AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

[Ellarr]

1 hour ago, EnixLHQ said:

Thanks for coming by and filling us in on that. I think the discussion about it is all done now, and I'm on the same page with it all.

The only thing I'll gripe about right now is that I think it was a fumble for GW to have released half the story like that. They could have been more up front about the battlepack and its restriction in the same breath as the AoS 3.0 rules. Even a preview would have been nice. Without it, disputes like this happen.

I'm sure battlepacks in the future will allow warscroll battalions again, but I am also sure they will only allow 3.0 battalions or have heavy restrictions if they do. My fear, though, is that those battlepacks will be viewed as inferior or non-standard, or not the competitive gold standard, and thus regulated to "fluffy" tables.

I agreed, it seems weird to have not just included the matched play battlepack in with the core rules pdf, but c'est la vie

[lare2]

Legion of Grief's looking like it's officially dead then. 

EDIT: In matched play, that is. 

Edited June 17, 2021 by lare2

[CaptainSoup]

Facehammer is currently going over the GHB page per page on their Youtube channel right now. They are going over the points and unit sizes showing the page for each faction. Right now they are on Destruction armies. While I'm not famailar with those factions and their points and unit sizes, it seems like everything went up in price but unit sizes remaining mostly the same. It's... it's not looking good... 

Waiting for when they get to the Death factions with bated breath... 

[Okonomiyakimarine]

just saw this online via facehammer. might get them out again!

 

Edited June 17, 2021 by Okonomiyakimarine

[CaptainSoup]

I was going to type out all the points since posting images of books is iffy here rules wise, but someone else did it so that works lol.

Reapers, Bladegheist and Herridans are now 10 model min unit size. This is good news. It means our main sources of damage isn't knee capped completely, we just have to deal with 32mm base size unit coherency which is just something we'll have to deal with. 

Everything else unit size wise is the same. Some points increases for some units (Chainrasp up 15 points, probably our penance for spamming them last edition) but then most units in the game did to some degree. All things considered we dodged a bullet here. We're still hurting pretty badly with the loss of our warscroll battalions, unit coherency, lack of monsters, ranged units etc., but at least we're still playable at this point. 

All that's left is the hope (but not guarantee) of day one FAQs.

Overall this edition will be interesting. I'm hoping our new book will give us something to do to make up for our lack of other things, like more damage and survivability, but for right now our units are properly sized (considering the new rules) but we'll still probably always use as many maxed sized units as possible to make up for our current short comings. 

[lare2]

There's my bedtime reading sorted. 

[The_Dudemeister]

Absolutely fantastic.

I've spent the last... don't know how long, why is it half past midnight already?... time looking through points changes of other armies. There are some massive increases all across the board on some of the worst offenders. We're talking single heroes going up as much as a full Nighthaunt list.

 

The new minimum sizes for Bladegheist and Harridans (and the latter going down from 180 to 160) are just the cherry on top. This is a BIG buff to our ghosties. Especially after the last GHBs did us so dirty

 

Also worth noting how much our Endless Spells went up. I smell new warscrolls for them. Untill then, who cares if something that noone took went up from 20 to 85, really?

[EnixLHQ]

1 hour ago, CaptainSoup said:

I was going to type out all the points since posting images of books is iffy here rules wise, but someone else did it so that works lol.

Reapers, Bladegheist and Herridans are now 10 model min unit size. This is good news. It means our main sources of damage isn't knee capped completely, we just have to deal with 32mm base size unit coherency which is just something we'll have to deal with. 

Everything else unit size wise is the same. Some points increases for some units (Chainrasp up 15 points, probably our penance for spamming them last edition) but then most units in the game did to some degree. All things considered we dodged a bullet here. We're still hurting pretty badly with the loss of our warscroll battalions, unit coherency, lack of monsters, ranged units etc., but at least we're still playable at this point. 

All that's left is the hope (but not guarantee) of day one FAQs.

Overall this edition will be interesting. I'm hoping our new book will give us something to do to make up for our lack of other things, like more damage and survivability, but for right now our units are properly sized (considering the new rules) but we'll still probably always use as many maxed sized units as possible to make up for our current short comings. 

And I was looking forward to bringing the Mourngul out, too.

Overall I think we're in a good spot for the transition period. We can still field decent units, and with KC's ward save we can make a couple core battalions into frontliners pretty easily or prop up another hero. Unleash Hell is a problem, though. I hope Ethereal changes.

