AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

[Nevar]

9 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

Starting to think the Black Coach is going to have some sort of aoe component as well, my bet is a speed boost or something else indispensible to warrant its inclusion in all the goodness here

They already mentioned the Black Coach would go well with the Grimhailer in an all Cavalry nighthaunt army.

I imagine Hexwraiths, Grimhailer, Harrows, and Horse of Shrouds will all make some awesome speedy builds.

[Neck-Romantic]

That might just be because its fast and can keep up

[Malakithe]

2 hours ago, El Syf said:

So compared to the new stormcast named characters the nighthaunt ones are poor.  I know they are the literal golden boys of the setting but it's ridiculous how much more the two stormcast characters have.

Plenty of mortal wound output, making ethereal rather redundant. I don't play against stormcast often and tbh with the new warscrolls am rather glad. 

Yeah no...the Nighthaunt named guys are supremely better then the SCE ones. And thats just face value...points are way cheaper for one. We still dont know about spell lores, endless spells, battalions, or allegiance....

At this point there is no reason to look at any one warscroll and say it sucks or is pointless. You have to look at all the pieces of the puzzle and realize the Grand Plan

[Lemon Knuckles]

My Grand Plan is to slowly go bankrupt buying more new plastic than I can ever hope to paint up in my lifetime.

I need a new Grand Plan.

[Malakithe]

12 minutes ago, Lemon Knuckles said:

My Grand Plan is to slowly go bankrupt buying more new plastic than I can ever hope to paint up in my lifetime.

I need a new Grand Plan.

The Grand Plan and the Long Game are one in the same 

[Maxo Bug]

On 6/24/2018 at 4:06 PM, kenshin620 said:

So given that the biggest (if not the only) difference between Cairn Wraiths and Grimghast Reapers are the blindfolds, I wouldn't be surprised if a more cost effective method of getting a collection of Cairn Wraiths would be to replace the blindfold heads with normal skulls.

The blindfolds, the skeletal hands vs thin ghastly ones, and the CW doesn't have a chain mail. 
I really liked my Cairn Wraiths... but it's true: they are very much alike for heroes, and the new ones shade them. ?

[Deadkitten]

5 hours ago, Nevar said:

They already mentioned the Black Coach would go well with the Grimhailer in an all Cavalry nighthaunt army.

I imagine Hexwraiths, Grimhailer, Harrows, and Horse of Shrouds will all make some awesome speedy builds.

 

4 hours ago, Neck-Romantic said:

That might just be because its fast and can keep up

Has anyone been fiddling with NH cav lists?  How would they fare?

[Nevar]

5 minutes ago, Deadkitten said:

 

Has anyone been fiddling with NH cav lists?  How would they fare?

We don't know enough about the battle tome to do that yet.

[Malakithe]

9 minutes ago, Nevar said:

We don't know enough about the battle tome to do that yet.

Yep. At this point its just foolish to attempt to even brainstorm a list until everything is layed out in front of us. All the new rules. GH2019. The battletomes. 

If your missing even one of those elements then your lists will be possibly flawed or lacking

[dillonjay21]

Love keeping up with all your guys discussion on the new Nighthaunt. I’m just getting into AOS and decided now was the perfect time with 2.0 and all the new line of models for Soul Wars. I got a head start on my battleline though with these guys, but didn’t realize how horrible they are to put together. Super straight forward to paint, so that made up for it.

[Neck-Romantic]

Yeah, putting hosts together caught me off guard too, and I survived assembling about 4k points of Necrons

[Iggy Starhost]

Hi Guys,

Im going to get the Soul Wars box and was thinking about builing an 1250 points Nighthaunt list (locals are around 1250 points), which I could bumb up to 2000 with playing Nagash. He is just such a badass, that he needs to be played. I've come up with this:

1220 points
MoGrief 240
KoS on Steed 140
Gaurdian of Souls 140
Spirit Torment 120

40 Chainrasps 280
10 G.Reapers  140
5 Hexwraiths 160

And for 2k I'll just add Nagash, and switchout KoSoES for some endless spells. Will it be sufficient units? Or switch the Spirittorment for 3 Spirit Hosts?
And doubting what the best size for the Chainrasps would be. 20 feels slim, where they can get one-shotted. 40 feels huge, but resilient. 

