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AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion


Gaz Taylor
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On 7/13/2018 at 9:58 AM, Frozenbeast said:

ybe get the "damned" bonus from the braystone as i don t think our shaman will really benefit from the +1 now that we don t have the summoning spell so maybe we can deploy the stone a bit more forward

I don’t own the endless spell box yet. But there must be something helpful in there and the plus 1 form the braystone might prove invaluable for that :) 

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15 hours ago, Kramer said:

I don’t own the endless spell box yet. But there must be something helpful in there and the plus 1 form the braystone might prove invaluable for that :) 

One thing I thought about is the palisade. It is a big template on the field and forces the enemy to move their shooters to see our units which might pull them out of position. Paired with Devolve spell might result in a powerful tool. 

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37 minutes ago, Frozenbeast said:

One thing I thought about is the palisade. It is a big template on the field and forces the enemy to move their shooters to see our units which might pull them out of position. Paired with Devolve spell might result in a powerful tool. 

Sounds like a good move to keep your opponent reacting and forcing him to keep readjusting. 

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You outnumber them 5 to 1 so swarm them with bodies. Use your speed to get to the objectives before them and make life difficult by forcing them to plow through unit after unit of chaff before they can get to you. A few Bray Shamans with some mortal wound causing endless spells wouldn't go astray.

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14 hours ago, The_Yellow_Sign said:

Any ideas for beating Sigmarines? Like 70% if the people I play are using them, and I find it annoying that they have no obvious weaknesses. All of their units seem ridiculously good, and Beastmen lack the mortal wounds to get through their crazy high armour saves.

You have to play to the objectives, you cannot reliably beat them in combat.

Try and muck up their movement by screening off objectives with your blocks whilst you score them. Do everything you can to take out their characters and remove their synergies and be liberal with inspiring presence. 

Try not to worry too much about having your models taken off as well, its just what happens to the Brayherd. 

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On 7/12/2018 at 8:36 PM, The_Yellow_Sign said:

I'm tempted to field a full unit of 30 Bestigors with the new points reduction, but I'm worried that they'll just be too unwieldy to use in such a big blob, since most of them won't be able to attack due to their larger bases. And on top of that they don't have any additional bonuses like Gors and Ungors do for larger unit sizes. Is it worth fielding a big 30 Bestigor blob, or would you suck up the points increase and deploy them in smaller units of 10 or 20?

I've only fielded mine in units of 30.  I think most the time you want Brayherd units nearly maximized.

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2 hours ago, Popisdead said:

I've only fielded mine in units of 30.  I think most the time you want Brayherd units nearly maximized.

I'd agree, they're your only reasonably reliable combat unit.

You need to ensure they stick around as long as possible and the only way to do that is with more bodies.

Edited by thebloody9
Pedantry.
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It really bugs me that Brayherd and Warherd are not the same faction.
It sucks having to field Cygor as a ally when you play Brayherd, because 400 points come really fast, and we never have enough Jabbers :D

Therefore, has anyone come up with a GA:Chaos list that could potentially be viable ?
What do we lose really by not taking the Brayherd allegiance ?

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33 minutes ago, Saiken said:

It really bugs me that Brayherd and Warherd are not the same faction.
It sucks having to field Cygor as a ally when you play Brayherd, because 400 points come really fast, and we never have enough Jabbers :D

Therefore, has anyone come up with a GA:Chaos list that could potentially be viable ?
What do we lose really by not taking the Brayherd allegiance ?

Hmm, I'd say use Wildstalker and then build from there but the unit requirements are steep.

A couple of chariot drops instead of Bestigor, minimum strength Raider units and 20 man Gor blocks with shields will net you around 1400-1500.

What do you end up spending the points on though. I keep coming back to Tzzangor flyers but then I end up thinking why not just do Tzzangor?  

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4 hours ago, Saiken said:

It really bugs me that Brayherd and Warherd are not the same faction.
It sucks having to field Cygor as a ally when you play Brayherd, because 400 points come really fast, and we never have enough Jabbers :D

Therefore, has anyone come up with a GA:Chaos list that could potentially be viable ?
What do we lose really by not taking the Brayherd allegiance ?