6 minutes ago, The_Dudemeister said:

Absolutely fantastic.

I've spent the last... don't know how long, why is it half past midnight already?... time looking through points changes of other armies. There are some massive increases all across the board on some of the worst offenders. We're talking single heroes going up as much as a full Nighthaunt list.

 

The new minimum sizes for Bladegheist and Harridans (and the latter going down from 180 to 160) are just the cherry on top. This is a BIG buff to our ghosties. Especially after the last GHBs did us so dirty

 

Also worth noting how much our Endless Spells went up. I smell new warscrolls for them. Untill then, who cares if something that noone took went up from 20 to 85, really?

The endless spell points could represent that we will retain control of them after casting given their close nature. But I hope it signals new warscrolls, too.

[The_Dudemeister]

Ok, enough positive vibes. We're Nighthaunt, it's all doom and gloom!

 

Hexwraiths are the big losers. Going from 130 to 150 is their (double) death sentence. Not only were they expensive enough already to could've stayed the same cost. They are now too expensive as bodyguards when you look at wound per point, making their whole bodyguard shtick obsolete.

 

Kurdoss only staying the same when other much better heroes like Spirit Torment went down? How does that even happen?

 

RIP, I mean Rest In Eternal Agony my beloved Myrmourn Banshees. They're not battleline so can only ever be reinforced to 8. No more +3 to unbinding. The only change that actually makes me sad, that was very powerful.

 

Glaivewraith Stalkers still only 4? Then how can we... haha, nah, I can't do that. Who cares about them, they functionally don't exist just like our Endless Spells

 

Hmm, not much to cry about. Doesn't mean I won't though 🙃

 

 

[EnixLHQ]

We still get our subfactions, right?

[CaptainSoup]

21 minutes ago, EnixLHQ said:

We still get our subfactions, right?

I think everyone else has their subfactions so we should still have ours. Match play battle pack didn't mention anything about them.

[lare2]

BR is specifically said to be legal, which means our subfactions should be cool. 

Overall I'm pretty happy with these changes. 

Edited June 18, 2021 by lare2

[Zashier29]

So, looking at the points and tinkering with lists, our biggest winners are the Grimghasts right? They go down to 155 points, they have a champion, the new all out attack gives them +3 +3 and +2 +3 for the champion, have a 2" reach to get around the new coherency rules (I'm entertaining the idea that this rule hurts the use of bladegeists and harridans by a lot), and they are a battleline with a min squad of 10. 

I'm having a hard time placing chainrasps. they feel like they need to be ran in a unit of 20, as 10 is just too flimsy, but I like by big hordes, but only 4 reinforcements really kills them. Are they worth playing over our Grimghasts, especially with warscroll battalions being obsolete in matched play? If this is true, do we even take a sub-faction if we don't run chainrasps? 

Feel free to point something out, I'm thinking of hopping over to OBR until Nighthaunt get something in the ways of a book or overhaul, but I'm holding out for some good news for our ghosts. Cheers. 

[Malakithe]

Goodbye Chains and hello Reapers!

[Ranzou]

Literally every game I take my 30 reapers. And it was my biggest fear of 3.0 - reapers which are not battleline. Now I'm happy.

Rasps rip, Hexwraiths rip, banshees rip, stalkers went up in points - seriously?

[Ranzou]

Guys, you know what, Cogs contain big secret. Now wizardS gain extra spell on slow flow.

Take Reikenor, cast cogs, give him, Olinder, Guardian and Midnight Tome Carrier extra spell cast. It's like 4 extra bolts.

[The_Dudemeister]

6 hours ago, Zashier29 said:

I'm having a hard time placing chainrasps. they feel like they need to be ran in a unit of 20, as 10 is just too flimsy, but I like by big hordes, but only 4 reinforcements really kills them. Are they worth playing over our Grimghasts, especially with warscroll battalions being obsolete in matched play? If this is true, do we even take a sub-faction if we don't run chainrasps? 

Feel free to point something out, I'm thinking of hopping over to OBR until Nighthaunt get something in the ways of a book or overhaul, but I'm holding out for some good news for our ghosts. Cheers. 

Chainrasps are our cheapest wounds and they're on 25mm bases.

Both these things make them excellent screens. Even with the new coherency rules, you can string them out all next to each other without a need for a second row.