 

[GeneralZero]

Spirit host are a pure nightmare to build. I lost half my hairs the last 2 days to  build 6 of them, having glue all over my fingers, trying to figure out where the assembling spot were. Super annoying mounting. Once done, they look great thouh. (but don't look to close )

[GeneralZero]

We know now all the NH range (but not all the warscrolls yet)

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2018/06/aos-putting-names-with-faces-complete-nighthaunt-unit-list-unveiled-models.html

 

Long gone are the multi kit. I am disapointed that the 3 big heros are just one build and not multi build/multi kit as it uses to be (even the IK are multi kit)

[CoffeeGrunt]

Imperial Knights aren't multikit? The new heavy and light chassis only have one build, and the older kits are the same model just with different weapon options. (Not a multi-kit in the style of, say, Wild Riders/Sisters of the Thorn where you get two rather distinct units.)

[PainfullyMediocre]

This is the last unit not properly teased, so we've got pictures of everything we are getting.

[Wraith]

1 hour ago, Iggy Starhost said:

Hi Guys,

Im going to get the Soul Wars box and was thinking about builing an 1250 points Nighthaunt list (locals are around 1250 points), which I could bumb up to 2000 with playing Nagash. He is just such a badass, that he needs to be played. I've come up with this:

1220 points
MoGrief 240
KoS on Steed 140
Gaurdian of Souls 140
Spirit Torment 120

40 Chainrasps 280
10 G.Reapers  140
5 Hexwraiths 160

And for 2k I'll just add Nagash, and switchout KoSoES for some endless spells. Will it be sufficient units? Or switch the Spirittorment for 3 Spirit Hosts?
And doubting what the best size for the Chainrasps would be. 20 feels slim, where they can get one-shotted. 40 feels huge, but resilient. 

 

What about this for 1250 points:

 

MoGrief 240

Guardian of Souls 140

Spirit Torment 120

 

20 Chainrasps 160 - battleline

30 Grimghasts 360 - battleline

12 M. Banshees 210

 

Endless Spell 20

 

So you got 4 dispels in there. A bit of healing. Decent sized units. Some good damage output.  What do you think.

[Iggy Starhost]

1 hour ago, Wraith said:

What about this for 1250 points:

 

MoGrief 240

Guardian of Souls 140

Spirit Torment 120

 

20 Chainrasps 160 - battleline

30 Grimghasts 360 - battleline

12 M. Banshees 210

 

Endless Spell 20

 

So you got 4 dispels in there. A bit of healing. Decent sized units. Some good damage output.  What do you think.

 

You think Grimghast are that good? I love them for their stats, but think you'll maximum get 10 in 2" range. Where getting 20 chainrasps in range would look more easy. I like Hewraiths for their speed, and low model count. So they can move quick and out manouver, and wont get stuck easily. 30 Grimghast just seems like a really huge blob.

[Wraith]

4 minutes ago, Iggy Starhost said:

 

You think Grimghast are that good? I love them for their stats, but think you'll maximum get 10 in 2" range. Where getting 20 chainrasps in range would look more easy. I like Hewraiths for their speed, and low model count. So they can move quick and out manouver, and wont get stuck easily. 30 Grimghast just seems like a really huge blob.

Sure, you’ll get more than 10 in range. The idea is to go after the biggest unit in the opposing army so they can get their reroll. And you want them to hang around, so 30 with leave you with useful numbers after causalities. The GoS can heal them up.

 

The Spirit Torment and Banshees make a nice team for taking on tough targets,

 

The Chainrasps are just there to block and give cover to the heros. Their main claim to fame is being cheap.