Yeah me too.  We went from 6th ed, really cool book, lots of flavour, unique style, integrated well to Phil Kelly and Andy Hoare making them poop worshiping crazies who barely squeaked by as playable with an oddity of a rule in 7th/8th to "you are strictly a meat shield and die in droves in the story" in AoS.

We lost all our cool flavour and fun to get it back in drips.  The Beasts of Chaos umbrella should really be more interesting than it is.

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6 hours ago, Saiken said:


What do we lose really by not taking the Brayherd allegiance ?

The biggest is probably Bestigor Battleline I'd say? But you could easily take some min ungors or something. Then I guess the the ambush rule. It is a little weird though how the ambush rule and the herdstone rule sort of contradict each other. The ambush rule promotes going knee deep in enemy territory, the herdstone meanwhile promotes hugging your territory. Its not like Brayherd is known for shooting (though I guess its a nice spot to park a shaman).

 

I mean heck look at Skaven. Split up into 6 factions, with one of them being made up of only Leaders! Almost everyone wants to be Legions of Nagash....but I don't think AoS is getting much for the next few months other than the Darkoath/Moonclan update. The current update schedule is really stretching out SCE/NH (paddling back and forth between AoS release, then Specialist Games, then 40k Kill Team).

 

 

I'm also curious, should God marks come back to Beastmen? On one hand that could KILL mono Beastmen armies much like slaves to darkness, but on the other hand at least people might be more inclided to get some! Or at the very least do you think God Marked units should be usable in a beastmen army? For example Tzaangors also being eligible as a Brayherd unit rather than ally? I mean they still have the Gor keyword.

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8 hours ago, kenshin620 said:

It is a little weird though how the ambush rule and the herdstone rule sort of contradict each other. The ambush rule promotes going knee deep in enemy territory, the herdstone meanwhile promotes hugging your territory.

The changes to Deadly and Damned terrain definitely make herdstones less impactful so you're not losing as much being out of range. Although with the new rules for placement anywhere in your territory at set up you can throw it down where you want to be in a turn or two.

Put it next to an objective or plonk it over the top of a gravesite. Not saying there's any dramatic advantage to be had but it can gum up your opponent a little more.

I think I might be falling out of love with the allegiance a little bit and am thinking about mixed chaos some more. I can get ambush through the battalion  (which I'd take anyway), herdstones are weaker and our best artifact the Herdstone Axe is now 90% less fun.

My last "Take it off!" moment with axe was against the unkillable Treelord Ancient so at least it went out with a bang.

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I am ultimately thinking abouti mixed chaos beastmen. With the changes to the terrain rules I find the herdstone difficult to utilize properly and ambush can be useful for chariots but I think nothing else as we are sooo quick we can get within charge range anyway. 

What I really like are the changes to magic that make Cygor a bit more viable (thinking about 2) if not a must take. With the pile in now being compulsory one jabberslythe is auto include in every beast army imo: if they target that with the shooting you get into combat with something else if not everything elsee. I was thinking to a list like this:

Allegiance: Chaos

Leaders
Great Bray Shaman (100)
- General
- Trait: Malicious Conqueror
Great Bray Shaman (100)
Doombull (120)
- Great Axe
Doombull (120)
- Pair of Axes

Battleline
10 x Gors (80)
- Gor-Blades & Beastshields
10 x Gors (80)
- Gor-Blades & Beastshields
10 x Gors (80)
- Gor-Blades & Beastshields

Units
30 x Bestigors (300)
6 x Bullgors (320)
- Great Axes

Behemoths
Cygor (180)
Cygor (180)
Jabberslythe (140)

Endless Spells
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Prismatic Palisade (30)

Total: 1890 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 148
 

Even though I am not sure on the atrifact (although not having to take BS within 6" is juicy as I won t spend in CP saving them for re roll charges for example) the basic idea is always the same: target saturation (minos+monsters) and bodies flood (even if the amount is not that high). The cygors are pretty scary for wizards as I reroll hits against them and the have to be sure on the casting or they suffer MWs. The jabber is the jabber, blindly marching forward agains a key target and the quicker it gets into combat the better. My punch will be minotaurs buffed by the doombulls (CA stack) and bestigors with mistic shield to be a bit more tank-y. Gors to capture obj or as chaff to block the path to enemy units. The endless spells might be optional especially the cogs. Palissade is to force opponents to go and fight where I want and to protect from shooting (paired with Devolve spell can get me a bit of time). The ultimate goal is always to play the objective and pick my fights hitting hard where I can. 