Nighthaunt really love screens because we want to be the ones charging with our stronger units. Forcing the opponent to waste their charges on 95 points units when they could've wiped 300+pts and then us counter-charging is the way.

Of course you can also get cheeky by deploying your Reapers 2" behind the Chainrasp screen. Opponent comes charging in, can only attack the Chainrasps. But now they're within 3" of the Reapers who will pile-in and do some cutting and slicing

 

Ps: Funny you mention OBR. They're currently the main salt mine because they cannot use the new command point mechanic. They surpassed our doom and gloom and shame us ghosties with their advanced suffering skills 😖

[Zashier29]

5 hours ago, The_Dudemeister said:

Chainrasps are our cheapest wounds and they're on 25mm bases.

Both these things make them excellent screens. Even with the new coherency rules, you can string them out all next to each other without a need for a second row.

So, essentially, I'm running min squad chainrasps to eat a charge and use the Reapers to clean house? I'm thinking lists today will run at least 2 units of 20 grimghasts, possibly one 30 unit. this leaves one or two reinforced squads of rasps, but to me that just feels bad. I'm wasting points and reinforcements on a squad that even at 20, doesn't survive very long (this could just be who I play against, but not the overall meta)? I think I would just run 4 min squads for more coverage and fill the last slots with more grimghasts and hope for a deepstrike wave of terror. 

Another thing is, since grimghasts are our best unit, how do we deal with elite armies or hero targeting? A unit of 10 grimghasts with reroll 1's from a sprit Torment and an all out attack only deal 6 wounds about 70% of the time against a 4+ save with a 6+ ward.  Due to the coherency rules, I'm against using Bladegeists or Harridans as about half I would say wouldn't be able to get into fight (this is me spit-balling, I could be terribly wrong) which leads them to deal less damage than the grimghasts against the same save as above even with a Spirit torment and all-out attack. Will this be a natural weakness that we have to accept?

 

5 hours ago, The_Dudemeister said:

Ps: Funny you mention OBR. They're currently the main salt mine because they cannot use the new command point mechanic. They surpassed our doom and gloom and shame us ghosties with their advanced suffering skills 😖

Yeah, lol. I went to their TGA and saw the pure Himalayan Salt poring from it. Hope they don't get destroyed in the Day 1 FAQ and hope for Nighthaunt getting some help! 

[CaptainSoup]

18 minutes ago, Zashier29 said:

So, essentially, I'm running min squad chainrasps to eat a charge and use the Reapers to clean house? I'm thinking lists today will run at least 2 units of 20 grimghasts, possibly one 30 unit. this leaves one or two reinforced squads of rasps, but to me that just feels bad. I'm wasting points and reinforcements on a squad that even at 20, doesn't survive very long (this could just be who I play against, but not the overall meta)? I think I would just run 4 min squads for more coverage and fill the last slots with more grimghasts and hope for a deepstrike wave of terror. 

Another thing is, since grimghasts are our best unit, how do we deal with elite armies or hero targeting? A unit of 10 grimghasts with reroll 1's from a sprit Torment and an all out attack only deal 6 wounds about 70% of the time against a 4+ save with a 6+ ward.  Due to the coherency rules, I'm against using Bladegeists or Harridans as about half I would say wouldn't be able to get into fight (this is me spit-balling, I could be terribly wrong) which leads them to deal less damage than the grimghasts against the same save as above even with a Spirit torment and all-out attack. Will this be a natural weakness that we have to accept?

 

Yeah, lol. I went to their TGA and saw the pure Himalayan Salt poring from it. Hope they don't get destroyed in the Day 1 FAQ and hope for Nighthaunt getting some help! 

Random spit-balling here:

Two 20 man reapers or a single 30 man will probably be the default auto-take choice going forward. My gut reaction looks like we'll be spoiled for points, not because things are cheap but because there isn't anything else worth taking specifically.

We could flood the table with small 10 man units of rasps that will work as a speed bump if aimed correctly, or could be extra wounds to cover our ever important heroes. Either way they won't last long on the table.

Mourngul could taken despite the inefficient cost just to give us access the monster abilities and something to fill our lists with. 

Lady O still has her posse of Hexwraiths which still make them somewhat relevant, but with the new hero abilities she could become even more useful in certain scenarios. 

