kenshin620 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 Yea it is actually surprising how (mostly) balanced weapon options are, usually. Even Sequitors flat out gaining one extra attack from swords I hear from some mathhammer posts only barely get extra wounds (but this does change once you start involving positive modifiers). Chaos Marauders are similar. Mathhammer will say axes>flails, but only just by a bit. Sure that bit could be the difference between killing nagash and not killing him, but I think in most casual games it would be a preference thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 20 minutes ago, kenshin620 said: Yea it is actually surprising how (mostly) balanced weapon options are, usually. Even Sequitors flat out gaining one extra attack from swords I hear from some mathhammer posts only barely get extra wounds (but this does change once you start involving positive modifiers). Chaos Marauders are similar. Mathhammer will say axes>flails, but only just by a bit. Sure that bit could be the difference between killing nagash and not killing him, but I think in most casual games it would be a preference thing. 12.5% more wounds with axes when compared to flails. In perspective, that's roughly 3 extra saves the enemy has to make for every 100 attacks you dish out. So 1 wound on archaon for every 100 attacks your marauders do. Probably not going to change much in the long run! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 While they mathematically perform very similar on average, the spears have a 50% higher ceiling assuming a 3rd equal rank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandzak-Miniatures Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 35 minutes ago, AverageBoss said: While they mathematically perform very similar on average, the spears have a 50% higher ceiling assuming a 3rd equal rank. Spears also look great! And the ungors will inevitably die horribly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Hi all fellow Beasties! I have no idea , as you can see from my list , but this is what I am rebasing from my old army. Then I'll see how it goes. Any suggestions on what spells might be worth taking ? Any other tweaks to get off to a good start ? Allegiance: Beasts Of Chaos - Greatfray: Darkwalkers Mortal Realm: Ghur Leaders Dragon Ogor Shaggoth (180) - General - Trait: Nomadic Leader - Artefact: Desolate Shard - Lore of Dark Storms: Hailstorm Great Bray Shaman (100) - Lore of the Twisted Wilds: Viletide Great Bray Shaman (100) - Lore of the Twisted Wilds: Vicious Stranglethorns Battleline 20 x Gors (160) - Gor-Blades & Beastshields 10 x Ungors (60) - Shortspears & Half-Shields 10 x Ungors (60) - Shortspears & Half-Shields Units 6 x Bullgors (320) - Pairs of Axes 2 x Razorgors (80) 1 x Tuskgor Chariots (60) 1 x Tuskgor Chariots (60) 1 x Tuskgor Chariots (60) 20 x Bestigors (240) 20 x Ungor Raiders (160) Behemoths Chaos Gargant (180) Chaos Gargant (180) Total: 2000 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 174 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 So in terms of potential janky lists, what does everyone think of a desolating herd darkstalker list with 3 ambushing cygors and the brayblast trumpet to assassinate key wizards turn 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevlar1972 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 2 hours ago, decker_cky said: So in terms of potential janky lists, what does everyone think of a desolating herd darkstalker list with 3 ambushing cygors and the brayblast trumpet to assassinate key wizards turn 1? Cygors aren't brayherd so the trumpet won't affect them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Forgot that desolating beastherd is only 0-1 Cygors too. Still, I think a pile of cygors ambushing could be uncomfortable for a lot of lists that rely on 1-2 key wizards - even if you just soften them, it makes the cygor dispel wounds a greater threat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Yellow_Sign Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 5 hours ago, decker_cky said: Forgot that desolating beastherd is only 0-1 Cygors too. Still, I think a pile of cygors ambushing could be uncomfortable for a lot of lists that rely on 1-2 key wizards - even if you just soften them, it makes the cygor dispel wounds a greater threat. I think Raiders are better at killing wizards, and cheaper than 2 Cygors. With the trumpet they put out around 17 wounds before saves in a group of 40. Desolating Beastherd makes them even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracothjay Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 15 minutes ago, The_Yellow_Sign said: I think Raiders are better at killing wizards, and cheaper than 2 Cygors. With the trumpet they put out around 17 wounds before saves in a group of 40. Desolating Beastherd makes them even better. Raiders are insane. I used just a unit of 30 in a 1K game last night. They killed 3 wrathmongers, khorne lord on jugganaut and some blood warriors. They helped so damn much, and I used the trumpet, ambushes with my trumpet shaman and 30 ungor raiders and eliminated the wrathmongers. I was blown away, and even after the trumpet was used they still performed beyond expectation. Can’t wait to use 40 in larger games ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 2 hours ago, Dracothjay said: Raiders are insane. I used just a unit of 30 in a 1K game last night. They killed 3 wrathmongers, khorne lord on jugganaut and some blood warriors. They helped so damn much, and I used the trumpet, ambushes with my trumpet shaman and 30 ungor raiders and eliminated the wrathmongers. I was blown away, and even after the trumpet was used they still performed beyond expectation. Can’t wait to use 