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Gaz Taylor

AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

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1 hour ago, Sumanye said:

What are people doing to build their Kairic Acolytes with respect to cursed glaives and shields?   This has always been a problem and it's always bugged me that you cannot really build Kairic Acolytes wysiwyg without conversion and I was really hoping this would be fixed in the new book.  I'll probably wait for the FAQ before I build anymore acolytes, but honestly I think I'm just going to say hell with it and build my cursed glaives with shields.  Not really interesting in converting a bunch of models, but also really hate things not being wysiwyg.  I understand most opponents won't care, but I guess I just like my army to be accurate.

 

cursed glaive models can have a shield as i understand it?

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2 hours ago, TheadTheOgorSlayer said:

Question, if I take the chainfire amulet and roll a 6, do I lose the whole attack or just the 6 up.

the wording states “the attack sequence ends” and someone told me that means the whole attack, not just the 6 up that does the mortal wounds.

the wording is similar for the slaves to darkness daemon prince for his sword so I’m very confused whether I’ve been been playing this correctly 

Each attack is done seperately technically. So it says the attack sequence ends because that line of that single attack ends. 

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3 hours ago, Sumanye said:

What are people doing to build their Kairic Acolytes with respect to cursed glaives and shields?   This has always been a problem and it's always bugged me that you cannot really build Kairic Acolytes wysiwyg without conversion and I was really hoping this would be fixed in the new book.  I'll probably wait for the FAQ before I build anymore acolytes, but honestly I think I'm just going to say hell with it and build my cursed glaives with shields.  Not really interesting in converting a bunch of models, but also really hate things not being wysiwyg.  I understand most opponents won't care, but I guess I just like my army to be accurate.

 

I have also been trying to bring up thjs point. Make sure to e-mail GW and ask to make sure it gets answered. People online are near 50-50 with what to do.

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4 hours ago, Sumanye said:

What are people doing to build their Kairic Acolytes with respect to cursed glaives and shields?   This has always been a problem and it's always bugged me that you cannot really build Kairic Acolytes wysiwyg without conversion and I was really hoping this would be fixed in the new book.  I'll probably wait for the FAQ before I build anymore acolytes, but honestly I think I'm just going to say hell with it and build my cursed glaives with shields.  Not really interesting in converting a bunch of models, but also really hate things not being wysiwyg.  I understand most opponents won't care, but I guess I just like my army to be accurate.

 

I believe that all weapon options are exclusive.


So I’m doing Glaive on the Vulcarch, Scroll and Two Weapons models and then pending the faq I’ll just cut off the top and bottom of the daggers. Then just not mounting the shield on their back.

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On 1/22/2020 at 2:46 AM, simakover said:

how you use youre changelling? as standart 2/2 wizard or put him in OP deploy and moving him with big unit? then you decide cast spell with him?

and that special with Tome of Eyes? looks like mediocre endless

It depends on the battleplan. I played places of power and was able to use his movement shenanigans to put him in range to claim an objective and still have him screened with 10 pink horrors due to them using the Changehost move. Otherwise I move him up the field being the Locus buff bot for my largest unit of Pink Horrors. I typically take Treason of Tzeentch for him so I can get very disgusting on the -1 to hits or put that spell on a unit that's attacking another of my pink units to even out the -1 to hits.

I am sure someone smarter has fully evaluated Tome of Eyes for you by now but I think its decent and it does give him something better than arcane bolt to cast. It's a D3 dmg spell at least even if it doesn't always work. But the best reason is the re-roll to cast and you don't have to keep him near anyone else. As a bonus it's a decent little blocker. It has to stay within 1" of the caster so you can use it as an extra model to screen the changeling with and reset where it is every time you move him. That being said just having him spam Geminids every turn and have your LOC eat it at the start of each of you hero phases is probably better. 

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Casting Arcane Bolt is not so bad. Easy spell, give Fate Point, can decrease horde bonus or monster damage table characteristics.

