AoS 2 - Legion Of Azgorh Discussion

[Lord Krungharr]

I saw many players giving allied heroes a relic at Adepticon.  That would be an important detail.  An allied Verminlord Corruptor with a Sword of Judgement...…..or not?

[Ravinsild]

15 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:

I saw many players giving allied heroes a relic at Adepticon.  That would be an important detail.  An allied Verminlord Corruptor with a Sword of Judgement...…..or not?

You saw many players unfortunately doing it wrong then. 

It does not specify in the core rules but it absolutely does in the core rules designers commentary. 

Edited April 19, 2019 by Ravinsild

[Lord Krungharr]

Whoa, that's a big deal!  Thanks for pointing that out clearly; it's now etched in me brains.

[Lobeau]

I've been pretty happy with the K'aadi myself. They're kinda a soft target, so it's best to put them down behind one of your units and use their 3inch attach range to your advantage, where they can't hit you back. Then if needed, fly them out and reposition when needed.

[Lord Krungharr]

The fly, plus their run and charge, is so very good, since we lack good speed in general.  If I can find a bunch of exalted flamer bits maybe I'll convert some old school big hats into K'daai.  The FW ones just didn't fit the look of my old army.

 

[Televiper11]

So I took this 1K list...
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Bull Centaur Taur'ruk (160)
- General
- Trait: Grotesque 
- Artefact: Armour of Bazherak the Cruel 
Shar'tor the Executioner (220)
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
20 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (180)
20 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (180)
Magma Cannon (140)
Total: 980 / 1000
Wounds: 66

...for a test-spin prior to my 1K tournament this weekend and had mixed results: I managed to table Sylvaneth in round 4 thanks to a double turn and my Magma Cannon rolling hot but I then got tabled by Nurgle in round 3, partly due to failed rolls but also due to being slow/unable to put any real hurt on his Blightlords.

As a result, am think of modifying my list to look like this:
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Bull Centaur Taur'ruk (160)
- General
- Trait: Grotesque 
- Artefact: Armour of Bazherak the Cruel 
Shar'tor the Executioner (220)
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
3 x K'Daai Fireborn (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Total: 940 / 1000
Extra Command Points: 1
Wounds: 55

Am concerned with having less wounds. Should I drop Shar'tor and just run more Fireborn?

I also picked up two rules questions: 

1) Artefact: Armour of Bazherak the Cruel -- is this a second save against all wounds or rolled on a per wound basis?

2) Does the Blackshard Armor count towards MW as well as regular ones? Wording is vague.

Edited April 24, 2019 by Televiper11

[Lord Krungharr]

I might run Shartor in that case as another Tauruk and save the points.  I feel he's better in larger games with Renders.

More Fireborn!  Or Fireglaives!

Seems like the Ironsworn should be able to dish out some pain in return for suffering pain with the spiteshields.

The Cruel Armor is indeed a second save vs wounds and mortal wounds after your armor save (if needed).  And it's per damage suffered, so if your armor fails vs a 3 damage attack, you take 3 separate additional 5+ saves.  Or if you suffer 6 mortal wounds from an enemy lightning cannon for example, you take 6 separate 5+ saves.

Blackshard Armor is only ignoring regular wounds, not mortal wounds.  Some might argue otherwise but in AoS, GW is pretty consistent about spelling out things that affect wounds vs mortal wounds, or things that affect both.  Of course it would be nice if it was both for the Blackshard Armor; seems like Drazhoath used to have a 5+ vs wounds and mortal wounds before......

[Televiper11]

21 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

I might run Shartor in that case as another Tauruk and save the points.  I feel he's better in larger games with Renders.

More Fireborn!  Or Fireglaives!

Seems like the Ironsworn should be able to dish out some pain in return for suffering pain with the spiteshields.

The Cruel Armor is indeed a second save vs wounds and mortal wounds after your armor save (if needed).  And it's per damage suffered, so if your armor fails vs a 3 damage attack, you take 3 separate additional 5+ saves.  Or if you suffer 6 mortal wounds from an enemy lightning cannon for example, you take 6 separate 5+ saves.

Blackshard Armor is only ignoring regular wounds, not mortal wounds.  Some might argue otherwise but in AoS, GW is pretty consistent about spelling out things that affect wounds vs mortal wounds, or things that affect both.  Of course it would be nice if it was both for the Blackshard Armor; seems like Drazhoath used to have a 5+ vs wounds and mortal wounds before......

Thanks for the clarification. And I did indeed go with more Fireborn! (Not taking Fireglaives due to Ulgu shooting restrictions)

Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Bull Centaur Taur'ruk (160)
- General
- Trait: Grotesque 
- Artefact: Armour of Bazherak the Cruel 
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
6 x K'Daai Fireborn (280)
3 x K'Daai Fireborn (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Total: 1000 
Wounds: 65

Quick question: can someone clarify this Fireborn rule for me?

