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Gaz Taylor

AoS 2 - Maggotkin of Nurgle Discussion

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Well I had a really rough weekend of games. I lost 5 out of 5. My Great Unclean one got deleted in a single turn by Grimghast Reapers. I was using Endless Gift on him at the time, but he didn't survive long enough to make it to the battleshock phase even with the witherstave debuff affecting the reapers.  My Plague Drones completely failed to materialize damage in all but one game. Even fully buffed with Locus/Grandfather's Joy/Blades of Putrefaction their damage seemed very swingy and unreliable and their fragility (for a nurgle unit) was punished immediately after their initial attack every single time. My plaguebearers also kind of let me down. Their whole thing is that are supposed to be hard to remove, but without creative positioning and stacking several additional buffs to their defences I was losing them in droves. Granted I was rolling very poorly all weekend, but Daemons didn't blow me away and I can see why mortal lists seem to be in vogue. My blight kings at least didn't let me down all weekend, constantly putting out more damage than I anticipated and tanking far more damage than I had dared to hope. It's just a shame I only had 5 of them with me. My next list will definitely be featuring them prominently.

Honestly feeling very demoralized after the weekend. I made some mistakes in my set up positioning and I learned from that, but too late. I had terrible luck on the dice (I got double turned almost every opportunity, failed to cast my best spells over half the time, etc). Also I know lack of sleep and some stress from my personal life was affecting my decision making, so I guess I shouldn't be too down on myself because this weekend probably isn't the best indicator of my own skill or Nurgle's potential, but boy... it was hard.

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It's not your fault, @Dreadmund. Grimghasts being availabel to Legions of Nagash is the single most broken thing about this game right now. Why is this the ONLY nighthaunt unit thats available to them? Yet its the best one in the book. Reapers being nighthaunt only would fix a lot of balance issues with LoN.

Sounds like you were playing two opponents per game, the opposing player and your own dice rolls.  Even the best players cant do well in that scenario. Nurgle is a 3-2 army right now. So going 0/5 is 100% an outlier. Dont beat yourself up. What glaring mistakes do you think you made? GUO sounds like he might have been out of position. Demons right now are just not in line with proper points costs. And with no viable battalions for demons it also makes things very difficult because if you want extra cp you have to pay for it with no additional buffs via battalions. and no way to get addition relics. I feel they will do right by us come GHB, with hopefully a new book within a year...a quick update to fix a few things and give us endless spells. 

My theory is since we were the FIRST 2nd edition book..just before "free summoning" was a worry on everyones mind.. they didnt want this book to be the harbinger of power creep and go overboard with a nrand new summoning mechanic.. so their aired on the side of caution. It was ok for about 6 ~monsths but now the book has not aged well. 

Take advanatage of blightkings low points cost now.. I have a strong feeling they will increase in points. As they stand they are an insane value. They went up 5 wounds per unit but went down 4 points per model. 

 

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20 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

What glaring mistakes do you think you made? GUO sounds like he might have been out of position.

In that case yes, my GUO wasn't where he should have been. Honestly a lot of my problems in that game stemmed from me taking first turn when I shouldn't have. 2 run rolls of 1 meant that I couldn't get my Plaguebearers far enough along the board to claim objectives or support the GUO. In retrospect with that battleplan I should have taken second turn. It would have given me more flexibility with my movement options utilizing gnarlmaw run and charge and most importantly it would have shut down the enemy's extra attacks on a charge ability which I didn't realise he even had. I won't make the same mistake against a nighthaunt player next time. Being new, I think unfamiliarity with enemy playstyles hurt me the most. In that respect, at least I learned a lot from the weekend. My next game vs this player will benefit from the ass-handing I got given.

27 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

I feel they will do right by us come GHB, with hopefully a new book within a year...a quick update to fix a few things and give us endless spells. 

My theory is since we were the FIRST 2nd edition book..just before "free summoning" was a worry on everyones mind.. they didnt want this book to be the harbinger of power creep and go overboard with a nrand new summoning mechanic.. so their aired on the side of caution. It was ok for about 6 ~monsths but now the book has not aged well. 