 

You could go the Hexwraiths and Lord of Shrouds on steed. But then maybe you should go 2 units of 5 and drop the Grimghasts. Generally you want enough of what does the job rather than a bit of this and a bit of that.

 

To give you an example of what I mean, a friend once ran a Feudal French army (6th ed WRG Ancients) which had a few knights, crossbow men, men at arms, etc. But not enough of anything to develop effective effort for any plan, defensive or offensive. So he gave up on that army idea and used his figures to form a Sicilian Norman army, built around knights and turcopoles (horse archers). The turcopoles screened the knights and the knights charged home in sufficient numbers to make a difference. Worked quite well.

 

A balanced army isn’t about a bit of this and a bit of that. It has troops that complement each other around a certain game plan. So decide how you think you might win and try to build around enough of whichever troops suit that plan.

 

In terms of Nighthaunts, to me they look like an aggressive army which goes straight into the attack. In fact most death armies are like that. No ranged attacks. But, despite GW blurb, it doesn’t as suitable for a board control/ long game plan compared to LoN armies. It doesn’t have the high wound count combined with extensive resurrection. Basically you want to build around the idea of getting in there and do lots of damage. Spirit Hosts and Grimghasts are both good at this so build around them.

[Neck-Romantic]

Yeah, you want to cut the heart out of the enemy early with NH, then replenish your losses as you mop up/deal with their counterattack

[GeneralZero]

What do you think about Hexwraith and Spirit Hosts (and eventualy cairn and old banshee )compared to new NH?

I think that they are pretty solid especially with the buffs from new char

[Iggy Starhost]

i'm used to playing Serpahon, and have 0 experience with death so I might be wrong. But playing the objectives seems hard with your list.

What I was planning with the list I wrote, let the KoSoES run around with the hexwraiths, giving them +1 attack (do the horses get +1 aswell?) and having a nice artifact to increase damage or movement. To fly to objectives, harras the backfield or go hero hunting. 

Use the horde of chainrasps as anvil, with the GoS and Spirit torment buffing and healing them, while getting LoS. Making the unit quite impressive in damage output. And use the 10 Grimghast as an hammerunit, since they're quite fast and hit hard. 

 

When I am playing against death, I'm just tieing up the big blob of skellies with small chaff units, denying them objectives. Nighthaunt seems to lack a bit less in board control tho

[Neck-Romantic]

The way Im seeing us play is a dense anvil/tarpit in the center, with faster units simply flying through to assasinate characters or double up by charging their center from behind to grab a quick advantage, then healing/ressurecting in order to maintain that advantage. 

We should be leveraging army wide fly and invuln saves, enabling us to reposition at will and go toe to toe with extremely deadly enemies with predictable losses.

Our main weakness is low wound count heroes who can get picked off/focused down before being able to heal, knock them out and our units' damage output will wither 

[RuneBrush]

1 hour ago, Iggy Starhost said:

You think Grimghast are that good? I love them for their stats, but think you'll maximum get 10 in 2" range. Where getting 20 chainrasps in range would look more easy. I like Hewraiths for their speed, and low model count. So they can move quick and out manouver, and wont get stuck easily. 30 Grimghast just seems like a really huge blob.

Depends entirely on how you want to run an army and the opponent you're up against.  For me, Grimghast are pretty speedy, with a middle of the road attack, but that all important -1 rend which Chainrasp don't have.   One of the biggest issues I find with big blob units (e.g. skeletons) is that they don't manoeuvre very well, but Grimghast have that 8" move and fly, so mitigate that a bit more than other big units.

[Neck-Romantic]

Grimghasts are fast, blendy, -1 rend AND 1 better save than chainrasps too.

Wondering if bladegheists will be si gle wound models.. kinda would be nice for the MoG's return 1 model ability to target multiwound models like hosts

Edited June 27, 2018 by Neck-Romantic