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RuneBrush

AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

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46 minutes ago, Tropical Ghost General said:

He needs to suffer the mortal wound. If it gets negated with a ward save then he hasn't suffered the mortal wound. A similar example would be Arkhan the Black's Curse of Years spell. Originally it wasn't FAQ'd that ward saves could stop the amount of dice that rolled, so if you roll three 6s, you then roll 3 dice to fish for the 5s. Then the FAQ change to mortal wounds suffered, so if any of those three 6's that were rolled were saved using ward saves, then you roll less dice, so for example if you rolled three 6s, they save one of them, you only roll two dice to fish for the 5s. The same principle applies here. It's mortal wounds suffered in order to get the casting bonus

Yeah of course, the thing I aimed for is in regards to the deathless spirit and if you must take the deathless spirit roll. I play it as I must roll for deathless and if I roll a 6 the wound is negated and that means the ability did not work. I was just curious if this is the same interpretation as you guys. 

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2 hours ago, Sauriv said:

must take the deathless spirit roll.

Yes. Because it's worded 'Roll a dice each time you allocate a wound or mortal wound to friendly, etc.....' Because you allocate the wound, you have to roll.

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@Sauriv so having done more research, as well as asking others in my local group, it seems that the Hallowheart FAQ sets the precedent for this.

The Hallowheart FAQ mentions mortal wounds suffered and not negated. Because Reik's ability doesn't include 'not negated' he can still use his ward save and potentially heal the wound suffered. 

I file this situation under 'GW wording confusions'. Using suffered, instead of something like inflicted, leads you to believe that a mortal wound must be suffered and not negated in order for the ability to take effect. But this seems to not be the case. 

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It's not FAQed for Reiky himself, but in general a ways back:

Quote

 

Warhammer Age of Sigmar – Core Rules, Designers’ Commentary Page 6 - WOUNDS AND DAMAGE

Q: Some abilities refer to a unit ‘suffering’ a wound, while others refer to models or units ‘inflicting’ a wound – do such abilities apply to wounds that are saved, negated, healed or ignored?

A: No. In the Warhammer Age of Sigmar rules, the term ‘suffered’ or ‘inflicted’ refers to a wound that is allocated to a model and has not been negated or healed.

 

If you grab aosshorts.com's All-in-One FAQ it's on page 7.

Combine that with Reiky's ability wordage:

Quote

If the mortal wound was suffered by an enemy model, add 1 to the casting roll; if the mortal wound was suffered by this model, add 3 to the casting roll.

And it becomes "the wound must take in order for the casting bonus to occur."

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That's how I'm interpreting it, which sucks. I also checked with Aiden Nicol almost a year ago on it and the TOs in New Zealand also ruled that way.

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Well I've asked the rules team to hopefully get some clarity on the issue, but in the meantime I'll play it as 6+ ward save prevents the ability going off. 😢

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We really need a new book, if only for a rewrite on rules clarity that the newer books get.

I am loving the lists people are coming up with changes they'd  like to see. Some of these suggestions are pretty unique.

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One bit of wishlisty-ness from this fella id like to see is the Vault of souls reworked into a kind of resurrection nuke for us. I mean come on its a vault of souls! 

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2 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

One bit of wishlisty-ness from this fella id like to see is the Vault of souls reworked into a kind of resurrection nuke for us. I mean come on its a vault of souls! 

Oh that would be so cool!

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7 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

One bit of wishlisty-ness from this fella id like to see is the Vault of souls reworked into a kind of resurrection nuke for us. I mean come on its a vault of souls! 

Yeah and one that will go off before turn 5 (if your lucky). 
seriously have you guys ever had it explode? 
I tried it once because it got to hmg out next to 40 Bloodreavers for a couple of turns.

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11 minutes ago, Greasygeek said:

Yeah and one that will go off before turn 5 (if your lucky). 
seriously have you guys ever had it explode? 
I tried it once because it got to hmg out next to 40 Bloodreavers for a couple of turns.

Nope. :) 

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2 hours ago, Vasshpit said:

One bit of wishlisty-ness from this fella id like to see is the Vault of souls reworked into a kind of resurrection nuke for us. I mean come on its a vault of souls! 

Nighthaunt version of the Flesh-Eaters Chalice would be awesome

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2 hours ago, Greasygeek said:

Yeah and one that will go off before turn 5 (if your lucky). 
seriously have you guys ever had it explode? 
I tried it once because it got to hmg out next to 40 Bloodreavers for a couple of turns.

The most I got up to was 9 wounds, most of which were inflicted on myself 😂😥

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Played my first game of AoS this morning since lockdown. My first time running pure NH against OBR and I got absolutely steamrollered.  At the end, he'd lost one guard model... that was it. I had an MSU list, throwing speed bumps at him, whilst playing the objectives. Could've knicked it turn 5 with a minor victory but alas, it wasn't meant to be. 

He ran Crematorians and it was shocking how I just bounced off his units. The dichotomy between our tome and the new ones is vast.

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55 minutes ago, lare2 said:

Played my first game of AoS this morning since lockdown. My first time running pure NH against OBR and I got absolutely steamrollered.  At the end, he'd lost one guard model... that was it. I had an MSU list, throwing speed bumps at him, whilst playing the objectives. Could've knicked it turn 5 with a minor victory but alas, it wasn't meant to be. 