As much as I would like to see Bladegheist or Herridans in play I'm having a hard time seeing a use for them. Their 32mm bases reduce their damage output with no noticeable way to improve them outside of having a pocket chainghast hugging close to the Bladegheists. The fact that there are less of everything this edition could change this depending on the armies we face, but it will be an uphill battle nonetheless. 

[LordPrometheus]

The problem is our bodies die far too quickly and we can't regen them fast enough to protect our heroes, and they don't hit hard enough unless we get lucky and wave of terror before we get hit. 

1 hour ago, Zashier29 said:

So, essentially, I'm running min squad chainrasps to eat a charge and use the Reapers to clean house? I'm thinking lists today will run at least 2 units of 20 grimghasts, possibly one 30 unit. this leaves one or two reinforced squads of rasps, but to me that just feels bad. I'm wasting points and reinforcements on a squad that even at 20, doesn't survive very long (this could just be who I play against, but not the overall meta)? 

 

It's not just you. NH get absolutely obliterated by the raw damage that's out there right now. A 4+ unrendable save doesn't mean very much these days. It would be fine if our model return was better and more reliable, but it's just nowhere near good enough to keep up. Especially now that the game is pushing us to MSU, most of the time the unit will be obliterated before you can even use your abilities to return models. 

[Benlisted]

I agree that suddenly nothing but Reapers looks worth taking.  Rasps - maybe okay as a speedbump, but feels really bad to waste reinforcements on.  Hosts I think are potentially decent in 3s, but on 50mms are ruined by coherency at 6+ models.  Hexwraiths not worth looking at unless you are running Emerald Host as bodyguards, even then only in 5s - or maybe if you really need some super fast objective grabbers, not for combat prowess (and given our movement shenanigans, is that really essential?)

Bladegheists and Harridans don't look awful points wise, especially as Reaper's rerolls are likely not to be in effect vs MSU, but for being on 32mms.  That really kills any desire to run them as more than 10, and even as 10s you're wondering why you're not just taking more Reapers who at least can all get into combat...

Myrmourns are just dead at 4 model max - you're never paying to reinforce them and get 4 more bodies, it's just not worth it.  Glaives as dead as they always were. Chainghasts might be alright as snipers but they're hardly rank and file.

I think Black Coach and Mourngul are looking good just by virtue of everything else being pretty lacklustre.  MSU should really help them shine.

Personally I am leaning towards a big stack of heroes, some monsters/BC, and then possibly even up to 4x20 reapers as a good core - they are fairly threatening especially if buffed, can actually all get into the fight, and are enough models we should be able to make use of our regeneration, such as it is.

[CaptainSoup]

41 minutes ago, Benlisted said:

I agree that suddenly nothing but Reapers looks worth taking.  Rasps - maybe okay as a speedbump, but feels really bad to waste reinforcements on.  Hosts I think are potentially decent in 3s, but on 50mms are ruined by coherency at 6+ models.  Hexwraiths not worth looking at unless you are running Emerald Host as bodyguards, even then only in 5s - or maybe if you really need some super fast objective grabbers, not for combat prowess (and given our movement shenanigans, is that really essential?)

Bladegheists and Harridans don't look awful points wise, especially as Reaper's rerolls are likely not to be in effect vs MSU, but for being on 32mms.  That really kills any desire to run them as more than 10, and even as 10s you're wondering why you're not just taking more Reapers who at least can all get into combat...

Myrmourns are just dead at 4 model max - you're never paying to reinforce them and get 4 more bodies, it's just not worth it.  Glaives as dead as they always were. Chainghasts might be alright as snipers but they're hardly rank and file.

I think Black Coach and Mourngul are looking good just by virtue of everything else being pretty lacklustre.  MSU should really help them shine.

Personally I am leaning towards a big stack of heroes, some monsters/BC, and then possibly even up to 4x20 reapers as a good core - they are fairly threatening especially if buffed, can actually all get into the fight, and are enough models we should be able to make use of our regeneration, such as it is.

Preach lol. 

The idea of 80 reapers on the table sounds like something no one wants to see on the table, you or your opponent. There are probably those in early 2nd edition who still remember what trouble reapers caused in old LoN armies and I can't help but shake the feeling that they'll wail in fear over them even if they can't do what they used to do, which might cause them to get nerfed again in a knee ****** response. Also the idea of buying more reapers is not something I would really want to do personally. I would probably use my unused Bladegheist as reaper proxies. They're basically reapers with swords anyway, I doubt people would even notice lol. 