40 in larger games ?? Do you think you would ever use 2x40 in 2000pt games? I'm considering it but the prospect of painting 80 raiders is a bit daunting haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 10 minutes ago, Retro said: Do you think you would ever use 2x40 in 2000pt games? I'm considering it but the prospect of painting 80 raiders is a bit daunting haha Considering those 80 models do not include your battleline, it makes for a lot of models in the army, which takes a lot of board space and a lot of time. I'd make sure you had movement trays of some kind to speed things up. 80 also might not effectively fit in brayblast trumpet range, if that's the trick you're going for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracothjay Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 51 minutes ago, Retro said: Do you think you would ever use 2x40 in 2000pt games? I'm considering it but the prospect of painting 80 raiders is a bit daunting haha Although the thought of that’s sounds so appealing, decker_cky brings up good points. I think a unit of 40 is enough. Enough to apply pressure that your enemy HAS to deal with them. Also, they are expensive to a degree and as they fall outside of battleline I think 2X40 is a points sink. A unit of 40 is the sweet spot. Is anyone else undecided if greatfrays are the way to go or just picking your own traits and artefacts is better? I’m so undecided as both avenues offer so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 15 minutes ago, Dracothjay said: Is anyone else undecided if greatfrays are the way to go or just picking your own traits and artefacts is better? I’m so undecided as both avenues offer so much. I think it's highly dependent on the strategy you're going for. Some Generic traits are pretty good, although a few are redundant. Bestial Cunning seems like a worse version of darkwalkers unless you really really don't want to take the Desolate Shard tax. Though Mutating Gnarlblade sure is tasty, and getting free spawns are the icing on the cake. Combine that with Nurgle MW bombs! At the very least it's not SCE and "I can't let go of Staunch Defender!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 23 minutes ago, kenshin620 said: I think it's highly dependent on the strategy you're going for. Some Generic traits are pretty good, although a few are redundant. Bestial Cunning seems like a worse version of darkwalkers unless you really really don't want to take the Desolate Shard tax. Though Mutating Gnarlblade sure is tasty, and getting free spawns are the icing on the cake. Combine that with Nurgle MW bombs! At the very least it's not SCE and "I can't let go of Staunch Defender!" The spawn that are generated from characters would be nurgle and darkwalkers, but would not explode as they cannot be part of the battalion. To answer the greatfray question, look at the command abilities. I see very good reasons why you would want some of the command abilities, particularly the shaggoth ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 19 minutes ago, decker_cky said: The spawn that are generated from characters would be nurgle and darkwalkers, but would not explode as they cannot be part of the battalion. Oh yea I know that, but it's still a cool combo of dealing out MWs and then having a spawn to deal with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackroks981 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 How do you guys find this for a comp. list using Tzaangors? Allegiance: Beasts Of Chaos- Greatfray: GavespawnLeadersTzaangor Shaman (180)- General- Trait: Unravelling Aura - Artefact: The Knowing Eye - Lore of the Twisted Wilds: Tendrils of AtrophyTzaangor Shaman (180)- Lore of the Twisted Wilds: ViletideGreat Bray Shaman (100)- Lore of the Twisted Wilds: Vicious StranglethornsBeastlord (90)- Artefact: Mutating Gnarlblade Battleline20 x Tzaangors (360)20 x Tzaangors (360)10 x Gors (80)- Gor-Blades & BeastshieldsUnits6 x Tzaangor Enlightened on Disc (280)10 x Ungor Raiders (80)10 x Ungor Raiders (80)BattalionsPhantasmagoria of Fate (200)Total: 1990 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 156 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satyrical Sophist Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Tried enlightened today, was playing tzeentch but only the beasts of chaos stuff is relevant. Enlightened were deadly. Managed to trigger the ability and they one phased a black coach. They went on to kill a spirit torment and finally a knight of shrouds. The Aviarch actually killed the knight on his own, after the knight killed his two fellow birdgoats. The shaman did a good job floating around and just gently filling back up a unit of tzaangor. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pandamina Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 3 hours ago, Jackroks981 said: How do you guys find this for a comp. list using Tzaangors? Allegiance: Beasts Of Chaos- Greatfray: GavespawnLeadersTzaangor Shaman (180)- General- Trait: Unravelling Aura - Artefact: The Knowing Eye - Lore of the Twisted Wilds: Tendrils of AtrophyTzaangor Shaman (180)- Lore of the Twisted Wilds: ViletideGreat Bray Shaman (100)- Lore of the Twisted Wilds: Vicious StranglethornsBeastlord (90)- Artefact: Mutating Gnarlblade Battleline20 x Tzaangors (360)20 x Tzaangors (360)10 x Gors (80)- Gor-Blades & BeastshieldsUnits6 x Tzaangor Enlightened on Disc (280)10 x Ungor Raiders (80)10 x Ungor Raiders (80)BattalionsPhantasmagoria of Fate (200)Total: 1990 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 156 IMO gavespawn don't really fit in comp. large formats. Second dispel is situational at best. Artifact is good, but we have plenty of other options. Spawn ability is hard to use on big blobs esp. 32mm