AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion

[kenshin620]

4 hours ago, Myrdin said:

Granted, it might always happen. I just think it wont but I guess we`ll see. Really looking forward to the Free Cities book, though I honestly and truly dislike the fact its a mixed book. Elves, and Dwarves should be their own thing, as should be the Free Cities a purely Empire thing. Why did they include SCE who already have 2 books is also beyond me.

Because it is the Free Cities book. Whether you like it or not, the Free Cities concept is one of the core fluff pillars of Order since the inception of AoS and now they want a proper book to represent that.

And SCE are one of the many fighting forces in their cities and it's almost as if gw wants people to have more excuses to have sce

And while there is the argument for the ally points, I think fluffwise ally points represent a small contingent of allies, rather than full cooperation.

 

And then theres the rabbit hole of "what truly fits on AoS" that goes in circles, some people reasoning why Greenskinz were squatted, others still clinging onto the hope Dispossessed will get their own book.

 

You know I'm still even surprised BoC even became a thing and somehow didn't lose a single model outside of characters (still don't understand why they sell Malagor the Dark Omen...but not as Malagor the Dark Omen! Would it hurt to have a single special character!)

[Maddpainting]

BoC are a huge part of WHFB and even AoS, its the "monsters in the woods" armies, the Chaos that glues the missing parts between humans and daemons. They've been a part of the cycle for 30yrs now.

Yes others has too, but BoC has always gotten love (I've been playing them since 5th WHFB) and they have beeen modeled 4x since 4th, even tho they always had terrible rules till now as an army (b.c they always were one fot he first books in each edition), they always been one of the first to get a book, to get new models, and to be the general beat stick to Elves/Humans/Dwarfs. I personally have had 3 different sets of Gors and Ungors from new kits, one in the 90's for Gors/Ungors (My favorites ones FYI), 1 in early 2000's, and when the raiders came out they split them up and rebox them again (tho the Gors bodies stayed the same they redid command sprue, no more torches). 

They also had during 6th and 7th, new Doombull and Bullgors redone, Dragon Ogres redone, new BL and Shaman, added Chariot and Razorgor  in 5th, late 6th? early 7th? Ghorgon/Cygor and Jabberslyhe, and new Shaman again but in plastic

Really the only few models that havent been updated are the Chariot, Centigors, Bestigors, Razorgors, and BL.


EDIT: PS, it also looks like we are getting an Underworlds warband.
 

Edited July 30, 2019 by Maddpainting

[Kazimer]

Really? Wow, Bestigors have aged pretty well then imo.

So is it worth it to bring a full block of 40 Ungor Raiders, or should I only bring the 30? I feel like I should maximize the gains of rerolling 1-2's to hit with a full block, even if it doesnt give me a discount.  Or is my 80 points better spent elsewhere?

[Myrdin]

Hmm IF we get (****** finally...) and underworld Warband, that means we will get new unit profiles for regular games as well, just like the other armies did.

Now lets hope for something actually new, like Khorngors, Slaangors and Pestigors (though again, if that was the case I am sure we would see them released alongside their respective god Battletome revamps).

Honestly, I`d like to see Gor axe throwers. Just a regular Gor with 8" throwing axe 4+/3+/-1/1. If paired weapons reroll 1 on the throw as well as in combat. Same price as regular Gors (or better to say, they would replace the regular gors entirely since it would be just Gors, but with an extra throwing ability)
That way we might actually squeeze some use out of the dozens of Gor models most of us have. Though I suppose we wont see anything new. They dont seem too eager on making new Beastmen sculpts, or dare I say NEW Beastmen altogether (Werewolves, Bearmen, Crowmen>Harpies, etc)

Fingers crossed, but better not expect much...

[Great Bray Tom]

Hey guys,

I will be attending a 2 vs 2 AoS tournament the last weekend of September and I would like to get your opinions!

My teammate will be playing Nighthaunt:
Cairn Wraith
Guardian of Souls
Knight of Shrouds
Spirit Torment

10x Grimghast Reapers
20x Chainrasp Horde
3x Spirit Hosts
3x Spirit Hosts

1000/1000

And I will be playing my Beasts of Chaos army.

Allies are in effect, mercenaries are not. Also abilities will not pass over to my ally or any effects I give my opponents army will not apply to my teammates army. 

Do you guys have an opinion on what I should play? I haven't played a lot of 1.000 points and the games I did play, I lost.

This is my collection so far:

3 Great Bray-Shaman
1 Chaos Sorcerer Lord
1 Tzaangor Shaman
1 Doombull
1 Dragon Ogor Shaggoth
1 Beastlord (will purchase this next week)

40 Bestigor
20 Ungor with shields 
20 Ungor with spears
30 Gors
10 Tzaangors

12 Bullgors
2 Chaos Spawn
1 Tuskgor Chariot
3 Tzaangor Skyfire (I might makes these Enlightened if I can find the bits somewhere)

1 Chimera
2 Ghorgon
1 Cygor

Right now I had this in mind:
Gavespawn, no battalion
1 Great Bray-Shaman
- Vicious Stranglethorns
1 Chaos Sorcere Lord
- Mark doens't matter, probably Tzeentch
1 Beastlord (General)
- Mutating Gnarlblade
- Unraveling Aura

30 Bestigor
20 Bestigor (So purchase 10 extra).
10 Ungor

1 Chaos Spawn

1000/1000

All insights are welcome! Like I said, I have won all my 2.000 point games but I haven't won a 1.000 point game yet.. Maybe because I relied on summoning in the past and with a 1.000 points I don't always have to time and resources to do so.

