Kevlar1972 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 38 minutes ago, kenshin620 said: Even if you don't want to whip them, you can use a GBS to boost them. Not saying Gargants are the end all monster, but Allherd can help their "banana peel slip" problem! I think the best independent monster might be the Ghorgon. He doesn't benefit too much from GBS vs the Gargant or Chimera so you don't have to baby sit him, can heal himself if lucky, and can eat important people from a unit like unit champions! Oh I think they are awesome. I just bought one to ally into my blades of khorne army. I didn't realize how much better their damage output was over a regular gargant until I read this thread. The chaos gargant is crazy. I plan on babysitting mine with wrathmongers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 13 minutes ago, Kevlar1972 said: Oh I think they are awesome. I just bought one to ally into my blades of khorne army. I didn't realize how much better their damage output was over a regular gargant until I read this thread. The chaos gargant is crazy. I plan on babysitting mine with wrathmongers! Oh wow I never thought of Wrathmongers! Now thats an idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackroks981 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 What are peoples thoughts on a Tzaangor heavy list? Was debating running something with a couple of 20 man blocks in a phantasmagoria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracothjay Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 I have a game on Monday and have come up with this list. What do ya’ll thingk? doombull - general - rampant juggernaut GBS - brayblast trumpet - tendrils of atrophy 3 bullgors - greataxe 3 bullgors - greataxe 10 bestigors 30 ungor raiders ES wildfire Taurus gonna ambush my raiders and maybe my bestigors turn 1. With the trumpet I hope to either snipe a key hero or hit a key unit hard and soften it up. If I ambush my bestigors I’ll try and charge them straight away, unsure if I want to risk my bestigors though. my doombull, bullgors and shaman will casually march up and hopefully get a round of spells off ready for next turn charging. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Dracothjay said: I have a game on Monday and have come up with this list. What do ya’ll thingk? doombull - general - rampant juggernaut GBS - brayblast trumpet - tendrils of atrophy 3 bullgors - greataxe 3 bullgors - greataxe 10 bestigors 30 ungor raiders ES wildfire Taurus gonna ambush my raiders and maybe my bestigors turn 1. With the trumpet I hope to either snipe a key hero or hit a key unit hard and soften it up. If I ambush my bestigors I’ll try and charge them straight away, unsure if I want to risk my bestigors though. my doombull, bullgors and shaman will casually march up and hopefully get a round of spells off ready for next turn charging. Thoughts? Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but you won't be able to ambush all 3, only 2 units. From the look of it you aren't taking darkwalkers which means your only "brayherd" for the purpose of ambushing are the GBS, Bestigor and raiders. You can only ambush with half of your brayherds rounded up. I would probably stay clear of ambushing when you've got such a small force of non brayherds (unless you take the darkwalkers greatfray) Edit: I just realised you weren't planning to ambush your shaman. So it's doable but it might be hard to get the units in range of the trumpet if he doesn't ambush with them Edited September 28, 2018 by Retro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracothjay Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Retro said: Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but you won't be able to ambush all 3, only 2 units. From the look of it you aren't taking darkwalkers which means your only "brayherd" for the purpose of ambushing are the GBS, Bestigor and raiders. You can only ambush with half of your brayherds rounded up. I would probably stay clear of ambushing when you've got such a small force of non brayherds (unless you take the darkwalkers greatfray) Edit: I just realised you weren't planning to ambush your shaman. So it's doable but it might be hard to get the units in range of the trumpet if he doesn't ambush with them Won’t be too hard getting my GBS in range at all. Movement of 9”, run him also which hopefully will put him mid table then I ambush to the side near him. Have my raiders in range of his 18” trumpet, raiders also having 18” range I should definately b able to target something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satyrical Sophist Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 I thought that while a unit has to be brayherd to ambush, you count all BoC units to see how many units you can ambush? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 17 minutes ago, Satyrical Sophist said: I thought that while a unit has to be brayherd to ambush, you count all BoC units to see how many units you can ambush? Yup, it's all BoC units. BTW is it cheesy or is it proper to have oval bases moving like crabs? So Chaos Warhounds are probably the cheapest bubble wrappers ever, but would it look like a powergamer move to have them move "sideways" to cover as much horizontal space as possible to protect some models from getting charged? According to the FAQ theres no such thing as facing, but I keep forgetting if ovals technically have a facing when moving. Unless a missed a tiny paragraph somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 50 minutes ago, kenshin620 said: Yup, it's all BoC units. BTW is it cheesy or is it proper to have oval bases moving like crabs? So Chaos Warhounds are probably the cheapest bubble wrappers ever, but would it look like a powergamer move to have them move "sideways" to cover as much horizontal space as possible to protect some models from getting charged? According to the FAQ theres no such thing as facing, but I keep forgetting if ovals technically have a facing when moving. Unless a missed a tiny paragraph somewhere. There's no such thing as facing, so no. Also, there is no use of warhounds which a reasonable person would interpret as powergamey. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasant Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 I think razorgors can be good if taken in min sized units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, decker_cky said: There's no such thing as facing, so no. Also, there is no use of warhounds which a reasonable person would interpret as powergamey. Yea I thought so! I'm sure though in some weird scenario, it will be best to have crab walking Dragon Ogors! 23 minutes ago, peasant said: I think razorgors can be good if taken in min sized units. They make good filler for ambush unit counting. Edited September 28, 2018 by kenshin620 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronga Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 I am trying to figure out the best kind of list that could deal with Daughters and Blight knights. Anyone have any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasant Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 7 hours ago, kenshin620 said: They make good filler for ambush unit counting. yes! and another think being a single miniature unit can deal with extremely hard hitting units like evocators MW~tsunami. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kramer Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 On 9/27/2018 at 11:25 PM, kenshin620 said: This sounds random but I just noticed in the big 2 full page army picture that in the back they have a Cygor without a rock! Interesting they modeled one like that for the army book where they usually prefer to build "the box cover" build. Haha found it. Almost looks like it broke and the photographer didn’t notice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuttyknatty Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 7 minutes ago, Kramer said: Haha found it. Almost looks like it broke and the photographer didn’t notice Isn’t that just the version with the statue in one hand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruinin Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 9 hours ago, Ronga said: I am trying to figure out the best kind of list that could deal with Daughters and Blight knights. Anyone have any ideas? I just played DOK the other night. 3 turns called it a draw but we both agreed I had it. My List: Gavespawn BL with gnarlblade GBS General with titanic fury GBS with viletide Shaggoth with Hailstorm 2x30 Gors (1shield and 1 dual is what I had) 2x10 Bestigor 1x10 Ungor 1 chariot 2x razorgor 1 spawn Cygor Chimera Gorgorath I tried to chaff him with ambush on the edges and razorgors and spawn in the middle. he went first turn and moved slightly (Gift from the heavens) I moved mostly forward trying block him. Didn't work so well because of the random runs with razors and slow spawn, BL killed 10 Witch elves on a suicide charge. Gorgorath was awesome wiping 30 witchelves. Morathi killed chimera in two turns but had no where to go could pick what kill next but couldnt get to my objective. I was about to get his objective where BL, 10 Bestigors on the edge and was going to bring 2x10 summoned gors to hold it (this is why I think I might have won it.) General, Cygor, spawn and shaggoth, held the middle. against the snakes. I think BOC cannot be played as a smash your face army, they need to play the objectives and go for board control and they are awesome at it. Next time I think I will try20 hounds for the guaranteed 16" move and/or 5 centigor next time to improve the center chaff game. I think I need a battalion to control turn sequence. To replay that game with the list I have in mind I would have the chaff in his face turn 1 controlling the board and then he either kills the chaff and I counter charge or doesn't kill chaff and I charge but he cannot advance more than 8" up the board as a line of dogs/Centigors would be at 16-20" from the start line in the middle and I would have ambushing stuff on the edges. We will see. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Yellow_Sign Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 15 minutes ago, Bruinin said: I just played DOK the other night. 