He ran Crematorians and it was shocking how I just bounced off his units. The dichotomy between our tome and the new ones is vast.

Hov come the speedbumps didn’t work?

Im planing to do the same versus my local Fyreslayer player, while also using Arkhan to Block his Path with pointless endless spells.

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17 minutes ago, Greasygeek said:

Hov come the speedbumps didn’t work?

I made some errors being out of practise but he also had +3" movement on his guard, or something like that. Everything they touched was instantly deleted. It took him until turn 5 to win it but they were stupid quick. 

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I never matched against Crematorians. They're the ones that have a chance to blow up on you when you kill a model? That's tough for us, having to try to heal back additional mortals in both when they attack and when we do. I wondered if we have enough model return to handle it. Was that much of a factor for you? Their ability is to remove cover from their targets, so I imagine that was a dead ability for them. How did their saves look? What's their output look like?

In my games against Petrifex the key was generating mortals on them. Reducing them to a Deathless shrug takes all the bite out of their defence, and their additional rend is useless. Pretty easy once you take out any range if they bring any, but it makes doing that a higher priority than grabbing objectives.

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Btw. Vs Fyreslayers (about 20 x Hearthguard).

Would you run 40 x Chainrasps
or 4 x 10 Chainrasps? (MSU).

Why?

Either way they are meant to slow them down with no intention of doing anything but blocking them off.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, EnixLHQ said:

I never matched against Crematorians. They're the ones that have a chance to blow up on you when you kill a model? That's tough for us, having to try to heal back additional mortals in both when they attack and when we do. I wondered if we have enough model return to handle it. Was that much of a factor for you? Their ability is to remove cover from their targets, so I imagine that was a dead ability for them. How did their saves look? What's their output look like?

Let's see what I can remember...

They do explode. It was horrible as he rolled well on them and when I killed his models they inevitably took my dudes with them. The sting then came when he then used that horrid big rhino thing to bring them back, meaning that when I attacked, I died and he didn't. That's my attack and before he's had a chance to hit me. My healing couldn't compete with this. 

Their saves were fine. Basically a 4+ but he was rerolling all failed and then deathless. It was hard to get through any wounds and when I did... see above. 

Damage output was buffed to high heaven due to Arkhan and Katakros. Arkhan was free to cast willy nilly and completely shut down my magic. 

Sorry I can't be more specific on ability names and whatnot but I'm not massively clued up on OBR tactics and whatnot. 

All in, it was a poorly matched barney. We both agreed that next game, if i wanted to bring pure NH, he'd bring his Sylvaneth. 

Edited by lare2

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Posted (edited)

Been thinking some properly powerful chapter/host/group bonuses would do quite a lot for our blank canvas of a book, and this board has discussed them a lot in the past.

Some of my favorites were 6" pile-in, +1 to deathless, reroll 1's on armor with mystic shield becoming full reroll armor, MW's on succesfull charges, healing/recovering d3 wounds/models if any enemy models were slain in combat ala the Mourngul's ability, and add d3 to enemy bravery rolls.

Edited by Neck-Romantic

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Isn’t it today in a few hours we should expect the GHB FAQ ? Hopefully then we will know for sure about the (lost) battalions.

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Managed to grab another win today! This time it was versus Seraphon, a really wonky magic focused list with Kroak.

I gave him the first turn, which after his hero phase felt like a major mistake, however I really didnt want to get double turned.

A grand total of 20 MWs went through in his Hero Phase. My general died, several SHs and Black Coach was down to like 2 Wounds.

It looked stupid, but that was essentially all his list did. Barely anything in shooting, and nothing in combat.

So all deep striking (Lady O, 10 Chainrasps and the 30 Grimghasts) spread out over two objectives - while the SHs sat in the middle and the 40 Rasps + GoS on another one. 

6 VP(NH) vs 2 VP (Seraphon)

I didnt get the double turn. Thought I was screwed at this point. He made a crazy Lord Arcanum combo with Purple Sun and 8 CP. It moved over 40 Rasps, 6 SHs and 30 Reapers. However it totally flunked and killed a total of like 5 models, none of which were SHs.
Reikenor managed a cheeky move + charge and pile-in move which got me a 5th point in the second round.

Once it was my turn, I had all objectives. Thats another 8 VP, and the next turn again he just couldnt get me off them as I could the double. 8 VP again.

At this point, Round 3, I had like 22 or 24 points, versus his like 6 points or something, so it was pretty much over.

We sure suck at fighting compared to most, but out flexible deep strike and fast moving models make us really good at the objective game.

easy peasy lemon squeezy!

 

7EF4136B-2279-4A06-AA70-87F212EA11F3.jpeg

34479F5D-AFCD-4108-9756-5FDF6B75E63C.jpeg

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Regarding White Dwarf, 40k equivalents to our battalions recieved formal Warhammer FAQs today. That's a promising sign. 

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1 hour ago, Snoogens said:

 

7EF4136B-2279-4A06-AA70-87F212EA11F3.jpeg

 

 

Great to hear on the win. On another note, I love the look for your army. What was your scheme? 

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