Yeah I am definitely looking forward to the GHB. Even just a few point cost tweaks could mean the world for us. There are too many units, particularly some of the newer, nicer looking sculpts that just aren't worth taking at all at the moment. I definitely think they will start releasing endless spells for factions that don't have any soon - they've been well received and would be a must buy for any player. That's just money on the table!

33 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

Take advanatage of blightkings low points cost now.. I have a strong feeling they will increase in points. As they stand they are an insane value. They went up 5 wounds per unit but went down 4 points per model. 

No doubt. I have 15 built and 5 on the sprue currently. I don't feel there was anything that my 60 plaguebearers did that 30 plaguebearers couldn't have done just as well. But an extra unit of 10 blightkings rocking around with some choice buffs could work wonders.

I'm not giving up, but I definitely need more practice.

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13 hours ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

Why is this the ONLY nighthaunt unit thats available to them?

Well technically its not the only one if we're being technical here.😜

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Hi folks! Have been directed here from another thread I started regarding competitive low model count armies. 

 

Easentially all I’m looking to know is, how viable an army is a lower model count Nurgle force? And what might such a list be comprised of? I don’t know that I’d want to play the Thricefold, but am definitely open to any ideas and thoughts on low model count Nurgle that can hang with higher level armies. All comments and assistance welcome and appreciated! 😀 

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23 minutes ago, Draakur said:

Hi folks! Have been directed here from another thread I started regarding competitive low model count armies. 

 

Easentially all I’m looking to know is, how viable an army is a lower model count Nurgle force? And what might such a list be comprised of? I don’t know that I’d want to play the Thricefold, but am definitely open to any ideas and thoughts on low model count Nurgle that can hang with higher level armies. All comments and assistance welcome and appreciated! 😀 

A mortal army with lots of blight kings sounds like what you want. Blight kings come in units of 5 and are very powerful for their cost. You can pair them up with a variety of heroes like the Lord of Blights and Lord of Afflictions in a battalion or the Glottkin by itself to get buffs that make them hit harder. The Harbinger of decay can make them tankier. The Great Unclean one can buff their movement speed and is the best choice to abuse realm spells because he is the only unit we have that can get a plus to spellcasting rolls (by taking a single, non-preventable wound). An army that focuses on blight kings has great synergies and can make up for their lack of model count through sheer brute force and staying power. However, you're still going to want daemons for summoning, including 20 Plaguebearers since that's the biggest unit size we can summon them in.

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17 minutes ago, Dreadmund said:

A mortal army with lots of blight kings sounds like what you want. Blight kings come in units of 5 and are very powerful for their cost. You can pair them up with a variety of heroes like the Lord of Blights and Lord of Afflictions in a battalion or the Glottkin by itself to get buffs that make them hit harder. The Harbinger of decay can make them tankier. The Great Unclean one can buff their movement speed and is the best choice to abuse realm spells because he is the only unit we have that can get a plus to spellcasting rolls (by taking a single, non-preventable wound). An army that focuses on blight kings has great synergies and can make up for their lack of model count through sheer brute force and staying power. However, you're still going to want daemons for summoning, including 20 Plaguebearers since that's the biggest unit size we can summon them in.

This is absolutely perfect and exactly the kind of info and detail I was hoping to get. Thank you so much!

 

Thinking about the rules etc, I had a glance at the Maggotkin Battletome picture and it looks like one of the more recent books, given some of the details on the cover - do I have that right? So their rules are likely set as they are and not changing any time soon I’d imagine, if I’ve got that correct?

 

i assume the Plaguebearers are also there for objective gaming too, given how significant that is (new to the game so doing a lot of learning right now - sorry if that seems a ridiculous question!)?

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24 minutes ago, Draakur said:

I had a glance at the Maggotkin Battletome picture and it looks like one of the more recent books, given some of the details on the cover - do I have that right? So their rules are likely set as they are and not changing any time soon I’d imagine, if I’ve got that correct?

Maggotkin came out in January 2018, and it considered by most to be the first real AoS 2.0 battletome. So pretty much every other faction that GW intends to support going forward will be getting their book before Maggotkin next gets a refresh and theres still lots of factions on that list. For the foreseeable future, baring any tweaks made in the GHB in Summer, that Battletome will be staying relevant.