Ignore modifiers (positive or negative) when making save rolls for attacks that target this unit. That means they ignore rend, right? And their save roll is always 5+? (which is a weak save) -- do they wear the Blackshard Armor?

Is it worth dropping 1 unit of Fireborn to bring a Chaos Sorcerer Lord to buff the other 2 units? (never mind, puts me 20pts over)

Edited April 25, 2019 by Televiper11
tidied it up

[Lord Krungharr]

Correct, the Fireborn ignore rend values, or anything that could possibly make their save worse (like the herdstone effect) or anything that could make their save better (not sure if there is such a thing).  And I'm pretty positive they do have the Legion of Azgorh keywords so get the Blackshard Armor wound ignoring effect.

[Blackspine]

Has anyone tried mass blobs of infantry?
2-3 packs of 20-30 fireglaives

2 packs of 30 ironsworn

They're very cheap. and if they can get to objectives, would most assuredly not go anywhere anytime soon. 

Coupled with the support of Kdaai/taruks/artillery it sounds great (not terribly exciting, I'd warrant)

[Drazhoath]

17 minutes ago, Blackspine said:

Has anyone tried mass blobs of infantry?
2-3 packs of 20-30 fireglaives

2 packs of 30 ironsworn

They're very cheap. and if they can get to objectives, would most assuredly not go anywhere anytime soon. 

Coupled with the support of Kdaai/taruks/artillery it sounds great (not terribly exciting, I'd warrant)

I ever play fireglaives in units of 10. You are more flexible even if an enemy unit charge one of your fireglaives.

[Televiper11]

Further armor questions:

• If Taur'ruk wears the Armor of Bazherak, he can't also wear the Blackshard Armor, right?
• Is that also true for the Daemsonsmith's Ensorcelled Armor?

[Charly2912]

@Televiper11 Blackshard Armor is our Battletrait 

All LoA units benefit from it regardless of artefacts or warscroll abilities 

@Blackspine I havent tried it yet but i am absolutely planning to do! Missing 20 more fireglaives for 2 units of 30

I will also add the blackshard warhost battalion to this list. Besides of the obvious Extra CP and artefact, Dropping 122 dwarves (including the heroes)  and nearly 1500 points at once will help us to Pick who goes First.

It also provides buffs to the majority of the army - bringing even the fireglaives to 4/4/-/1 with rerolling 1s to hit and wound in melee. (Castellan command ability not even taken into Account). 

Prolly add a DS and 3 magma cannons bringing you to 1980 points. Points left for a minor endless Spell or triumph (i imagine rerollin all hit rolls on a 30 Block of fireglaives can be pretty devastating) 

Draz might have its place too for the battleshock bubble but i guess we should drop down to 20 FGs then because there wouldnt be much spare points left otherwise 

One problem i see is that the FGs wont Profit from the blackshard armor as much as they would do in smaller units.

And i Guess you are right about the "exciting playstyle" of such an army still worth trying it out! 

 

Edited April 28, 2019 by Charly2912

[Lord Krungharr]

Even with 2 units of 30 Fireglaives in a Blackshard Warhost you can still split your shots if/as needed, to perform like smaller units.

I still want to try out the massed Spiteshield trick with allied Sorcerer Lord (for Oracular Visions) to see how many mortal wounds they can deal by making saves of 6s.  I only have the Renders for that, maybe someday I'll have 60 Ironsworn though.

 

[Televiper11]

1K tournament is tomorrow, set in Ulgu, with hidden agendas. I'm feeling pretty solid about my list. Made a last minute decision to break-up my Fireborn to give me more movement around the board so I can compete for objectives faster.

Allegiance: Legion of Azgorh
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Bull Centaur Taur'ruk (160)
- General
- Trait: Grotesque 
- Artefact: Armour of Bazherak the Cruel 
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
3 x K'Daai Fireborn (140)
3 x K'Daai Fireborn (140)
3 x K'Daai Fireborn (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Total: 1000 
Wounds: 65
 

No idea what armies I'll be facing. Their last tourney saw Bonesplitters, Stormcast, DoK, Nighthaunt, and Mixed Destruction.

This is my first ever matched play event. My goal is to learn, have fun, and not come last. 

Edited April 27, 2019 by Televiper11

[Charly2912]

@Lord Krungharr

 

i meant Blackshard Armor and not Blackshard Warhost in my con argument. Sorry - its edited.

 

 @Televiper11

and the kdaai profit more often of the battletrait in 2 smaller units. Good luck and tell us how it went

Edited April 28, 2019 by Charly2912

[Televiper11]

Well, I came last but had fun at the 1K tournament none-the-less.

