AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

[mrbedlam]

I'm giving this some consideration at the moment, mostly because I like to play in the theme over the best composition, but I still want to challenge my opponents.

The Wild Hunt Rides

KoSoES- General (Ruler of Spirit Hosts, Balefire Blade)

 Dreadblade Harrow (Midnight Tome, Soul Cage)

Dreadblade Harrow

Reiknor - Soul Cage

GoS - Spirit Drain/Beacon

2 x 20 Chainrasp

2 x 5 Hexwraith

10 Grimghast

Black Coach

Deathriders

Chainguard.

QuickSilver Swords

1990 points.

 

Its probably not the most effective but I managed to squeeze in 2 battalions so I'm willing to give it a whirl. Not sold on the Artifacts all the way but those can be adjusted as I play (as will the list I'm sure)

[Neck-Romantic]

Thinking the first turn charge with cogs strat is just too dependent on dice to be viable...maybe not for deathriders battalion.

Thinking of trying a 2 pronged army with;

Olynder and a Torment surrounded by a tight ball of 2x6 Hosts in one group (pendant of fell wind)

 mKoS, Torment, GoS and 2x15 Revenants in another tight group (wytchlight lantern)

with a throwaway 10x rasps to sit on an obj..

Thoughts?

[Tropical Ghost General]

6 hours ago, CanHammer-darren said:

That’s too bad. I have 3 of them haha. 

I know that feeling. I still run them occasionally but only for fun games. The list sounds brutal, only thing worth bearing in mind is what are you using for tarpit? The 2 x 10 rasps would work better a 1 x20, also less drops that way.

11 hours ago, Dauzy said:

Is it possible with 5 step to conclude my deployment ?

Yes, that list is 5 drops, as you can deploy the battalion as a single drop with some units on the table and some units in the underworld. Personally I think that the rasps aren't the best bodyguard for Lady O, but the only way to know is to play the list

[Dauzy]

Which unit seems to be the best Body Guard for olynder in your opinion ?

Quote

Yes, that list is 5 drops, as you can deploy the battalion as a single drop with some units on the table and some units in the underworld. Personally I think that the rasps aren't the best bodyguard for Lady O, but the only way to know is to play the list

 

Edited October 22, 2018 by Dauzy

[Tropical Ghost General]

1 hour ago, Neck-Romantic said:

Thoughts?

Have you looked at the Lord Ex battalion for the SH bodyguard? If you make the Lord Ex the general with the RotSH command trait, then he'll be ressing the SHs every turn anyway. And you can make a unit of 3 SHs are objective holders. The GoS would be better suited with the SH bodyguard than the blades, as he'll have better longevity and the SHs will benefit from his ability better than the blades, who don't really need the +1 to wound.

[Tropical Ghost General]

Just now, Dauzy said:

Body Guard for olynder in your opinion ?

I don't like them as a unit, but probably SHs, due to the multiple wounds and the really large base size. Lady O isn't great in combat, she's alright but she's not a combat beast (non of our heroes are really ?). Lady O is a mortal wound assassin (unless you play lizards or death or other factions that have bravery 10). The other option is grims, blades or harridans, because while they can be less durable that SHs, they can follow up and finish off what Lady O starts off assassinating with mortal wounds.

[Tropical Ghost General]

4 hours ago, mrbedlam said:

2 x 5 Hexwraith

10 Grimghast

Everything seems fine, except these two. Hexwraiths in units of 5 will die and die quickly. If your are paying for the battalion to give them a 9+ wave of terror, then you want to be running units of 10 minimal, maybe even 15 if you can afford it (both cash and points wise). Grims are good, but go from being good to mental the larger the unit size.

[Tropical Ghost General]

15 hours ago, dmorley21 said:

base my Nighthaunt so that it looks like they're coming out of the fog.

This is awesome. Really liking this. I remember way back in the day that GW used to have white foam packing material when mail ordering stuff, that was perfect for making smoke and fog from, haven't found a suitable replacement though ?

[Neck-Romantic]

My meta reeeqlly needs Oly's MW output 

[Tropical Ghost General]

2 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

My meta reeeqlly needs Oly's MW output 

Haha. I wish that was the case with me. I have a lot of Death, SC and lizards. I rarely play anything that has bravery 8 or less, it mainly all 10's, sucks major plums. Have you thought about using none SHs as bodyguards?