I also kind of want to try to run a buffed up KoS or Cairn Wraith just to see what it could kill. I know realistically its a horrible idea and they'll die pretty much instantly, but I can dream dammit. 😆

Edited June 18, 2021 by CaptainSoup

[EnixLHQ]

2 hours ago, CaptainSoup said:

Random spit-balling here:

Two 20 man reapers or a single 30 man will probably be the default auto-take choice going forward. My gut reaction looks like we'll be spoiled for points, not because things are cheap but because there isn't anything else worth taking specifically.

We could flood the table with small 10 man units of rasps that will work as a speed bump if aimed correctly, or could be extra wounds to cover our ever important heroes. Either way they won't last long on the table.

Mourngul could taken despite the inefficient cost just to give us access the monster abilities and something to fill our lists with. 

Lady O still has her posse of Hexwraiths which still make them somewhat relevant, but with the new hero abilities she could become even more useful in certain scenarios. 

As much as I would like to see Bladegheist or Herridans in play I'm having a hard time seeing a use for them. Their 32mm bases reduce their damage output with no noticeable way to improve them outside of having a pocket chainghast hugging close to the Bladegheists. The fact that there are less of everything this edition could change this depending on the armies we face, but it will be an uphill battle nonetheless. 

I don't see Mourngul in the list of points. Is it listed elsewhere?

2 hours ago, Benlisted said:

I agree that suddenly nothing but Reapers looks worth taking.  Rasps - maybe okay as a speedbump, but feels really bad to waste reinforcements on.  Hosts I think are potentially decent in 3s, but on 50mms are ruined by coherency at 6+ models.  Hexwraiths not worth looking at unless you are running Emerald Host as bodyguards, even then only in 5s - or maybe if you really need some super fast objective grabbers, not for combat prowess (and given our movement shenanigans, is that really essential?)

Bladegheists and Harridans don't look awful points wise, especially as Reaper's rerolls are likely not to be in effect vs MSU, but for being on 32mms.  That really kills any desire to run them as more than 10, and even as 10s you're wondering why you're not just taking more Reapers who at least can all get into combat...

Myrmourns are just dead at 4 model max - you're never paying to reinforce them and get 4 more bodies, it's just not worth it.  Glaives as dead as they always were. Chainghasts might be alright as snipers but they're hardly rank and file.

I think Black Coach and Mourngul are looking good just by virtue of everything else being pretty lacklustre.  MSU should really help them shine.

Personally I am leaning towards a big stack of heroes, some monsters/BC, and then possibly even up to 4x20 reapers as a good core - they are fairly threatening especially if buffed, can actually all get into the fight, and are enough models we should be able to make use of our regeneration, such as it is.

I'm not seriously building any lists just yet, I want to wait a bit and see what the official release of the pre-order materials this Saturday ends up looking at, and what the Nighthaunt preview at WH Community points out for changes. I think it stands to reason that Nighthaunt has a fair few more changes ahead of us.

That being said, I foresee things working something like this:

