AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion

[Maddpainting]

17 minutes ago, Myrdin said:

To bad the dont have BoC Keyword. We need some god damm love in here ffs.

At least we can ally them in. I really do like those models, and seeing the warscroll... sure why not They replace the Harpies we once used to have rather nicely. Though only as Allies.

Good lord, all of these units just show how horrible Gors are....

Yep, thats why i want to play with them, they are OURS not STD. I really wish they were BoC as well.

But the rumor is STD battletome is right around the corner, so i can see why these are for them if that is true.

[benmoorepaintco]

1 hour ago, Great Bray Tom said:

I would make the Raiders one blob of 40 to ensure the 30+ models as long as possible. 

Also I would take out the Gors, and instead of 30 Bestigor I’ve found that playing blobs of 20 works better for mobility. So maybe:

Raiders into one unit of 40

2x30 Bestigor become 20, 20 and 10

Take out the Gors. You are now at 1930. And get another command point OR take out the Gorgon aswell and add a Chimera but I’m not sure if that screws up the chosen Battalion.

i’ve found 10 Gors to be utterly useless and an extra CP with the new abilities might be better.

The Gors are for the battallion, I could take a chariot instead but I would rather have the bodies. 

[The Jabber Tzeentch]

2 hours ago, Great Bray Tom said:

I would make the Raiders one blob of 40 to ensure the 30+ models as long as possible. 

Also I would take out the Gors, and instead of 30 Bestigor I’ve found that playing blobs of 20 works better for mobility. So maybe:

Raiders into one unit of 40

2x30 Bestigor become 20, 20 and 10

Take out the Gors. You are now at 1930. And get another command point OR take out the Gorgon aswell and add a Chimera but I’m not sure if that screws up the chosen Battalion.

i’ve found 10 Gors to be utterly useless and an extra CP with the new abilities might be better.

Need the Gor for the battalion.

List looks alright. I do agree that 30 besties can be difficult, 30 20 10 could be a good way to go. 

[The_Yellow_Sign]

7 hours ago, benmoorepaintco said:

Hey y'all, I'm still pretty new to BoC and I'm working on a list I can take to a gaming store/maybe some local tournaments. It looks like this:

Beastlord: general, unravelling aura, mutating gnarlblade
Great Bray Shaman: knowing eye, vicious stranglethorns (to sit at the herdstone)
Great Bray Shaman: tendrils of atrophy
Great Bray Shaman: Wild Rampage

10x ungors
10x ungor raiders
30x ungor raiders (these can alternately be build as 2 20 man units)
10x gors: gor blades & beastshields
30x bestigors
30x bestigors
5x centigors (because I really like the models)
1x Chaos Spawn

1x Ghorgon

Desolating Beastherd

Wildfire Taurus

 

Can I do anything with this list, or do I need to revamp it  again?

I think it's a solid list. I think that the  small Raider unit you have is a good choice since they give you a forward alpha-strike screen thanks to their 6" move after deployment.

[Myrdin]

We `re gonna play a fast 500 skirmish game today. Not sure about the rules and how you build the list, only that they were released in WD as an extra.

Thus I just did the list as for any normal game:

1x Beastlord with Axe or Blade for artifact

2x10 Bestigors

1x10 Ungors

1x Chariot

1x Razorgor

Exactly 500 pts. If there will be objective play, Chariot and Piggy got it covered. If its gonna be just a slugfest, they wont be as useful albeit for maybe flanking the enemy Character. A well balanced list if I may say so myself. Especially after seeing some of the things other people forced into those 500pts, "sigh and an eye roll". 

This game is mostly introductory for some new players we got, and also to get the others get used to the GHB changes.

 

I have been thnking about the Furies again.... I am kinda torn on this. I have a LOT of harpies from back in the day. Some from Mantic, some from Raging heroes. I do like the new Gargoyle-esque look these guys have, but rather than getting those giving the old minis of mine some use again sounds like a better choice... especially those from RG, since theirs stuff aint so cheap for it to just sit on a shelf.  The unit itself looks solid though. (Cant understand why they didnt include BoC keyword though. At least the Raptorix are clearly mutated Beasts.)

Any idea about their base size ? Cant find them in the GW shop yet, so unsure, but they look like 40mm to me.

Edited July 25, 2019 by Myrdin

[Maddpainting]

At 500pts and learning, just play w/e looks cool, learn all the rules first then you'll understand the list building and able to figure out what you like.

After you play a few games come back and talk, then we can really help you find what you like  

[Kazimer]

A start collecting Beastmen is actually a really good way to learn. If you make your Ungors into bowmen you pretty much get 500 on the nose and you get a great idea of everything Beastmen have to offer.

[Myrdin]

2 hours ago, Maddpainting said:

At 500pts and learning, just play w/e looks cool, learn all the rules first then you'll understand the list building and able to figure out what you like.