[Tropical Ghost General]

2 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

My meta reeeqlly needs Oly's MW output 

Haha. I wish that was the case with me. I have a lot of Death, SC and lizards. I rarely play anything that has bravery 8 or less, it mainly all 10's, sucks major plums. Have you thought about using none SHs as bodyguards?

[dmorley21]

12 hours ago, Dauzy said:

Hi Everyone, 

 I would like to share with you an army list that I would like to build. 

I don't really know if this list can be competitive.

I really like your list! I think it definitely has some potential. 

1 hour ago, Neck-Romantic said:

Thinking the first turn charge with cogs strat is just too dependent on dice to be viable...maybe not for deathriders battalion.

If you inflict the mortal wound on yourself and avoid an unbind, you've got over a 91% chance of casting Cogs. There will be the odd game where you don't get it off, but it's fairly reliable.

With Cogs, you need to roll a 7 on the charge that can be re-rolled if you have a CP and a close enough hero. I'm not sure of the math on that, but it's definitely more likely to pull off than not. 

And, as you mentioned, Death Riders need a 6, though Hexwraiths are so fast they may not need to hide in the underworld. 

I think Reikenor+Cogs+Deepstrike is very viable, but certainly not automatic. 

[Neck-Romantic]

I just played a tournament where I failed cogs on a +3 every single furst turn. Im burned out on it as an alpha strike strategy is all

[Neck-Romantic]

Ok @Tropical Ghost General check this out

Olynder, Torment, Lord Ex 6 Hosts 3Hosts 3 Hosts (battalion)

mKoS, Torment, 2x15 Revenants (battalion)

Cogs  for Oly to summon once she gets to the main melee for + spell and reroll her armor save

Its VERY low model count, but between Oly, a Torment, and Exec with RotSHtheres a lot of healing, still have 2 self-contained groups, shitload of mortals (my meta demands this) and Oly heals herself with veil, torment, her d6 if neccesary and cogs for survivability

(Could drop cogs for a Vairm wraith I spoze)

Edited October 22, 2018 by Neck-Romantic

[Tropical Ghost General]

2 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

as an alpha strike strategy is all

It's tricky. Because we are a horde army that plays the attrition game, yet we are one of the worst at it. In my local meta I didn't use the underworlds ability for ages and kept losing games, especially to death and nurgle and lizards and basically anyone else that could summon. Then I started using the WoT and have been undefeated for the last 6 games now, and that's against lizards, khorne, death, etc...If your not going to use cogs and underworlds, then you have to go super hordes, so 2 x 40 rasps, 2 x 60 grims, etc...just swamp the board with bodies, sack off battalion and just go for mass of bodies (or spirits).

5 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

Cogs  for Oly to summon once she gets to the main melee for + spell and reroll her armor save

I like it, but this is the only thing that I'm not too sure on, only reason being, that having cogs close to the enemy means that it's easier to dispel or take control off. I wonder if the list would benefit more by dropping cogs and the 2nd torment (one with the SHs) and taking a GoS (to hang with Lady O and the spirits) and with the remaining 50pts, either taking an extra CP (so you start with and extra 3CP) or using the 50CP to bump one unit of 15 blades to 20?

[Neck-Romantic]

My gos's keep failing to even cast their spells, im taking the Torments for the reroll 1's and gauarnteed heals if you kill stuff. 

Failed to cast their heal WITH the beacon of nagashizzar too. 

Edited October 22, 2018 by Neck-Romantic

[Tropical Ghost General]

10 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

Failed to cast their heal WITH the beqcon of nagashizzar too

?

I am a firm believer that we are weak AF at magic, yet we are also 90% reliant on magic to be effective, with healing and debuffs, cogs, etc... Tbh honest, I'm just glad that we have a wizard, not having one in AoS 1.0 was tough. I might be wrong saying this, but the army as a whole feels like it is undecided on what it wants to be, it's alpha strike but not the best alpha strike by a long shot, it's magic but weak AF at magic, it's attrition but weak AF at attrition and doesn't summon, it's a horde army but not real synergies or buffs to hordes (other than the points savings for maxing out some units), it's bravery bashing army with no way of debuffing bravery. It really does feel like an army that isn't one thing or the other, no real specialisms that make it stand out from the crowd other than having some of the best looking sculpts that GW have ever done. I love ghosts but it does feel like playing an unfinished army so much of the time. 

[Tropical Ghost General]

10 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

Failed to cast their heal WITH the beqcon of nagashizzar too

?