27 minutes ago, Draakur said:

i assume the Plaguebearers are also there for objective gaming too, given how significant that is (new to the game so doing a lot of learning right now - sorry if that seems a ridiculous question!)?

Yeah, they don't hit hard and are tanky for a horde unit but still not terrible so. Their main purpose is to put bodies on objectives to claim them or to act as a physical wall preventing the enemy from getting bodies/heroes on objectives. That's why I think it's important to have some for summoning, it will often allow you to change the math in your favour.

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12 minutes ago, Dreadmund said:

Maggotkin came out in January 2018, and it considered by most to be the first real AoS 2.0 battletome. So pretty much every other faction that GW intends to support going forward will be getting their book before Maggotkin next gets a refresh and theres still lots of factions on that list. For the foreseeable future, baring any tweaks made in the GHB in Summer, that Battletome will be staying relevant.

Interesting - good to know. I’ll be keeping my eye out, my searching is telling me a new GHB may well be imminent. Thanks again for the concise, knowledgeable and speedy replies, it makes this experience of “catching up” and learning the ins and outs of the game and hobby that much more enjoyable and manageable.

 

And yep roger on the Plaguebearers, makes sense. I imagine that addition would be essential in a competitive form of this type of list then.

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5 minutes ago, Draakur said:

And yep roger on the Plaguebearers, makes sense. I imagine that addition would be essential in a competitive form of this type of list then.

For summoning at least, yes. You have other options if you want to start with a big unit for this purpose. Chaos Marauders and Plague Monks are popular. But Plaguebearers are the only ones you can summon.

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Thoughts on this list. Any and all.. be as critical as you can. Removing Glottkin is NOT an option. 

Should I go cogs instead of the CP? Two command points allows me to use glottkins +1 attack (mainly for monks) AND inspiring presence. Cogs would GREATLY increase my chnaces of turn 1 charge with both the monks and outflanking blightkings, but I could only use inspiring presence OR Glottkin's command (lords of nurgle) 


The Glottkin (420)
- Lore of Malignance: Blades of Putrefaction
Gutrot Spume (140)
Great Unclean One (340)
- General
- Bile Blade & Doomsday Bell
- Trait: Grandfather's Blessing 
- Artefact: The Witherstave 
- Lore of Virulence: Favoured Poxes
10 x Putrid Blightkings (320)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
40 x Plague Monks (240)
- Foetid Blades

Total: 1940 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 181
 

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Posted (edited)
On 3/27/2019 at 9:35 PM, sal4m4nd3r said:

Thoughts on this list. Any and all.. be as critical as you can. Removing Glottkin is NOT an option. 

Should I go cogs instead of the CP? Two command points allows me to use glottkins +1 attack (mainly for monks) AND inspiring presence. Cogs would GREATLY increase my chnaces of turn 1 charge with both the monks and outflanking blightkings, but I could only use inspiring presence OR Glottkin's command (lords of nurgle) 
 

Well the inspiring presence is great if you want to keep those monks a little longer. (Or maybe you might use it on the blightkings, but i guess you woukd use it on the plague monks) On the other hand do you really need that after your monks have got their charge and did damage?

The cogs have a rather high roll of 7, or a 6 with your GUO.  The cogs gonna help make the charges (which would be what you want right?), furthermore if you keep control over them during the match you coukd also use them to cast an extra spell, mystic shield extra, foul regenenis extra....besides extra save roll for the wizard.

IF the cogs are on the field i feel you have more use of that compared with the extra command point. (Although no monks running is great to obviously)

 

I like your list Glott 2 spells and the best rotbringer spell togther with GUO and the best daemon spell. Gutrot for the nice attack in the back...only thing i can think of is that your blightkings do mot really have much buffs. Might be troublesome since you have a lot of them. No harby for extra save, no LoP for re-rolls, no LoB (blightcyst, but i read you wanted to shift awy from that). Ofcourse you have your buffs and debuffs from the spells, but that are not guaranteed buffs! You coukd fail a spell, or it gets dispelled. Relying on magic can be dangerous (especially for Nurgle, with those high casts).

