AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion

[Wulfrik the Wanderer]

1 minute ago, ccconner777 said:

I didnt realize archaon had all the keywords on his warscroll baseline, I assumed he was just marked like everyone else. Thanks for pointing that out! So archaon could have every aura buff (except only one of the general aura upgrades of course) if you had a hero of each mark in your army? Interesting

Yes this is what would happen. This is only possible due to his "Slaves to Darkness"  and each individual keyword on his warscroll. Since Aura's only look for keywords, and none are removed due to the Aura of Chaos allegiance ability, then you can benefit so long as you have an appropriately marked slaves to darkness hero nearby. Difficulty comes with 1. keeping up with Archaon and 2. getting that Phat Base wholly within 12".

[Rod]

52 minutes ago, Midjithero said:

In my opinion, I feel that it helps your unit both offensively and defensively.  

With the Hero Aura, you get 6s do +1 dmg and -1 to hit with shooting.

with Warshrine you get the first ability no matter what, ReRoll ALL wounds (so you fish for 6s), and if the unit is Nurgle you get +1 save.

with the Plaguetouched Warband, you get the 6s bounce back MWs.

overall, I’d consider Nurgle to give the best benefits in this book, followed by Slaanesh, and then the other 3 are truely army flavor specific.  

 

You need 3+ gor the chant to pass

[sal4m4nd3r]

2 hours ago, Wulfrik the Wanderer said:

Yes this is what would happen. This is only possible due to his "Slaves to Darkness"  and each individual keyword on his warscroll. Since Aura's only look for keywords, and none are removed due to the Aura of Chaos allegiance ability, then you can benefit so long as you have an appropriately marked slaves to darkness hero nearby. Difficulty comes with 1. keeping up with Archaon and 2. getting that Phat Base wholly within 12".

He also has the hedonites keyword. No clue why but he does. 

[Wulfrik the Wanderer]

2 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

He also has the hedonites keyword. No clue why but he does. 

Well, if you chose to take him in a Hedonites of Slaanesh army, he would be able to benefit from certain battalions, spells, and most of all, Locus of Diversion. Which is pretty cool!

[JackStreicher]

2 hours ago, Wulfrik the Wanderer said:

Well, if you chose to take him in a Hedonites of Slaanesh army, he would be able to benefit from certain battalions, spells, and most of all, Locus of Diversion. Which is pretty cool!

*broken

[TheMuphinMan]

Would never play this because I'd probably never be able to face the person again but I call this Brannigan's List after the legendary Captain Zap Brannigan

Allegiance: Host of the Everchosen
Plaguetouched Warband (180)
-Archaon the Everchosen (800) general Lore of the Damned: Mask of Darkness
-Chaos Sorcerer Lord (110) Lore of the Damned:?
-Chaos Marauders (150) x4
-Chaos Spawn (50) x2

Daemon Prince of Nurgle 210

2000pt/2000pt

Each turn you send a wave of buffed chaos marauders at the enemy (mask of darkness to teleport 9" away then its only a 1/36 chance to fail charge), and try and tie up as many units as possible. Each 6 to hit against them is d3 mortals back (daemon prince) and each 6 to wound is 1 mortal back (battalion). Every time one dies it can pile in and fight (archaon's command ability).

other options could be replace sorcerer lord for 2 spawns to allow one of the marauder units to go up to 40, or dropping the warband/spawns for more marauders or to add in sayl for an extra teleport attempt,

Edited December 13, 2019 by TheMuphinMan

[Janevit]

14 minutes ago, TheMuphinMan said:

Would never play this because I'd probably never be able to face the person again but I call this Brannigan's List after the legendary Captain Zap Brannigan

Allegiance: Host of the Everchosen
Plaguetouched Warband (180)
-Archaon the Everchosen (800) general Lore of the Damned: Mask of Darkness
-Chaos Sorcerer Lord (110) Lore of the Damned:?
-Chaos Marauders (150) x4
-Chaos Spawn (50) x2

Daemon Prince of Nurgle 210

2000pt/2000pt

Each turn you send a wave of buffed chaos marauders at the enemy (mask of darkness to teleport 9" away then its only a 1/36 chance to fail charge), and try and tie up as many units as possible. Each 6 to hit against them is d3 mortals back (daemon prince) and each 6 to wound is 1 mortal back (battalion). Every time one dies it can pile in and fight (archaon's command ability).

IIRC Plaguetouched need 1 STD nurgle mortal Hero and 7 STD nurgle mortal units. Are spawns mortal? 

Edited: yes they are. Interesting. 👍

Edited December 13, 2019 by Janevit

[TheMuphinMan]

2 minutes ago, Janevit said:

IIRC Plaguetouched need 1 STD nurgle mortal Hero and 7 STD nurgle mortal units. Your list got 5/7 so need to change a little bit. 👍

hero: archaon

units: sorcerer 1, marauder x4 2-5, spawn x2 6&7

 

[Sinfullyvannila]

5 minutes ago, Janevit said:

IIRC Plaguetouched need 1 STD nurgle mortal Hero and 7 STD nurgle mortal units. Are spawns mortal? 

