AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

[Walkirriox]

4 hours ago, ianob said:

6 hosts with a Lantern is 7 mortals and 3.5 rend 0 hits on average. Let’s not get hyperbolic now

Well, in 2 turns the tree is actually dead. And you have that sweet 17% chance of a charge-attack... if you are lucky enough, that tree is dead in one turn.

[Luke1705]

49 minutes ago, Walkirriox said:

Well, in 2 turns the tree is actually dead. And you have that sweet 17% chance of a charge-attack... if you are lucky enough, that tree is dead in one turn.

Not true on average. Remember that your lantern buff only works once a game. And truly, I don’t think it’s a worthwhile investment compared to other relic options

[PhallusDominus]

I made an account just for this, because I'm confused as ****** about the new White Dwarf. I've been a Nighthaunt player from the start, and now with all these new additions, I was quite stumped that we couldn't take a Mortis Engine. Now we see a battle report with NH allegiance using a Mortis Engine in the White Dwarf? Did I miss something? Are they messing with us?

[Kirjava13]

Yes- they did it "because it would be cool". Nothing stopping you from doing that in anything other than a strict rules tournament, as long as your opponent doesn't mind!

[PhallusDominus]

 Thanks for clearing that up! Made a Legion of Sacrament army so I could play with the centerpiece Mortis Engine... Whoops, hehe

[Neck-Romantic]

And 6 hosts is 36 attacks with rerolls.. most likely more than only 7 MW's.

[KoalaSnok]

22 minutes ago, Neck-Romantic said:

And 6 hosts is 36 attacks with rerolls.. most likely more than only 7 MW's.

1/6×36=6

Rerolling 1s, you get 6 of them as well, 1/6×6=1

6+1=7

[Neck-Romantic]

It isnt rerolling 1's its rerolling all your hits.

Rerolling ones is the torments buff.

That's an average of 10 MWs and 10 no-rend wounds, enough to core him like an apple, and even possibly kill him if he fails a few saves

Edited August 13, 2018 by Neck-Romantic

[Keldaur]

15 hours ago, Neck-Romantic said:

And 6 hosts is 36 attacks with rerolls.. most likely more than only 7 MW's.

6's are a russian roulette. I have played plenty with the harvest moon and 3x6 units of spirit hosts, and get only 2-3 MWs even with the rerolls. Not really consistent, but you can also get a crazy amount of MWs, but those turns when you only kill 1 chainrasps really make you want to throw the spirit hosts away.

Edited August 14, 2018 by Keldaur

[Keldaur]

On 8/12/2018 at 7:02 PM, ianob said:

6 hosts with a Lantern is 7 mortals and 3.5 rend 0 hits on average. Let’s not get hyperbolic now

Average 10MW 10Hits.

36 = 6MW 6Hits (12)

36-12 = 24 = 4MW 4Hits

Edited August 14, 2018 by Keldaur

[Neck-Romantic]

Got a few games in with same list vs Sylvaneth and again the Mourngul won the 'Ghost with the Most' award both games, while the teleporting Dreadblade Harrow did nothing and was eventually picked off. 

Excited to try out Olynder in place of Mourn, and Shroudgard in place of Hexwraiths 

[ianob]

8 hours ago, Keldaur said:

Average 10MW 10Hits.

36 = 6MW 6Hits (12)

36-12 = 24 = 4MW 4Hits

What are we talking about that's rerolling all misses?

[tea_wild_owl]

5 minutes ago, ianob said:

What are we talking about that's rerolling all misses?

there's an artefact that let's you reroll all failed to hits for all nighthaunt in a certain distance once a game (don't know the exact values and name, don't have the tome currently available)

Edited August 14, 2018 by tea_wild_owl

[Keldaur]

16 minutes ago, ianob said:

What are we talking about that's rerolling all misses?

The post you answered specifically stated the lantern that gives you rerolls once per battle.

Edited August 14, 2018 by Keldaur

[ianob]

4 hours ago, Keldaur said:

The post you answered specifically stated the lantern that gives you rerolls once per battle.

Whoops

All I’ll say then is that basing unit evaluations on a once per game artifacts with an opportunity cost of potentially better artifacts is not ideal listbuilding!

[Greasygeek]

On 8/11/2018 at 2:11 AM, Smavo said:

It's pretty easy to "kite" sylvaneths now as the woods have the overgrown rule from the citadel wood scenery aswell. So as long as there is 1" between a model in the wood crossing the base of the wood they do not have LoS so if they do want to turtle in their wood then they lose their muscle attacks. So you can either avoid them and swarm another objective or make them come to you.

Wait what now? Wyld woods ALSO have the citadel woods rule?! Has this been confirmed? We played our woods as eonly one or the other so we had to choose before setup if the scenery was a citadel wood or a wyldwood.

Edited August 14, 2018 by Greasygeek

[Smavo]

1 hour ago, Greasygeek said:

Wait what now? Wyld woods ALSO have the citadel woods rule?! Has this been confirmed? We played our woods as eonly one or the other so we had to choose before setup if the scenery was a citadel wood or a wyldwood.

Check the designer notes for sylvaneth that was release with t nh e faqs.

[SleeperAgent]

1 hour ago, Greasygeek said:

Wait what now? Wyld woods ALSO have the citadel woods rule?! Has this been confirmed? We played our woods as eonly one or the other so we had to choose before setup if the scenery was a citadel wood or a wyldwood.

Just remember, this doesn't affect Nighthaunt at all. As our entire army flies so both ways have line of sight. 

[Skrekkugle]

11 hours ago, SleeperAgent said:

Just remember, this doesn't affect Nighthaunt at all. As our entire army flies so both ways have line of sight. 

Never heard of this before.. Where does it state that flying units are always in LOS?

[Neck-Romantic]

Yeah... I dont think that matters for checking LOS; eithet friendly or hostile. You cant just always see or be seen by anyone if you fly. 

Both RAW and RAI

[Calum Todd]

Flying models ignore the Overgrown Wilderness rule for the citadel woods, i.e a flying unit can see and be seen through a forest.

Edit - For clarity this is found in the Citadel Woods warscroll, not under the flying rule.

Edited August 15, 2018 by Calum Todd

[Skrekkugle]

Ah got ya. Apparently it's in the GHB and only for the wood specifically:

No idea why they had to put that in though. You can just.. you know.. land?

[Neck-Romantic]

Ah, good catch!

[SleeperAgent]

Yeah we've been playing it as always LOS because it says "This scenery rule does not apply if either model can fly".  But it goes both ways so thats nice. Can't just turtle in a forest when Olynder and Reikenor can spam spells in there.

[Keldaur]

On 8/14/2018 at 3:24 PM, ianob said:

Whoops

All I’ll say then is that basing unit evaluations on a once per game artifacts with an opportunity cost of potentially better artifacts is not ideal listbuilding!

I understand where you are coming from, but that's poorly worded, ideal listbuilding does not exist.

Better artifacts rely on the list itself, not in the artifact on its own. You are not getting ethereal amulet just because its good, you get it because your list have a big threat that can take advantadge of it. Pendant of fell wind is probably the only artifact that is better no matter what kind of list you make for nighthaunt (and still i am not sure it would apply always). Midnight tome is a solid artifact, but you use it to fill a gap in your list, otherwise you don't. Harvest moon allows you to do some very good and decisive plays when you are playing spirit hosts which outweights heavilly whatever you could get with a different artifact through the game (and that's what you should compute to see if it's optimal or not, not just if it's an once per game or not).

Edited August 16, 2018 by Keldaur