Played three games vs. Fyreslayers, Bonesplitterz, and Stormcast. 

Took a major loss to the Slayers, partly due to being unprepared for their new Tome buffs but partly due to poor deployment on my part. They chewed me up and that's that.

Took a major loss to Bonesplitterz, 

Spoiler

but I think my opponent might have been cheating me on his saves. And the game was ugly all around so I'm just tossing the results from it.

Took a minor loss to Stormcast. I was well-positioned to win the game but we ran out of time. This was the only game where I felt the true potential of my LoA list as I nailed all my buffs and showed decent tactical play. Taur'ruk alone wiped out a unit of Sequitors. And I rolled hot with my Daemonsmith -- Blood of Hashut is awesome!

With practice I can see this being a really strong army. I am pleased with them.

Edited May 1, 2019 by Televiper11

[Entombet]

I hawe turnament next week and plan to use this list.

Allegiance: Legion of Azgorh
Bull Centaur Taur'ruk (160)
- General
- Trait: Grotesque 
- Artefact: Armour of Bazherak the Cruel 
Drazhoath the Ashen (320)
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
6 x K'Daai Fireborn (280)
Magma Cannon (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Skullcracker War Engine (200)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 122
 

[Televiper11]

Battalion question: I am building out my list for a 2K tourney and have the models necessary to build both the BSW & HWAT but not enough points to carry both. I'm leaning towards the War Train as that Infernal Engineer buff is pretty sweet and would allow to bring a ton of artillery.  BSW feels slightly redundant to me as my battleline units already carry the +1 Bravery Icon. I also don't really want to carry the Castellan or Standard Bearer when those points could go to more K'daai or more shooting.

Thoughts?

 

Edited May 10, 2019 by Televiper11

[Entombet]

1 hour ago, Televiper11 said:

Battalion question: I am building out my list for a 2K tourney and have the models necessary to build both the BSW & HWAT but not enough points to carry both. I'm leaning towards the War Train as that Infernal Engineer buff is pretty sweet and would allow to bring a ton of artillery.  BSW feels slightly redundant to me as my battleline units already carry the +1 Bravery Icon. I also don't really want to carry the Castellan or Standard Bearer when those points could go to more K'daai or more shooting.

Thoughts?

 

All our battalions are pointless

[Blackspine]

8 hours ago, Entombet said:

I hawe turnament next week and plan to use this list.

Allegiance: Legion of Azgorh
Bull Centaur Taur'ruk (160)
- General
- Trait: Grotesque 
- Artefact: Armour of Bazherak the Cruel 
Drazhoath the Ashen (320)
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
10 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (90)
6 x K'Daai Fireborn (280)
Magma Cannon (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Skullcracker War Engine (200)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 122
 

I like this list!
The one thing I see is that the small units may struggle to hold objectives. 20 ironsworn is almost the same price as 30.
Draz is there, meaning battle shock won't be much of a problem.
but there's not a lot to block the enemy from collapsing your small lines.

 

[Blackspine]

11 minutes ago, Entombet said:

All our battalions are pointless

They're pretty cheap considering a lot of battalions.
Artillery train is most of the things you'd want to bring anyway.
 

120 for command point, and an item, and the range on the smith is a good deal to me.

The others...less so. 

I don't think bull centaurs prove enough of a threat to make it viable. They're good blockers/ grabbers, but they hit as hard as a ten pound bag of wafers. 

[Televiper11]

9 minutes ago, Blackspine said:

They're pretty cheap considering a lot of battalions.
Artillery train is most of the things you'd want to bring anyway.
 

120 for command point, and an item, and the range on the smith is a good deal to me.

The others...less so. 

I don't think bull centaurs prove enough of a threat to make it viable. They're good blockers/ grabbers, but they hit as hard as a ten pound bag of wafers. 

Yeah, BCR kinda suck. Even Shar'tor isn't that great. I only ever use Taur'ruk -- he actually hits like a tank!

I'm going with the Artillery Train and dropping the Blackshard Warhost.

[Televiper11]

I'm in an escalation league so my next list is gonna be 1,250pts and I'm just adding some Fireglaives. But for 1.5K-2K, I'm running the Train with two Magma's and a Deathshrieker.

[Blackspine]

9 minutes ago, Televiper11 said:

Yeah, BCR kinda suck. Even Shar'tor isn't that great. I only ever use Taur'ruk -- he actually hits like a tank!

I'm going with the Artillery Train and dropping the Blackshard Warhost.

Fully convinced the Taruk is one of hardest hitters Chaos has. (characters)
point for point, possibly the best.

Cheap enough to toss out out and watch them do loads of damage and shrug when opponent sends 3-5 times his cost to kill him. 
(or spends a lot of shooting. either way.)