After you play a few games come back and talk, then we can really help you find what you like  

Guys , you`re talking as if I was a newbie here lol

I`ve been playing Beastmen long before AoS was a thing. The game was mostly for new players and for the rest of us who wanna take a look at the GHB changes that happened lately. Either my comment was written in a confusing way or people people assumed that due to the small points range and me stating its an introductory game, not reading the whole text.

Anyway. Yeah, single chariots, are not good. Always take them in pairs minimum, ideally in 3s

[Maddpainting]

I dont remember everyones names. And honestly assumed if you are going to forums you needed to discus something. I'm sorry for assuming.

But about the Furies, i for sure am going to run 1 unit of them, good movement with fly and 2 wounds each for cheap. Heck yeah i'm taking them.

 

[decker_cky]

2 hours ago, Myrdin said:

Guys , you`re talking as if I was a newbie here lol

I`ve been playing Beastmen long before AoS was a thing. The game was mostly for new players and for the rest of us who wanna take a look at the GHB changes that happened lately. Either my comment was written in a confusing way or people people assumed that due to the small points range and me stating its an introductory game, not reading the whole text.

Anyway. Yeah, single chariots, are not good. Always take them in pairs minimum, ideally in 3s

What about cheap exploding chariot spam in the nurgle battalion (particularly in nurgle allegiance, which allows chariots to run and charge)?

 

Also, how is 3 a choice when for 20 pts more, you have a unit of 4 chariots?

Edited July 26, 2019 by decker_cky

[Tankman]

Couldn't find anything in FAQ but can the Devolve spell be used to break unit coherency if enemy unit models are closer to 2 different units?

[swarmofseals]

1 hour ago, Tankman said:

Couldn't find anything in FAQ but can the Devolve spell be used to break unit coherency if enemy unit models are closer to 2 different units?

That's an interesting one. I don't think so because I'm fairly certain that you can't legally break unit coherency when moving, so breaking coherency in order to get closer to two different enemy units wouldn't be "possible" under the normal movement rules. That said, I'm not entirely sure what should happen in this situation. My best guess is that the opponent would start moving models, and then would have to make a move with each model in succession that fulfilled the requirements of the spell to the greatest extent possible given the rules of movement. So you'd end up with the unit strung out thinly. That's just a guess though.

[Myrdin]

15 hours ago, decker_cky said:

What about cheap exploding chariot spam in the nurgle battalion (particularly in nurgle allegiance, which allows chariots to run and charge)?

 

Also, how is 3 a choice when for 20 pts more, you have a unit of 4 chariots?

I was comparing the unit of 3 to the 1x1x1. Ofc if you have 4, then use 4 in a big cheap blocking unit.  

That nurgle thing is so weak I dont even.... if it was D3 MV this would be another story.

And I personally dont play anything nurgle related. Just dont like Nurgle in general

 

Or ok, let me clarify: Single chariots are good for objective capturing. Not for combat and or blocking. Should have said this in the first place. Since Razorgors are now more expensive and funny enough when doing my lists no longer work as padding, since those 40pts was a sweet spot that I always had to fill out after finishing those list, I think the Chariots are now a better option and a replacement for them.  More wounds, better save and more damage output in general. Never mention Shamans speed buff.

 

@Maddpainting No harm done. It was just genuinely funny to me seeing as I`ve been active here for at least a year by now

Edited July 27, 2019 by Myrdin

[Sauriv]

It's the opponent that makes the move and "the closest unit" is measured one time "at the start of the move". In all other cases I'm aware of when 2 things are equally close the player who does stuff choose one, the opponent in this case. 

I interpret the text concerning models to make sure that each model actually moves as close as possible so that the opponent can't make a thin line in the direction, keeping the main 80% where they were. 

[decker_cky]

15 hours ago, Myrdin said:

That nurgle thing is so weak I dont even.... if it was D3 MV this would be another story.

It's a huge aura (7" from a huge base), and triggers on a 2+ (nearly every D3 MW aura ability in the game triggers on a 4+, which barely more MW on average than 1 on a 2+).  Not good enough on its own, but I definitely think that if you have a nurgle list already (and beasts bring some great tricks to nurgle), filling out with a pile of single chariots as chaff is a solid choice. With the wheel, spells available, and a bit of shooting, typical 5 wound heroes can be put in a precarious situation, and that often shuts down or suppresses synergy your opponent planned to rely upon. 

[kenshin620]

Plus one thing about the god battalions is that they're some of the most flexible battalions in the game with all brayherds, warherds, and thunderscorn available (except khorne shaggys. Thats not a thing because wizards!)

Edited July 29, 2019 by kenshin620

[Maddpainting]

So, i am a... army horde. I'm fixing that and going to be selling my IDK, i already have 6k points in BoC (I basically have max size of every unit and then some). Im also selling 4 of my 7 40k armies.

