunatic and have been converting my own centigors, pretty pleased with them. Figured I'd try chariots next. One problem I've been having is getting the bases for chariots (somewhat for centigors as well, but I'll have a fair few from the boars for the chariots), the only source seems to be £3 from GW direct, which seems pretty pricey. 

On a gaming front, anyone tried chariots much? I want to try them in both nurgle and khorne lists for different reasons. For nurgle they are a cheap fast unit that takes advantage of the battalion bonus and for khorne I think they are one of the cheapest sources of blood tithe points (other than spawn, which are considerably reliable). 

For nurgle the centigors also work well with blades of putrefaction (since they have a native hit bonus and 4 attacks each) and are very very fast. (14 + 3 + d6+1 + 2d6 for an expected 28.5 charge).

Ebay is your friend.
Or you can check Back to Base.

MDF bases are cheep and tend to come in bigger amounts that what GW sells. But on ebay you can get even the usual plastic ones for good price as the bases are not IP protected and there are dozens of companies that produce cheap plastic, mdf, resin, etc bases.

Just this week I picked up 200  25mm round bases from Aliexpress for 21 bucks, soooooo..... yeah, you know, look around and you`ll find what you are looking for.

[Amradiel]

Which units would you call competitive? Even if it just a theory. 

[The_Yellow_Sign]

3 minutes ago, Amradiel said:

Which units would you call competitive? Even if it just a theory. 

If you're running them in Beasts of Chaos, I'd say Tzaangor Shaman, Shaggoth, Bray Shaman, Enlightened (on foot or disc), Skyfires, Tzaangors, Bestigors, Ungors, Ungor Raiders, Centigors, Dragon Ogres. Then for filler or specialized purposes you can find the following useful in certain lists: Razorgors, Warhounds, Chariots.

[Myrdin]

1 hour ago, The_Yellow_Sign said:

If you're running them in Beasts of Chaos, I'd say Tzaangor Shaman, Shaggoth, Bray Shaman, Enlightened (on foot or disc), Skyfires, Tzaangors, Bestigors, Ungors, Ungor Raiders, Centigors, Dragon Ogres. Then for filler or specialized purposes you can find the following useful in certain lists: Razorgors, Warhounds, Chariots.

Just to add onto what  Yellow_Sign said > General Chaos players also seem to favor the Chimera as it got quite substantial buff (+1 attack for each head and +2A for its claws). But I dont have any experience with it yet, so I am only repeating what I heard from other Chaos players in the area.

As far as FW stuff is considered Skin Wolves seem to be a very, very strong pick as well.

Personally I think I will bring a unit of 6 for my 2v2 instead of the Chimera and some other stuff and see how they perform. (its open play game with quite benevolently bent Allies rules as one of the guys doesnt have enough stuff for his army, thus I can take allies over the set limit as well. )

@The_Yellow_Sign

I didnt know realms have Artefacts ! :O  and WOW are they OP !! 

You just changed my world   (we never used to define realms when gaming, so thats why I never knew)

Edited December 13, 2018 by Myrdin

[Amradiel]

10 hours ago, The_Yellow_Sign said:

If you're running them in Beasts of Chaos, I'd say Tzaangor Shaman, Shaggoth, Bray Shaman, Enlightened (on foot or disc), Skyfires, Tzaangors, Bestigors, Ungors, Ungor Raiders, Centigors, Dragon Ogres. Then for filler or specialized purposes you can find the following useful in certain lists: Razorgors, Warhounds, Chariots.

I have 3 start collecting boxes, 3 boxes of Enlightened, 2 chaos spawns, 1 Beastlord, 1 Shaggoth, 1 Tzaangor Shaman and 1 Herdstone so far. Planning on buying more Ungors.

[Kazimer]

For Brass Despoilers, should I absolutely go for Beastlord if I am running Bestigors and Gors, or can I run a Doombull just for the pure damage output of the beast?

[Kaleb Daark]

5 minutes ago, Kazimer said:

For Brass Despoilers, should I absolutely go for Beastlord if I am running Bestigors and Gors, or can I run a Doombull just for the pure damage output of the beast?

I'd go doombull because... Doombull

 

Edited December 13, 2018 by Kaleb Daark

[Skoll]

a beastlord with the mutated gnarlblade has more damage output than a doombull, so if you are going for all bestigors to begin  with i'd say keep the theme

[Kazimer]

What if I play the Despoilers as a section of a Blades of Khorne army? Can I still take a BoC relic?