3 turns called it a draw but we both agreed I had it. My List: Gavespawn BL with gnarlblade GBS General with titanic fury GBS with viletide Shaggoth with Hailstorm 2x30 Gors (1shield and 1 dual is what I had) 2x10 Bestigor 1x10 Ungor 1 chariot 2x razorgor 1 spawn Cygor Chimera Gorgorath I tried to chaff him with ambush on the edges and razorgors and spawn in the middle. he went first turn and moved slightly (Gift from the heavens) I moved mostly forward trying block him. Didn't work so well because of the random runs with razors and slow spawn, BL killed 10 Witch elves on a suicide charge. Gorgorath was awesome wiping 30 witchelves. Morathi killed chimera in two turns but had no where to go could pick what kill next but couldnt get to my objective. I was about to get his objective where BL, 10 Bestigors on the edge and was going to bring 2x10 summoned gors to hold it (this is why I think I might have won it.) General, Cygor, spawn and shaggoth, held the middle. against the snakes. I think BOC cannot be played as a smash your face army, they need to play the objectives and go for board control and they are awesome at it. Next time I think I will try20 hounds for the guaranteed 16" move and/or 5 centigor next time to improve the center chaff game. I think I need a battalion to control turn sequence. To replay that game with the list I have in mind I would have the chaff in his face turn 1 controlling the board and then he either kills the chaff and I counter charge or doesn't kill chaff and I charge but he cannot advance more than 8" up the board as a line of dogs/Centigors would be at 16-20" from the start line in the middle and I would have ambushing stuff on the edges. We will see. Do you mean Ghorgon rather than Gorgorath? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruinin Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 48 minutes ago, The_Yellow_Sign said: Do you mean Ghorgon rather than Gorgorath? Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 17 hours ago, Satyrical Sophist said: I thought that while a unit has to be brayherd to ambush, you count all BoC units to see how many units you can ambush? I stand corrected, obviously completely misread those rules Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenshin620 Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 3 hours ago, Bruinin said: I think BOC cannot be played as a smash your face army, they need to play the objectives and go for board control and they are awesome at it. Next time I think I will try20 hounds for the guaranteed 16" move and/or 5 centigor next time to improve the center chaff game. I think I need a battalion to control turn sequence. To replay that game with the list I have in mind I would have the chaff in his face turn 1 controlling the board and then he either kills the chaff and I counter charge or doesn't kill chaff and I charge but he cannot advance more than 8" up the board as a line of dogs/Centigors would be at 16-20" from the start line in the middle and I would have ambushing stuff on the edges. We will see. Yea thats my thoughts exactly on the power level of BoC. Despite the coolness of using giant units of Bestigors or Bullgors with Desolation Beastherd, I think point for point DoK will beat you out in a melee slugfest. DoK will beat almost anyone in a melee slugfest! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevlar1972 Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 13 hours ago, Ronga said: I am trying to figure out the best kind of list that could deal with Daughters and Blight knights. Anyone have any ideas? Summoning list with fast hard hitting units. Maybe lots of chariots. You may lose the battles but should win the war of attrition. You can replace units. They can't. It's hard for any army to overcome a big points deficit. Summoning has always been an unfair advantage, if you can do it and they can't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satyrical Sophist Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Double gargant box seems like good value. I wonder how they run in pairs, makes a flubbed charge unlikely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke of Gisoreux Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) On 9/24/2018 at 5:35 PM, scrollbuilderdude said: Warscroll Builder has been updated with the Beasts of Chaos faction. Let me know if I missed anything! The Warscroll Builder currently handles Tzaangors as being Battleline only in Beasts of Chaos armies when a Tzaangor Shaman is the General and in other Chaos armies they are no Battleline any more. According to the Beasts of Chaos Battletome that doesn't correspond to the wording used there. It's different to the other "X is Battleline when Y is General" conditions. The role Battleline is printed there. So I read it like Tzaangors are Battleline for all armies they can be used in (like Disciples of Tzeentch or GA Chaos), but for Beasts of Chaos the condition "General is a Tzaangor Shaman" has to be met for them to become Battleline. The exact wording is: "Battlefield Role: Battleline. Battleline in Beasts of Chaos army only if general is a Tzaangor Shaman" Others have for example: Battlefield Role: (not mentioned). Battleline in Beasts of Chaos army if general is a Doombull" Edited September 29, 2018 by Duke of Gisoreux added examples Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracothjay Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Guys, completely off current topic, but does anyone have good links/guides to painting doombull a and bullgors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amradiel Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) Playing around with a Gavespawn list. Really fell in love with the fluff. Suggestions for improvement would be great. Add a endless spell or not? Edited September 29, 2018 by Amradiel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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