tzaangors. I think allherd (summon is busted) or no herd would be better for 2k as you need lots of heroes (presumably beastlords) for GS to be viable. Also at least one shoggot (thunderscorn are the best lorewise addition to tzaangor army as they stated to be allies in disciples of tzeench battletome) is perfect for the utility purposes and you can add some dragon ogors as battleline with him being a general in no herd army because he has really good command traits like d3 cp. Then you can take one 20-30 tzaangor unit with sundering blades and wild rampage spells or allied chaos sorcerer lord if you wish. And one or two (depends on who is your general) min ungor units will do as sacrifice targets or screen. Ungor raiders are much better at 30-40 than at 2×10 because of their warscroll ability, and you can either camp them in battleshock immunity aura or ambush with trumpet. Also i'm not a big fan of 200 points do nothing battalion. Instead of turn control i'd rather toss 6x enlightened or 3x skyfires behind my tzaangor blob. Hope this will be helpful 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urauloth Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 On 10/1/2018 at 10:33 PM, Retro said: I never stopped to do the math hammer on it before but you are 100% right. Swords having the benefit of not reducing in effectiveness once you have less than 3 ranks worth of models left to fight. Yeah, I hadn't either; I looked at the higher number of potential attacks and stopped there. I appreciate the perspective, Retro and @decker_cky. Nice to know the options are more balanced than I assumed, because that can only be a good thing fo the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackroks981 Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 6 hours ago, Pandamina said: IMO gavespawn don't really fit in comp. large formats. Second dispel is situational at best. Artifact is good, but we have plenty of other options. Spawn ability is hard to use on big blobs esp. 32mm tzaangors. I think allherd (summon is busted) or no herd would be better for 2k as you need lots of heroes (presumably beastlords) for GS to be viable. Also at least one shoggot (thunderscorn are the best lorewise addition to tzaangor army as they stated to be allies in disciples of tzeench battletome) is perfect for the utility purposes and you can add some dragon ogors as battleline with him being a general in no herd army because he has really good command traits like d3 cp. Then you can take one 20-30 tzaangor unit with sundering blades and wild rampage spells or allied chaos sorcerer lord if you wish. And one or two (depends on who is your general) min ungor units will do as sacrifice targets or screen. Ungor raiders are much better at 30-40 than at 2×10 because of their warscroll ability, and you can either camp them in battleshock immunity aura or ambush with trumpet. Also i'm not a big fan of 200 points do nothing battalion. Instead of turn control i'd rather toss 6x enlightened or 3x skyfires behind my tzaangor blob. Hope this will be helpful Only reason the battalion is there is for the one drop and potential first turn charges. As for the ungor raiders they aren’t intended to do any work, just a quick mobile screen or something to sit back and take objectives. As for 30 Tzaangors they are way to unwieldy at the moment, getting 30 within range of a shaman for the wound buff, which they desperately need now since the nerf is almost impossible. Thanks for the help dude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skreech Verminking Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Hi, ill be trying my beasts of chaos army against a friend of mine out. we’ll be playing 1250p. didnt have enough units to fill out the points, so I went with some endless spells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satyrical Sophist Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 19 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said: Hi, ill be trying my beasts of chaos army against a friend of mine out. we’ll be playing 1250p. didnt have enough units to fill out the points, so I went with some endless spells. Pendulum might be better than portal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tasman Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 8 minutes ago, Satyrical Sophist said: Pendulum might be better than portal Or the bale wind. Extra range on Bray shamans spell + cover save + extra spell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Worm Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Hi everyone, i have just stareted with AoS and Beasts of Chaos so I have few questions: 1.) GBS has DEVOVLE spell, can anyone tell me how it works: If i understand i pick enemy unit and this unit must move 2D6 to to closest Beast of chaos unit? 2.) If i cast the spell: Wildfire Taurus, and i cast him in front of the enemy unit can he move over him or must he go past him with his units? 3.) Herdstone, i am not sure if i play this model/terain correctly: - Locus of Savegery: do i need to be with my units wholy within aour to benefit from it, meaning if i have a unit of 40xUngors and 3 modes from the unit are not in the aour range do i get the benefit from it or not? - Entropic Loadstone: saome as above, must enemy unit be wholy inside aura or only one model form the unit and it works? 4.) Summoning: is it possible to summon more model in the same unit, meaning can I spend 12 points and summon 20 xBestigors in one unit or do they need to be in two units of 10? What units do you summon, i really like Cockatrice, why it is very cheap only 5point when you put it on the tabel it can shoot asap and even in CC it is not that bad? Thanks for the answers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.