Should be

[JackStreicher]

38 minutes ago, TheMuphinMan said:

Would never play this because I'd probably never be able to face the person again but I call this Brannigan's List after the legendary Captain Zap Brannigan

Allegiance: Host of the Everchosen
Plaguetouched Warband (180)
-Archaon the Everchosen (800) general Lore of the Damned: Mask of Darkness
-Chaos Sorcerer Lord (110) Lore of the Damned:?
-Chaos Marauders (150) x4
-Chaos Spawn (50) x2

Daemon Prince of Nurgle 210

2000pt/2000pt

Each turn you send a wave of buffed chaos marauders at the enemy (mask of darkness to teleport 9" away then its only a 1/36 chance to fail charge), and try and tie up as many units as possible. Each 6 to hit against them is d3 mortals back (daemon prince) and each 6 to wound is 1 mortal back (battalion). Every time one dies it can pile in and fight (archaon's command ability).

other options could be replace sorcerer lord for 2 spawns to allow one of the marauder units to go up to 40, or dropping the warband/spawns for more marauders or to add in sayl for an extra teleport attempt,

Well well good Sir, I think you broke the game 🤣

[Gibs]

Marauders are looking badass and clearly the chosen infantry in this book!  

Putting them to one side what are your thoughts on optimizing  Chaos Warriors and Knights given we have amazing new models for them?

 

 

 

 

Edited December 13, 2019 by Gibs

[TheMuphinMan]

26 minutes ago, Gibs said:

Marauders are looking badass and clearly the chosen infantry in this book!  

Putting them to one side what are your thoughts on optimizing  Chaos Warriors and Knights given we have amazing new models for them?

 

 

 

 

warriors are 10pts a wound with good saves and the shields give a save against mortal wounds so they can sit on an objective pretty easily. If you go a warshrine and undivided they have two 6+ ward saves on top of that or go nurgle and shrine for a 3+ save with rerolls, then a single 6+ ward save if they stay in the bubble. Could use the shrine on a block of nurgle warriors, then use Sayl's spell or the mask of darkness spell to get them on a far objective early to set up shop.

knights are more mobile  and have a bigger footprint (if stretched lengthwise) so they could set up a screen/blockcade/escort for whatever hammer you are using and can block LoS for foot heroes.

[Gibs]

29 minutes ago, TheMuphinMan said:

warriors are 10pts a wound with good saves and the shields give a save against mortal wounds so they can sit on an objective pretty easily. If you go a warshrine and undivided they have two 6+ ward saves on top of that or go nurgle and shrine for a 3+ save with rerolls, then a single 6+ ward save if they stay in the bubble. Could use the shrine on a block of nurgle warriors, then use Sayl's spell or the mask of darkness spell to get them on a far objective early to set up shop.

knights are more mobile  and have a bigger footprint (if stretched lengthwise) so they could set up a screen/blockcade/escort for whatever hammer you are using and can block LoS for foot heroes.

I have only had a skim through the book as technically the shop won't let us take it away for another 24 hours. However, was considering running shields in the front and then halberds in the rear. Duel hand weapons looks the most killy, especially with Khorne but is that the roll of another unit? Park a Khorne DP next to a block of warriors near some terrain and they are not easy pickings though. 

My first impression of the knights were they seemed a little 'meh' for the points, maybe I am being a little harash? They feel like Warriors i.e. a little bit tanky and a little bit killy but they don't really excel in anything.   They are a very expensive screening!

No question the War-shrine is much improved and will be a great supporting unit for a foot slogging army. 

Edited December 13, 2019 by Gibs

[mmimzie]

39 minutes ago, Gibs said:

Marauders are looking badass and clearly the chosen infantry in this book!  

Putting them to one side what are your thoughts on optimizing  Chaos Warriors and Knights given we have amazing new models for them?

 

 

 

 

marauders want cabalist as an important note as they want to be teleported, and that spell goes off a a 7+ which means 42% of the time (not a small margine) you won't be picking your fights against a lot of the fighty armies. While you definitly want 20 man squads, 8 wounds of on a couple of these units is enough to make them basicly useless, and means they can be threatend by throw away screen and small objective grabber units.  Thier power lies in MSU and being layers of onions that need to be peeled. I think if your gonna go heavy maurder battalion heavy is where you want to go. Maurders definitly are money damage wise, but i think if your not running cabalist you might be a bit disappointed with your army needing crucial spells. 

I think the knights are no joke, while they have a lower damage output they need less support to do thier job, just a chaos lord hanging around and a sorcerer lord for easy buffs. So they can fight into any army as a strong hammer unit.  I think the mounted lord command ability is too much of a CP expenditure for this army that doesn't have a strong CP engine. 

I know you didn't mention them but maunder horsemen in ruin bringer warband  seem great as they can all just charge into units and mortal wound out units, and allowing them to side step activation wars.   This on top of thier not amazing shooting attack. But it's enough to put down a keeper of secrets safely.  Chaos knights could fit into ruinbringers giving them a few extra mortal wound on the charge, and some more CP to work with. 