I am a firm believer that we are weak AF at magic, yet we are also 90% reliant on magic to be effective, with healing and debuffs, cogs, etc... Tbh honest, I'm just glad that we have a wizard, not having one in AoS 1.0 was tough. I might be wrong saying this, but the army as a whole feels like it is undecided on what it wants to be, it's alpha strike but not the best alpha strike by a long shot, it's magic but weak AF at magic, it's attrition but weak AF at attrition and doesn't summon, it's a horde army but not real synergies or buffs to hordes (other than the points savings for maxing out some units), it's bravery bashing army with no way of debuffing bravery. It really does feel like an army that isn't one thing or the other, no real specialisms that make it stand out from the crowd other than having some of the best looking sculpts that GW have ever done. I love ghosts but it does feel like playing an unfinished army so much of the time. 

[Espy85]

Hi guys, I came from a bad defeat, yesterday I played against tzeentch and it went wrong.
My opponent deployed Kairos, a curselyng and a gaunt summoner, 2x9 enlightened on disc, 2x10 acolytes and 10 pink horrors.
I played Olynder, Knight of Shrouds with Sword of Judgment, Spirit Torment and Guardian, 10 Hexwraith, 40 Chainrasp, 10 chainrasp, 20 dreadscythe and Myrmourn.
The game ended in the fourth round, when even the last unit was destroyed, the thing that depressed me was losing entire units in a single round of cac, each of my units was devastated in one turn. 40 Chainrasp had managed to knock out 2 enlightened, but the remaining seven took out the entire unit by 40. The dreadscythe died before they could attack. The Myrmourn were killed by two spells, one made 2 mortal wounds, the next one 6. Both in the same magical phase. I seriously start thinking about playing only the reapers, it's the only unit we have, I put 90 of them and the rest are heroes.

[Neck-Romantic]

@Tropical Ghost General

I feel you so far. We pay through the nose for fly and invuln as well. With the inevitable nerf to grims incoming (probably a reduction to 1" and a pointcost / unit size change, if I know GW's patented over-reaction nerfs) I feel like some subtle buffs are neccesary.

Dropping the difficulty of our spells, changing our heal mechanic to mirror Invocation of Nehek, giving us some sort of re-roll armor save buff/spell/aura, or a "bring back annihilated unit" mechanic perhaps triggered by wiping an enemy squad would be a good start.

[Vasshpit]

We don't have a terrain piece yet, correct?

This could go a long way to helping us out if it had the right specs. 

[Neck-Romantic]

Dont get me started on Idoneth's myriad bullsh*t lol.

[Espy85]

Also I fear a nerf to reapers, and it makes me angry, it is not a problem of the nighthaunts, but of legion of nagash, because we have to lose ourselves. This battletome should be rewritten, we have no resistance, it would help us an extra wound on some units (dreadscythe and bladegheist), delete the word "completely" from some description because it makes it difficult to activate some buffs, and then there is the discourse of the wounds recovered , too few, and too situational. The 10+ charge bonus is too important for us, but this too is too situational. We hope that they will adjust something with the FAQs.

@VasshpitA scenic element could fix something, the sigmarite mausoleum could be modified in the rules, to give us the possibility to summon  new units.

@Tropical Ghost GeneralBecause it's unfinished, and I think it's the fault of Nagsh, some units if they were made better could be brought into LoN and break the game. And then there is the ethereal rule, enormously overrated by game designers.

Edited October 22, 2018 by Espy85

[Tropical Ghost General]

11 minutes ago, Espy85 said:

enormously overrated by game designers.

amen to that

[Tropical Ghost General]

23 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

Idoneth's myriad bullsh*t lol

Haha, I feel that there is some venting that needs to take place here ?

36 minutes ago, Vasshpit said:

We don't have a terrain piece yet, correct?

And I don't see us getting one either, unless they nerf the grims so hard that the only thing that will make us viable again is a magic piece of terrain.

One of the things that annoyed me most was our faction specific endless spells. So far the SC and beasts of Chaos are the only others released, and both have at least 1 buffing/utility spell amongst them for each faction. We get 3 predatory spells, all of which are garbage. The scythe is so situational and why would you take it and not the standard pendulum. The vault of souls is one that never explodes and when it does explode it's with such a whimper. And the hourglass, it's great at healing, but it doesn't revive, cool, that's really helpful, so let's throw it at our opponent to do some mortal wounds instead, now it's there turn and they are going to use it heal themselves instead now ?‍♂️. I brought them because they look great, but they suck plums so hard.