[Kazimer]

Id drop 10 of the bestigors and add in 2 blocks of 10 ungors, 30 bestigors are pretty unwieldy and usually just equate to extra wounds.

[Great Bray Tom]

1 minute ago, Kazimer said:

Id drop 10 of the bestigors and add in 2 blocks of 10 ungors, 30 bestigors are pretty unwieldy and usually just equate to extra wounds.

That’s not possible because of the point discount on the Bestigor. -10 Bestigor from the 30 man unit would put me with a max of 10 Ungor. That’s not worth it imo

[Maddpainting]

I like 30 Bestigors if you are not taking the Bull, if gives you the ability to hit 2 units at once and fighting both at the same time

 

[Kazimer]

Aaah didnt remember the points discount, good point.

[decker_cky]

7 hours ago, Myrdin said:

Hmm IF we get (****** finally...) and underworld Warband, that means we will get new unit profiles for regular games as well, just like the other armies did.

Now lets hope for something actually new, like Khorngors, Slaangors and Pestigors (though again, if that was the case I am sure we would see them released alongside their respective god Battletome revamps).

Honestly, I`d like to see Gor axe throwers. Just a regular Gor with 8" throwing axe 4+/3+/-1/1. If paired weapons reroll 1 on the throw as well as in combat. Same price as regular Gors (or better to say, they would replace the regular gors entirely since it would be just Gors, but with an extra throwing ability)
That way we might actually squeeze some use out of the dozens of Gor models most of us have. Though I suppose we wont see anything new. They dont seem too eager on making new Beastmen sculpts, or dare I say NEW Beastmen altogether (Werewolves, Bearmen, Crowmen>Harpies, etc)

Fingers crossed, but better not expect much...

I don't think any of the underworld warbands are particularly effective in AoS matched play. They tend to have high points cost, and eclectic equipment and abilities. I think one of the khorne units is decent for being a cheap blood tithe point. 

[SwampHeart]

8 hours ago, Myrdin said:

Hmm IF we get (****** finally...) and underworld Warband, that means we will get new unit profiles for regular games as well, just like the other armies did.

Now lets hope for something actually new, like Khorngors, Slaangors and Pestigors (though again, if that was the case I am sure we would see them released alongside their respective god Battletome revamps).

Honestly, I`d like to see Gor axe throwers. Just a regular Gor with 8" throwing axe 4+/3+/-1/1. If paired weapons reroll 1 on the throw as well as in combat. Same price as regular Gors (or better to say, they would replace the regular gors entirely since it would be just Gors, but with an extra throwing ability)
That way we might actually squeeze some use out of the dozens of Gor models most of us have. Though I suppose we wont see anything new. They dont seem too eager on making new Beastmen sculpts, or dare I say NEW Beastmen altogether (Werewolves, Bearmen, Crowmen>Harpies, etc)

Fingers crossed, but better not expect much...

This isn't how Warband Underworlds work out. You get the exact warband with rules converted for AoS use - they're always underwhelming and over costed. They don't result in new units that can be fielded but instead one specific selection of the models specifically in the warband. 

[Maddpainting]

I'm more excited about new models. They will make great additions to leaders in units.

[Chaos Shepard]

Underworld warbands often have a leader who is a variation on an existing leader. Maybe the warband could have a beastlord with a shield or great ax or even some kind of loadout we haven't seen before.

[kenshin620]

58 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:

I'm more excited about new models. They will make great additions to leaders in units.

I heard a rumor that originally the stats for Warbands in AoS were suppose to be unit upgrades (like 1 Liberator unit in your army may be fielded as Steelhearts Champions)

But yea for the most part, assume the warband is a unit filler/variant pose.

 

Then again though the new Raptoryx who are CLEARLY MONSTERS are Slaves to Darkness only, not Beasts of Chaos. Go figure!

I mean that description..."One of the many forms of wildlife twisted by the power of Chaos"

[decker_cky]

24 minutes ago, kenshin620 said:

Then again though the new Raptoryx who are CLEARLY MONSTERS are Slaves to Darkness only, not Beasts of Chaos. Go figure!

I mean that description..."One of the many forms of wildlife twisted by the power of Chaos"

I was hopelessly optimistic, and thought GW might be really creative in how they tied the warbands to AoS, with things like giving the Untamed Beasts the Brayherd (but not Beasts of Chaos) keyword for ability synergy. It would have been so easy to justify fluffwise.  Unfortunately, GW went with very simple warbands. 

There's still hope that the warbands will be made a bit more interesting when the eventual slaves to darkness/everchosen/etc.. battletome comes out, but based on what we've seen I don't hold out much hope. 