Changeling knows spells from enemy wizards warscrolls within 9" so You can try to go for that which begs a question:
- If You teleport Changeling 9" away from enemy and then summon Vortex, does the Vortex have to be placed 9" away from enemy or centrally from Changeling 40mm base? Hand of Dust cast on Nagash using Destiny Dices? :D

Edited by Xyxel

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General questions :

- Is there a spell that can be normally cast more than once per magic/hero phase? (I don't speak about trics like ES then dispell then cast again etc...)

- what are the sources of making our castings more reliable? I'm in a brainstorming to make the fate points going above 9 in T1 with my list with kairos (in the previous page)

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20 minutes ago, GeneralZero said:

- Is there a spell that can be normally cast more than once per magic/hero phase? (I don't speak about trics like ES then dispell then cast again etc...)

- what are the sources of making our castings more reliable? I'm in a brainstorming to make the fate points going above 9 in T1 with my list with kairos (in the previous page)

Some warscrolls have "signature spells" like Nagash, Horrors and Karic Acolytes that specifically specify that they can be cast multiple times in a single phase. In general it's 1 cast per distinct spell per phase though.

Lord of Change Command ability, Changecaster's once per battle ability, Horrors get +1 near a daemon hero, Tome of Eyes grants reroll spellcasts, Blue Scribes also grants reroll spellcasts in an aura, some artefacts convey bonus to cast... Our book is literally filled with this stuff.

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Spoiler

Allegiance: Tzeentch 
Change Coven:  Guild of Summoners
Mortal Realm: Chamon

LEADERS
Kairos Fateweaver
 (400)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
Herald of Tzeentch on Burning Chariot (140)
- General
- Command Trait:- Prophet of the Ostensible

- Staff of Change
- Lore of Change: Treason of Tzeentch
Herald of Tzeentch (110)
- Ritual Dagger
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch
Gaunt Summoner (240)
- Lore of Fate: Glimpse the Future
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (110)
- Lore of Fate: Arcane Suggestion
- Artefact:  Brimstone Familiar
Be'Lakor (240)

UNITS
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch
 (200)
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)

ENDLESS SPELLS
Balewind Vortex
 (40)
Darkfire Daemonrift (50)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (60)
Umbral Spellportal (70)
Soulsnare Shackles (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 75

Want to try this list from tempest2020, but im dont understand how better change spells on wizards?

Why kairos use foldreality, but not a DMG spell?

How make first moves, place units? Cause it is not one drop so may be defensive placement better then aggressive

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10 minutes ago, simakover said:
  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Tzeentch 
Change Coven:  Guild of Summoners
Mortal Realm: Chamon

LEADERS
Kairos Fateweaver
 (400)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
Herald of Tzeentch on Burning Chariot (140)
- General
- Command Trait:- Prophet of the Ostensible

- Staff of Change
- Lore of Change: Treason of Tzeentch
Herald of Tzeentch (110)
- Ritual Dagger
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch
Gaunt Summoner (240)
- Lore of Fate: Glimpse the Future
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (110)
- Lore of Fate: Arcane Suggestion
- Artefact:  Brimstone Familiar
Be'Lakor (240)

UNITS
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch
 (200)
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)

ENDLESS SPELLS
Balewind Vortex
 (40)
Darkfire Daemonrift (50)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (60)
Umbral Spellportal (70)
Soulsnare Shackles (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 75

Want to try this list from tempest2020, but im dont understand how better change spells on wizards?

Why kairos use foldreality, but not a DMG spell?

How make first moves, place units? Cause it is not one drop so may be defensive placement better then aggressive

Don’t forget that Kairos now all friendly spells. That, his own damage spell and all the Endless will most likely result in that if necessary Kairos can dish out a lot of hurt if needed.

As to deployment and movements- really up to the mission and what you are up against. You will most likely need to set up solid screens with pinks/acolytes if up against something that can threaten you first turn - if not you will probably need to plan for getting first turn (move up and park on objectives - de-buff and buff as appropriate and summon the first LoC turn 1). 