But i wanted to have the ability to play all the Chaos armies with my BoC, this will handle my multi-army itch (I hope), i know what i need for Khorne, Tzeentch, and Slaanesh, but i have no idea what i need to buy for Nurgle.

What units do i need to buy for nurgle to be able to play MoN BoC army?

[kenshin620]

Are we talking about mortal/daemon choices?

Need sorcerers. Blades of Putrification is one of the most valuable spells for nurgle, especially if you stack it on attack heavy models like centigors or dragon ogors. Maybe a mortal hero to carry Rustfang since you won't have access to tendrils of atrophy.

[Great Bray Tom]

I proxied a Chaos Sorcerer Lord this weekend as a spellcaster instead of a Bray Herd and an extra command point.

Holy ****** this guy is incredible with Bestigor and Bullgor.

[Skreech Verminking]

19 minutes ago, Great Bray Tom said:

I proxied a Chaos Sorcerer Lord this weekend as a spellcaster instead of a Bray Herd and an extra command point.

Holy ****** this guy is incredible with Bestigor and Bullgor.

Interesting, so I’m guessing the daemonic power spell helps a lot.

 

[Maddpainting]

3 hours ago, kenshin620 said:

Are we talking about mortal/daemon choices?

Need sorcerers. Blades of Putrification is one of the most valuable spells for nurgle, especially if you stack it on attack heavy models like centigors or dragon ogors. Maybe a mortal hero to carry Rustfang since you won't have access to tendrils of atrophy.

I'm not sure if it matters? What every buffs and abilities Beastmen can use. But thanks for the good start.
 

2 hours ago, Great Bray Tom said:

I proxied a Chaos Sorcerer Lord this weekend as a spellcaster instead of a Bray Herd and an extra command point.

Holy ****** this guy is incredible with Bestigor and Bullgor.

Yeah, i use one all the time, i had one at Adepticon (Beastlord, Shaman, 1 Shaman Disk, 1 Lord on mount, 30 bestigors, 40 Raiders, 1x9 Tzaangors on Disk, Battalion, Cogs, and 2x10 ungors for fill battalion and battleline).

It was really worth it IMO. I really missed the 2nd Shaman tho, and its not possible tod o that list now that Cogs/Disks went up in points, it'll be 50pts over i think.

The Bestigors won me game 1 easily, crazy enough the Disks didnt do all that well, the Bestigors and Raiders did better, everyone knew what they did and made it very hard for me to do anything with them.

Edited July 29, 2019 by Maddpainting

[Danger Wizard 5000]

This last Saturday I played a 2000 pt game against Flesh Eater Courts, using the new Scorched Earth scenario. His list was;

Ghoul King on Terrorgheist

6 Flayers and a corresponding hero

6 Horrors and a corresponding hero

3 units of 10 ghouls and 1 ghoul hero

Vargulf

Small, compact force, one that I learned takes damage on the chin and rip almost anything apart. He was running them as Gristlegore.

 

My list was a 2 drop, Ghavespawn using the Desolating Beastherd. Included in that was

1 Beastlord w Mutating Axe

3 Shamans, one with the Knowing Eye artifact

2 units of 30 Bestigors

10 Ungors

40 Ungor Raiders

1 Tuskgor Chariot

1 Cygor

Wildfire Taurus

Chronomantic Cogs

 

Outside of the battalion was a unit of 5 Centigors for harassing/objective grabbing

 

We deployed on the short sides of the table as per the scenario rules, and I elected to go first.

 

I’ll spare the details, but the gist was I charged him top of turn 1 with both units of bestigors, the centigors and chariot. I cast chronomantic cogs and the wildfire taurus, which was too far to reach anything turn 1. In the shooting phase my Cygor took aim and knocked down 3 ghouls from the leading unit. My ungor raiders failed to kill a single horror with their shooting despite rerolling 1s and 2s to hit, then took cover behind the line of furry bodies surging forward. The unit of Bestigors on the right went first, splitting their attacks between the units of horrors and flayers, killing a couple each. On the counter attack the 2 big crypt units, their heroes and the vargulf killed my centigors, 20 bestigors and left the chariot at 1 wound. My bestigors on the other flank slaughtered the 10 ghouls they charged but failed to kill the ghoul hero. In the battleshock phase I realized I had left my general too far back, so despite having 3 command points the remaining bestigors fled the field, denying me from scoring the objective by them. Still, I scored my 4 objectives and the one on his left flank.

 

On his turn the pain truly began. He brought back all of his casualties from his horror and flayer unit, screamed my poor chariot to timbers, then charged my bestigors with his terrorgheist and horrors and my now horribly exposed raiders with his flayers. Both units were wiped out due to a combo of double attacking from the flayers and massive mortal wound output from the terrorghest. Battleshock took care of the rest. I really screwed myself by not placing my heroes closer to my big expensive units like I usually do but it was a poignant reminder. He only scored his 4 objectives, putting us at 5-4.