That was my “critical” evaluation. On the other hand I love the list and if the spells go off (and you have cogs, which i would add, cause i assume all spells go of ;) ) then this could be devastating for an opponent.

 

Edit: Maybe give GUO tome of a thousand poxes instead of witherstave to get that extra +1 on spells

Edited by Fluxlord

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Posted (edited)

Hi I ve tried yesterday a drone bomb list with good results, 6 flyes killed:

2 varghulf heroes

1 abhorrant King

6 crypt horrors

1 abhorrant King on terrorgheist

The secret for this carnage were 30 plagueBearers that hold enemy units in position and a poxbringer with The favourite poxes! At T1 I was hopeless as The enemy heroes were reviving a lot of models, and The Hero on terrorgheist was truly formidable with The maw attack rerrolling (on a 6, 6 mw, and with a CP pile in again!)

 

 

 

Edited by peasant

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My Next try is very experimental, a list that Will Focus in generating a lot of contagion points:

LEADERS
Lord of Plagues (140)
- General
- Command Trait : Avalanche of Rotten Flesh 
- Artefact : Rustfang 
Lord of Plagues (140)
Lord of Plagues (140)
Lord of Plagues (140)
Lord of Plagues (140)
Gutrot Spume (140)
UNITS
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)
TOTAL: 1960/2000 

189wounds!

This list wont play to kill fast, just endure and farm contagion points while camping on objectives via lord of plagues ability and territory coverage (gutrot help a lot with that), could be fun. I Will play It this weekend or The following if I gather enough family points (rarer than contagion points these days with a newborn)

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Including Glottkin I would try something like this. Just because drones sync so well with the command ability. With 2x30 Plaguebearers you also have a good objective game. Add . Fleshy abdunance.

Drones are flexible and I think the overall synergy in the list is way more flexible and you can adjust ypur gameplan depending on scenario and Opponent. lacking maybe heros for specific maps but at least you have a durable GUO.

 

Great Unclean One (340) - General

- Command Trait : Grandfather's Blessing

- Bile Blade & Doomsday Bell - Artefact : The Witherstave

- Lore of Virulence : Favoured Poxes

The Glottkin (420) -

Lore of Malignance : Blades of Putrefaction

 30 x Plaguebearers (320)

30 x Plaguebearers (320)

5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)

3 x Plague Drones (200)

3 x Plague Drones (200)

ENDLESS SPELLS

Aethervoid Pendulum (40)

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42 minutes ago, Zplash said:

Including Glottkin I would try something like this. Just because drones sync so well with the command ability. With 2x30 Plaguebearers you also have a good objective game. Add . Fleshy abdunance.

Drones are flexible and I think the overall synergy in the list is way more flexible and you can adjust ypur gameplan depending on scenario and Opponent. lacking maybe heros for specific maps but at least you have a durable GUO.

 

Great Unclean One (340) - General

- Command Trait : Grandfather's Blessing

- Bile Blade & Doomsday Bell - Artefact : The Witherstave

- Lore of Virulence : Favoured Poxes

The Glottkin (420) -

Lore of Malignance : Blades of Putrefaction

 30 x Plaguebearers (320)

30 x Plaguebearers (320)

5 x Putrid Blightkings (160)

3 x Plague Drones (200)

3 x Plague Drones (200)

ENDLESS SPELLS

Aethervoid Pendulum (40)

I prefer to run 6 drones instead of 3+3,  you Will Max The effect of command abilities and Blades of putrefaction

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4 minutes ago, peasant said:

I prefer to run 6 drones instead of 3+3,  you Will Max The effect of command abilities and Blades of putrefaction

It depends. Glott command Doesnt matter about 6 or 2x3 with good positioning. 

Still GUO and blades benefit from 1x6 drones but I prefer to be more flexible and maybe flank 3 drones or something. Blades can also go on plaguebearers as well as command. Depends on Situation. With 1x6 drones you are kind of have only a 1 Pony Trick. I like to have more options :D

but again it depends in your play style etc. And 1x6 drones have there benefits for sure :)

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55 minutes ago, Zplash said:

It depends. Glott command Doesnt matter about 6 or 2x3 with good positioning. 