• With command points becoming so frequent, and also expiring every round, we will be looking at abilities like At the Double (run), Redeploy (retreat), Forward to Victory (charge), Unleash Hell (overwatch for Chainghasts/Krulghast/Black Coach with Soulreach), All-out Attack (combat), maybe Inspiring Presence (battleshock) as augments to any troop choices, since you will be using them. This means that you can assume your Reapers will be attacking with a +1, or your double-reinforced Chainrasp Horde won't be fleeing. Also, lots of Spectral Summons, KoS (both) buffs, and Lady Olynder model returns.
• Native command abilities are more powerful in the same vein that removing all the extra artefacts made our own artefacts more powerful options than the alternative. For example, the KoSoES's Lord of Gheists for +1 attacks now has no alternative. No Vampire Lord to give the better version, no universal command ability to usurp it. Similarly, the KoS on foot's Spectral Overseer for +1 to hit is not All-out Attack, and thus both can be used in the same phase (not from the same command source, and not to the same unit, but we have two pockets of +1 to hit on the field). Plus, our CAs are worded with "at the start of X phase" meaning we still have our flexibility in using them on our opponent's turn, which we should with all these command points.
• Unit roles have changed, thanks to the loss of warscroll battalions and new unit sizes. Hexwraiths, for example, are no longer long-range hunters or assassins. They are objective hunters and skirmishers, or health/screens in Emerald Host. The damage is very small, but against another cavalry it can be enough. Reapers will be doing a lot of heavy lifting solely on their 2" range, but that doesn't discount the 1" damage dealers we have. We're going into this like we're going to surround opponents every time, but in my experience we get surrounded just as much, and in these cases a pack of Bladegheists or, now even more so, Dreadscythe Harridans are going to be worth taking. Remember that your opponent is going to have these same concerns we do; if they want to get max damage they're piling in. Let them.
• Our base regeneration hasn't changed. But what has is how often we have access to it. Lady Olynder can use her CA in our hero phase for at least 1 and now we have the CA to use it reliably, Ruler of the Spirit Host is the same. Black Coach still has Nimbus, and Spirit Torment is still my MVP. Plus, there's now Rally, a new CA for the hero phase, every hero phase, that can return models for any unit that's not in combat (yeah, opponent gets this, too, but this is a bonus for us). The wildcard here is Spectral Lure. On one hand it is slightly more reliable, with our opponents who had access to battalions that increased unbinding attempts or potential no longer gaining those benefits, or their wizards getting cost changes, but at the same time our MSUs now being small enough that having a viable target for the spell might be rarer to come by.
• The concept of throw-away or distractionary units needs another fresh new look. I've always advocated for other tactical styles for Nighthaunt like Envelopment and Pincer, as Hammer and Anvil is not our style, but now any hangers on are going to be forced to see things in more of this direction. No more 40 unit anvils. No more high mortal-wound hammers or daggers. Time to start thinking about out-juking, out-maneuvering, and out-sniping your opponent. This includes using spells like the one that turns heroes into monsters as disctrationary "yes, please unbind this" spells to let our native ones through more often.
• Reconsider the Krulghast Cruciator. I mean, look at what it does. His ruleset heralded the change in ward saves. His keyword highlighted TOTEM importance. He might hold other clues for what's to come, like a more reliable shooting phase, or a change in how our defenses work. But, as of right now, his 12" 4 attack, 3/3/-2/1 is already likely to hit. With All-out Attack, which can be used for shooting, that's a 2/3/-2/1. With a Spirit Torment there's some rerolling 1s to hit in all phases. You can make him hit every time if you want to, and then everyone around him has a 5+ ward. This can be huge, and I'm highly suggesting he be included in every list right now.
• Battlelines, battlelines, battlelines. Say it with me, "battlelines." What does GW want us to focus on right now? Battlelines. They might as well write it on neon pink stickers and slap it on the cover of every book that's coming out in the next 6 months. Why? No clue, honestly, but it's written on the whiteboard in permanent marker. So let's join in why not. Chainrasps, Spirit Hosts, Reapers, and Hexwraiths. We can have some fun with that.
• And finally Core Battalions. _sigh Okay, I see a lot of use here. I'll set aside my smoldering rage for a bit and accept the Core-only meta and start looking into how we can abuse these standard-issue battalions.
  • Unified: Well, if'n everyone's going to be looking to go second nowadays, our opponents might be trying to capitalize on this to ensure priority and the choice to go second. So can we. It requires a Commander and 2 Troops. Can take a max of a Commander, 2 sub-commanders, 5 troops, and either a behemoth or artillery. So, how about a Spirit Torment with Ruler, a Kulghast Cruciator, 2 Reaper units (reinforced once each), 1 Spirit Host unit (reinforced once), 1 Hexwraith unit, and the Black Coach? 945 points, one drop. The Hexwraiths and Black Coach will be doing harrasment, Spirit Hosts hold an objective or help fight for one. Both leaders stick together to reinforce each other and buff their Reaper palls. For a total of 1070 points you can reinforce the Spirit Hosts one more time to make sure that blob isn't going anywhere. That's 1055 or 930 points to spend on additional stuff.
  • Expert: Once per battle, free All-out Attack or Defense. Only to one unit from this battalion, though Hm.
  • Magnificent: 1 extra enhancement. Hmmm. It comes with a better ability in the Warlord battalion, so maybe.
  • Slayers: Same as Expert, but instead of Defense as the second option, Unleash Hell.
  • Strategists: Okay, I see this getting some use. Once per battle you can opt for an additional CP in your hero phase. Requires a Commander, 2 sub-commanders. If you want the additional enhancement then bring 1 troop. Maxes out with 2 Commanders, 4 sub-commanders, 2 troops (with the lesser version maxing at 1 commander, 3 sub-commanders). I would suggest this being your other battalion to use along side Unified for the extra CPs and getting your heroes out on the field. Minimum 3 heroes, so with the rest of our ~1000 points what would we'd like to see? A couple Dreadblade Harrows? How about Olynder, Guardian of Souls, KoSoES, and another Hexwraith unit? We'd lose Ruler, and we'd have a cap of 4 heroes so we'd have to drop maybe the KC or put him in the Strat battalion, but gain Emerald Host subfaction potential for Olynder wounds (or KoS if you actually want to play Emerald Host as intended).
    • This would make a list that looks like this:
    • Subfaction: Emerald Host
    • Unified: Spirit Torment, 2x Reapers (reinforced once each), 1x Spirit Host (reinforced once), 1x Hexwraith, 1x Black Coach
    • Strategist (Warlord): Lady Olynder (General), GoS, KC, 1x Hexwraith
    • Total: 5 drops, 2 enhancements, 2 CP a round with 1 more one time, for a total of 1975 points.
      • And I'd might play this like this: Spirit Torment with one Reaper blob, the KC with the other Reaper blob, GoS with either of Reaper blobs, Black Coach with whatever Reaper blob didn't get GoS, Olynder and both Hexwraiths in the Underworlds, Spirit Hosts in the Underworlds. Unified doesn't state that reserves isn't a valid location. Try to go second, but be prepared to go first. If first, drop Spirit Hosts on an objective. If second drop them near a contested one. Push up the field with your on-field units. Drop an Olynderbomb in the back field. Pay special attention to the designer's emphasizing that objectives are taken, not held, and move away from the ones I control and try to push back my opponent into safe distances.