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31 minutes ago, simakover said:
  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Tzeentch 
Change Coven:  Guild of Summoners
Mortal Realm: Chamon

LEADERS
Kairos Fateweaver
 (400)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
Herald of Tzeentch on Burning Chariot (140)
- General
- Command Trait:- Prophet of the Ostensible

- Staff of Change
- Lore of Change: Treason of Tzeentch
Herald of Tzeentch (110)
- Ritual Dagger
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch
Gaunt Summoner (240)
- Lore of Fate: Glimpse the Future
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (110)
- Lore of Fate: Arcane Suggestion
- Artefact:  Brimstone Familiar
Be'Lakor (240)

UNITS
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch
 (200)
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)

ENDLESS SPELLS
Balewind Vortex
 (40)
Darkfire Daemonrift (50)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (60)
Umbral Spellportal (70)
Soulsnare Shackles (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 75

Want to try this list from tempest2020, but im dont understand how better change spells on wizards?

Why kairos use foldreality, but not a DMG spell?

How make first moves, place units? Cause it is not one drop so may be defensive placement better then aggressive

This kind of list scares me, not because they are scary but because playing a list in which

1) there are no offensive unit and/or anvil like

2) horrors and kairics by 10 are super fragiles and can be erased easyly and can't reply do things in return

3) most HQ are fragile and not fighters.

Maybe the ES make the difference...

Edited by GeneralZero

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18 hours ago, MattyP said:

so, I love the new endless spells for Tzeentch (probably would try to take 1-2 of them in a list) but realized that if i take the GS he has StD keyword and that gives access to StD endless spells. Are they worth taking? Been hearing a lot about Darkfire Demon drift

Also, the Tzaangor shaman (or the Great Bray Shaman via the Tzeentch battalion), have access to the Beast of Chaos endless spells. And Archaon can also cast the Hedonite endless spells.

We we have access to a dozen endless spells, without resorting to allies. :)

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15 minutes ago, AverageBoss said:

Also, the Tzaangor shaman (or the Great Bray Shaman via the Tzeentch battalion), have access to the Beast of Chaos endless spells. And Archaon can also cast the Hedonite endless spells.

We we have access to a dozen endless spells, without resorting to allies. :)

just when i thought i had enough models to paint :D ....though i won't use Archaon, can't stand the model lol

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Guild of Summoners list...or maybe just a heavy caster and Fate Point list. I dont know...just tossing stuff into warscroll builder lol spells and items to be determined. Not sure who would be general either

Allegiance: Tzeentch
- Change Coven: Guild of Summoners

Kairos Fateweaver (400)
Ogroid Thaumaturge (160)
Gaunt Summoner on Disc of Tzeentch (260)
Gaunt Summoner of Tzeentch (240)
The Blue Scribes (120)
- Lore of Change: Tzeentch's Firestorm

20 x Kairic Acolytes (200)
20 x Kairic Acolytes (200)
10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)
10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)
10 x Kairic Acolytes (100)
Balewind Vortex (40)
Umbral Spellportal (70)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Wounds: 107
 

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I've got a rules question on adding Tzaangors to an existing unit of Tzaangors via abilities like the Tzaangor Shaman's spell. What equipment are they allowed to have? Could I add a hornblower or standard bearer? What about 2 hander guys or guys with two hand weapons in a unit of guys with shields?

I've got some extra Tzaangors from Silver tower that I'm looking to use as additions to units that haven't had any models slain but I'm not sure how limited I'll be with them.

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10 hours ago, GeneralZero said:

This kind of list scares me, not because they are scary but because playing a list in which

1) there are no offensive unit and/or anvil like

2) horrors and kairics by 10 are super fragiles and can be erased easyly and can't reply do things in return

3) most HQ are fragile and not fighters.

Maybe the ES make the difference...

1. all the mortal wounds adds up to a decent unit and it's not about clearing out whole, and  you have 30 horrors between the whole army you have like 1.5 big killy unit power. The difference is you can target down and kill key characters

2. The horrors are rather tanky  as they can with support hold an enemy army up veryu well. They are about as durable as 40 clan rats which can be tough to kill to the man.  MOre importantly they are supported with ALOT of debuffs, arcane suggesttion is -1 to hit/wound, gemnids is usualy -1 melee attand and -1 to hit against shooting, while treason of tzneetch is another -1 to hit. So you can completely turn off the kill power of most units in the game. Making the horrors very durable when used well. 