[mmimzie]

21 minutes ago, Gibs said:

However, was considering running shields in the front and then halberds in the rear

Warriors have to all run the same weapons. 

in my book as long as you don't need battle line iron golems are where it's at for tanky little units, or even tanky big units. 

[Gibs]

5 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

Warriors have to all run the same weapons. 

in my book as long as you don't need battle line iron golems are where it's at for tanky little units, or even tanky big units. 

That is annoying need to get the book, studying it 30 minutes wasn't enough haha. I am not sure the shields are worth taking on a full unit of warriors then? 

I don't think you take Marauders in units sizes less than 30 they are basically a barbarian horde so the more you can take the better. Back in fantasy units of 50 Marauders were not an uncommon sight on the table. 

Edited December 13, 2019 by Gibs

[Gibs]

1 minute ago, mmimzie said:

Warriors have to all run the same weapons. 

in my book as long as you don't need battle line iron golems are where it's at for tanky little units, or even tanky big units. 

That is annoying need to get the book to study it 30 minutes wasn't enough haha. I am not sure the shields are worth taking on a full unit of warriors then? 

I don't think you take Marauders in units sizes less than 30 they are basically a barbarian horde so the more you can take the better. Back in fantasy units of 50 Marauders were not an uncommon sight on the table. 

[Sinfullyvannila]

32 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

Warriors have to all run the same weapons. 

Not until we get errata saying otherwise. RaW; they get mixed weapons.

Edited December 13, 2019 by Sinfullyvannila

[Gibs]

26 minutes ago, Sinfullyvannila said:

Not until we get errata saying otherwise. RaW; they get mixed weapons.

I really hope this is the case! This would at least make Chaos Warriors a little more interesting and flexible as a unit.

[Salt_merchant]

For anyone whos seen a clearer picture than me

 

While in order to get command traits on more heroes your general cant be a daemon prince in a ravagers list

 

am i able to take a chaos lord as my general and pick a daemon prince as one of my ravagers heroes that gets a command trait?

 

i know he cant summon marauders or cultists but can he simply get a command trait?

[mmimzie]

1 hour ago, Gibs said:

That is annoying need to get the book to study it 30 minutes wasn't enough haha. I am not sure the shields are worth taking on a full unit of warriors then? 

I don't think you take Marauders in units sizes less than 30 they are basically a barbarian horde so the more you can take the better. Back in fantasy units of 50 Marauders were not an uncommon sight on the table. 

Maraurders are taken in lots of 20, and max 40. The 20 buff is just rend, and with the way AoS tends to work you shouldn't get more than 20-25 25mm bases into combat.  At 40 you start running in battleshock issues really hard really fast, as you start auto failing battle shocks at 5+ deaths.  While losing jsut -1 rend isn't gonna break your damage so much if you lose a single model. 

once you start thinking of maxing the maurders other units start to matter like unmade. 

[decker_cky]

22 hours ago, firtahl said:

I definitely didn't catch the hero phase activation, which I agree makes it much less attractive. I don't think I agree that a 12" bubble is so easily avoided, especially in the hyper alpha strike meta for most armies outside of something like OBR. Even if its focused down, that's attacks spent stopping it rather than the truly important units. +5 saves don't make it much of an attack sponge, but maybe the low save will entice people to make the wrong choice because its easy and go for it over better targets.

For me the 10" move, 10 wounds, and large fight last bubble (even if its hero phase activation make it more reactive than proactive) make it a steal at 100 pts given that a lot of armies will try to t1 charge as things get more competitive. Its utility is even more pronounced if you go first since the effect is until the end of the battle round rather than player turn. Definitely not a game changing unit, but I don't expect a 100 pt model to be what makes or breaks a game. It just seems like its hard to go wrong adding 1 to a lot of factions.  I guess we wont know for sure until its released and people get to try it out.

Not to mention that on top of all that....it casually has a  passive 12" bubble of -2 bravery, which won't always come into play, but will be great against certain opponents. 

[Charleston]

4 hours ago, mmimzie said:

Warriors have to all run the same weapons. 

That´s the point: The wording sounds like mix and match is allowed right now, as it allows "each [Warrior] armed with one of the following options"

[Sinfullyvannila]

42 minutes ago, Charleston said:

That´s the point: The wording sounds like mix and match is allowed right now, as it allows "each [Warrior] armed with one of the following options"

Indeed, when a unit has mutually exclusive weapon options it’s phrased as “the unit is armed with one of the following weapon options... in addition x units may replace their weapons”

See Sequitors, Liberators, Ogor Gluttons etc

When the unit is allowed to mix weapon options the entry is phrased “a unit has x number of models each armed with... in addition...”

See Tzaangors, Varanguard etc

Edited December 13, 2019 by Sinfullyvannila

[Gibs]

So assuming mix and match is intended what combinations make the most sense for those with access to the numbers?