Still GUO and blades benefit from 1x6 drones but I prefer to be more flexible and maybe flank 3 drones or something. Blades can also go on plaguebearers as well as command. Depends on Situation. With 1x6 drones you are kind of have only a 1 Pony Trick. I like to have more options

but again it depends in your play style etc. And 1x6 drones have there benefits for sure :)

Yeah you are right! Another sugestion, frío The Endless spell, and change The putrids for 5 chaos Warriors ir 10 plagueBearers ti get antes additional command point

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On 6/21/2018 at 9:05 PM, Infernalslayer said:

Wanted to use some mortal rotbringers in a few 1000 point games to avoid big Plaguebearer hordes since we play in 4x4 tables. Can i fit Harbinger of Decay and Blightkings effectively without hadicapping myself much?

Sure can. Blightkings are undercosted atm and can surely fit in 1000 with a 160 point hero with plenty to spare.

 

@Fluxlord thanks for critica synopsis. I’m effectively reading buffs and the 5++ save on the blightkings ..for more kings and better chaff. I love the plague monks models in a big block to. I’m going to keep witherstave as it’s a hard counter to gristlegore and a lot of abilities that proc in a six. Leaning to go with cogs after reading your post. I can use IP to keep them in the fight and follow that up with glotts commabd to make up for not getting the bonus attack in the charge turn two. I’ll report on any games I get in.

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Posted (edited)

I didnt realize how disgustingly broken the skaven "warp lightning vortex" endless spell is. It casts on an 8.. so a bit high.. but range is 26" and (similar to soul snare shackles) the other two wholly within 7" of the first. When it is  set-up and at the end of each movement phase it does d3 mortals to all units within 6" of ONE of them. If within 6" of two you get +1 to the roll. +2 to the roll if within 6" of all three. And on a unmodified roll of 6... thats d6 mortals. Also models that are within 6" cant fly or run.  

Image result for shocked meme gif

So you can cast turn one, right into there deployment zone, it procs, then it procs at the end of your movement phase. So before the opponent can even take a hero phase (if you go first) it hits them. thats DEVASTATING. Relevant to Nurgle because the Verminlord Corrupter is a nurgle wizard and skaventide wizard. So he can be in our army (not ally - so can have artefacts, command traits if general, and a nurgle demon spell) and also cast this endless spell. 

Note his unique spell is 13" range, pick a unit and roll a dice for each model within that unit (NOT within the range of the spell) and each 4+ is a mortal wound. 13" range gaunt summoner spell. 

Verminlord corrupter+warp lightning vortex is only 20 points more then GUO 

Edited by sal4m4nd3r

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Im trying to convert some chaos knights to nurgle. Ive used green stuff directly in The Horse legal but It seems fragile to me. Any advice? Do you find The size ok? Or is like he ido riding a donkey? The other Knight is for comparison

IMG_20190401_190303.jpg

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37 minutes ago, peasant said:

Im trying to convert some chaos knights to nurgle. Ive used green stuff directly in The Horse legal but It seems fragile to me. Any advice? Do you find The size ok? Or is like he ido riding a donkey? The other Knight is for comparison

IMG_20190401_190303.jpg

I think it looks great. If the dude was standing next to the horse, the saddle would come up to his shoulder, which is about right for a large horse. I think the blightkings are just so fat that they'll never look like a medieval knight on a horse.

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2 minutes ago, hughwyeth said:

I think it looks great. If the dude was standing next to the horse, the saddle would come up to his shoulder, which is about right for a large horse. I think the blightkings are just so fat that they'll never look like a medieval knight on a horse.

Yeah, they Will like strange, lets see what he does like after some painting hehe

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1 hour ago, peasant said:

Im trying to convert some chaos knights to nurgle. Ive used green stuff directly in The Horse legal but It seems fragile to me. Any advice? Do you find The size ok? Or is like he ido riding a donkey? The other Knight is for comparison

IMG_20190401_190303.jpg

Everchosen horses fit them well. You just need to be a millionaire.

I think yours looks good tho

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One month ago, I got for cheap 6 varanguards but I sobre want to nurglify  them if I can avoid that.

31 minutes ago, Riavan said:

Everchosen horses fit them well. You just need to be a millionaire.

I think yours looks good tho

 

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