[SwampHeart]

What is the BoC playerbase's fascination with/need to have ally options/things other than what's in the BoC book added to the pool of choices? This is an honest question. We already have what amounts to one of the most flexible Tomes in the game - you can port the army into 5 different allegiance abilities with additionally access to those allegiance warscrolls. Why does everyone feel the constant need to have every possible new thing be a BoC option as well?

[kenshin620]

I don't care about humans in BoC, I just don't understand why the humans get crazy bird things. I mean I think chaos warhounds fit with mortals better than chaos Mighty Ducks. Why not run them as warhound stand ins? Hey don't use perfectly good logic here!🤓

Even Slaughterbrutes have some excuse not being BoC, having to be bound by a powerful chaos champion so I would think beastlords don't want to bother with that.

[Myrdin]

12 hours ago, kenshin620 said:

I don't care about humans in BoC, I just don't understand why the humans get crazy bird things. I mean I think chaos warhounds fit with mortals better than chaos Mighty Ducks. Why not run them as warhound stand ins? Hey don't use perfectly good logic here!🤓

Even Slaughterbrutes have some excuse not being BoC, having to be bound by a powerful chaos champion so I would think beastlords don't want to bother with that.

A beastlord would beat, and stare that thing into submission 

I agree about the mighty ducks. Thats something we should have gotten as well, same with the Furies. Things that are just remotely bestial ? Ok I can concede that. But full fledged mutated beasts like these ? They should have BoC keyword by default.

On a side note... if we had those ducks, I would make a thunder bird wing of Cockatrices, and ducklings just for the lolz. Wish we got some winged Birdmen as well, some flappy version of Crow-Tzaangors.  

And as for new models.... the majority of BoC sculpts have aged fairly well, but even so, comparing them with some of the modern, cool highly detailed and dynamic sculpts, you can see the disparity. And lets not even get started on Razorgors and Centigors. 

People ask why we want new stuff...  maybe coz ours looks like it came from a different era, and we as well want to have the feeling of new shiny toys to play with.

Edited August 1, 2019 by Myrdin

[Maddpainting]

I just want new Centigors and some named characters.

[Sauriv]

15 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:

I just want new Centigors and some named characters.

I converted my centigors from gors and glade riders, but yeah, they really need new models. 

I would love a hero ghorgon, could be named but i rather not. But a named version of beastlord och doombull would be epic. 

Edited August 1, 2019 by Sauriv

[SwampHeart]

Here's our Underworlds Warband:

[Myrdin]

48 minutes ago, SwampHeart said:

Here's our Underworlds Warband:

 

I...

I...

I think I need to change my underwear

 

Ok on a more serious note.

Holy Jesus on a bycycle. This is what I was talking about when I mentioned new shiny models. A LOT more dynamic, bunch of details, overall great looking Beastmen. Love A+ !

Now as far as the warband itself goes..... One has to notice a distinct lack of Gors in there. I expected A bestigor and an Ungor sure, but 4 ungors a bestigor and only 1 Gor ?  Well...... hmmmm... who at the same time could pass for a fine Bestigor.

 

Now I wanna see the rules for these, and hope for some neat syngergies. The Hero looks like something between a shaman and a Bestigor with an Idol/Totem staff and a Ritual dagger.

Mayhaps a model similar to that Khorn Buff guy ? It would be nice to see a token bearer of a sorts who can burn CP for AoE wide buff, or something like that.

Thanks for sharing this

 

*Still no Centigor. Had some hopes but did not happen. To bad

Edited August 1, 2019 by Myrdin

[Maddpainting]

The one cutting himself is so awesome. 

I'll get this one too, can be used with little conversion

Edited August 1, 2019 by Maddpainting

[kenshin620]

7 hours ago, Myrdin said:

Now as far as the warband itself goes..... One has to notice a distinct lack of Gors in there. I expected A bestigor and an Ungor sure, but 4 ungors a bestigor and only 1 Gor ?  Well...... hmmmm... who at the same time could pass for a fine Bestigor.

 

Now I wanna see the rules for these, and hope for some neat syngergies. The Hero looks like something between a shaman and a Bestigor with an Idol/Totem staff and a Ritual dagger.

 

It's not a gor, it's a Bray Shaman. So I'd guess it'll be 1 Shaman Hero, and then a unit of 1 gor+4 ungor raiders. Which is a pretty silly unit for AoS but the Tzeentch one takes the cake for "what are you suppose to do with this?"

[decker_cky]

Worth noting that the WHC article describes the models as "the first Bestigor, Ungors and Great Bray-Shaman specifically designed for the Mortal Realms", so it looks like it's 1 bray shaman, 1 bestigor and 4 ungors. 

I hope they at least give a shooting profile to the two spear ungors (javelins) - it it's 2 spear ungors and 2 raiders, it's a bit silly. Best case might be for the unit to be a bray shaman with a useful new unique spell and 5 reasonably priced ablative wounds (otherwise known as a bray shaman packing its own herdstone sacrifices).

Edited August 1, 2019 by decker_cky