 

By the end of round 1 I had suffered 101 casualties, not including the sacrificial ungors. Things were looking grim but it was a friendly game, so we played on. 

 

He won the double turn and plowed forward, “nobly” devouring my Cygor, Beastlord and the shaman on an objective. My heroes devolved into shrieking chaos spawns that tied up his big units temporarily. He burned both of my lead objectives and rolled high, putting him around 11 or 12 points.

 

ON my turn I went into damage control mode. I knew it was unlikely that I could win but still a mathematical possibility. I retreated my chaos spawn Beastlord out of combat and raced it towards his back field. My 2 shamans and ungors backed away from the ghouls. I summoned 5 centigors next to one of his leading unprotected objectives, claiming it. I ended my turn on 3 objectives, closing the gap to 7-12. I decided not to burn the objective I had just stolen this turn, hoping to seize initiative next turn and score it for 2 rounds.

Alas, my opponent won initiative, but was too far forward to double back and kill my Centigors. So, he pressed forwards, his flayers screaming and killing my Shaman. That shaman also devolved into a mound gibbering flesh and I used the 6” placement rule to tie up all 3 of the units that were encroaching on the objective there, denying them the charge to my terrified ungors beyond. He slaughtered my last shaman and the chaos spawn that had appeared amidst the flayers and burned my 3^rd objective, only rolling a 1 for points. He had also used his once per battle summoning ability to bring in another unit of flayers towards my back end, so he was

 

My turn I ran my chaos spawn onto the objective I had just claimed and my centigors hoofed it to the 10 ghouls in the back field guarding one of his objectives. They made their 5” charge and cleared all the ghouls, suffering only 1 wound in return. I scored 3 objectives, burning none, and rolled for initiative for round 4…

 

Which I won! I charged the second unit of ghouls on his other rear objective, killing 6 but losing 1 centigor, so the objective stayed under his control. I moved my chaos spawn further backs towards his rear objectives and burned the one in the center, netting 2 points for that one and 2 more for mine and his back objectives. On his turn he claimed my last home objective, wiping out my brave ungors, and raced everything he could towards my marauding centogors. His ghoul king on terroghiest landed near his central objective, crouching protectively over it. He did not burn my last objective, since I had nothing to contest it with, and we rolled for initiative for the final round.

 

Mercifully, I won initiative, and ran my centigors to within 6” of the objective guarded by the terrogheist, grabbing it from out under his rotted nose. My last act was to burn all 3 of his objectives, rolling high and scoring 8 points, bring me to a total of 22 points. At this point it was impossible for my opponent to score higher, so with only models I had summoned onto the field remaining I had emerged victorious! It was a nail biter of a game and I made some poor tactical choices in the beginning, but once I only had a few units to work with I was much more analytical and careful with my remaining tools and it worked!

 

My opponent was a great player and really fun to play against. We were both surprised at the tricks of each other’s armies and learned a lot. I can’t wait for a rematch! Hope you guys enjoyed reading.

[Popisdead]

5 hours ago, Great Bray Tom said:

I proxied a Chaos Sorcerer Lord this weekend as a spellcaster instead of a Bray Herd and an extra command point.

Holy ****** this guy is incredible with Bestigor and Bullgor.

Mmmm yeah totally forgot about him.  thanks   RR1s is a very underrated ability.  

[Kazimer]

What are the odds if the StD book comes out soon that the spell and ability the Sorcerer has will.become Mortal only though? Or even worse, StD only.

[Myrdin]

13 hours ago, Kazimer said:

What are the odds if the StD book comes out soon that the spell and ability the Sorcerer has will.become Mortal only though? Or even worse, StD only.

Now this might not mean much but BoC and StD have always been compatible allies.

For us, currently they are the only ones we can take. For them BoC have always been  an access to cheap chaff (though these days there is some more we offer as well).  As such I dont see the ability changing and limiting the effect even more. I mean one would have to go against a lot of established lore as well to deny a Chaos Chosen champion the ability to lead and inspire all of his minions, the slavering braying hordes of mutants and beastmen included.

Granted, it might always happen. I just think it wont but I guess we`ll see. Really looking forward to the Free Cities book, though I honestly and truly dislike the fact its a mixed book. Elves, and Dwarves should be their own thing, as should be the Free Cities a purely Empire thing. Why did they include SCE who already have 2 books is also beyond me.

I just wanted the good old Empire back, in AoS Coat, with some new tricks up its sleeve. Not this combination of 4 factions, that will turn out into the ultimate cheese lists one can imagine. But I guess we will see soon, once the book hits the shelves.