Thoughts? 

P. S. : keep in mind I don t have the availability of models to field the battalion. 

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Very interesting list, and definitely along the lines of what I was thinking with my previous question.

I'm just wondering about including Tzaangors in such a list. They do fit the general style of the army ( they're gors after all) and they seem pretty deadly ?
Any reason why you chose not to include them at all ?

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13 hours ago, Saiken said:

Very interesting list, and definitely along the lines of what I was thinking with my previous question.

I'm just wondering about including Tzaangors in such a list. They do fit the general style of the army ( they're gors after all) and they seem pretty deadly ?
Any reason why you chose not to include them at all ??

Never had the models to start with?

Second of all I need bodies so bestigors are better from that point of view (more wounds and more armour for the same points). 

Tzaangors are BL but cost too much: with the same amount of points I could field three times at least in wounds and models with gors. 

One solution might be replacing the minos and the doombull for a maxed out unit of tzaangors which I see very well as they will definitely be more durable and hit harder than the bulls for sure but the problem will present again: I don t have the models?

Edited by Frozenbeast
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On 7/20/2018 at 10:30 AM, JackStreicher said:

How are BH faring in the new Edition? I‘d like to know if they‘re competetive / what armies hurt them the most?

The simple answer is that they are in a decent spot versus most GHB armies but are up against it if your opponent brings a Battletome.

Against GHB armies you have an advantage in mobility (less now that everyone can access the movement commands), cheap bodies and heroes/wizards so you can get lots of scoring units onto objectives and normally cling on through attrition.  Most GHB armies lack the fire power to just blow you away blocks of 30 models turn after turn although there are exceptions (played a Slaneesh Daemon army with 2 Exalted Keepers recently and they were horrifying).

In my experience the armies I worry about are things like Arcanites, Bloodbound and KO that can delete lots of models at will. Particularly when multiple units are getting hit, your bravery is abysmal and you need Inspiring Presence to keep things manageable (luckily you won't be spending those command point on anything else).

I'm less concerned about armies that concentrate on high value units with good attacks like Stormcast and Sylvaneth or mortal wound output like Nurgle or Sacrament. A mortal wound kills the same number of Gor as a standard wound and a Scythe Hunter is wasting that rend on Ungor. It's an up hill battle here though as you will struggle to kill units and risk getting ground off objectives instead of blasted off.

My nightmare opponent is DoK. As quick as us, with flying units. Bucketloads of attacks and bravery debuffs. Lots of bodies and heroes for scoring and some big anvil monsters that you can't kill. 

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On 7/16/2018 at 9:43 PM, Agent of Chaos said:

You outnumber them 5 to 1 so swarm them with bodies. Use your speed to get to the objectives before them and make life difficult by forcing them to plow through unit after unit of chaff before they can get to you. 

Pretty much this.  Don't dismiss 80 Ungors either if you can find them.

 

4 hours ago, thebloody9 said:

(played a Slaneesh Daemon army with 2 Exalted Keepers recently and they were horrifying)

That is 900 points of that army.  :|

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In case you missed it, there are currently strong rumours on the Rumour  Thread pointing towards a release at the end of the year of a Darkoath/Beastmen army ...
If it's allowed to dream ... well I'm definitely dreaming right now ! ?

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7 hours ago, Saiken said:

In case you missed it, there are currently strong rumours on the Rumour  Thread pointing towards a release at the end of the year of a Darkoath/Beastmen army ...
If it's allowed to dream ... well I'm definitely dreaming right now ! ?

Where did you guys read this?  

I've been to the dakka dakka rumour tracker thread and I've found things have pretty much dried up regarding rumours.   Even if something is leaked (like Rogue Trader for kill team) GW does the official news an hour later. 

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