This is very cursory, as I don't have the full book to digest anything and I could be wrong on a number of points.

Edited June 18, 2021 by EnixLHQ

[Zashier29]

38 minutes ago, EnixLHQ said:

And finally Core Battalions. _sigh Okay, I see a lot of use here. I'll set aside my smoldering rage for a bit and accept the Core-only meta and start looking into how we can abuse these standard-issue battalions.

Unless I'm mistaken, I think you left out Vanguard, which requires a sub-commander and a troop, up to a max of 3 troops. It allows for once per battle to select a unit in this battalion to at the double or forward to victory (run 6" or reroll a charge). For us, wouldn't this be something to at least consider? I at least tried to reroll charges in hopes for a wave of terror or because I deepstruck a unit. We also don't have any in built abilities to help assure charges, so this maybe what we have to take as well. 

[EnixLHQ]

6 minutes ago, Zashier29 said:

Unless I'm mistaken, I think you left out Vanguard, which requires a sub-commander and a troop, up to a max of 3 troops. It allows for once per battle to select a unit in this battalion to at the double or forward to victory (run 6" or reroll a charge). For us, wouldn't this be something to at least consider? I at least tried to reroll charges in hopes for a wave of terror or because I deepstruck a unit. We also don't have any in built abilities to help assure charges, so this maybe what we have to take as well. 

Yep. Missed it.

• Swift: Once per battle a single unit from this battalion gets a free At the Double or Forward to Victory, so a full 6" run or charge re-roll. My opinion on this is that we already have a lot of movement shenanigans and while this does provide some utility, I don't think I'd select it over Unified or Strategist, unless maybe Unified starts looking like a lost cause. A free CA is still a CA, and you're still limited to one unique CA per phase. That being said, in a Wave of Terror fishing list I wouldn't take as many Reapers and instead going for Bladegheists and/or gasp Glaivewraiths and putting them in this battalion thanks to their retreat and charge mechanic.

That reminds me. Glaivewraith Stalkers are actually looking like a good utility unit to me. Small, cheap, every model in the unit is a champion, retreat and charge in the same turn. It's a hard shame that it takes reinforcement slots to make them into a damage unit, but they were never meant to do damage and they can potentially now do the what they were originally intended to do, which is to retreat over front lines to charge ranged or hero units in the back to tie them up. They were meant to be discardable anti-ranged options back when Stormcast was the only ranged threat with only 4 crossbowers to a unit. Maybe we'll see smaller ranged units now and these guys could tie them up for a phase or two.