3. Most the HQs are fragile but with above as long as it's not shooting they aren't really getting to your heros.  Now it does get weaker against very long range shooting that goes first, but aleast against someo f that long range shooting you can also give them -1 to hit and they are fragile enough that your horrors and magic can clear out most shooting units. 

MOst importantly it's an objective based game not one based on killing everything for most missions. Meaning all tzneetch cares to do and all we ahve really cared to do is  stay even or near even on points and then core 1 or two more points when our enemy starts to limp or clear a tiny hole. 

Edited by mmimzie
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2 hours ago, Forrix said:

I've got a rules question on adding Tzaangors to an existing unit of Tzaangors via abilities like the Tzaangor Shaman's spell. What equipment are they allowed to have? Could I add a hornblower or standard bearer? What about 2 hander guys or guys with two hand weapons in a unit of guys with shields?

I've got some extra Tzaangors from Silver tower that I'm looking to use as additions to units that haven't had any models slain but I'm not sure how limited I'll be with them.

No, not really.  This is covered in a faq.  Basically if it says 1/10 can have a horn, then the 10th extra Tzaangor you place could have a horn.  You cannot, for example, place an 11th Tzaangor and give him a horn or 2 handed weapon, (I’m assuming your original 10 took all options available).  However, if you added 10 extra Tzaangors somehow, your 5th, 6th could be a mutant  and 2 hander and your 10th could be horn mutant standard or 2hander.  But that’s how you would have to do it, so practically speak, probably not since you likely won’t add that many Tzaangors without losing any.

Edited by Sumanye
Messed up the counting

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4 hours ago, mmimzie said:

1. all the mortal wounds adds up to a decent unit and it's not about clearing out whole, and  you have 30 flamers between the whole army you have like 1.5 big killy unit power. The difference is you can target down and kill key characters.

It’s probably late and I am missing something, but where did you get the 30 flamers (or do you mean that the spell power of the character is equal to approx 30 flamers)? If so - really interested in the comparison.

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1 hour ago, NJohansson said:

It’s probably late and I am missing something, but where did you get the 30 flamers (or do you mean that the spell power of the character is equal to approx 30 flamers)? If so - really interested in the comparison.

Horrors had flamers on the brain lol.

 

The spell power though is high as it's all mortal wounds instead of having to go against saves. Making it better against better saves or worse against hordes. 

 

That said you do have mini horse buster from the gaunt summoner and reason of tzneetch. 

Edited by mmimzie

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OMG  this just clicked for me. 

 

 

You can summon Kairos in guild of summoners..... Woooooow I'm jazzed.

 

I'm more excited because I don't tend to like running named characters unless I summon them in.

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14 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

and reason of tzneetch. 

Reason of Tzeentch... that sounds decidedly positive actually! 😘

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48 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

You can summon Kairos in guild of summoners..... Woooooow I'm jazzed.

I don't think you can, as he's not a legal unit in the actual summon list (that lists Lord of Change by name, not keyword)... but then idk why they used the keyword format when explaining the GoS abilities. 

Interesting. 

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53 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

OMG  this just clicked for me. 

 

 

You can summon Kairos in guild of summoners..... Woooooow I'm jazzed.

 

I'm more excited because I don't tend to like running named characters unless I summon them in.

Yeah it seems weird that you can summon him in Guild of Summoners but not using Fate points.  I'll be looking for advance rulings from TOs/opponents on this until the FAQ.

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It most certainly could be FAQd, but if it doesn't get hit than that's pretty magic. 

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Looking at multitudinous summoners. Looking for thoughts and suggested changes.

 

Allegiance: Tzeentch
- Change Coven: Guild of Summoners
Changecaster, Herald of Tzeentch (110)
The Blue Scribes (120)
Gaunt Summoner of Tzeentch (240)
Changecaster, Herald of Tzeentch (110)
Magister (100)
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
10 x Blue Horrors of Tzeentch (100)
10 x Brimstone Horrors of Tzeentch (60)
10 x Brimstone Horrors of Tzeentch (60)
10 x Brimstone Horrors of Tzeentch (60)
Multitudinous Host (160)
Balewind Vortex (40)
Burning Sigil of Tzeentch (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 105
 

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